Buying townhouse second hand vs new

[Snugs08]

 

Currently me and wifey have explored dozen of new moo baans from every developer under the sun, and all the same sales nonsense, showroom that looks awesome, and then barebones buildings, but free aircons, free transfer, free stamp, free mortgage fee, free this and free that, and special price today super promotion for frango and wifey, but ssshhhh, boss do just for you, about as a convincing in terms of great deal  as an 80% discount sale in Central department store...  oh an iphone raffle - sure that was aimed at wives i.e. all silly non-sense.  It becomes an art though, refuse to see the showhome, some me empty, tell them forget about iphone / 200k homepro voucher / free lump of gold, circle the big figure on the quote sheet, ask them when boss is back lol..

 

But on risk, one thing that is safe, it seems, that our outlay initially is rather minimal, varying from 5k to 50k, usually around 5-20k reservation fee, and then lock in fee to bring it up to 50k in some instances within 7-14 days, but many waiving the latter with a little push, so outlays until mortgage approval and transfer day under 20k - excluding valuation fee from bank if applicable and private contractor for inspection if desired.  In a nutshell your moving costs until transfer day are rather minimal, and with that you can somewhat hope the banks done their due diligence as the fork over the bulk on transfer day.

 

I also quite confident with the names involved that things will run relatively smoothly accordingly to schedule with all of them, and resigned to the fact that like a new car leaving the showroom to turn around and sell it same day would be shouldering a 10%+ loss  whatever the awesome super sale deal and freebies we got - but that's not the point..

 

We have also starting look at second hand homes and then I'm totally lost. It seems deposit to secure it are significantly higher, it also seems there a risk of deeds not being ready to transfer, leins/charges on the property, and I've read and heard multiple stories of people losing securing deposits, basically the opposite of new..

 

What is the typical securing deposit for say a 3-4m townhouse?

 

How do you ensure due diligence that the property is transferable - i.e. the charges / mortgage total isn't beyond the sales price due to depreciation or cash home loans etc..

At what stage do you involve your legal representation? How much would this likely be?

 

Deposit worry me, pay 10% down, and find out the roof is a mess that hasn't been declared then sure legally entitled to the deposit back, but imagine nightmare getting it..

 

Also it seems many banks only work with new developers - LH not quoting, KBank quoting 8.35% and TTB 4.75% - KTB Bank was insane with massive insurance requirement  -GSB doesn't seem to distinguish though - relatively decent rates on both non-insured/insured, can they deliver though? Competence seemed low, no branch could produce a Amortization Schedule which would be watchdog offense anywhere else. I  could probably of started this from paragraph five but maybe of some insight for anyone else feeling special when touring

 

Any and all insight appreciated, especially if recent...  Thanks

Edited March 3, 2023 by Snugs08

[OneMoreFarang]

Do you or your wife pay cash? Or do you or your wife need a mortgage?

Do you have Thai nationality? Or permanent residency? Fine. If not, then it gets more difficult to impossible.

It seems one big reason that many people, Thais and foreigners in Thailand, prefer new is because the developers have all the agreements with the banks.

 

If you buy "used" and you want to renovate it, expect better prices but lots of headache. 

 

[Denim]

I have sold three properties in Bangkok. No problem and the same goes for buying if you do your homework.

 

There is one BIG advantage in buying secondhand and it is worth considering. If you buy property in a moobahn that is already three or more years old you at least get to see the worst picture since everyone will have done their extensions etc. Some of these can be real eyesores. Any new built village looks good when it opens for sale. But once the owners move in there is no telling what they will do to their property. I have seen properties painted completely purple or pink whatever including all doors etc !! Hideous walls and awnings etc.  So....secondhand you can escape the fate of having the new owner next to your new house turning his into a slum that reflects badly on your place..

 

In addition , when buying secondhand you get a good idea of who your neighbors are.  Do you want to live next door to someone who has three pitbulls or a champion crow in the front garden. Would you like live next to a party animal who invites his friends around to sit in the garden and play loud music ? Stuff like this can happen when you buy new, It is a lottery. Sure , when they sell you your new house they will tell you there are rules and regulations that owners have to abide by. In reality , enforcing these rules can be very lax indeed.

 

Above all....don't rush. Take your time and look at as many places as possible and try to talk to as many people as you can in the places you like to make sure your big investment doesn't turn into a nightmare.

[Celsius]

If you think you get some kind of awesome warranty when buying new, you are greatly mistaken. Most projects have 1 year builder warranty and the it excludes this and excludes that....

 

But yes, buying used when using a bank may become much more costly than  when buying new and that includes higher interest rates on second hand property. Now you have discovered the real reason why Thais prefer new stuff over used one. Contrary to the popular belief from barstool expats it is NOT because the house has been infested with ghosts, it is exactly because the loan terms on new property are much better.

 

 

[Snugs08]

45 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

Do you or your wife pay cash? Or do you or your wife need a mortgage?

Do you have Thai nationality? Or permanent residency? Fine. If not, then it gets more difficult to impossible.

It seems one big reason that many people, Thais and foreigners in Thailand, prefer new is because the developers have all the agreements with the banks.

 

If you buy "used" and you want to renovate it, expect better prices but lots of headache. 

 

Mortgage. All her name. Ill be putting in a down payment amount depending on lender terms and approval probability.

You are not wrong about the banks relations. A certain massive developer, and well respected by Thais, for example were in one moo ban telling us confidently they could put the sale price 1.2m higher than because we already give you 1.2million discount, then another 300k so 1.5m "fantasy thai buy anything with discount" deal, imagine that NorthernRock style 120% loans in 2023,  if we want a bag of cash for renovations or whatever..  Most other moo bans were a bit more sensible, explaining their top tier banking relations, but also equally okay if we wanted to arrange our own mortgage.

 

 

Edited March 3, 2023 by Snugs08

[Snugs08]

40 minutes ago, Celsius said:

If you think you get some kind of awesome warranty when buying new, you are greatly mistaken. Most projects have 1 year builder warranty and the it excludes this and excludes that....

 

 

 

Yes, the warranty is the thing wifey bangs on about pushing me towards new, sure it would be like getting blood out of a stone, last property we seen she said we was impressed when the sales lady explained "we also call you near end of warranty to check everything is okay", hard work

[Snugs08]

44 minutes ago, Denim said:

I have sold three properties in Bangkok. No problem and the same goes for buying if you do your homework.

 

There is one BIG advantage in buying secondhand and it is worth considering. If you buy property in a moobahn that is already three or more years old you at least get to see the worst picture since everyone will have done their extensions etc. Some of these can be real eyesores. Any new built village looks good when it opens for sale. But once the owners move in there is no telling what they will do to their property. I have seen properties painted completely purple or pink whatever including all doors etc !! Hideous walls and awnings etc.  So....secondhand you can escape the fate of having the new owner next to your new house turning his into a slum that reflects badly on your place..

 

In addition , when buying secondhand you get a good idea of who your neighbors are.  Do you want to live next door to someone who has three pitbulls or a champion crow in the front garden. Would you like live next to a party animal who invites his friends around to sit in the garden and play loud music ? Stuff like this can happen when you buy new, It is a lottery. Sure , when they sell you your new house they will tell you there are rules and regulations that owners have to abide by. In reality , enforcing these rules can be very lax indeed.

 

Above all....don't rush. Take your time and look at as many places as possible and try to talk to as many people as you can in the places you like to make sure your big investment doesn't turn into a nightmare.

This is very good advice, points I hadn't fully considered. Thanks

[OneMoreFarang]

1 hour ago, Denim said:

In addition , when buying secondhand you get a good idea of who your neighbors are.  Do you want to live next door to someone who has three pitbulls or a champion crow in the front garden. Would you like live next to a party animal who invites his friends around to sit in the garden and play loud music ?

That reminds me of advice from a friend in Bangkok who sold condominiums.

What he did and advised people to do is to go to the car park and look at the cars. What kind of cars are there? What condition? Are there any abandoned cars?

I guess the same principle would apply to a mooban. And cars are easier to see than the occasional party at night.