Eliquis and strong exercise

[ozimoron]

@Sheryl

 

I take Eliquis for a Portal Venous Thrombosis 3 years ago. One complication was varicose veins around the espohagus. I haven't had any issues since.

 

I have signed up for a program with a personal trainer at a gym (The Brick)  in Pattaya, starting today. I'm wondering whether intensive exercise or lifting weights possibly leading to bleeding muscles poses a significant risk?

 

I am on Irbesartan since 25 years and have well controlled BP, around 135 / 84.

Edited December 17, 2022 by ozimoron

[Sheryl]

Actually a BP of 135/84 is not optimally controlled but borderline hypertensive. You might want to reconsider either the dose of irbesartan or other measures such as weight loss. Exercise will likley help as well.

 

There is no reason why a proper program of exercise should cause bleeding in the muscles or anywhere else. Build up gradually of course.

[ozimoron]

2 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

Actually a BP of 135/84 is not optimally controlled but borderline hypertensive. You might want to reconsider either the dose of irbesartan or other measures such as weight loss. Exercise will likley help as well.

 

There is no reason why a proper program of exercise should cause bleeding in the muscles or anywhere else. Build up gradually of course.

I'm always told that BP  is fine although I know it should be closer to 120 over 70 odd. I take 150 mg so there is room to up the dosage. I'm hoping a decent exercise routine will bring that down. I do a lot of walking as it is ( I don't own a vehicle in Pattaya so as to force me to walk) but that's about it.

 

Thanks for your much valued input.

[Sheryl]

1 minute ago, ozimoron said:

I'm always told that BP  is fine although I know it should be closer to 120 over 70 odd. I take 150 mg so there is room to up the dosage. I'm hoping a decent exercise routine will bring that down. I do a lot of walking as it is ( I don't own a vehicle in Pattaya so as to force me to walk) but that's about it.

 

Thanks for your much valued input.

Thai health providers are several decades behind the times on this and still tell people anything below 140/90 is fine. It is not.

https://www.health.harvard.edu/heart-health/reading-the-new-blood-pressure-guidelines

[HuskerDo2]

Just now, Sheryl said:

Thai health providers are several decades behind the times on this and still tell people anything below 140/90 is fine. It is not.

https://www.health.harvard.edu/heart-health/reading-the-new-blood-pressure-guidelines

These Harvard numbers look right but I was told by a cardiologist that the upper number can shoot up just from walking down the hallway. He said the lower number was more important. Also, if you take your BP in the morning expect it to be higher. He said that's just the way the human body works. He suggested taking the BP every day late afternoon before dinner on a regular basis to get a better idea of what your real BP rate is. If you are upset, stressed, had a cup of coffee, etc it will be higher than normal. 

[Sheryl]

15 minutes ago, HuskerDo2 said:

These Harvard numbers look right but I was told by a cardiologist that the upper number can shoot up just from walking down the hallway. He said the lower number was more important. Also, if you take your BP in the morning expect it to be higher. He said that's just the way the human body works. He suggested taking the BP every day late afternoon before dinner on a regular basis to get a better idea of what your real BP rate is. If you are upset, stressed, had a cup of coffee, etc it will be higher than normal. 

Blood pressure naturally shoots up on exertion or any sort of stress. Even a sneeze or cough will cause a momentary (and very high) rise. These changes mainly occur in the top number (systolic). Indeed, whenever you see a very elevated systolic with a normal or near normal diastolic it is a good indication that the person is experiencing a temporary stressor of some sort - pain, anxiety, exertion etc.

 

BP should always be measured at complete rest.

[Lacessit]

I would suggest to the OP losing weight will help with the BP. It makes sense, your heart and circulatory system has less of a burden on it.

 

When I was put on telmisartan 6 years ago, my BP was 180/90. It is now 120/65, and the only medication which I take (co-incidentally for BPH) is 1 mg of Cardura.

 

Perhaps the OP should consider swimming as an alternative to heavy weight training. Less risk of injury.

Edited December 17, 2022 by Lacessit

[ozimoron]

I just completed my first hour with a personal trainer, very tiring. No heavy weights (max 2.5 Kg.), lots of stretching and mobility. I am the OP, my height is 173 cm, weight 72 Kg. Age 68.

 

My experience was very positive.

Edited December 17, 2022 by ozimoron

[BigStar]

9 hours ago, Lacessit said:

Perhaps the OP should consider swimming as an alternative to heavy weight training. Less risk of injury.

Very different. Both? Older people need strength training. It needn't be with heavy weights, and indeed the OP hasn't started with them. Could be bodyweight, isometrics, bands, or a TRX. Light weights can be lifted super slowly. One gradually works up to intensity according to capability.

 

 

[Lacessit]

10 hours ago, ozimoron said:

I just completed my first hour with a personal trainer, very tiring. No heavy weights (max 2.5 Kg.), lots of stretching and mobility. I am the OP, my height is 173 cm, weight 72 Kg. Age 68.

 

My experience was very positive.

BMI is in normal range. My guess is your personal trainer will slowly increase the weight regime.

[Lacessit]

1 hour ago, BigStar said:

Very different. Both? Older people need strength training. It needn't be with heavy weights, and indeed the OP hasn't started with them. Could be bodyweight, isometrics, bands, or a TRX. Light weights can be lifted super slowly. One gradually works up to intensity according to capability.

 

 

I am 79. I have a regime of cardio, stretching and swimming. Pushups. Climbing stairs, golf walking.

Unfortunately, I find when I start pushing on the weights side, I tend to injure myself, which defeats the purpose of the training.

I will give the super slow hint a try.

[ozimoron]

1 hour ago, BigStar said:

Very different. Both? Older people need strength training. It needn't be with heavy weights, and indeed the OP hasn't started with them. Could be bodyweight, isometrics, bands, or a TRX. Light weights can be lifted super slowly. One gradually works up to intensity according to capability.

Whatever they are. Today the heaviest weight were 2.5 Kg dumbbells. Mostly on machines. I was stuffed after an hour. Going back Monday. There was one 5 Kg exercise, lifting to full stretch from above my head. That was the hardest.

Edited December 17, 2022 by ozimoron

[BigStar]

1 hour ago, Lacessit said:

I am 79. I have a regime of cardio, stretching and swimming. Pushups. Climbing stairs, golf walking.

Unfortunately, I find when I start pushing on the weights side, I tend to injure myself, which defeats the purpose of the training.

I will give the super slow hint a try.

Not bad, doing a lot more than most people ????

 

Super slow and also static holds when the muscle is at max contraction. That way you can do fewer reps, easier on the joints. Hold 2 - 4 sec. Lighter weights, fewer reps = safety and efficiency. 

 

@ozimoronhas the advantage of a trainer; trainer sounds good so far. At my gym I sometimes wish I were a beginner, 'cause there's a really cute, very fit young lady trainer working there in her tight yoga pants, and she's good. Mostly. 

 

Form's very important. Gotta stop if you're too tired to do it correctly. Younger folks can get away with being sloppy, but we can't. Look on youtube for instruction. Athlean-X is knowledgeable. A lot of vids out there are targeted at seniors.

 

Another trick is to keep things in balance. If you do a push set, like a dumbbell press, do a corresponding pull, like a dumbbell row. A lot of problems I see on the forum--knees, hips, back--probably arise from long-term muscle imbalances.

 

Staying with lighter weights and going slowly, like 4 sec up, 4 down at minimum, helps. Get plenty of rest for the muscles worked, 3 - 4 days at least. So injuries should be minimal. May have to stop and deal with them sometimes. Happens to everyone.

 

BTW, some exercises should be avoided, but you'll see them commonly in Thai gyms. Behind the neck pulldowns, upright rows, and situps, for example. (Google unsafe exercises.) The gym has the ab crunch machine, good. Otherwise, a substitute for situps for seniors are leg raises, much easier on the back. These can be held isometrically and get hard as h.e.ll. Slider pikes are also good, esp. when combined w/ the leg raises. Hits stomach and back. I did leg raises and TRX pikes during the COVID lockdowns, and they were good to me.

 

 

Edited December 17, 2022 by BigStar

[BigStar]

14 hours ago, Lacessit said:

I will give the super slow hint a try.

BTW, be sure to keep breathing when you're lifting slowly. Less stress on the heart. You'll see a lot of enthusiastic pumpers in the gym holding their breaths during the concentric phase to make it easier, but it's only for a second or so.

 

[ozimoron]

My muscles are super sore today after 2 days following a 1 hour routine. I guess the best approach is to let the soreness dissipate before taking the plunge again? I skipped a Thai massage today for the same reason.

[Lacessit]

1 hour ago, ozimoron said:

My muscles are super sore today after 2 days following a 1 hour routine. I guess the best approach is to let the soreness dissipate before taking the plunge again? I skipped a Thai massage today for the same reason.

IMO a gentle Thai massage would be helpful, also try hot showers.

[ozimoron]

1 minute ago, Lacessit said:

IMO a gentle Thai massage would be helpful, also try hot showers.

I didn't think you could use "gentle" and "Thai massage" in the same sentence, lol. I always have showers as hot as I can tolerate.

[Lacessit]

2 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

I didn't think you could use "gentle" and "Thai massage" in the same sentence, lol. I always have showers as hot as I can tolerate.

My regular Thai massage woman is quite gentle, it is possible to train them. She says I am a holiday from the Japanese and Koreans, who exhaust her with their demands for strong massage.

[ozimoron]

It's taken until today for significant pain to recede from my triceps after my fist session. I'm going back this morning. My trainer says that it isn't necessary for muscle pain to recede before continuing training. I would have thought that the muscles should be allowed to heal first. Any thoughts?