ADVICE NEEDED. Executing a foreigners Thai will.

[MUSTYJACK]

Not sure if this is the right section, if not maybe a mod can move it to the Legal Questions forum if there is one.

 

1. I am in the UK at present.

 

2. An elderly  British friend died in Thailand 3 weeks ago. He was old, very unwell, alone, and shunned help of any kind. He had withdrawn into himself due to stubbornness, booze and depression.

 

3. His estranged next of kin in the UK (son) was contacted by the Foreign Office via the UK Embassy in BKK. A lawyer was then contacted by the son and engaged  to collect the death cert. and organise the cremation. (fees 70,000baht)

 

4. A copy of his 12 year old will was discovered by a distant relative in the UK.  Apparently this will is valid in Thailand

 

5. I am named as the executor of the will. There is about B2 mill. in his accounts to be transferred after probate has been obtained to his relatives in the UK. 

 

6. As I am the executor, it is I and not the relatives, (nor the son who is not a beneficiary), are legally bound to gain probate and distribute the funds according to the instructions in the will, unless I legally renounce my responsibility to do this.  Neither his relatives nor his son want to take on those duties. If the will is not executed, the funds will remain frozen in the bank for a few years and then pass to the Thai state.

 

7. Can I do this ( gain probate and access the funds) from the UK? 

 

8. Or do I need to be in physically present Thailand to obtain probate from the court, and do I need to be in Thailand to take the probate cert. to the banks to release the funds?

 

9. I will be travelling to Thailand in 3 months,  can I do this myself without the need to engage the (expensive) services of a lawyer. I can speak and read  Thai to a level that would  enable me to deal with most of the documentation and procedures. Has ayone ever done this before?

 

Any advice would be most grateful. Thank You.

 

 

[Banana7]

Someone has to go to the court to get the probate order issued, pay the taxes and they need to speak and write Thai. I recommend hiring a lawyer.

Edited July 28, 2022 by Banana7

[Klonko]

If you feel morally obligated to your friend and the beneficiaries really need the money, I would only accept the executor role if all legal heirs and beneficiaries explicitly accept the last will and indemnify you from any claims. Further, you need legal advice in the UK and Thailand for ensuring compliance with respective (tax) laws. 

 

Advice for any future last wills: try to keep the assets separated by country, distribute the assets to beneficiaries in the same country, nominate executors for each country and notify your executors while alive.

Edited July 28, 2022 by Klonko

[paahlman]

You can give a power of attorney to a lawyer in Thailand to execute it. 

[soisanuk]

8 hours ago, Banana7 said:

Someone has to go to the court to get the probate order issued, pay the taxes and they need to speak and write Thai. I recommend hiring a lawyer.

It is my understanding that a Thai lawyer admitted to the Bar in Thailand is the only one who can act for you before a Thai court (probate). I am not sure if you must attend as the executor - best to obtain advice from a Thai lawyer.  Likewise, they can advise you about the validity of a UK will in Thailand.  It is also my understanding that foreign wills can be valid provided they meet Thailand requirements for such documents AND they must be translated into Thai for the Court.

 

If in Pattaya, send me a private message and I can recommend someone knowledgeable about what will be required - they are an English speaking person whose Thai wife is a lawyer admitted to the Bar and can practice before Thai courts.   

[jcmj]

Get a good lawyer. My friend is still dealing with his friends Thai will 1 1/2 years and going. Many things are handled differently here so let them guide you. Good luck. 

[inThailand]

Great question. 

 

I have been trying to find out the process myself. Have met no falang who can clearly lay out the steps of this process, though some claim they have done it. 

 

Following and 

Good Luck! 

[HarrySeaman]

I went through this for a friend who died intestate last Fall.  I hired a Thai lawyer (lawyer is a Thai citizen reserved occupation) to guide me through this.  It involved papers being sent back and forth to the USA so that they could be signed by my friends brother and two video appearances my me before a Thai probate court to be appointed the executor.  This process took several months.

 

Being executor allowed me to access my friend's bank accounts and distribute the funds locally, according to the family wishes.  It also allowed me to get the USA Embassy to okay the release the body for cremation and disposal of the remains at sea.  Two of our Thai friends took care of all the details of these things, which meant everything went quickly and smoothly once the body was released.

 

All attorney and funeral expenses were paid from my friends funds.  I had to spend a great deal of time and effort, but it was worth it knowing that my friend was treated properly following his death.

 

It is my understanding that the nearest or appointed relative, or in your case you as executor in the UK will, can get a Thai attorney appointed the local Thai executor to take care of everything here in Thailand without you having to do it in person, but you need to check this with a Thai attorney in the location where your friend died.

 

To prevent all this mess I strongly recommend that all expats, as well as taking care of legal aspects in their own country, get a valid Thai will that appoints an executor in Thailand.  This allows things to proceed smoothly immediately.  In my case my 20 year long Thai partner/wife is both my executor and beneficiary.  I also have a living will that appoints my Thai partner/wife as the one who will make medical decisions for me if I am unable to make them for myself.  Together the cost of these was around 30,000 Bt, and well worth the cost for my peace of mind.

[CM Dad]

I have done this before several times by myself without the help of lawyers.  As I was the named executor in the wills, all I had to do was take the death certificate and a letter from the embassy of the deceased's country giving me the authority to close bank accounts and disperse funds and belongings.  The embassy required a copy of the death certificate and the will. I have only dealt with the US Embassy, but I am fairly certain that the UK Embassy has similar procedures.  You definitely do not need a lawyer in the UK, and I seriously doubt that there are any taxes due in either country. I also had the authority to have the bodies cremated.  You can do it yourself, but if you are concerned then hire an attorney in Thailand if you are going to be here..  Just be careful and don't allow the attorney to overcharge you as the legal process is fairly simple and straightforward.                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                     

[arithai12]

16 hours ago, MUSTYJACK said:

4. A copy of his 12 year old will was discovered by a distant relative in the UK.  Apparently this will is valid in Thailand

 

5. I am named as the executor of the will. There is about B2 mill. in his accounts to be transferred after probate has been obtained to his relatives in the UK.

Discovered? Apparently?

You seem to have been a close friend, but were you in contact recently? Did he inform you that you are supposed to execute his will? Why was this will located in the UK and not in Thailand? Do you have any idea if there could be a newer will "to be discovered" somewhere? Who said that the one in the UK is valid in Thailand "apparently"? Which language is it written in and who are the witnesses?

 

It seems your old friend didn't give a damn. Why should you? I mean, good will and honor to the memory of better times are commendable, but is it worthy? You don't mention how many beneficiaries. 2M B minus expenses and taxes is not a lot of cake if the slices are many.

 

Only you know the answers. If going ahead, a Thai lawyer would probably be a good idea.

 

[arithai12]

2 hours ago, CM Dad said:

...

I seriously doubt that there are any taxes due in either country

...

I don't know about US and Thailand (or UK in this context), but I do know that in my EU country there are complicated taxation levels which depend on whether the beneficiary is a spouse, direct discendent (or ascendant), parallel such a siblings, and finally highest for non-family. In some cases a tax-free franchise can apply up to some amounts, so that for low amounts no tax will apply as you seem to have experienced.

Taxation for real estate con be hefty, but that's obviously not the case here.

[MikePBrown]

Hi Below FYI is my experience of being an Executor for a Thai Will - my circumstances are not the same as yours but I hope the information will be useful.

My Thai Wife passed on last September and I was the Joint Executor of her Thai Will. I appointed a Lawyer in Chiang Mai to collect the paperwork, submit this to the Courts and obtain the Court Order to confirm I was one of the Executors. This took just under 3 months to complete and required me to attend a Court Hearing and answer the Courts questions under oath. Because of covid the Court asked that this be done via Zoom with me in my Lawyers Office. The Hearing was all in Thai and the Court wanted to satisfy themselves I was a suitable person to carry out the Executors duties. My Lawyer charged me Bt20k for this service, I found him to be honest, efficient and a reasonable fee, but he only speaks Thai - happy to share contact information if of use.

Armed with Death Certificate, Court Order, proof of my ID and Wife's ID I closed several Bank Accounts she had opened. All the banks required the 2 Executors to be present in the Branch when closing the accounts, though the process was different in each bank. With the except of an Agricultural Bank they did not require me to go to the branch where the account was based, i.e. I could do the paperwork etc at any of their branches. Most banks required me to open an account in my name for receiving the balance of my wife's account. The process varied from being all done in 1 hour to taking up to 2 weeks.

 

Hope this is of help

[timendres]

I think this is a good reminder for those of us here. If you know you are coming to the end, it is much easier for all involved to liquidate and distribute all wealth in Thailand before you check out. Leaving this process to someone else is a real burden.