New Political Party Ready To Launch

[Plus]

It's like stamping out prostitution. Ok, vote buying is illegal, but what are you going to with several banknotes? How can you possibly prove anything if the canvasser doesn't admit it himself?

It needs to be a sting operation or everything should be caught on video.

And don't forget that police are often not in a position to challenge local pooyais so they can't be of any help to EC officials.

It's the reality - you can't force the law on people when it goes against their tradition. It's the junge out there, no matter whether you have military junta in Bangkok or not. Thai state has little power and no resources to enforce anything in rural areas.

[blaze]

It's like stamping out prostitution. Ok, vote buying is illegal, but what are you going to with several banknotes? How can you possibly prove anything if the canvasser doesn't admit it himself?

It needs to be a sting operation or everything should be caught on video.

And don't forget that police are often not in a position to challenge local pooyais so they can't be of any help to EC officials.

It's the reality - you can't force the law on people when it goes against their tradition. It's the junge out there, no matter whether you have military junta in Bangkok or not. Thai state has little power and no resources to enforce anything in rural areas.

I'm not expecting that it be stamped out- not if it exists on the scale that you guys claim it does: I'm asking that several cases be proved in court. Certainly that wouldn't be hard to do with prostitution (ask the Uzbek girls who run afoul of local authorities) and I think that at least with the EC and the army, the political will is there.

I can see now, if this forum is any indication, that a PPP win will not be regarded as legitimate- that in fact the PPP does not enjoy popular support- and illegally bought the election. Despite no solid evidence. But perception is what counts. ANd more than good governance, what Thailand needs now is a shared perception that the government, regardless of how flawed, is a reflection of the wishes of the people. And that's not going to be the way it's seen. There are bad days ahead.

I have not heard any suggestion from the PPP that it will demonstrate to oppose a Democrat gov't- nor from PPP sympathizers- but I fear that a rejuvenated PAD (and this has been promised) could be a real problem down the line.

In fact, I think it's feasible that the PPP, for reasons mentioned by several of you, might actually enjoy watching the Dems take power and then deal with their election promises, their vows to amend the constitution and what is looking like, a coming global recession.

[Jai Dee]

Security tightened following the bombing of PPP office

Prime Minister Surayud Chulanont on Tuesday instructed police and relevant authorities to beef up security in the wake of a bombing incident on Monday's night at an office of the People Power Party at Lat Phrao.

No casualites were reported.

"I have received separate reports from police and the Election Commission and ordered the law enforcement authorities to get to the bottom of the explosion at PPP office," he said.

Surayud ruled out the speculation that the December 23 election might be delayed because of the campaignrelated violence and the flash floods in the three southernmost provinces. He said all main roads in the South were open inspite of the inundation in certain areas.

"The balloting is on course and the government will try to facilitate voters in casting their ballots," he said.

Source: The Nation - 18 December 2007

[hammered]

It's like stamping out prostitution. Ok, vote buying is illegal, but what are you going to with several banknotes? How can you possibly prove anything if the canvasser doesn't admit it himself?

It needs to be a sting operation or everything should be caught on video.

And don't forget that police are often not in a position to challenge local pooyais so they can't be of any help to EC officials.

It's the reality - you can't force the law on people when it goes against their tradition. It's the junge out there, no matter whether you have military junta in Bangkok or not. Thai state has little power and no resources to enforce anything in rural areas.

I'm not expecting that it be stamped out- not if it exists on the scale that you guys claim it does: I'm asking that several cases be proved in court. Certainly that wouldn't be hard to do with prostitution (ask the Uzbek girls who run afoul of local authorities) and I think that at least with the EC and the army, the political will is there.

I can see now, if this forum is any indication, that a PPP win will not be regarded as legitimate- that in fact the PPP does not enjoy popular support- and illegally bought the election. Despite no solid evidence. But perception is what counts. ANd more than good governance, what Thailand needs now is a shared perception that the government, regardless of how flawed, is a reflection of the wishes of the people. And that's not going to be the way it's seen. There are bad days ahead.

I have not heard any suggestion from the PPP that it will demonstrate to oppose a Democrat gov't- nor from PPP sympathizers- but I fear that a rejuvenated PAD (and this has been promised) could be a real problem down the line.

In fact, I think it's feasible that the PPP, for reasons mentioned by several of you, might actually enjoy watching the Dems take power and then deal with their election promises, their vows to amend the constitution and what is looking like, a coming global recession.

Virtaully every Thai person I talk to thinks PPP will get the most seats but not enough to win the election (241) and they will not form the government under any circumstances as this will lead to chaos. Several PPP people Yuth "doooyen" being prominent among them have said there willbe chaos if PPP is not allowed to rule, so there is a fair chance of chaos anyway.

[blaze]

It's like stamping out prostitution. Ok, vote buying is illegal, but what are you going to with several banknotes? How can you possibly prove anything if the canvasser doesn't admit it himself?

It needs to be a sting operation or everything should be caught on video.

And don't forget that police are often not in a position to challenge local pooyais so they can't be of any help to EC officials.

It's the reality - you can't force the law on people when it goes against their tradition. It's the junge out there, no matter whether you have military junta in Bangkok or not. Thai state has little power and no resources to enforce anything in rural areas.

I'm not expecting that it be stamped out- not if it exists on the scale that you guys claim it does: I'm asking that several cases be proved in court. Certainly that wouldn't be hard to do with prostitution (ask the Uzbek girls who run afoul of local authorities) and I think that at least with the EC and the army, the political will is there.

I can see now, if this forum is any indication, that a PPP win will not be regarded as legitimate- that in fact the PPP does not enjoy popular support- and illegally bought the election. Despite no solid evidence. But perception is what counts. ANd more than good governance, what Thailand needs now is a shared perception that the government, regardless of how flawed, is a reflection of the wishes of the people. And that's not going to be the way it's seen. There are bad days ahead.

I have not heard any suggestion from the PPP that it will demonstrate to oppose a Democrat gov't- nor from PPP sympathizers- but I fear that a rejuvenated PAD (and this has been promised) could be a real problem down the line.

In fact, I think it's feasible that the PPP, for reasons mentioned by several of you, might actually enjoy watching the Dems take power and then deal with their election promises, their vows to amend the constitution and what is looking like, a coming global recession.

Virtaully every Thai person I talk to thinks PPP will get the most seats but not enough to win the election (241) and they will not form the government under any circumstances as this will lead to chaos. Several PPP people Yuth "doooyen" being prominent among them have said there willbe chaos if PPP is not allowed to rule, so there is a fair chance of chaos anyway.

If a democratically elected government, is not allowed to rule- without just legal cause- there should be, at the very least, some rather vocal consternation.

I don't care whether it's PPP, Democrat or the Thai Rhino party.

I would also suggest that no Thai in this country has any more valid estimation of who will win than we do- we are all relying on polls. By the way- how are the Dems showing in the southern Moslem provinces? Anybody know?

[hammered]

It's like stamping out prostitution. Ok, vote buying is illegal, but what are you going to with several banknotes? How can you possibly prove anything if the canvasser doesn't admit it himself?

It needs to be a sting operation or everything should be caught on video.

And don't forget that police are often not in a position to challenge local pooyais so they can't be of any help to EC officials.

It's the reality - you can't force the law on people when it goes against their tradition. It's the junge out there, no matter whether you have military junta in Bangkok or not. Thai state has little power and no resources to enforce anything in rural areas.

I'm not expecting that it be stamped out- not if it exists on the scale that you guys claim it does: I'm asking that several cases be proved in court. Certainly that wouldn't be hard to do with prostitution (ask the Uzbek girls who run afoul of local authorities) and I think that at least with the EC and the army, the political will is there.

I can see now, if this forum is any indication, that a PPP win will not be regarded as legitimate- that in fact the PPP does not enjoy popular support- and illegally bought the election. Despite no solid evidence. But perception is what counts. ANd more than good governance, what Thailand needs now is a shared perception that the government, regardless of how flawed, is a reflection of the wishes of the people. And that's not going to be the way it's seen. There are bad days ahead.

I have not heard any suggestion from the PPP that it will demonstrate to oppose a Democrat gov't- nor from PPP sympathizers- but I fear that a rejuvenated PAD (and this has been promised) could be a real problem down the line.

In fact, I think it's feasible that the PPP, for reasons mentioned by several of you, might actually enjoy watching the Dems take power and then deal with their election promises, their vows to amend the constitution and what is looking like, a coming global recession.

Virtaully every Thai person I talk to thinks PPP will get the most seats but not enough to win the election (241) and they will not form the government under any circumstances as this will lead to chaos. Several PPP people Yuth "doooyen" being prominent among them have said there willbe chaos if PPP is not allowed to rule, so there is a fair chance of chaos anyway.

If a democratically elected government, is not allowed to rule- without just legal cause- there should be, at the very least, some rather vocal consternation.

I don't care whether it's PPP, Democrat or the Thai Rhino party.

I would also suggest that no Thai in this country has any more valid estimation of who will win than we do- we are all relying on polls. By the way- how are the Dems showing in the southern Moslem provinces? Anybody know?

I think Yuth was referring to PPP coming topbut not getting 241 which of course is differentfrom winning as the big partyin the Ukraine just found out and accepted without violence.

[blaze]

Yes that's true. But regardless of the parties, the challenges remain: what is the direction for tourism, say- and the reporters should be demanding that the polititians answer that- this would mean the reporters would have to do a lot of homework- but it would also mean the the politicos would have to start thinking a bit more about issues.

Why would politicos talk about "issues" if they don't get votes for them. This is a typical example of "two democracies" from another thread - majoirty of voters in this country are looking for local, friendly guys they feel "connection" with. They don't even realise elections should be about bigger issues.

Too often- the most challenging question that reporters demand is "So what made you decide to get into politics?" "Or how do you feel about vote buying"? Sheesh!

Not true, they ask all those questions and openly take a piss at the answers, in editorials and personal columns. Illegal casino owner, Por Pratunam, has been sentenced to 18 months in jail yesterday, his son is running in elections and he totally denied that his father was involved in anything fishy. They all do it for the Nation and for the People, if you are daft enough to believe them.

But I'll go a bit farther- the almost obsessive focus by the media on vote buying in this election

I don't see it from the English press, no "obsessive focus" at all. No daily dose of fresh allegations and no follow up on last week's news either.

- I think, may be serving a specific purpose. Intentional or not- I don't know. But it certainly serves to support the notion that Thais aren't ready for elections. That both voters and polititians are too corrupt. And that notion of course plays right into the hands of those who prefer 'guided democracy'.

Errr..., do you mean to say that the media is manipulated by the junta and so totally misrepresents both the politicians and their supporters? Do you mean to say that in reality they are all noble citizens out to save the country, suffering in the hands of media mafia? That's quite a conspiracy...

Re your last paragraph- I think the Post and the Nation have made it pretty clear that they do not want to see a PPP win. Newspaper stories don't exist 'out there'. They are an assemblage of facts selected according to various criteria: information value, responsible reporting, bias of the newspaper owners and advertizers and pure old fashioned entertainment.

It is not called the 'fifth estate' for nothing. The press has taken countries to illegal wars, it has instigated the election of normally unpopular figures, it has taken down powerful men. And it has made them.

IF the press is owned by big money- you can be pretty sure that its not going to be advocating socialist causes. If the owners of the press are opposed to overseas interventions- you can be pretty sure the press is not going to portray foreign adventurism very favorably.

I think in Thailand that the Press represents a liberal strain in the status quo- economically, morally and socially. And this is reflected in its coverage.

So no- I don't think there is a cabal between the military and the press any more than there was between the Washington Post and the US neo cons in the days leading up to the war... just some shared interests- including- keeping the PPP out of power.

[hammered]

Yes that's true. But regardless of the parties, the challenges remain: what is the direction for tourism, say- and the reporters should be demanding that the polititians answer that- this would mean the reporters would have to do a lot of homework- but it would also mean the the politicos would have to start thinking a bit more about issues.

Why would politicos talk about "issues" if they don't get votes for them. This is a typical example of "two democracies" from another thread - majoirty of voters in this country are looking for local, friendly guys they feel "connection" with. They don't even realise elections should be about bigger issues.

Too often- the most challenging question that reporters demand is "So what made you decide to get into politics?" "Or how do you feel about vote buying"? Sheesh!

Not true, they ask all those questions and openly take a piss at the answers, in editorials and personal columns. Illegal casino owner, Por Pratunam, has been sentenced to 18 months in jail yesterday, his son is running in elections and he totally denied that his father was involved in anything fishy. They all do it for the Nation and for the People, if you are daft enough to believe them.

But I'll go a bit farther- the almost obsessive focus by the media on vote buying in this election

I don't see it from the English press, no "obsessive focus" at all. No daily dose of fresh allegations and no follow up on last week's news either.

- I think, may be serving a specific purpose. Intentional or not- I don't know. But it certainly serves to support the notion that Thais aren't ready for elections. That both voters and polititians are too corrupt. And that notion of course plays right into the hands of those who prefer 'guided democracy'.

Errr..., do you mean to say that the media is manipulated by the junta and so totally misrepresents both the politicians and their supporters? Do you mean to say that in reality they are all noble citizens out to save the country, suffering in the hands of media mafia? That's quite a conspiracy...

Re your last paragraph- I think the Post and the Nation have made it pretty clear that they do not want to see a PPP win. Newspaper stories don't exist 'out there'. They are an assemblage of facts selected according to various criteria: information value, responsible reporting, bias of the newspaper owners and advertizers and pure old fashioned entertainment.

It is not called the 'fifth estate' for nothing. The press has taken countries to illegal wars, it has instigated the election of normally unpopular figures, it has taken down powerful men. And it has made them.

IF the press is owned by big money- you can be pretty sure that its not going to be advocating socialist causes. If the owners of the press are opposed to overseas interventions- you can be pretty sure the press is not going to portray foreign adventurism very favorably.

I think in Thailand that the Press represents a liberal strain in the status quo- economically, morally and socially. And this is reflected in its coverage.

So no- I don't think there is a cabal between the military and the press any more than there was between the Washington Post and the US neo cons in the days leading up to the war... just some shared interests- including- keeping the PPP out of power.

Pretty fair asesment of howthe press works in general in Thailand. The PPP does have its own sympathisers too but they will only really come out if/when they win

[Ricardo]

I had not heard before, of the Thai Rhino Party, do you have a web-site or further details ?

[blaze]

I had not heard before, of the Thai Rhino Party, do you have a web-site or further details ?

Did I say Rhino? I meant wino. And given some of the party policy statements, wino parties might be more common in the upper reaches of the political stratosphere than we would care to know.

[John K]

Pro-Thaksin candidate keeps a low profile ahead of Thai polls

BURIRAM, Thailand : Prakit Poldeeh, a supporter of deposed Thai premier Thaksin Shinawatra, is keeping a low profile as he campaigns for this month's elections under the military's watchful eyes.

"This is the most difficult campaign for me," said 59-year-old Prakit, who is running for his seventh term in parliament in Sunday's polls, the first since last year's coup ousting Thaksin.

"Election rules are so unclear that I can't really do much. I've opted to stay quiet for fear of violating the rules. Instead of me going out, I send volunteers to voters to explain my policy," he told AFP at his office.

Prakit is running for the People Power Party (PPP), which was taken over by members of Thaksin's disbanded Thai Rak Thai (Thais Love Thais) party.

A military-appointed court dissolved Thaksin's party in late May for election fraud.

The court also banned Thaksin and 110 Thai Rak Thai officials from politics for five years.

Since the 2006 coup, the ousted premier, a self-made billionaire, has been in exile in London where he has bought Manchester City football club.

While the junta says the polls will restore democracy, observers ask how free and fair the elections can be when about one-third of Thailand, mainly Thaksin's strongholds such as Buriram, is still under martial law.

"The coup government wants to block PPP from winning," Prakit says, adding authorities have yet to allow him to display campaign billboards even though those of opposition candidates are seen across this rural province.

"I am still waiting for permission on the billboards. What can I do?" shrugs the softly spoken man.

While no troops or tanks are seen in the streets of Buriram, about 410 kilometres (250 miles) northeast of Bangkok, Prakit says soldiers, often disguised as villagers, come to his town meetings with voters.

"I am under pressure from 'observers,'" the candidate says, referring to soldiers.

"They record my speeches. Villagers told me they are afraid to go to my meetings because of the presence of soldiers. I can't really go out to meet villagers," he sighs.

When Prakit ventured out for campaigning on one Saturday afternoon, he spoke for just five minutes in front of around 50 voters, mostly farmers.

"Thank you for your support, and please vote for me," he said, wearing a blue shirt and jeans with a colourful scarf around his waist in a traditional Thai style.

The small crowd cheered and clapped. After the brief speech, one villager offered Prakit a drink.

The scene was in stark contrast to that at a recent event in the campaign by Thailand's oldest political outfit, the Democrat Party, which aims to make inroads into Thaksin's electoral bases such as Buriram.

When Democrat candidate Chaiwat Sinsuwong spoke on the top of his campaign pick-up truck here, not a single voter showed up to see him.

The 58-year-old man was visibly angry when asked about campaigning in the pro-Thaksin province, only saying: "This is no longer Thaksin's stronghold."

Not so for Kiean Pawasri, a 55-year-old farmer, who was among the crowd during Prakit's speech.

"I will vote for PPP because PPP will carry on Thaksin's policy to help the poor," he said, adding: "I want Thaksin to come back and work for us again."

Thaksin led his party to two election victories on the back of strong support among farmers as he launched populist measures - debt relief, investment funds and cheap medical care - in a bid to boost the rural economy.

Most of Thailand's 64 million population live in rural areas.

But average monthly household income in impoverished Buriram, whose main business is rice farming, still stands at just 7,800 baht (about US$200), roughly a quarter of the 30,000 baht average in Bangkok, according to official statistics.

A 31-year-old elementary school teacher with a baby also said she would vote for Prakit.

"I support PPP. I know which party is good for our country," said the woman, who declined to be named, as she chatted with villagers at Prakit's campaign stop.

Prakit says he is confident of victory in the December elections.

"Although coup leaders use tricks against us, and want people to get confused about the elections, I know villagers support me," he said.

"Villagers want PPP to win so that the party can work for them. I am ready to work for them," Prakit said. - AFP/ch

Source http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stories/afp.../317992/1/.html

[sriracha john]

In view of it's traditional use and grammatical correctness, I would substitute "silent" for "silence" throughout this article....

PAD stirs up the silence majority to oppose Thaksin

The People's Alliance for Democracy launched a convoy on Tuesday to drum up the opposition to the People Power Party, seen as the proxy of former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra, ahead of the balloting on Sunday.

"It is time for the silence majority to choose between the nation and Thaksin," PAD adviser Pipop Thongchai said in reference to undecided voters and those planned not to vote.

Pipop said he counted on voters to put the country back on course by ending the Thaksin legacy via the rejection of the PPP.

The PAD convoy will lead a daily march til Saturday to encourage voters to cast ballots for any other parties than the PPP. It has scheduled pass through crowded places in Silom, the Victory Monument, Sanam Luang, Bang Kapi, Suan Luang, Bang Khen and the Ma Boon Krong shopping complex.

- The Nation

[blaze]

Pro-Thaksin candidate keeps a low profile ahead of Thai polls

BURIRAM, Thailand : Prakit Poldeeh, a supporter of deposed Thai premier Thaksin Shinawatra, is keeping a low profile as he campaigns for this month's elections under the military's watchful eyes.

"This is the most difficult campaign for me," said 59-year-old Prakit, who is running for his seventh term in parliament in Sunday's polls, the first since last year's coup ousting Thaksin.

"Election rules are so unclear that I can't really do much. I've opted to stay quiet for fear of violating the rules. Instead of me going out, I send volunteers to voters to explain my policy," he told AFP at his office.

Prakit is running for the People Power Party (PPP), which was taken over by members of Thaksin's disbanded Thai Rak Thai (Thais Love Thais) party.

A military-appointed court dissolved Thaksin's party in late May for election fraud.

The court also banned Thaksin and 110 Thai Rak Thai officials from politics for five years.

Since the 2006 coup, the ousted premier, a self-made billionaire, has been in exile in London where he has bought Manchester City football club.

While the junta says the polls will restore democracy, observers ask how free and fair the elections can be when about one-third of Thailand, mainly Thaksin's strongholds such as Buriram, is still under martial law.

"The coup government wants to block PPP from winning," Prakit says, adding authorities have yet to allow him to display campaign billboards even though those of opposition candidates are seen across this rural province.

"I am still waiting for permission on the billboards. What can I do?" shrugs the softly spoken man.

While no troops or tanks are seen in the streets of Buriram, about 410 kilometres (250 miles) northeast of Bangkok, Prakit says soldiers, often disguised as villagers, come to his town meetings with voters.

"I am under pressure from 'observers,'" the candidate says, referring to soldiers.

"They record my speeches. Villagers told me they are afraid to go to my meetings because of the presence of soldiers. I can't really go out to meet villagers," he sighs.

When Prakit ventured out for campaigning on one Saturday afternoon, he spoke for just five minutes in front of around 50 voters, mostly farmers.

"Thank you for your support, and please vote for me," he said, wearing a blue shirt and jeans with a colourful scarf around his waist in a traditional Thai style.

The small crowd cheered and clapped. After the brief speech, one villager offered Prakit a drink.

The scene was in stark contrast to that at a recent event in the campaign by Thailand's oldest political outfit, the Democrat Party, which aims to make inroads into Thaksin's electoral bases such as Buriram.

When Democrat candidate Chaiwat Sinsuwong spoke on the top of his campaign pick-up truck here, not a single voter showed up to see him.

The 58-year-old man was visibly angry when asked about campaigning in the pro-Thaksin province, only saying: "This is no longer Thaksin's stronghold."

Not so for Kiean Pawasri, a 55-year-old farmer, who was among the crowd during Prakit's speech.

"I will vote for PPP because PPP will carry on Thaksin's policy to help the poor," he said, adding: "I want Thaksin to come back and work for us again."

Thaksin led his party to two election victories on the back of strong support among farmers as he launched populist measures - debt relief, investment funds and cheap medical care - in a bid to boost the rural economy.

Most of Thailand's 64 million population live in rural areas.

But average monthly household income in impoverished Buriram, whose main business is rice farming, still stands at just 7,800 baht (about US$200), roughly a quarter of the 30,000 baht average in Bangkok, according to official statistics.

A 31-year-old elementary school teacher with a baby also said she would vote for Prakit.

"I support PPP. I know which party is good for our country," said the woman, who declined to be named, as she chatted with villagers at Prakit's campaign stop.

Prakit says he is confident of victory in the December elections.

"Although coup leaders use tricks against us, and want people to get confused about the elections, I know villagers support me," he said.

"Villagers want PPP to win so that the party can work for them. I am ready to work for them," Prakit said. - AFP/ch

Source http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stories/afp.../317992/1/.html

Thank you for posting this John. It would certainly seem, if Prakit is to be believed, that the CNS 'secret document' which the EC claims was never acted upon- was indeed- acted upon. And is still in force.

Despite the consistency of his allegations with similar ones referring to PPP harassments around the country, it is possible that Prakit is lying. But since this reflects the espoused goals and methods in the not so secret document...

Edited December 19, 2007 by blaze

[sriracha john]

Ex-MPs' children to run in poll

Ruengwit Lik [TRT Banned #98], a former Kamphaeng Phet MP, said he would also field his son Pai, 28.

Praising his son, Ruengwit said Pai was good-looking and could become a model.

"Pai has accompanied me on campaigns since he was young, he absorbed politics from me. I am not worried about him contesting the election. I believe in his abilities," he said.

"My constituency base is strong - it might be enough to send him to Parliament."

Wisaradee Techatheerawat, 25, daughter of former Chiang Rai MP Wisarn Techatheerawat [TRT Banned #99], said she was confident of being elected because residents of the northern province still supported Thai Rak Thai and ousted premier Thaksin Shinawatra.

She said her father was her role model and inspired her to become a politician. "I have seen people ask for help from my father - I want to help them as my father did," she said. Following her father's political ban, she said she sought to change crisis into opportunity by meeting PPP secretary-general Surapong Suebwonglee and offering herself as a candidate.

Wisaradee denied that she was her father's nominee.

"I have to prove that I can do it. I chose my [campaign] staff and introduced myself to local residents."

She was also a member of the anti-coup group that held rallies at Sanam Luang earlier this year.

"People want Thaksin to come back. But they like Khun Samak [sundaravej] too," she said, referring to the PPP leader who is seen as Thaksin's representative.

Thaksin niece joins the fray

Chinnicha Wongsawat, a 26-year-old niece of ousted prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra (TRT Banned #1), will be contesting the general election in Chiang Mai.

Even though 100 million baht in her bank accounts has been frozen - the Assets Examination Committee suspects the money was part of the proceeds from the sale of Shin Corp to Singapore's Temasek Holdings - Chinnicha said it would not affect her campaign.

*above issue is covered here*:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?sh...p;#entry1630511

AEC Freezes Thaksin's Assets, Proceeds From Shin Corp Sale

Additionally, she might not need it so much anyway as Money & Banking Magazine listed her as 64th on Thailand's 500 Richest People list with 760 million baht, while her siblings Chayapha and Yoschanant had 645 million baht and 636 million baht, respectively.

"I think it is a different issue. Politics is politics, while the case is in the justice system. Therefore it should not be linked," she said.

Chinnicha says she has no need to make people understand the controversial case, adding she has talked to voters as a candidate who wants to serve the country.

Chinnicha is the daughter of Thaksin's younger sister, former TRT MP Yaowapa Wongsawat (TRT Banned #13).

She has been known as businesswoman but when her mother was banned from politics, she decided to quit business and enter politics.

Chinnicha denies she is a nominee of Yaowapa and claims that being a niece of Thaksin will not give her an advantage.

His niece... his lawyer.... and now... his sister-in-law....

People's Power Party Ready for Election Race

The People's Power Party shrugged off any allegations of being representatives of the now-defunct Thai Rak Thai Party, and said it is ready to fight head-on in the South.

Apart from its Southern candidates, the PPP also disclosed the names of 32 female contenders – 17 of them former MPs or related to former Thai Rak Thai executives who were banned from the December 23 election.

Among the female candidates are Karuna Chidchob, the wife of former Buriram MP, Newin Chidchob (TRT Banned #6), and Sriyada Shinawatra, who is the sister-in-law of deposed Premier Thaksin Shinawatra (TRT Banned #1).

- Thailand Outlook

========================================================================

The sis-in-law of Thaksin didn't fair so well last time out, the 2006 elections, when she lost by nearly a 4 to 1 margin to......

uhmm... errrr... ahhhh......

no one running.

From the the thaivisa thread:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?sh...mp;#entry703743

I Will Not Resign: Thaksin

Thai Rak Thai flops in Phuket poll

PHUKET: -- Thai Rak Thai Party (TRT) candidate Dr Sriyada Palimapan has failed in her bid to be elected Member of Parliament for Phuket District 1.

Dr Sriyada garnered a total of 11,910 votes, but these were far outweighed by the 41,903 “no votes” cast by voters in District 1.

--Phuket Gazette 2006-03-03

==========================================================================

Here's a photo of the cosmetic dentist who wants to be MP:

Sriyada Shinawatra

The parade of kinfolk of TRT banished-ees continues for PPP....

Wikran in 'for the good of the nation'

Wikran Suphamongkol, the 27-year-old nephew of former Foreign Minister Kantathi Suphamongkol (TRT Banned #31), has decided to jump into the fray with the People Power Party.

He said his decision came after he watched his clients suffer from the economic slowdown. "I used to run a financial company and many of my clients went bankrupt because of the economic situation," he explained. He said he has had an eye on politics for a while now, but wasn't able to join in because he was studying.

Wikran said he wanted to follow in his uncle's footsteps. His other role model is Samak Sundaravej. :D

Wikran admits that he is fresh in this field, has no supporters and will have to rely on senior party members to help him canvass for votes.

More and more and more and more of the same.....

Banned TRT politicians fielding relatives

Nakhon Ratchasima- The election is a family business in this province where several former TRT MPs serving a five year ban from politics are fielding their wives, children or brothers in their stead. Former MP's Pairoj Suwanchawee (TRT Banned #69), Chamlong Krutkhunthod (TRT Banned #32), Suporn Atthawong (TRT Banned #48), and Prachathipatai Kamsingnok (TRT Banned #66) are pinning their hopes on their relatives, putting them up as candidates for the People Power Party (PPP) or Puea Pandin. They have to compete with the Ruam Jai Thai Chart Pattana Party, which is considered the strongest in the province. Nakhon Ratchasima has the most seats at stake anywhere outside Bangkok, with 16 up for grabs. Pairoj has fielded his wife, Ranongrak, and his oldest son, Polapee, 25, as candidates under the Puea Pandin banner. Chamlong has entered his younger brother, Boonlert, with PPP and Suporn his elder brother, Samphat also with the PPP. The PPP has also given Prachathipatai's son, Voarakorn, the chance to contest.

Continued here:

http://www.bangkokpost.net/News/19Dec2007_news06.php

Edited December 19, 2007 by sriracha john

[John K]

ELECTION OUTCOME

Rivals warn of clashes

Regardless of who wins, large and volatile rallies are likely, leaders say

No matter who wins the election, things will be far from peaceful as two rival groups are threatening to rally against each other if their favourites fail.

The People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) has threatened to stage a rally if the People Power Party gets to form a government and whitewash former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra's past.

Meanwhile, if the Democrats' win is considered doubtful by the pro-Thaksin camp, the Democratic Alliance Against Dictatorship (DAAD) will stand up and protest.

PAD spokesman Suriyasai Katasila, who is also secretary-general of the Popular Campaign for Democracy, said the PAD would not rally if the PPP wins, but will definitely create a ruckus if Samak Sundaravej uses legal devices to clear Thaksin.

Suriyasai said he had listened carefully to PPP's addresses, most of which concentrated on promising people that the party would work to clear Thaksin's name.

"The PPP has tried to distort facts. They have not told people about the damage that [Thaksin] inflicted upon the country, so if the next government uses its power to help Thaksin, we will rally again," he said.

Any rallies would be peaceful, he said, though the feeling was that they would be vastly bigger than previous anti-Thaksin turnouts.

The PAD yesterday launched a convoy to drum up opposition to the PPP, which is widely considered the proxy party of Thaksin.

"It is time for the silent majority to choose between the nation and Thaksin," PAD adviser Pipob Thongchai said in reference to undecided voters and those who don't plan to vote.

Pipob said he counted on voters to put the country back on track by ending the Thaksin legacy and rejecting the PPP.

DAAD co-leader Natthawut Sai-kua said the alliance wanted this election to be fair and that they had encouraged people opposing the coup to come out and vote.

He said the DAAD would not launch any campaigns unless it considers the poll results as unfair.

"We can accept it if the Democrats win the election, but it has to prove that the votes came from real people not other powers," he said.

Though Natthawut is a party-list candidate for PPP, he still works with the DAAD camp, and believes his party will win. "There is no way that the Democrats will win, but if they miraculously do, then we will have to prove that they did not get support from anything other than the people."

President of the Federation for Democracy, Weng Tojirakarn, who is also a DAAD leader, said he and his allies would not take a stand against the PAD because they had the constitutional right to rally.

However, he said, he believed the people could decide for themselves if they wanted to support the PAD or not.

"For us, we respect all the votes, whether they go to the PPP or the Democrats, and we won't go against them because we want to see democracy return to the country. Our campaign is calling on people to 'come out to vote and make the coup extinct'," Weng said.

He said the Federation for Democracy would also monitor the elections for fraud. "Tomorrow we will meet the Election Commission to tell them that we will observe the process of voting," he said.

Meanwhile, Kraiwan Kasemsin, chairman of the Taxi Club in Mor Chit and Don Muang, said his group would not stir up the sentiments of taxi drivers to rally like the PAD.

He said he disagreed with PAD's plan, adding the people's choice should be respected, even if it results in the PPP winning. However, he said, if the PAD disagreed with the election result and insisted on rallying against it, his group and allies were ready for clashes, he said.

"We are showing that we respect the people's voice. Why can't the PAD do the same?"

A taxi driver, who declined to be named, said most taxi drivers had posted stickers supporting the PPP because they all know it is actually the now-defunct Thai Rak Thai.

"The Thai Rak Thai government had policies that helped taxi drivers. It impressed us, so most drivers want to show that they still love Thaksin and are ready to vote for PPP," he said.

The Nation

[John K]

This certainly is not good news. About the only way this can be avoided would be for the EC to disqualify the PPP/TRT/Thaksin group. This also is tied to the added security previously mentioned and unfortunately to my earlier prediction about potential bombs during the new year celebrations.

[Plus]

if Prakit is to be believed, that the CNS 'secret document' which the EC claims was never acted upon- was indeed- acted upon. And is still in force.

Despite the consistency of his allegations with similar ones referring to PPP harassments around the country, it is possible that Prakit is lying. But since this reflects the espoused goals and methods in the not so secret document...

Prakit is lying? He didn't say anything - recording candidates speeches is not harassement, soldiers coming to his rallies is not harassement. What is he complaining about? Has he got something to hide from those soldeirs? Would he say different things if it was off record? In that case I wish ALL speeches throughout the country were recorded.

Using Thaksin's name while campaigning was illegal from the staert, wasn't it? After all he has been banned and PPP officially has no links to him.

[John K]

It is all spin, he never would have been allowed to talk to the press in this tone if Thaksin did not give the OK.

[hammered]

At this point you cant believe anything the PPP or the Junta say. This is a pure power push for winner takes all and both sides are using whatever powe they have to influence the outcome. It is wrong tio think the Junta is not using state power (just as TRT did in past elections according to some of its ex-MPs) and it is wrong to think the PPP have not bought lots of feudal overseer MPs and have not paid for votes and have also not tried to get class ten types to influence bits of the state they can. That is reality. There was no way this election wa sever going to be left to people to make informed decisions as too much was at stake for Thaksin and his opponents. Persoanlly I doubt the election will solve anything and both sides will have totally legitimate reasons to complain about the outcome and of course neither side or their supporters will admit to their own manipulations. A recipe for disaster, and a country far far from reconcilliation which can probably only be achieved by all the main protagonists being removed from the politcal scene completely which is unlikely to happen as they all want the pie and will do anything to get it.

[marshbags]

When most political parties do not take their "policies" seriously, why should the media treat them any differently.

Why should the media discuss policies when the parties promoting them avoid doing so?

Do you want them to analyse ridiculous ideas like turning Samut Prakan into Nice or quadrupling tourist arrivals through already congested Suwarnabhumi?

What's the point of asking what would Matchima or Pua Paendindo if it gets elected? At most they will get one or two insignificant portfolios and they have no idea which ones.

I don't see it as a media problem.

Yes that's true. But regardless of the parties, the challenges remain: what is the direction for tourism, say- and the reporters should be demanding that the polititians answer that- this would mean the reporters would have to do a lot of homework- but it would also mean the the politicos would have to start thinking a bit more about issues.

Too often- the most challenging question that reporters demand is "So what made you decide to get into politics?" "Or how do you feel about vote buying"? Sheesh!

Remember that incisive interview with Abhsit last year- in either the post or the Nation where the most eloquently answered question was "So who is your favorite band?" (answer: REM)

But I'll go a bit farther- the almost obsessive focus by the media on vote buying in this election- I think, may be serving a specific purpose. Intentional or not- I don't know. But it certainly serves to support the notion that Thais aren't ready for elections. That both voters and polititians are too corrupt. And that notion of course plays right into the hands of those who prefer 'guided democracy'.

Spend a bit of time at any election in any of the villages up North where my wifes family are and youll recognise that the media are not concentrating enough on vote buying. Sadly neither it seems are the EC. There is not a single doubt in my mind that the number of seats the PPP gets will be increased by a bit of purchasing power, and that is not based on any Nation report equally as it wont be swayed by somethign that some willy nilly academic PPP apologist said, but direct observation. If you happen to know any ex-TRT politicos well enough to socialise with you can also get their side on the effectiveness of this.

I of course can't argue with anecdote. It is alarming though, that given the extent of vote buying- given the rewards for turning in the guilty- not a case has yet been proved. I can't believe that the EC is simply turning a blind eye- one of its mandates is to stamp out vote buying- and they can't find any? Yet you can? Are they that ineffective? If so- get rid of them quick.

If the army with all its resources- the police- the EC- ISOC- is impotent in the face of this scourge there is no hope for the country- not because of vote buying but because the authorities are useless.

I can back Hammered up regarding the vote buying and have to say it is happening in several provinces within the North / North East ect. ect. ecttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttt.

Blaze highlights, the seemingly lack of will to solve the problem that is as wide spread now as it was in previous elections, possibly more so when you consider what,s at stake for certain unethical PUYAI

Monetary Persuation...........

It has been ongoing by the way since a certain PPP official paid a courtesy call to Udonthani and they were handing out 500 baht notes in town that i posted on previously ????

Now my M.Ban is at the present time handing out GIFTS to the local community members who are now encouraged to vote for the surrogate party.

I know the lady with the priviledge of doing this ( for an even bigger / mega gift ) and the majority of the village know her and what is happening as well, as it,s much publicised.

I might add that this particular giver of monies, was one of the less well off within the M Ban until the local TRT / PPP supporters started using her place for local activities and meetings and since then she has amazingly been able to do substantial improvements to her house, open a shop and is now quite wealthy by local standards.

Her house is adjacent to the local " PUYAI Ban or PRA CHUM ???? by the way, as my wife has tried to explain in detail when i enquired further just now.

My wife also says there are several of her friends waiting to receive these welcomed gifts.

100 baht notes in this instance she tells me, not 500 baht.

It,s so blatant and arrogantly open and for sure is not kept secretive.

Messages are being passed on by locals within the community to those who are among the choosen die hards who have not got theirs, to go and collect their money.

Now should the will really be there then surely it could have been dealt with already.

I just wonder once again if the powers that be are purposely storing this evidence and waiting for the outcome of the elections.

Should the PPP win / be in a position to govern, the E.C. can then come forward with the evidence, suspend the results ( a legal non violent way as against a military one ) with the election laws / constitution supporting them, to enable BOTH groups to be thus disbanded.

Both, being the alleged banned TRT and it,s members, along with the PPP and it,s already banned advisors who are financing them with past T money that they managed to cream off during their reign of governance.

marshbags

P.S.

My wife is not and never has been one of the beneficiaries due to her open distaste for the parties and refusing past offers of monies, shirts, jackets ect .ect.

I am pleased to add she is no longer alone in her thoughts and distrust of these officials and what in real terms all the so called benefits the rural areas have gained as against what the corrupt officials got out of it all.

Edited December 19, 2007 by marshbags

[hammered]

When most political parties do not take their "policies" seriously, why should the media treat them any differently.

Why should the media discuss policies when the parties promoting them avoid doing so?

Do you want them to analyse ridiculous ideas like turning Samut Prakan into Nice or quadrupling tourist arrivals through already congested Suwarnabhumi?

What's the point of asking what would Matchima or Pua Paendindo if it gets elected? At most they will get one or two insignificant portfolios and they have no idea which ones.

I don't see it as a media problem.

Yes that's true. But regardless of the parties, the challenges remain: what is the direction for tourism, say- and the reporters should be demanding that the polititians answer that- this would mean the reporters would have to do a lot of homework- but it would also mean the the politicos would have to start thinking a bit more about issues.

Too often- the most challenging question that reporters demand is "So what made you decide to get into politics?" "Or how do you feel about vote buying"? Sheesh!

Remember that incisive interview with Abhsit last year- in either the post or the Nation where the most eloquently answered question was "So who is your favorite band?" (answer: REM)

But I'll go a bit farther- the almost obsessive focus by the media on vote buying in this election- I think, may be serving a specific purpose. Intentional or not- I don't know. But it certainly serves to support the notion that Thais aren't ready for elections. That both voters and polititians are too corrupt. And that notion of course plays right into the hands of those who prefer 'guided democracy'.

Spend a bit of time at any election in any of the villages up North where my wifes family are and youll recognise that the media are not concentrating enough on vote buying. Sadly neither it seems are the EC. There is not a single doubt in my mind that the number of seats the PPP gets will be increased by a bit of purchasing power, and that is not based on any Nation report equally as it wont be swayed by somethign that some willy nilly academic PPP apologist said, but direct observation. If you happen to know any ex-TRT politicos well enough to socialise with you can also get their side on the effectiveness of this.

I of course can't argue with anecdote. It is alarming though, that given the extent of vote buying- given the rewards for turning in the guilty- not a case has yet been proved. I can't believe that the EC is simply turning a blind eye- one of its mandates is to stamp out vote buying- and they can't find any? Yet you can? Are they that ineffective? If so- get rid of them quick.

If the army with all its resources- the police- the EC- ISOC- is impotent in the face of this scourge there is no hope for the country- not because of vote buying but because the authorities are useless.

I can back Hammered up regarding the vote buying and have to say it is happening in several provinces within the North / North East ect. ect. ecttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttt.

Blaze highlights, the seemingly lack of will to solve the problem that is as wide spread now as it was in previous elections, possibly more so when you consider what,s at stake for certain unethical PUYAI

Monetary Persuation...........

It has been ongoing by the way since a certain PPP official paid a courtesy call to Udonthani and they were handing out 500 baht notes in town that i posted on previously ????

Now my M.Ban is at the present time handing out GIFTS to the local community members who are now encouraged to vote for the surrogate party.

I know the lady with the priviledge of doing this ( for an even bigger / mega gift ) and the majority of the village know her and what is happening as well, as it,s much publicised.

I might add that this particular giver of monies, was one of the less well off within the M Ban until the local TRT / PPP supporters started using her place for local activities and meetings and since then she has amazingly been able to do substantial improvements to her house, open a shop and is now quite wealthy by local standards.

Her house is adjacent to the local " PUYAI Ban or PRA CHUM ???? by the way, as my wife has tried to explain in detail when i enquired further just now.

My wife also says there are several of her friends waiting to receive these welcomed gifts.

100 baht notes in this instance she tells me, not 500 baht.

It,s so blatant and arrogantly open and for sure is not kept secretive.

Messages are being passed on by locals within the community to those who are among the choosen die hards who have not got theirs, to go and collect their money.

Now should the will really be there then surely it could have been dealt with already.

I just wonder once again if the powers that be are purposely storing this evidence and waiting for the outcome of the elections.

Should the PPP win / be in a position to govern, the E.C. can then come forward with the evidence, suspend the results ( a legal non violent way as against a military one ) with the election laws / constitution supporting them, to enable BOTH groups to be thus disbanded.

Both, being the alleged banned TRT and it,s members, along with the PPP and it,s already banned advisors who are financing them with past T money that they managed to cream off during their reign of governance.

marshbags

P.S.

My wife is not and never has been one of the beneficiaries due to her open distaste for the parties and refusing past offers of monies, shirts, jackets ect .ect.

I am pleased to add she is no longer alone in her thoughts and distrust of these officials and what in real terms all the so called benefits the rural areas have gained as against what the corrupt officials got out of it all.

Marshbags your detailed account is very very similar to what I have seen right down to how one of the poorer in the village became immensely rich and powerful on th eback of TRT canvassing linked in his case with a bunch of unharrassed ya-ba selling I would also add that the local police also seem to at least turn a blind eye if not more and that in itself may not help with catching what is going on.

Persoanlly I do not have your faith in the EC doing much about what is still a fairly open practice.

Thanks for the detail

[marshbags]

Hiya Hammered,

I to have similar thoughts relating to the outcome should the eventuality occur.

One thing that keeps holding me back on this is the thought that, in reality should it be so.......

What the f*** was the last year and all that took place during it all about, and in purpose of what.

Surely i keep telling myself, they haven,t gone to that trouble to hand it back to them on a plate.

Also more importantly all the blood letting vendetta,s that would surely take place, if this scenario was to unfold.

I would also like to say that this was one of the reasons i no longer get too involved in the debates like i used to.

So many things happening that i cannot relate to, and do not have logical answers to, that are in a similar context to the above.

Kinda demoralised by what Thaksin and his ilk have been doing i,m sad to say.

God help the younger generations if he is allowed to walk back in and pick up were he left off !!!!!!!

Shame on all those who voice their phoney love of their country, while displaying the opposite for anticipated self rewarding outcomes.

They are constantly undermining the present authorities, middle classes and the poor who while not all perfect ( whoever say they are and that includes all of us, are liars ) are generally decent Thai people and loyal citizens, in the true sense of what loyalty to their country proudly means.

marshbags

P.S.

By the way, did they ban loudspeakers as i was led to believe, while only displaying the candidates and playing music when going around ??????

The,re gradually building up to more than the isolated case as we get nearer to the 23rd., if this is the case.

If so then they haven,t heard of it around my M.Ban and the localities.

marshbags

Edited December 19, 2007 by marshbags

[Plus]

Whatever people say, the traditional "elites" define this country, its ideology, its policies, stability and consistency. Thaksin enjoyed elite's backing all the way until last year, if there was a schism, no one took it seriously.

The coup brought confrontation up for everyone to see. Suddently the country is divided into two irreconcilable camps, and if the power slips away form the elites, no one knows what the consequences would be. For one thing they are not going down quitely, another is future policy direction.

Who is taking over the country? Outside of rural areas PPP has absolutely no credibility, if nutty rightwingers backed up by former communists, campaigning not on policies but on the name of a political convict come to power - what kind of message does it send to the outside world?

They public promises are simply unbelievable, people will start asking - where is this country going?

It's better to be quiet and appear stupid than open your mouth and remove all doubt - in this case Thailand is going to expose itself to the whole world as a self-destructing country.

[Tony Clifton]

Whatever people say, the traditional "elites" define this country, its ideology, its policies, stability and consistency. Thaksin enjoyed elite's backing all the way until last year, if there was a schism, no one took it seriously.

The coup brought confrontation up for everyone to see. Suddently the country is divided into two irreconcilable camps, and if the power slips away form the elites, no one knows what the consequences would be. For one thing they are not going down quitely, another is future policy direction.

Who is taking over the country? Outside of rural areas PPP has absolutely no credibility, if nutty rightwingers backed up by former communists, campaigning not on policies but on the name of a political convict come to power - what kind of message does it send to the outside world?

They public promises are simply unbelievable, people will start asking - where is this country going?

It's better to be quiet and appear stupid than open your mouth and remove all doubt - in this case Thailand is going to expose itself to the whole world as a self-destructing country.

One ridiculous campaign promise by Noppadon yesterday, yes, Thaksin's lawyer, was on the news.

With the ridiculous promise to increase tourism by pumping in to 45 million tourists per year, Noppadon said that every tourist would spend 70,000 baht per day. Oh the insanity.

[sriracha john]

Abhisit reaffirms alliance with Chart Thai

Democrat Party Leader Abhisit Vejjajiva reaffirmed his political alliance with Banharn Silpa-archa yesterday by announcing his party's intention to team up with Chart Thai to form the next government after the election. He made the announcement during a debate among key politicians from five political parties three days before voters go to the polls amid speculation that Chart Thai is being courted again by the People Power party (PPP). The debate was organised by the Bangkok Post and its partners. The speakers were posed various questions, one of them focusing on the make-up of the next government. ''I won't beat around the bush. The first party I'll phone will be Chart Thai because we have stuck together through thick and thin,'' Mr Abhisit said, drawing a cheer from Chart Thai supporters in the conference room. Mingkwan Sangsuwan, the PPP economic chief who was asked the question before Mr Abhisit, had also declined to give a direct answer to it. He said that it was the business of PPP leader Samak Sundaravej.

Continued here:

http://www.bangkokpost.net/News/20Dec2007_news02.php

==================================================================

Shame the PPP decided to send a representative to a debate who can't speak for the PPP.

Too bad they didn't have a video-link to London for the debate, then they could have asked the PPP Party Leader directly.

Edited December 20, 2007 by sriracha john

[marshbags]

Whatever people say, the traditional "elites" define this country, its ideology, its policies, stability and consistency. Thaksin enjoyed elite's backing all the way until last year, if there was a schism, no one took it seriously.

The coup brought confrontation up for everyone to see. Suddently the country is divided into two irreconcilable camps, and if the power slips away form the elites, no one knows what the consequences would be. For one thing they are not going down quitely, another is future policy direction.

Who is taking over the country? Outside of rural areas PPP has absolutely no credibility, if nutty rightwingers backed up by former communists, campaigning not on policies but on the name of a political convict come to power - what kind of message does it send to the outside world?

They public promises are simply unbelievable, people will start asking - where is this country going?

It's better to be quiet and appear stupid than open your mouth and remove all doubt - in this case Thailand is going to expose itself to the whole world as a self-destructing country.

One ridiculous campaign promise by Noppadon yesterday, yes, Thaksin's lawyer, was on the news.

With the ridiculous promise to increase tourism by pumping in to 45 million tourists per year, Noppadon said that every tourist would spend 70,000 baht per day. Oh the insanity.

Come on T.C., he had stuttering attack while he was putting this across, he meant 70 baht per day and added the extra 3 zeros to his notes.

marshbags

[ando]

Whatever people say, the traditional "elites" define this country, its ideology, its policies, stability and consistency. Thaksin enjoyed elite's backing all the way until last year, if there was a schism, no one took it seriously.

The coup brought confrontation up for everyone to see. Suddently the country is divided into two irreconcilable camps, and if the power slips away form the elites, no one knows what the consequences would be. For one thing they are not going down quitely, another is future policy direction.

Durrrr... Its called democracy my good man. Its when the people get to elect the government they want. Its when people vote to elect a government to represent them and each persons vote is worth the same (or there abouts) whether they are rich or poor. Its what the rest of the democratic world does in places like USA, UK, Canada, Germany, Australia etc, etc.......

The old argument propagated by the corrupt elite (and military) ruling class that the poor peasants votes shouldn't count for anything is exactly the same argument that people like Hitler, Pol Pot and Idie Amin put forward. How on earth are the MAJORITY poor peasant class ever going to become politically wise if they are kept down in poverty with poor education and little chance of ever bettering their position in life?

Should the country be managed solely by an educated corrupt ruling class elite who gain their power and status through exploitation of the poor masses? That's the way it worked centuries ago in feudal England and Europe. The educated elite ruling over the peasant class and keeping them down by use of military force. Its basically slavery by another name. Something the western world moved on from a long time ago. And I am sure it was a painful, slow process with lots of hiccoughs along the way that has led to a situation where common people like you and me enjoy a fair and reasonable share in our countries wealth today.

The rural peasant class may be uneducated, through no fault of their own, but they are not stupid. Sure they are going to vote for the candidate who offers them the best deal. Don't you? I do, and I am sure almost all voters in a democracy do.

The transition from a society where the majority poor peasant class is ruled over and held down by a minority elite into a true democracy where all citizens have an equal say in who will govern the country is not going to be a smooth transition. But in the end it will be to the benefit of the country as a whole. Perverting and distorting democracy to maintain power by the ruling class elite in the face of ever mounting pressure for true democracy can only have one of two outcomes in the end. Either the country moves over to a true western style democracy, or it moves to an absolute dictatorship like Burma in order to keep the masses at bay.

Thailand is in transition and the peasant majority want a voice in government. The military, endorsed by the elite ruling class, are managing to hold back the tide of true democracy at the moment, but there will come a time where they will either have to get out of the way or take absolute control long term. Tinkering with the laws, the government, the constitution and the judiciary will not maintain power for the elite and their military cronies in the long term. Rather it will only prolong the agony of transition to a true democracy. Admittedly, Thailands almost universal culture of corruption doesnt help much either and just gives further political amunition to draw the process out even further.

Wake up and look at the bigger picture.

[Ricardo]

Too bad they didn't have a video-link to London for the debate, then they could have asked the PPP Party Leader directly.

But he is surely up in Manchester, working 25-hour days, managing his new business & promoting the give-aways of Thai foods ?

Edited December 20, 2007 by Ricardo

[hammered]

Whatever people say, the traditional "elites" define this country, its ideology, its policies, stability and consistency. Thaksin enjoyed elite's backing all the way until last year, if there was a schism, no one took it seriously.

The coup brought confrontation up for everyone to see. Suddently the country is divided into two irreconcilable camps, and if the power slips away form the elites, no one knows what the consequences would be. For one thing they are not going down quitely, another is future policy direction.

Who is taking over the country? Outside of rural areas PPP has absolutely no credibility, if nutty rightwingers backed up by former communists, campaigning not on policies but on the name of a political convict come to power - what kind of message does it send to the outside world?

They public promises are simply unbelievable, people will start asking - where is this country going?

It's better to be quiet and appear stupid than open your mouth and remove all doubt - in this case Thailand is going to expose itself to the whole world as a self-destructing country.

I think we get to see what will happen quite soon. Persoanlly I now think the PPP has good chance of getting the 241+ seats needed to govern on their own. Although no fan at all of that motley crew it may even be the best thing for the country if they do get into power. A lot of those who voted for them may well be disappointed when they see they cannot work economic miracles with the world possibly moving into recession and Thai unskilled labour no longer competetive in a globalised market. It may also be that they cannot just bring Thaksin back triumphantly as promised - seperation of powers etc. Will the PPP also be able to go after the generals? Well they may not even try until they can get a few reshuffles under their belts and even Thaksin with all his power and havuing stuffed all the vital Bangkok based units with his cronies was ousted by a coup.

If itr werent for the questions of pardfons, revenge etc it is quite likely most parties wouldnt want to win the next election and oversee a time of economic headaches and if instability continues a complete lack of investment outside of what the government itself can throw into the pot.

[Plus]

Whatever people say, the traditional "elites" define this country, its ideology, its policies, stability and consistency. Thaksin enjoyed elite's backing all the way until last year, if there was a schism, no one took it seriously.

The coup brought confrontation up for everyone to see. Suddently the country is divided into two irreconcilable camps, and if the power slips away form the elites, no one knows what the consequences would be. For one thing they are not going down quitely, another is future policy direction.

Durrrr... Its called democracy my good man.

You missed the point, it means overturning decades of tradition and starting a completely new, unchartered course. It doesn't really matter if the change is brought up by democratic means or not - Thailand will become very unpredictable and very unstable, swinging from military conservative governments to populist yahoo governments and back in a matter of months.

On one hand people will congratulate Thailand for allowing these change to happen through ballot box, on the other hand they'll start asking questions - who are these people, can we rely on them, will this new regime last, and who is really in charge?

The first thing they'll discover is that the luntaics took charge of the asylum.

Pupper government of Samak and Co. is the worst possible choice to present to the outside world. Being elected democratically says a lot about the whole nation, too.