On 9/1/2023 at 11:09 AM, Peabody said:

The two camps are:
1. The values submitted by him to the banks to secure loans.
2. The values stated by him on his real estate tax forms.

Rachel Maddow did a very good explanation of Trump’s property, bank and insurance fraud when Michael Cohen delivered the goods to the NYAG.

 

Black and white fraud, and the NYAG has the receipts.

1 hour ago, Bkk Brian said:

Donald Trump’s New York Business Empire Must Be Dissolved, Judge Rules

New York judge on Tuesday canceled the certificates of the key businesses behind Donald Trump's empire, ordering a quick timeline to dissolve the Trump Organization and other corporate entities.

Manhattan Supreme Court Justice Arthur Engoron's blockbuster ruling found that the former president and his business leaders failed to correct course after being warned of a "propensity to engage in persistent fraud."

Engoron found that New York Attorney General Letitia James has proven her fraud claims without the need for a trial on that issue. Her lawsuit sought $250 million in damages, and six other counts against Trump, his family, and his business associates, who have been gearing up for a court fight in October.

https://themessenger.com/politics/new-york-trump-organization-judge-new-york-letitia-james

Now we get to see the real value.

I don’t watch videos in discussion forums, neither do I post videos in this forum.

 

If I did, I’d be posting a Sinatra song right now.

 

As it is I have it playing in the background as I enjoy reading the news over my morning coffee.

 

An ear worm, while the orange fraudster worm is taken down.

 

 

Edited September 27, 20232 yr by Chomper Higgot

2 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

I don’t watch videos in discussion forums, neither do I post videos in this forum.

 

If I did, I’d be posting a Sinatra song right now.

 

As it I’d I have it playing in the background as I enjoy reading the news over my morning coffee.

I'd be playing "The lion sleeps tonight".

A main ruling on Tuesday found that Donald Trump (and family) are liable for over-valuing properties to score bigger and better loans. The judge has ruled that the Trump Org. must cease all operations as the other charges are decided.

 

Responding to the judge saying Trump jacked up the price of properties, his son Eric Trump complained that Mar-a-Lago is worth over $1 billion. The judge valued it at more like $18 million.

 

https://www.rawstory.com/eric-trump-mar-a-lago-value/

Here’s the best bit, well one of the best bits.

 

The courts will take control of all Trump’s US business assets then dispose of them.

 

A process that will involve real valuations and balancing the loans against the asset values.

 

We’ll get to see the real values, the debts and who the money is owed to,

 

 

 

 

A NY black woman has brought Trump's business down. What a delicious irony.

On 8/31/2023 at 8:48 AM, SunnyinBangrak said:

You can't equate bluster with treason.

Can you equate stupidity from common sense???

A post and replies contravening our Community Standards has been removed.    

3 hours ago, Bkk Brian said:

Donald Trump’s New York Business Empire Must Be Dissolved, Judge Rules

New York judge on Tuesday canceled the certificates of the key businesses behind Donald Trump's empire, ordering a quick timeline to dissolve the Trump Organization and other corporate entities.

Manhattan Supreme Court Justice Arthur Engoron's blockbuster ruling found that the former president and his business leaders failed to correct course after being warned of a "propensity to engage in persistent fraud."

Engoron found that New York Attorney General Letitia James has proven her fraud claims without the need for a trial on that issue. Her lawsuit sought $250 million in damages, and six other counts against Trump, his family, and his business associates, who have been gearing up for a court fight in October.

https://themessenger.com/politics/new-york-trump-organization-judge-new-york-letitia-james

What's amazing is that this is a summary judgement by the court.  The judge deemed the evidence to be so overwhelming--and the defense claims so weak and irrelevant--that there's no need for a trial.  Trump is unquestionably guilty of fraud as charged.  The trial will only deal with the penalties.  There will be appeals, of course, but even that doesn't look promising.  Trump is toast. 

Trump found guilty of fraud ... oh my.

 

It's a civil case in civil court, and no criminal charges filed.  Shows how desperate they are to silence Trump.   What business person, corporation hasn't exaggerated their net worth, up or down.

 

You'd have to take half the citizens to jail for fraud, whether exaggerating their net worth up .... or down, to avoid taxes.

 

Unless he committed bank/mail fraud, and obviously didn't, or he'd be in criminal court for that.  So simply another smear campaign.

13 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

Trump found guilty of fraud ... oh my.

 

It's a civil case in civil court, and no criminal charges filed.  Shows how desperate they are to silence Trump.   What business person, corporation hasn't exaggerated their net worth, up or down.

 

You'd have to take half the citizens to jail for fraud, whether exaggerating their net worth up .... or down, to avoid taxes.

 

Unless he committed bank/mail fraud, and obviously didn't, or he'd be in criminal court for that.  So simply another smear campaign.

If you are American, you are the victim for Trump's tax evasion.

Edited September 27, 20232 yr by ozimoron

1 hour ago, KhunLA said:

Trump found guilty of fraud ... oh my.

 

It's a civil case in civil court, and no criminal charges filed.  Shows how desperate they are to silence Trump.   What business person, corporation hasn't exaggerated their net worth, up or down.

 

You'd have to take half the citizens to jail for fraud, whether exaggerating their net worth up .... or down, to avoid taxes.

 

Unless he committed bank/mail fraud, and obviously didn't, or he'd be in criminal court for that.  So simply another smear campaign.

Let me guess:

 

You think the charges in the NYC fraud case are bogus.

 

You think the classified documents case is bogus.

 

You think the Georgia case is bogus.

 

You think the Federal Jan 6 case is bogus.

 

And now you think the New York state fraud case is bogus.

 

Trump is innocent of all of this, despite all the documentation, the literal tons of evidence. But Joe Biden is guilty of something, despite the complete lack of published evidence, right?

 

What happened to "everyone is equal under the law"? Why do you maintain 2 different standards of justice in your head?

1 hour ago, KhunLA said:

Unless he committed bank/mail fraud, and obviously didn't, or he'd be in criminal court for that.  So simply another smear campaign.

He did:

" the ex-president for years committed fraud and deceived banks and insurers by inflating the value of his assets."

Trump Organization gets 'corporate death penalty' after 'persistent fraud': legal experts (msn.com)

 

He will go to criminal court for this soon.

 

Do you think the banks and insurers will be OK with this? Just another Trump supporter ignoring the facts.

Edited September 27, 20232 yr by FritsSikkink

1 hour ago, KhunLA said:

Trump found guilty of fraud ... oh my.

 

It's a civil case in civil court, and no criminal charges filed.  Shows how desperate they are to silence Trump.   What business person, corporation hasn't exaggerated their net worth, up or down.

 

You'd have to take half the citizens to jail for fraud, whether exaggerating their net worth up .... or down, to avoid taxes.

 

Unless he committed bank/mail fraud, and obviously didn't, or he'd be in criminal court for that.  So simply another smear campaign.

So by your own standards if he goes to a criminal court then its not a smear campaign and fine. Ok so just confirming that with you on the 91 criminal indictments he has in separate cases.

21 hours ago, ozimoron said:

 This both sides-ism is ridiculous, really.

"BOTH SIDE-ISM"... what does that even mean... that prosecuting more than one side is ridiculous... who gets to choose which side?  ALL criminals need to be prosecuted... not just the ones that you pick.

This just in... "The Biden Administration — including top officials at the Justice Department — lied to the American public and engaged in a cover-up that interfered with federal investigators and protected the Biden family, including President Biden himself," the committee said."

 

What We Know About a Judge’s Finding That Trump Committed Fraud

Sept. 27, 2023, 5:43 p.m. ET

 

But Justice Engoron also took the unusual step of canceling business certificates that allow some of Mr. Trump’s properties to operate. John W. Moscow, a lawyer who has worked on fraud investigations for more than 40 years, said the dissolution of the companies — nullifying their very right to exist — was striking.

“Corporate dissolution as a sanction for misconduct is not something I’ve heard of,” he said.

 

 

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/09/27/nyregion/trump-fraud-ruling.html

https://archive.ph/epQF3

 

NB reference to the 'June ruling' here:

 

https://edition.cnn.com/2023/06/27/politics/ivanka-trump-civil-fraud-case-donald-trump/index.html

Edited September 29, 20232 yr by metisdead
Edited as per fair use policy.

13 minutes ago, Skipalongcassidy said:

"BOTH SIDE-ISM"... what does that even mean... that prosecuting more than one side is ridiculous... who gets to choose which side?  ALL criminals need to be prosecuted... not just the ones that you pick.

This just in... "The Biden Administration — including top officials at the Justice Department — lied to the American public and engaged in a cover-up that interfered with federal investigators and protected the Biden family, including President Biden himself," the committee said."

That's nice, this topic is about Trump however not Biden.

12 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

That's nice, this topic is about Trump however not Biden.

I'm sorry... I should have known that you couldn't deal with the big picture... should have narrowed it... forgive me.

1 minute ago, Skipalongcassidy said:

I'm sorry... I should have known that you couldn't deal with the big picture... should have narrowed it... forgive me.

Apologies accepted, the bigger picture if you want to talk about Biden is in the the other topic you just cross posted on

 

 

3 hours ago, Skipalongcassidy said:

"BOTH SIDE-ISM"... what does that even mean... that prosecuting more than one side is ridiculous... who gets to choose which side?  ALL criminals need to be prosecuted... not just the ones that you pick.

This just in... "The Biden Administration — including top officials at the Justice Department — lied to the American public and engaged in a cover-up that interfered with federal investigators and protected the Biden family, including President Biden himself," the committee said."

But the committee offered no proof.

 

Even you have to admit that the Republicans have made a lot of accusations but no proof.

6 hours ago, Skipalongcassidy said:

"BOTH SIDE-ISM"... what does that even mean... that prosecuting more than one side is ridiculous... who gets to choose which side?  ALL criminals need to be prosecuted... not just the ones that you pick.

This just in... "The Biden Administration — including top officials at the Justice Department — lied to the American public and engaged in a cover-up that interfered with federal investigators and protected the Biden family, including President Biden himself," the committee said."

“The committee said”.

 

The committee can say a lot of things, but unless they provide proof/evidence, I’m going to take it with a grain of salt, because they’ve got zip on Biden.

 

You know what proof/evidence is, right? The stuff that judges and juries want to be able to decide if someone is guilty or not? The smoking gun, the bloody knife, the damning video or recording? Like the stuff they have on Trump, really hard and solid evidence? Not the kind of stuff these MAGA folk think they have on Biden, because it’s all conjured up in their fantasy reality and holds no water whatsoever.

 

So show me the proof/evidence, and I will take you seriously. If not, I guess you’re just another of those gullible MAGA cult believers.

23 hours ago, Danderman123 said:

But the committee offered no proof.

 

Even you have to admit that the Republicans have made a lot of accusations but no proof.

"The House Oversight and Accountability Committee has uncovered a mountain of evidence revealing how Joe Biden abused his public office for his family’s financial gain," House Oversight Committee Chairman Rep. James Comer, R-Ky., said in his opening statement. "For years, President Biden has lied to the American people about his knowledge of and participation in his family’s corrupt business schemes."

 

If and when they use this evidence to move forward will that be enough for you?  What if it happens to be true... do not Americans deserve to get to the bottom of this as well?

1 minute ago, Skipalongcassidy said:

"The House Oversight and Accountability Committee has uncovered a mountain of evidence revealing how Joe Biden abused his public office for his family’s financial gain," House Oversight Committee Chairman Rep. James Comer, R-Ky., said in his opening statement. "For years, President Biden has lied to the American people about his knowledge of and participation in his family’s corrupt business schemes."

 

If and when they use this evidence to move forward will that be enough for you?  What if it happens to be true... do not Americans deserve to get to the bottom of this as well?

Statements by political hacks are not evidence of anything other than sordid political hackery.

On 9/28/2023 at 5:19 AM, Skipalongcassidy said:

"BOTH SIDE-ISM"... what does that even mean... that prosecuting more than one side is ridiculous... who gets to choose which side?  ALL criminals need to be prosecuted... not just the ones that you pick.

This just in... "The Biden Administration — including top officials at the Justice Department — lied to the American public and engaged in a cover-up that interfered with federal investigators and protected the Biden family, including President Biden himself," the committee said."

All criminals do need to be prosecuted. How is that relevant to this case?

20 hours ago, rudi49jr said:

“The committee said”.

 

The committee can say a lot of things, but unless they provide proof/evidence, I’m going to take it with a grain of salt, because they’ve got zip on Biden.

 

You know what proof/evidence is, right? The stuff that judges and juries want to be able to decide if someone is guilty or not? The smoking gun, the bloody knife, the damning video or recording? Like the stuff they have on Trump, really hard and solid evidence? Not the kind of stuff these MAGA folk think they have on Biden, because it’s all conjured up in their fantasy reality and holds no water whatsoever.

 

So show me the proof/evidence, and I will take you seriously. If not, I guess you’re just another of those gullible MAGA cult believers.

Unfortunately for America the gathering of proof has been delayed too long by republicans afraid of ruffling feathers in congress... but it has now started... give it time... it has been nearly 8 years of constant democrap investigations to finally find one thing on Trump... Let's see how well Biden and Menendez do in 8 years... is there a threshold of evidence that you will accept... asking for a friend.

1 minute ago, Skipalongcassidy said:

Unfortunately for America the gathering of proof has been delayed too long by republicans afraid of ruffling feathers in congress... but it has now started... give it time... it has been nearly 8 years of constant democrap investigations to finally find one thing on Trump... Let's see how well Biden and Menendez do in 8 years... is there a threshold of evidence that you will accept... asking for a friend.

They said that when Ken Starr investigated Clinton for 7 years. It's all about the investigation, not the outcome. That was the same playbook for Benghazi. Pointless, fruitless investigations that were never intended to produce any result, let alone a timely result.

20 minutes ago, Skipalongcassidy said:

"The House Oversight and Accountability Committee has uncovered a mountain of evidence revealing how Joe Biden abused his public office for his family’s financial gain," House Oversight Committee Chairman Rep. James Comer, R-Ky., said in his opening statement. "For years, President Biden has lied to the American people about his knowledge of and participation in his family’s corrupt business schemes."

 

If and when they use this evidence to move forward will that be enough for you?  What if it happens to be true... do not Americans deserve to get to the bottom of this as well?

That's this case in a nutshell:

 

The Republicans talk about a mountain of evidence, but don't actually have any.

 

You are being conned.

21 minutes ago, Skipalongcassidy said:

"The House Oversight and Accountability Committee has uncovered a mountain of evidence revealing how Joe Biden abused his public office for his family’s financial gain," House Oversight Committee Chairman Rep. James Comer, R-Ky., said in his opening statement. "For years, President Biden has lied to the American people about his knowledge of and participation in his family’s corrupt business schemes."

 

If and when they use this evidence to move forward will that be enough for you?  What if it happens to be true... do not Americans deserve to get to the bottom of this as well?

If there is credible evidence, yes.

 

Will Trump supporters wait for credible evidence before calling President Biden a criminal?  Obviously not.

9 minutes ago, Skipalongcassidy said:

Unfortunately for America the gathering of proof has been delayed too long by republicans afraid of ruffling feathers in congress... but it has now started... give it time... it has been nearly 8 years of constant democrap investigations to finally find one thing on Trump... Let's see how well Biden and Menendez do in 8 years... is there a threshold of evidence that you will accept... asking for a friend.

There are 91 charges against Trump.

 

91 is not the same as one.