Did you try to learn Thai? How did you get on? How old were you? Was it worth it? Regrets?

[thaibeachlovers]

On 1/25/2022 at 3:23 AM, Neeranam said:

I really can't understand anyone who says otherwise. 

 

The simple joys of living like talking to the neighbors, the postman, the alcoholic bin scavenger, a random person on a train. It could actually save your life, which I've said for years. 

I wouldn't have a conversation with those people in my own country, so why would I have in Thailand?

The only people I wanted to "converse" with were tourists, and regardless of where they were from they all spoke English.

 

I can see how it might save my life, but happily such a situation never arose for me.

[kwilco]

7 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

It absolutely is worth the effort in every conceivable way. If you are single, you'll get the girls easier, if you are married, you'll not want to take your wife every single place you go. That is indeed a ball and chain. 

 

I never had a problem getting girls in Thailand, even not speaking Thai.

 

I never understand why anyone would claim it's necessary to speak Thai, as I visited and lived there many many years without being able to speak conversational Thai.

If anyone wants to spend the time and effort to learn it by all means do so, but please don't say it's "necessary" when it is so obviously not.

 

However, a basic vocabulary is important to get by. I found a few phrases were all I needed, eg where is the toilet, thank you, all the way ( for on local buses ), numbers and "how much", a few food choices etc.

"Necessary" is not the word I'd use.

But when you see a non-speaker, you think "there's  a guy who doesn't know what he's missing out on.

[thaibeachlovers]

4 minutes ago, kwilco said:

"Necessary" is not the word I'd use.

But when you see a non-speaker, you think "there's  a guy who doesn't know what he's missing out on.

Perhaps, but what one doesn't know, one doesn't miss.

 

I'm not AGAINST learning Thai per se, but IMO it's just not necessary, other than the basics.

Truthfully I never wanted to have a conversation with a Thai man, and was never interested in vocal conversation with a Thai female ( if you get what I mean ).

If anyone wants to spend the time and effort, has the hearing ability to distinguish tones, and has a reason to do so ( like working in LOS ) by all means go for it.

[GinBoy2]

39 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Perhaps, but what one doesn't know, one doesn't miss.

 

I'm not AGAINST learning Thai per se, but IMO it's just not necessary, other than the basics.

Truthfully I never wanted to have a conversation with a Thai man, and was never interested in vocal conversation with a Thai female ( if you get what I mean ).

If anyone wants to spend the time and effort, has the hearing ability to distinguish tones, and has a reason to do so ( like working in LOS ) by all means go for it.

I kinda get a kick outta being able to understand the world around me. 

 

But I get it, that for some it's no big deal and learning your first tonal language at a certain age can be hard.

 

But even if you don't want to do legwork of learning to speak, learn to read Thai.

I buckled down and leaned to speak and read Mandarin which is frikkin difficult, bare minimum is you need to memorize 1200 characters

Thai is relatively easy. 44 consonants and 16 vowels. Unlike Mandarin, it's a cipher just like English, Spanish or most other languages.

 

Once you can read Thai that makes life one Hell of a lot easier, even if you can't speak a word

[Neeranam]

6 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Truthfully I never wanted to have a conversation with a Thai man, and was never interested in vocal conversation with a Thai female ( if you get what I mean ).

Strange. Why have you got against Thai people that you don't want to speak to them? 

[thaibeachlovers]

2 hours ago, Neeranam said:

Strange. Why have you got against Thai people that you don't want to speak to them? 

I have nothing against them. I just wasn't interested in speaking with them. I wasn't in LOS for the conversation.

[Mac Mickmanus]

2 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I have nothing against them. I just wasn't interested in speaking with them. I wasn't in LOS for the conversation.

What was you in Thailand for ?

[Neeranam]

 

It's impossible, IMHO, to learn about the culture of a country if you can't speak the language. 

[TheScience]

My Thai language skills have dwindled to nothing. I just avoid them as they (other than wife's friends) avoid me.

 

I think it entirely a fool's errand to learn this complicated language which is useless outside it's borders.

 

Knew a guy who loved China. Lived there for decades. He was a maniac for the language and reached hsk4 (5 is highest) which is extremely proficient. He left China under similar circumstances as what are developing in Thailand today.

 

When I second retire I'll pick it up again but nothing serious.

 

Doing anything to adjust or fit in here is just met with derision.

 

If I was a dopey upcountry farang I might have more use for it. We city folk..

 

[TheScience]

11 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

 

It's impossible, IMHO, to learn about the culture of a country if you can't speak the language. 

What needs to be learnt?

 

What am I missing?

 

Nothing but problems here anymore. If I weren't married I'd have been gone a decade ago.

 

Learn the culture lol

[TheScience]

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I have nothing against them. I just wasn't interested in speaking with them. I wasn't in LOS for the conversation.

I couldn't agree more. None of them are especially versed in Buddhism or Hinduism despite worshipping deities. We have 24 holidays half of which the Thais have no clue what for. No one knows anything about how the political system and courts function. The history of the nation...well...good luck sorting that and even discussing in honestly no one can - or will. Thais do not keep abreast of what's going on even in their region let alone the world. Technology?? High tech = the latest iphone.

 

I love my wife. She brings fun, cheer and kwam suk into my life but you're not going to find many Thais that are interested and able to debate who was the greater philosopher Kierkegaard or Schopenhauer or how many angels can dance on the head of a pin.

 

Come to think of it most farang expats would fall into this category as well...

Edited January 27, 2022 by TheScience

[kwilco]

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I have nothing against them

OMG! That is one of the top 5 racist cliches!

[TheScience]

1 minute ago, kwilco said:

OMG! That is one of the top 5 racist cliches!

What does he win?

[kwilco]

10 minutes ago, TheScience said:

Kierkegaard or Schopenhauer

That's because they are western philosopher's How would most westerners fair on Lao Tzu, Buddha and Confucius.?

[Neeranam]

6 minutes ago, TheScience said:

I couldn't agree more. None of them are especially versed in Buddhism or Hinduism despite worshipping deities. We have 24 holidays half of which the Thais have no clue what for.

Total nonsense. I often talk to the monks in the morning about religious things, especially the Hindu connection in the type of Buddhism practiced by some here. Also the presence of Animism and Fetishism. I like to go to the temples, of which there are many near my home to meditate and often chat with monks about these things. Recently, I was discussing with two monks how there are 2 schools of thought here, does making amends  erase negative Karma. This alone is a cultural aspect that is explained, how some Thais don't apologize or make amends like Westerners do.  

[kwilco]

30 minutes ago, TheScience said:

complicated language which is useless outside it's borders.

Very ignorant argument.

I think becausevyou are <deleted> at it, you think it's "compmicated" and of course Thsi is useful outside Thailand. It doesn't compete with English but it has its uses...you just don't know about it.

[Neeranam]

1 hour ago, TheScience said:

Nothing but problems here anymore. If I weren't married I'd have been gone a decade ago.

What sort of problems?

If you integrate into society, you have fewer issues than those who don't. 

Do you plan to have children, if so, would you pass on your derision of their culture to them? I know some farang who do, which is extremely psychologically damaging to the kids. 

[TheScience]

29 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

What sort of problems?

If you integrate into society, you have fewer issues than those who don't. 

Do you plan to have children, if so, would you pass on your derision of their culture to them? I know some farang who do, which is extremely psychologically damaging to the kids. 

I wouldn't disagree. That's pretty broad and vague.

 

I've no interest in children. Having a wife here without a second passport is hassle enough.

 

Really wouldn't want to bring kids into today's world - especially what Thailand is becoming or has become. After about a year into our relationship my now wife had no interest in children either (she was 33).

Edited January 27, 2022 by TheScience

[TheScience]

1 hour ago, kwilco said:

Very ignorant argument.

I think becausevyou are <deleted> at it, you think it's "compmicated" and of course Thsi is useful outside Thailand. It doesn't compete with English but it has its uses...you just don't know about it.

I'd noticed you omitted the uses, usefulness. Pretty hollow argument.

 

Judging by your post you might brush up on your English skills especially if it's your first language. Dread.

[Neeranam]

18 minutes ago, TheScience said:

I'd noticed you omitted the uses, usefulness. Pretty hollow argument.

 

Judging by your post you might brush up on your English skills especially if it's your first language. Dread.

Interestingly, it's often English teachers that don't learn the language. What is this telling your students? 

[TheScience]

56 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Interestingly, it's often English teachers that don't learn the language. What is this telling your students? 

It's telling them that I have spent hundreds of hours training myself up (second career) to provide them with the best education and support I am capable of.

 

It's telling them that unlike so many of the frauds that step in front of them I hold teaching licenses in US and Thailand.

 

It tells them that I am so supportive of them as well as their dreams, goals and ambitions that I would sacrifice hundreds of hours of personal time to assist them in getting the best scores possible on BMAT, SAT, IELTS, CUTEP and TUGET.

 

By having written nearly one hundred recommendations and worked with students to win an aggregate of 30M THB baht in overseas scholarships to places like Columbia, Oxford, Hong Kong University and University Toronto among others... additionally, the 150 students I'd supported to get into Chullongkorn, Sirirat, Ramathibodi Medical Schools first round, Chula BBA & Law as well as Thammasat first round polisci and law....the dozen or so King's scholars, three MFA winners and two Petch Yod Mongkut winners...

 

It tells them that if they have the ambition and grades I will go to the ends of the earth to help them be the success they dream of.

 

The other teachers, worthless... flounder about. Some even waste the students time prattling on in bad Thai simply for their own gratification.

 

How much English does a Thai learn when you are babbling on in Thai? Probably zero.

 

Hope this is crystal clear old man.

Edited January 27, 2022 by TheScience

[Neeranam]

51 minutes ago, TheScience said:

It's telling them that I have spent hundreds of hours training myself up (second career) to provide them with the best education and support I am capable of.

 

It's telling them that unlike so many of the frauds that step in front of them I hold teaching licenses in US and Thailand.

 

It tells them that I am so supportive of them as well as their dreams, goals and ambitions that I would sacrifice hundreds of hours of personal time to assist them in getting the best scores possible on BMAT, SAT, IELTS, CUTEP and TUGET.

 

By having written nearly one hundred recommendations and worked with students to win an aggregate of 30M THB baht in overseas scholarships to places like Columbia, Oxford, Hong Kong University and University Toronto among others... additionally, the 150 students I'd supported to get into Chullongkorn, Sirirat, Ramathibodi Medical Schools first round, Chula BBA & Law as well as Thammasat first round polisci and law....the dozen or so King's scholars, three MFA winners and two Petch Yod Mongkut winners...

 

It tells them that if they have the ambition and grades I will go to the ends of the earth to help them be the success they dream of.

 

The other teachers, worthless... flounder about. Some even waste the students time prattling on in bad Thai simply for their own gratification.

 

How much English does a Thai learn when you are babbling on in Thai? Probably zero.

 

Hope this is crystal clear old man.

Also, they often have very low self-esteem, resulting in self-righteously criticizing others. 

 

I didn't mean you teach them in Thai.

 

Many English teachers I've known want their Thai teacher to speak English, which is also ridiculous, especially if they have studies acquisition theory.

 

But seriously, if you live in Thailand and know how to teach a language, you should know how to learn one. 

[TheScience]

8 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

But seriously, if you live in Thailand and know how to teach a language, you should know how to learn one. 

But seriously, maybe I see it having little purpose.

 

I get by just fine with my limited amount of Thai. The longer I'm here the less I want to converse with Thai people. Moreover, I can easily see leaving here the way the country is going.

 

On those rare occasions that I'm together with my wife's friends I do feel a bit embarrassed that my Thai isn't better especially considering how long I've been here. Then I have another beer and forget it because there's almost nothing I wish to discuss with them. Well, nothing.

 

This isn't 1995 no one owes anything to this country. It gives nothing, it takes much. For the sake of living here I call it even.

 

Your posts are smug and condescending.

Edited January 27, 2022 by TheScience

[Rimmer]

A post with a bank of quotes only has been removed.

 

Please stop the off topic bickering

[thaibeachlovers]

16 hours ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

What was you in Thailand for ?

The temples.

[thaibeachlovers]

10 hours ago, TheScience said:

On those rare occasions that I'm together with my wife's friends I do feel a bit embarrassed that my Thai isn't better especially considering how long I've been here. Then I have another beer and forget it because there's almost nothing I wish to discuss with them. Well, nothing.

Never a problem for me as I left them to get on with it and did something else. Had I been able to speak conversational Thai, I doubt I'd have had any interest in talking about what I'd been eating and what I was going to eat, which seemed to be my wife's primary motivation in life.

When the old biddies in the village gathered under the MIL's house to gossip they referred to the "farang" many times and frankly, I'm glad I don't know what they were saying about me.

[thaibeachlovers]

13 hours ago, TheScience said:

I wouldn't disagree. That's pretty broad and vague.

 

I've no interest in children. Having a wife here without a second passport is hassle enough.

 

Really wouldn't want to bring kids into today's world - especially what Thailand is becoming or has become. After about a year into our relationship my now wife had no interest in children either (she was 33).

You and I are very much aligned on the children thing. I fail to understand why old farangs with children in home country feel compelled to produce more in a foreign land where they can be denied even the right to see them should the mother choose to do so ( despite the law ), and look more like a grandfather than a father. I'd have been embarrassed if my father had looked that old when I was at school.

I do understand why Thai women want children from the farang ATM, as it locks in the money supply indefinitely.

If old farangs really want to have kids around, there are kids in orphanages to adopt.

 

Re the world today, if I did only one thing right in my life, IMO it was not bringing children into the world as it has become. Many parents I know fear for what will happen for their children.

I even wonder if for possibly the first time in history, children in western countries will be significantly worse off than their parents.

Edited January 27, 2022 by thaibeachlovers

[GinBoy2]

Well was a verbal diarrhea thread.

 

But to bring it back to reality.

 

All my kids are polyglots.

 

My two American daughters speak English & Spanish, and my eldest daughter is in the process of learning Mandarin from her half brother.

 

My Thai son speaks, English, Thai, Lao and Mandarin .

 

Has it made their lives better, Hell Yeah.

 

Learning languages, as hard as it can be is never a bad thing.

 

You will in later life never learn a language like you did when you were a child.

 

My head swirls in a mix of English and Spanish, yet I never have those head conversations in any of my later in life learned languages.

 

But that doesn't mean that I don't love the fact that I can interact and understand everything around me in those learned languages

[GammaGlobulin]

This Topic, especially as it is posted here on our Farang Pub Forum, can be very helpful to all those who intend to come to Thailand for retirement, and/or who plan to stay in Thailand for years, maybe even until the day they die.

 

When I first arrived in Thailand, I was not able to walk. and could only move from room to room with the aid of a wheelchair.

 

I had to think of something that might keep me busy while I recuperated in this beautiful land of helpful and gracious people, good food, and pleasant weather, not to mention this land of the Thai Myna bird, an avian specie possessed of uncommonly complex linguistic ability.

 

The reason I am RETURNING to this topic, after a few days of posting-quiescence is becuase I really wish to encourage older people, like me, to NEVER fear the language acquisition adventure which is available to all of us old ones who are willing to put in the time, in order to achieve great success in learning an L2.

 

In fact, anyone between the ages of 50 and 70 can most DEFINITELY learn passa Thai.  I know this to be true after having witnessed this happen, many times.

 

The more important requirement for success in learning Thai is....  TIME ON TASK!

 

In addition, in order to learn to speak passa Thai, then you should be willing to learn Thai script, which will also benefit you during your days, months, and years in Thailand.

 

I mean, if you love Thai food, then you need to be able to easily read a Thai menu, which you WILL be able to do, maybe after one or two years of passa Thai learning, and Thai-food eating.

 

Therefore, My Dear Friends, my most important advice to you is to NOT waste your Golden Retirement Years here, in Thailand, without learning to READ and Speak passa Thai.

 

Passa Thai is not an easy language, and I think it is a bit more difficult than learning Mandarin Chinese.  Still, passa Thai is easier than several other languages, and there is really NO DOUBT that any guy or gal, worth his or her salt, can fairly quickly (within one to three years) learn to comprehend simple spoken Thai, and also be able to speak simple Thai, and, what I consider crucial, be able to read Thai script at a fairly high level, meaning the level taught by university classes at Year Two in their Thai language curriculum.

 

Dumb and Ignorant as I may be, yet, I do know a thing or two about learning languages.

 

Trust me, that if you are between the age of 50 and the almost impossible age of 75, you will STILL be able to make good progress in learning Thai, month by month, if only you possess the will to put in the TIME ON TASK.

 

Passa Thai is, in my opinion, quite a beautiful language.

 

Good Luck to ALL, in our Thai-language-learning endeavor which so many of us share in common!

 

 

[kwilco]

On 1/27/2022 at 6:03 AM, Neeranam said:

None of them are especially versed in Buddhism or Hinduis

 

On 1/27/2022 at 7:58 AM, Neeranam said:

Interestingly, it's often English teachers that don't learn the language. What is this telling your students? 

You need to understand the principles of TEFL.