5 hours ago, nigelforbes said:

It looks like a messy topic but probably worthwhile putting into perspective. The US EPA defines HEPA filters thusly:

 

" This type of air filter can theoretically remove at least 99.97% of dust, pollen, mold, bacteria, and any airborne particles with a size of 0.3 microns (µm). The diameter specification of 0.3 microns responds to the worst case; the most penetrating particle size (MPPS). Particles that are larger or smaller are trapped with even higher efficiency. Using the worst case particle size results in the worst case efficiency rating (i.e. 99.97% or better for all particle sizes)".

 

https://www.epa.gov/indoor-air-quality-iaq/what-hepa-filter

 

Note the word, "theoretically" in the above definition.

 

Using the links I supplied previously, it looks as though the IQAir device, probably the best one sold anywhere, is this effective: "During testing, it removed 97.4% of airborne particulates.

 

On the other hand, the Xiaomi looks like this: "Within the 1 hour test, the Xiaomi removed 96.5% of air particulates".

 

Also, neither test, nor the HEPA definition above, says how long it takes or should take to reach the standard, minutes, hours, days perhaps?

 

Obviously the term HEPA is abused and involved in marketing fuzziness but to what extent, I am unsure. Finally of course there's the cost/performance trade off aspect. Xiaomi costs 12k and removes 96/5%, IQAir costs 70k and removes 96.5%. 

 

Lastly, it is unclear to me whether HEPA standards for air purifiers have been overtaken by other standards such as air quality standards. Of course it's great to make sure that no small bad particles get into your lungs but is the HEPA standard of 99.7% of all particle sizes absolutely necessary or achievable in a residential setting? In a clean room where fine products such as optical lenses are made, yes and in some sterile settings such as isolation wards of hospitals, yes. But in the average house or apartment, I doubt it. The cracks and gaps around windows and doors in many houses would prevent that target from ever being reached plus there is unlikely to be an air lock chamber on the front and back doors! My guess is that for domestic air purifiers, the HEPA standard is a goal rather than an absolute and that proximity to that goal is determined by price. 

 

 

 

 

 

I have read about this subject that time when I bought our Coway air purifiers. The coway filters where with the Hepa 12 standard ad the Xiaomi only where Hepa 11. Not big difference but I still want the best concidering particles (ex. PM 2.5) goes into the blood via the lungs. Not care about the costs if I can live 10 year longer. About same amount that are dying on the road in Thailand are dying due to the bad air. The air is very bad in Thailand. This is not spoken about so much.

On 12/24/2022 at 7:03 PM, nigelforbes said:

BTW Xiaomi products are sold in MI stores, there's one on the 2nd floor (?) of Central Festival, a few doors down from Central Dept store.

This is correct, but the prices are much higher than buying from Lazada.  We have bought 3 Xiaomi units and numerous filters for them from Lazada.  All 3 purifiers are running and doing a good job after three years of use.

Edited December 27, 20223 yr by LarryLEB

3 hours ago, Captor said:

I have read about this subject that time when I bought our Coway air purifiers. The coway filters where with the Hepa 12 standard ad the Xiaomi only where Hepa 11. Not big difference but I still want the best concidering particles (ex. PM 2.5) goes into the blood via the lungs. Not care about the costs if I can live 10 year longer. About same amount that are dying on the road in Thailand are dying due to the bad air. The air is very bad in Thailand. This is not spoken about so much.

Gray filter (that comes standard in Air Filter 3C/3H) is HEPA 11. However you can also get HEPA 12, the black filter. No idea what light blue, green and purple filters conform to, just that light blue is basic (standard with 2S), purple is antibacterial, and green one has an extra carbon filter for formaldehyde capture.

 

Xiaomi didn't invent these products. They took over a Korean company and first generation Xiaomi air purifiers were even made in Korea. However you turn it around, they are Korean/Japanese engineered, equipped with NIDEC fans, which is quite a famous Japanese company. Even design is mostly based on the original Korean design, a little bit changed to match the Xiaomi white with black circle display standard look, but this really should not be counted as a Chinese product. The only stuff Xiaomi really added (apart from marketing and near global reach) was the app integration, mass production and distribution capabilities, and service network.

 

 

Try some house plants.

I chose a Daikin air purifier because I have Daikin air-conditioner units and they work brilliantly. The Daikin air purifier has also worked brilliantly. It's not as cheap as these Xaomi models everyone seems to recommend but I don't mind paying more for something that concerns health. It's silent when in quiet mode.

Here is a Greenpeace report attached about the air pollution in Thailand if someone is interested in reading more about this subject.

the-burden-of-air-pollution-in-thailand_2021.pdf

Went to Power Buy to look at Air Purifier units.

 

The price cards PB put in front of the models usually mentioned "HEPA Filter", but none stated "True HEPA" or "HEPA 13".

 

I'm not sure if they are not either of those things, or if at least some are but PB just not bothering with that info.

 

I examined a few models and also looked at as much of the box as was visible but couldn't find any more filter info.

 

The salesperson pulled a filter out of 1 unit, a dual - HEPA / Charcoal filter, but it only said "HEPA" on that side.

 

Tough to find that info at online sellers also.

Edited February 19, 20233 yr by JimmyJ

I don't like to download mainstream companies apps to my phone.

 

Will I be able to control the Xiaomi - and all other AP's for that matter - by just using the controls on the machine?

 

Or are the apps essential to control some functions?

3 hours ago, JimmyJ said:

I don't like to download mainstream companies apps to my phone.

 

Will I be able to control the Xiaomi - and all other AP's for that matter - by just using the controls on the machine?

 

Or are the apps essential to control some functions?

I have the cheapest model from Hatari. No app required.

I also have the cheapest model from Xiaomi. No app required. 

I had a Chinese one last year. 

 

It worked great until one day it was totally dead.    Less than 12 months of use (more like 6).

 

I looked for something that would hold up better,  the Japanese ones are excellent,  but spendy.

 

I ended up getting a Hatari on Lazada.  I like Hatari because it is a Thai company and you don't have to pay extra for importing it from elsewhere.   We have Hatari fans in the house and they have worked very well.

 

This one is silent,  has a hepa filter, and is robust enough to clean the air in our 400 sq ft space quickly.

 

definitely appreciate having it now that the air is nasty and unhealthy.

8 hours ago, samuttodd said:

I had a Chinese one last year. 

 

It worked great until one day it was totally dead.    Less than 12 months of use (more like 6).

 

I looked for something that would hold up better,  the Japanese ones are excellent,  but spendy.

 

I ended up getting a Hatari on Lazada.  I like Hatari because it is a Thai company and you don't have to pay extra for importing it from elsewhere.   We have Hatari fans in the house and they have worked very well.

 

This one is silent,  has a hepa filter, and is robust enough to clean the air in our 400 sq ft space quickly.

 

definitely appreciate having it now that the air is nasty and unhealthy.

Hatari is good because it is one of the very few brands where you can easily get replacement filters.

Xiaomi is another one.

It is very difficult, to say the least,  to get replacement filters for the Japanese brands. In a thread from the time PM 2.5 started, like 5 or 6 years ago,  somebody posted his experiences looking for replacement filters for, I think it was Sharp. You don't want to go through the same ordeal.

I use these:

https://smartairfilters.com/th/en/product/sqair-air-purifier/

https://www.lazada.co.th/shop/smart-air

They are simple, inexpensive and easy to get replacements filters.

If you want all bells & whistles such as auto on,  phone app to control etc, then this isn't for you. If your just looking for a simple filter that works, it is.

The control is simply a knob with 3 speeds. The tech is simply a fan that pulls air through  filter. That's it, and that all you need.

On 12/24/2022 at 6:49 PM, nigelforbes said:

We also run two Xiaomi's, a smaller one for the bedroom and very large one for rest of the house. Noise is not an issue and filter costs are very reasonable, 2,200 for the large device but only once a year. We also have filtrette attached to our aircon units, useful to run on really bad days in fan only mode. Finally, we also have a Xiaomi in the pickup that runs off 12v, it helps a lot on bad days.

I clean the filters gently with pressurized air once and awhile during the burning season. Now Im looking for a humidifier for 30m2 room.

Edited February 22, 20233 yr by Hummin

On 2/19/2023 at 12:05 PM, JimmyJ said:

Went to Power Buy to look at Air Purifier units.

 

The price cards PB put in front of the models usually mentioned "HEPA Filter", but none stated "True HEPA" or "HEPA 13".

 

I'm not sure if they are not either of those things, or if at least some are but PB just not bothering with that info.

 

I examined a few models and also looked at as much of the box as was visible but couldn't find any more filter info.

 

The salesperson pulled a filter out of 1 unit, a dual - HEPA / Charcoal filter, but it only said "HEPA" on that side.

 

Tough to find that info at online sellers also.

Right, there are also different standards of Hepa. One that is not as good that the chinese companies are using. The other standard is used by european and US companies. Also by Coway from Korea I believe. I don´t remember the details but they can be found on internet. The simple rule is don´t buy the cheapest and not from China. I believe the chinese brands Hepa is Hepa 10 or 11. Not more than that.

My old vacuum cleaner is Hepa 14. Just because it says Hepa it don´t mean anything magic. It depends on WHAT hepa it is.

 

Edited February 22, 20233 yr by Captor

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Edited February 22, 20233 yr by Captor

On 12/26/2022 at 8:37 AM, spidermike007 said:

Avoid Xiaomi like the plague. They are less expensive for a reason. They either stop working after a year, or the app stops working and you can't control the unit. Chinese junk.

 

The Samsung units are built to last. They are expensive. But I have had mine well over ten years now. Also, check replacement filters. The good units have very large filters. And check prices of replacement filters. They can be expensive. 

My Xiaomi's are 4 and 6 years old.  never a problem, running 24/7