Lawyer to draw up will

[Alphim]

Good day,

I am English in living Thailand  married to a Thai National, Lady and need some advice about drawing up a will.

I have property in South Africa so understand I do need to have a Thai will also. My wife being much younger than I, logically I will pass away first so I want to make sure everything is sorted.

I would appreciate any advice on which lawyers to contact, especially from somebody who has gone thorough the process. 

 

Thank you.

 

[yang123]

Q: OP - whereabouts in Thailand do you live?

[davidst01]

Was talking about Wills in the bar the other night. My buddy mentioned he used Isan lawyers. An Englishman is the owner of the business he said. Ive never used them but he said they were really good. Can all be done with a phone call and emails apparently. 

[KannikaP]

DIY.

THAI WILL FULL THAI & ENG.docx

[ezzra]

I know this good and reasonable lady lawyer in Pattaya who can do most jobs, PM me if you need more info..

[soi3eddie]

1 hour ago, davidst01 said:

Was talking about Wills in the bar the other night. My buddy mentioned he used Isan lawyers. An Englishman is the owner of the business he said. Ive never used them but he said they were really good. Can all be done with a phone call and emails apparently. 

I've met John from Isaan Lawyers a few times. He is a British lawyer/solicitor. My understanding is that he is intending to open an office in Pattaya at some point (if not already).

 

[soi3eddie]

@Alphim - As you have property overseas in South Africa then check whether or not you'll need a will from that country too.

 

[HerewardtheWake]

Try 888legal in Pattaya, Thailand. Kevin Bamfield is known to many expats here for  over 20 years for his integrity, knowledge of Thai laws, and readiness to help.

[topt]

3 hours ago, soi3eddie said:

've met John from Isaan Lawyers a few times. He is a British lawyer/solicitor.

Apologies as of topic but do you know what happened to Sebastian (French guy) as 10 years ago or so I thought it was his business?

[soi3eddie]

42 minutes ago, topt said:

Apologies as of topic but do you know what happened to Sebastian (French guy) as 10 years ago or so I thought it was his business?

Never heard of him.

 

[proton]

1 hour ago, topt said:

Apologies as of topic but do you know what happened to Sebastian (French guy) as 10 years ago or so I thought it was his business?

Canadian, unfortunate story about his mother! Last time I asked 'cheap' price for a simple will was 5k, that was 10 years ago in Bkk. Best do it yourself in Thai and English with downloaded forms. Money for old rope.

[Alphim]

23 hours ago, yang123 said:

Q: OP - whereabouts in Thailand do you live?

Soi Nawamin74, Ramintra Sub, Bangkok

[Alphim]

23 hours ago, KannikaP said:

DIY.

THAI WILL FULL THAI & ENG.docx 24.69 kB · 29 downloads

Thank you all, much appreciated. The D.I.Y would be O.K and acceptable to all parties?

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

22 hours ago, soi3eddie said:

@Alphim - As you have property overseas in South Africa then check whether or not you'll need a will from that country too.

 

Indeed... Re the OP's comment above...

 

In general, a Thai will is only going to cover/govern assets here in TH...

 

If the OP has property assets in S.A., I believe he's going to need a S.A. will to cover those, separate from any assets and related will done in TH.

 

 

[1FinickyOne]

if in CM Lanna lawyers did everything for me. As I have assets in USA I have an executor and Will there too.

 

good lookin out. 

[moogradod]

9 minutes ago, Alphim said:

Thank you all, much appreciated. The D.I.Y would be O.K and acceptable to all parties?

A Thai Will will only cover your assets in Thailand as far as I know. And to my knowledge, only the Thai text will be considered by any court. The English text would only be a tool for you in case you do not speak and read Thai that you know about what is written in there. If the translation is faulty only the Thai text counts.

 

I would not make any effort to DIY and I do not understand that many even consider doing this given the importance ot the matter.

 

 

[soi3eddie]

Another big consideration; is not just getting the Thai will drawn up and the cost for that. I was quoted 5,000 Baht to draw up Thai will with English translation. Sounds good right? BUT, and it's a big one, what is the cost to execute that will on one's demise? The well known law firm in Pattaya that I met with, told me that their fee on my death would be 150,000 Baht! Ouch! And, that does not include the costs for their work in transferring assetts such as my condominium or vehicle. It does not include the costs on dealing with the Thai bank either to release account funds to those named in the will. I'm still looking for best option. Much easier if you know you're going to die soon (can deal with personally in advance of death) but a problem if sudden, unexpected, death.

 

Edited January 14, 2023 by soi3eddie

[LukKrueng]

44 minutes ago, soi3eddie said:

Another big consideration; is not just getting the Thai will drawn up and the cost for that. I was quoted 5,000 Baht to draw up Thai will with English translation. Sounds good right? BUT, and it's a big one, what is the cost to execute that will on one's demise? The well known law firm in Pattaya that I met with, told me that their fee on my death would be 150,000 Baht! Ouch! And, that does not include the costs for their work in transferring assetts such as my condominium or vehicle. It does not include the costs on dealing with the Thai bank either to release account funds to those named in the will. I'm still looking for best option. Much easier if you know you're going to die soon (can deal with personally in advance of death) but a problem if sudden, unexpected, death.

 

Can't you have one of the heirs as executer?

[soi3eddie]

The 150,000 Baht quoted was just for probate by the law firm. Executor/s simply give the law firm instructions and ensure that the will is carried out as stated and are unlikely to posess the legal knowledge to go through the probate process - whether in Thailand or a western country.

 

[topt]

3 hours ago, soi3eddie said:

are unlikely to posess the legal knowledge to go through the probate process - whether in Thailand or a western country.

What do you base that on? I know several people who have done probate in the UK for relatives and although not simple it did not require "legal"knowledge.

 

My understanding is that Thailand may be different however I don't have any practical knowledge of that.

[scorecard]

22 hours ago, proton said:

Canadian, unfortunate story about his mother! Last time I asked 'cheap' price for a simple will was 5k, that was 10 years ago in Bkk. Best do it yourself in Thai and English with downloaded forms. Money for old rope.

DIY, be careful of:

 

- Some aspects of Thai laws on this subject are not exactly the same as in many western countries. E.G. who can be executor? Is being a benficiary and the executor allowed? All laid out in the Thai Commercial code (available on line in English).

- Don't include 'situations' which are acually illegal. 

- Ensure that what you say cannot be interpreted 2 or more different ways*.

- Ensure that what you say in Section XX doesn't clash with what you say in another section of the will.

*If this happens and the will has to be processed by the Thai courts to get court orders to take to banks, Land Titles office etc., etc. , there's a very good chance the judge will not process the will, and they don't listen to comments made by family/old friends etc. 

[Orinoco]

4 hours ago, moogradod said:

I would not make any effort to DIY and I do not understand that many even consider doing this given the importance ot the matter.

+1. 

[soi3eddie]

5 hours ago, topt said:

What do you base that on? I know several people who have done probate in the UK for relatives and although not simple it did not require "legal"knowledge.

 

My understanding is that Thailand may be different however I don't have any practical knowledge of that.

I started to deal with my father's estate some years ago and in the end handed the process over to solicitors. Maybe it's easier now with more help forthcoming in completing the tasks involved in the UK. 

 

The Thai lawyers did mention probate having to go to court which is mainly why I stated needing legal knowledge.

As an interesting excercise, I asked ChatGPT. The question and response is below. Probably why the quote from lawyer for handling probate was so high but 150,000 Baht still seems excessive.

 

Q: How do I file probate in Thailand for foreigner? If it is difficult then why?

 

Filing probate in Thailand for a foreigner can be a complex and time-consuming process.

1. Gather necessary documents: The first step is to gather all necessary documents, such as the deceased's death certificate, a copy of their passport, and any last will and testament.

2. Hire a lawyer: It is highly recommended to hire a local lawyer who is experienced in probate law in Thailand. They can assist with navigating the legal system and can help ensure that the process goes smoothly.

3. File for probate: The next step is to file for probate with the appropriate court in Thailand. This will involve submitting all necessary documents and paying any fees associated with the process.

4. Notify relevant parties: Once the probate process has been initiated, the executor of the estate must notify any relevant parties, such as heirs and creditors.

5. Obtain a probate order: After all necessary documents have been filed and all parties have been notified, the court will review the case and issue a probate order.

The process can be difficult due to the complexity of the legal system in Thailand and the language barrier. Additionally, there may be additional requirements or restrictions for foreigners filing for probate in Thailand. It is important to work with a reputable lawyer who is familiar with the process to ensure a smooth and successful outcome.

[soi3eddie]

9 hours ago, LukKrueng said:

Can't you have one of the heirs as executer?

The Thai lawyer told me that a beneficiary cannot be an executor.

 

[topt]

9 hours ago, soi3eddie said:

The Thai lawyer told me that a beneficiary cannot be an executor.

 

Well to the best of my knowledge that is completely wrong and there has been first hand posts in previous threads that would dispute that.

 

Witnesses cannot be beneficiaries

.

You may want to ask for a second opinion.........

[Alphim]

Well, thanks for all the replies and advices. It would seem at the end of the day a solicitor must be involved. That will be my next step.......finding one.

[Lite Beer]

Isaan lawyers will draw up a will.

Can all be done online and EMS.

6,000 Baht.

[JimGant]

On 1/14/2023 at 1:15 PM, Alphim said:

The D.I.Y would be O.K and acceptable to all parties?

Sure, if it's uncomplicated, like your Thai wife is sole heir and your executor -- and you only have one asset, like a bank account, that would be subject to probate. And there's no one out there that would contest your wife being sole heir. Plenty of discussion on this forum on how to avoid probate with a bank account (like, doing an online transfer by your heir to her online account before you head to the barbecue).

 

The DIY template offered earlier in this thread seems to me one of the better such templates I've seen, primarily due to its simplicity -- no need for a flowery, overly inclusive, with too many legal buzzwords -- to be an acceptable Thai Will.

[Alphim]

21 hours ago, JimGant said:

Sure, if it's uncomplicated, like your Thai wife is sole heir and your executor -- and you only have one asset, like a bank account, that would be subject to probate. And there's no one out there that would contest your wife being sole heir. Plenty of discussion on this forum on how to avoid probate with a bank account (like, doing an online transfer by your heir to her online account before you head to the barbecue).

 

The DIY template offered earlier in this thread seems to me one of the better such templates I've seen, primarily due to its simplicity -- no need for a flowery, overly inclusive, with too many legal buzzwords -- to be an acceptable Thai Will.

Barbeque, nice :-). That template does look good. One law firm I contact want Thb22k but that doe no include doing the application for probate, although they can assist, off course at extra cost!

If there are no assets, fixed properties etc, and only cash, is it necessary to apply for probate? As you mentioned transfer it all to my wifes account, or perhaps just give her signing powers there again..................................................... Cheers.

[Alphim]

On 1/15/2023 at 8:38 PM, Lite Beer said:

Isaan lawyers will draw up a will.

Can all be done online and EMS.

6,000 Baht.

Thanks, I'll looking them.