Marriage And Visits By Immigration Officials...

[MarcoH]

I have just finished the first step in applying for a Non O/ Marriage visa and was informed by immigration that they wold be popping in for a visit sometime within this month. That's fine even if I am not entirely happy with the thought of a bunch of strangers invading my private space.

Sbk, have you or any other Farang women experienced this and what sort of things do they want to know??

Hi There

It was already practice in -3yrs ago when i star to process, they told me thta they will come to our house, actually they will sent paper's to local Police and it's up to police to check is i really live where is claims to live.....well no worries,,my neigbour is police.

Well we wait and wait nothing happen so we went to police station and paper's where there and as we cam there they told us that we can fill out papers same time and just get realtives, who are goverment worker's(Teacher) to sign paper's and thats it,, no one come to house or even talk to any one close to us.....

We live outskirt's of Ubon

-Marco-

[SweatySock]

When I first applied for my 12 month "Thai Wife" visa, I was invited to the local constabulary to verify that I was staying where I claimed and that I was of good moral character and indeed married to my wife.

I had to present a Thai of acceptable position to verify my identity. The Thai I presented, I had met the night before and the good moral character cost me a bottle of "Famous Grouse" whisky.

This was only required on the initial application and since then it has been plain sailing.

[IsaanAlex]

My God. Thai government people coming around my place-where my wife and kids live, just to extend a Visa. I'd rather get a multiple O and leave every 90 days indefinitely (if possible).

So many of the Thai government people that I've had dealings with are grade-A pieces of shit that I would hope knew as little about me as possible; from the Thai that married my wife and I in bangrak district, (who, midway kindly inquired if he could give her a ring should he happen to pass by our town, as he does often [wink wink]), to the policeman who tried to befriend me upon my arrrival to my Thai 'home' city, (and in short order was drunkenly calling my cell from whorehouses talking about the 'deks' with my wife and hanging up on her when the genius figured out it wasn't me on the line), to the outrageously drunk tourist cop who (just barely) dealt with a workmates 'hit and flee', after he near-sheared off a Thai ladies foot when she stepped out in front of his motorcycle on a green light, and was subsequently mobbed by about 20 very angry Thais.

What an unwelcoming shithole Thailand is becoming.

IA

[Foggy Bottom]

There is an excellent clarification feature of the whole marriage visa rules mess effective from 10 July in this month's Good Morning Chiangmai News - News feature - I recommend everyone read it carefully .... especially the completely laughable "legalese" in the first paragraph of the first section about staying because married to a Thai - it is so indicative of why they tolerate us at all ... quoting

"A foreign husband wants to look after a Thai wife

This is not allowed unless they are fully legally married and the husband has a high income to support the wife....... The foreign husband must have not less than 400,000b in the bank OR earnings of at least 40,000b per month. If the officer suspects this is not the case he can check with the bank in case the applicant withdraws almost all the money. This is not allowed."

Further into the rules, it also discusses the home visits and their requirements.

Gaz

[teelac888]

Ahhhhhh, yet another process cloned from Switzerland, where his Majesty spent many years in school.

When you apply for Swiss citizenship, the cops do this very same thing: go to your neighbors and ask if you make noise after 10 PM, etc.

They also interview you extensively - what kind of books you read, clubs you belong to, etc.

The bottom line is that the Thais find new ways to remove foreigners in direct proportion to the increase in GNP.

As the standard of living goes up the number of farangs goes down and they keep inventing new ways to exclude, so that only the elite farangs who pay a heavy price will remain.

[sassienie]

I have been living in Thailand, on and off for the last 15 years.

I and my family left England last May 2003 and we are staying here for good this time.

In my area I have over 15 farang close friends, all have families living here.

My family and I, plus all my friends living here, have never had one incident of extreme police or immigration check ups as described in some of these messages.

I and my friends here have always had and experienced a most courteous service in our area immigration office.

To be honest, some of these farang visa applicants sound a bit iffy to me and maybe the authorities in Thailand know that, as the police here are not stupid.

Its all very simple. Providing farangs that wish to have a long stay in Thailand can produce at least the bare minimum that is required of them in immigration and satisfy the officers of their honesty and intensions, than there will be no problem.

My advice is to farangs thinking of staying in Thailand for long term is, ensure that you completely meet the immigration requirements prior to leaving your home countries.

There are plenty of sites on the internet that give detailed information. Be prepared as its no good whinging afterwards when its too late.

So for those of you that done things properly in the first place, please dont be alarmed by these articles.

[penzman]

Our official address is at my mother in law's house. We're there almost every week-end. The officials did pay a visit and did not even bother visiting our room or the house. Maybe they did talk to the lady next door who always has her nose stuck between the shutters. Is there an equivalent word for "falang watching" as "ornithology" for bird watching?

[Nam Kao]

Yes, its named ATMPediology

[Martin]

Nice one, Nam Kao.

And 'sassienie', you have hit the nail right on the head.

This is a marvellous place for those who have the sense to do things properly in the first place.

Thai officers and officials are not daft, despite what some posts say on here.

(I am reminded that "Peter's criticisms of Paul tell me a lot about Peter, but maybe nothing about Paul".)

If we gradually move towards a Thailand that is 'Farang-Prat Free' I shan't shed any tears.

By the way, what is the meaning of 'sassienie', please?

[Lifer]

This is in reply to Jinjingna's post about being inspected at the home after marriage. This is normal procedure and nothing to be concerned about. As everyone probably knows, a lot of things are done that aren't quite legal.

After one applies and legally registers their marriage and then applies for the one year marriage visa, the Immigration office wants to make sure that you are living with the person you say you are and that you actually are residing at the address you gave them.

Six years ago when I was married, we were told at the time of applying for the one year visa that this was the procedure and that it would only be done once. They said that a special police unit would show up at our residence, take a look to see there was evidence that we both lived together, and that it would be done within several days.

On the day they came, one male and one female officer, I happened to be home. They were very polite and courteous. I invited them in, they looked around to see our things. The female officer casually walked in the bedroom, opened the closet, and saw both our clothes hanging there. I had done some laundry on that day and my wifes things were drying outside alondside mine.

As for the forms, they checked with a neighbor and ask if they knew us and had we both lived there together and for how long. They also went down to the housing project office and ask them down there. Since we had purchased the house from them, there was no problem getting there verification that we were married andliving together.

Not a big deal, nothing to be paranoid about. Its just one of those things that needs to be done by regulation. The United States check up on immigrants in a similar fashion. From a happily married Chiangmai located Farang

[ovenman]

Not a big deal, nothing to be paranoid about. Its just one of those things that needs to be done by regulation. The United States check up on immigrants in a similar fashion. From a happily married Chiangmai located Farang

Right, with the difference between the US/European countries and Thailand being that in Thailand the "inspectees" are not being considered as immigrants or as potential immigrants. The "inspectees" are merely guests that the authorities might consider letting stay for a year after the appropriate amount of hemming and hawing.

[Felt 35]

Is the resume after the main post and most of the replies that it’s okay with a "police state"?

Well if living home, should I then accept that it would be "normal practise" that police or immigration could come on a unexpected visit to my home any time they want for "checking" if my wife really stay on that address and that she have an income far over the average income in my home country! (######, she is my wife, not a refugee)

I really never ever hope my home country will fall so many steps down and be so inhuman.

What the next, blending our windows!

[pipchatel]

Hello All. We had the police and Immigration people vist once, but only the first application. We wernt home! But they spoke to My wifes family and looked at our house. They lefy happy In the end its only sensible that they see who we really are, what we say we are. In the Uk a lot worse than that., But as I say, that happened only once and the next 3 yrs it was never repeated.

Just to add some info. I did my 4th year visa yesterday in Chiang Mai. No problems at all. But they wanted the whole of my Bangkok bank pass book copied!!! So they are looking for constant funds!

Let me be the firsat to wish you all a Happy Christmas

Pip

[Martin]

I have no experience of living in Bangkok or another area of Thailand, but Esarn certainly isn't a Police State.

The police here are a darned sight more pleasant and civilised than the majority of the coppers I have come across in England's towns and cities.

I served for a few years on the Liaison Committee that was set up to link between the police of a northern city and the local population.

The senior officers were, of course, always trying to project the best possible light on the Constabulary. But it wasn't hard to detect that in their hearts they were most unhappy about the personalities of many of their recruits.

One once said to me "It is an ill wind that doesn't blow some good. At least in the Depression Years of the 1930s we could pick and choose from the best school-leavers. It is very different now".

I get the impression that the Royal Thai Police still get to 'cherry pick' in this rural area.

[sbk]

There is an excellent clarification feature of the whole marriage visa rules mess effective from 10 July in this month's Good Morning Chiangmai News - News feature - I recommend everyone read it carefully .... especially the completely laughable "legalese" in the first paragraph of the first section about staying because married to a Thai - it is so indicative of why they tolerate us at all ... quoting

"A foreign husband wants to look after a Thai wife

This is not allowed unless they are fully legally married and the husband has a high income to support the wife....... The foreign husband must have not less than 400,000b in the bank OR earnings of at least 40,000b per month. If the officer suspects this is not the case he can check with the bank in case the applicant withdraws almost all the money. This is not allowed."

Further into the rules, it also discusses the home visits and their requirements.

Gaz

Thanks for that Gaz, most enlightening. Except for, of course, a Thai husband looking after a foreign wife. Amazing. Are we really so few (like there are alot more Thai nationals looking after a foreign parent?) that we don't even qualify for a listing?

I know there are some requirements for the Thai husband (having been receiving a one year visa as a foreign wife for quite a few years now), so why is this category completely ignored in all publications?

[lopburi3]

There is an excellent clarification feature of the whole marriage visa rules mess effective from 10 July in this month's Good Morning Chiangmai News - News feature - I recommend everyone read it carefully .... especially the completely laughable "legalese" in the first paragraph of the first section about staying because married to a Thai - it is so indicative of why they tolerate us at all ... quoting

"A foreign husband wants to look after a Thai wife

This is not allowed unless they are fully legally married and the husband has a high income to support the wife....... The foreign husband must have not less than 400,000b in the bank OR earnings of at least 40,000b per month. If the officer suspects this is not the case he can check with the bank in case the applicant withdraws almost all the money. This is not allowed."

Further into the rules, it also discusses the home visits and their requirements.

Gaz

Thanks for that Gaz, most enlightening. Except for, of course, a Thai husband looking after a foreign wife. Amazing. Are we really so few (like there are alot more Thai nationals looking after a foreign parent?) that we don't even qualify for a listing?

I know there are some requirements for the Thai husband (having been receiving a one year visa as a foreign wife for quite a few years now), so why is this category completely ignored in all publications?

Who can ignore you?

Application for further stay for an alien wife to receive the support from a husband who is a Thai citizen or a Thai permanent resident of the Kingdom of Thailand.

1. The husband who has Thai nationality

1. Immigration form 7

2. Copy of passport

3. A 4 cm. x 6 cm. photograph

4. A 1,900 bath application fee

5. Marriage Certificate

6. A copy of census registration, a copy of Identification Card

7. Birth Certificate of the applicant's children (if any)

8. A record of interviewing the applicant and her husband

9. The officials reserve the rights to examine or ask for additional documents if

necessary

2. The husband who is a permanent resident in Royal Thailand

1. Immigration form 7

2. a Copy of passport

3. A 4 cm. x 6 cm. photograph

4. A 1,900 bath application fee

5. Marriage Certificate

6. A certified copy of the husband's passport, an alien identification card of the husband, permanent residence certificate of the husband

7. Birth Certificate of the applicant's children (if any)

8. A record of the interview of the applicant and her husband

9. Evidence of husband's income together with related documents such as:

- Bank pass-book

- Bank Statement from the Bank the applicant has an account

- Evidence of working and income

10. Evidence of income tax payment (if any)

11. The officials reserve the rights to examine or ask for additional documents if necessary.

Source: http://www.imm3.police.go.th/eng/application.html#03

[sbk]

Who can ignore you?

Application for further stay for an alien wife to receive the support from a husband who is a Thai citizen or a Thai permanent resident of the Kingdom of Thailand.

1. The husband who has Thai nationality

1. Immigration form 7

2. Copy of passport

3. A 4 cm. x 6 cm. photograph

4. A 1,900 bath application fee

5. Marriage Certificate

6. A copy of census registration, a copy of Identification Card

7. Birth Certificate of the applicant's children (if any)

8. A record of interviewing the applicant and her husband

9. The officials reserve the rights to examine or ask for additional documents if

necessary

2. The husband who is a permanent resident in Royal Thailand

1. Immigration form 7

2. a Copy of passport

3. A 4 cm. x 6 cm. photograph

4. A 1,900 bath application fee

5. Marriage Certificate

6. A certified copy of the husband's passport, an alien identification card of the husband, permanent residence certificate of the husband

7. Birth Certificate of the applicant's children (if any)

8. A record of the interview of the applicant and her husband

9. Evidence of husband's income together with related documents such as:

- Bank pass-book

- Bank Statement from the Bank the applicant has an account

- Evidence of working and income

10. Evidence of income tax payment (if any)

11. The officials reserve the rights to examine or ask for additional documents if necessary.

Source: http://www.imm3.police.go.th/eng/application.html#03

Not my husband, that is for sure.

No, I should have been more specific. I know we are listed on the immigration website but any time any article is published regarding regulations for foreigners residing in Thailand us 'little women' always get left out. Just seems funny that the article in the Chiang Mai paper lists the requirements for a Thai national looking after a foreign parent but not a Thai husband looking after a foreign wife. How many Thai nationals looking after a foreign parent have you seen lopburi?

[lopburi3]

How many Thai nationals looking after a foreign parent have you seen lopburi?

None but I suspect that there are quite a number among the nationals from countries in the region and hill people whose children are Thai. As this was Chiang Mai speaking suspect there may be more in this category than in yours for that office.

[ovenman]

No, I should have been more specific. I know we are listed on the immigration website but any time any article is published regarding regulations for foreigners residing in Thailand us 'little women' always get left out.

I doubt that any slight is intended by the omission. It's more likely the case that because the regulations aren't ever-changing for foreign women married to Thai men that this category often gets ignored (although for the sake of completeness the article should note the non-change).

[Foggy Bottom]

The rules as quoted in the Good Morning Chiangmai article are the entirity of the ammendments introduced on July 10th - I saw the originals last september (in Thai from the original printout - know they were originals because the paper was recycled with rough notes and blurb on the other side where it had been put back through the printer) and took copies into the university for translation - opinion there was that they were working draft and would not be implemented with that wording, but TiT - they have.

The translation in the magazine is by the translator who does a lot of Chiangmai Provincial Centre's (County Hall) translations - important point that - goes a long way towards authenticating meaning implied in many of the statements.

Why no section for Thai husbands looking after foreign wives - easy - no change in requirements. ..... Can't be telling the world that Thai's have to earn 40,000 a month to look after a foreign wife - wouldn't help the "poor and impoverished people" reputation used to justify official dual-pricing at national parks, or the insulting wages offered in state universities, now would it?

Personally I wouldn't mind receiving Thaksin's (correct) tax bill as my salary level, but accepting his actually declared one would peobably leave me worse off than I am now. Some things are the same the world over.

[DaveYo]

The above shows as follows 1. The husband who has Thai nationality, and also 2. The husband who is a permanent resident in Royal Thailand. This applies only to either Thai Nationality or Permanent Residence.

The one prior which is above this shows "A foreign husband wants to look after a Thai wife

This is not allowed unless they are fully legally married and the husband has a high income to support the wife..

If one gets techinical about this It says NOT ALLOWED, yet they put in a grandfather clause here as their addendum ""must be married legally and etc.""

First to be legally married one has to be approved by their own embassy with their documents, and those documents must be translated into Thai language. Then you have to go to the Thai Amphur in the jurisdictional area to be legally married according to the eyes and laws of Thailand and you must have those papers too.

I do know Amphurs to some extent do not issue these marriage licenses unless such couple is authenticated, investigated to some extent, and that their intentions are legit along with such couple verifying their Address in Thailand. Such can be made from your bills, or Thai Driving License, or Rent payments etc, including perhaps your address from the Post Office and so on.

So basically my question is why does Immigration have doubts of such marriage when in fact if one followed the above proceedures and such is approved from the Amphur it is a done deal. All one needs to do is send Official Copies of such Approval from the Amphur to Immigrations so they can file it.

In America a foreigner who is married to an American Citizen usually is kept on the watch list minimum of 5 years and such can be less at the USA Immigrations discretion. After that they don't care what the foreigner does from that point on. Reason many get married just to stay in USA and many do in fact try to get divorced within that time frame.

If so under such thought from USA, Thai Immigrations can simplify their rules requiring same to Foreigners married to Thai Citizens by doing the same concept as USA.

My only objection to all this is the darn Banking requirements being tied into the Marriage. It is really a pain in the neck. But then again I can see why as to it being Thailands effort to minimize foreigners trying to marry their own people as the foreigners try hard in making an effort to stay here etc.

I have said it before last year, Thailand's rules are getting harder and harder for the Expats in their efforts to live long term here in Thailand. Eventually all this is going to reach the breaking point when Foreigners will not stay much less want to invest over here. If this happens then Thailand is all on its own, as for economic development etc.

Why foreigners come in to do all this work for them such as building the subway and airports etc,, with their expertise, and Thailand does not reciprocate in like manner in easing the rules against foreigners living over here. See my point???

Daveyo

[otherstuff1957]

Getting back to the original thread... When I applied for my type O visa I had to supply pictures of our apartment, inside and out, both to prove that we lived together and to prove that I was giving her a decent standard of living! The police checked with the apartment management to verify that we actually lived there. We never knew when it actually happened.

Sassienie hit the nail on the head - if you follow the rules there is no problem. Also, the police and immigration officials that I have dealt with have been polite and efficient - probably more so than their US counterparts. While the paperwork is a bit of a pain it's nothing compared with trying to get a tourist visa for my Thai wife!

[Snapshot]

A Thai Wife looking after a Foreign Husband"""

Now... I am one of those guys.

Whenever I go to the Immigration, they ask me: "How do you make money in Thailand?? (I've stayed here for 20 years)(I have many stories to tell)

My answer to the Immigration is always"

Sir/Miss... my (Thai) wife takes care of me. She gives me food everyday.. and she gives me 100 Baht for "tip" everyday day.... and that's enough for me ...

... and I say that with a big GRIN on my face

... what are they going to answer/do? ... YOU're going to tell me? show off to me? stop me from living in Thailand???

Hahahahahah... tell me.... I'm here.... I am living....

AND... I talk no bullshit....

I am Snapshot.... It has taken me twenty years to learn how to live her... I am a slow learner...

[DaveYo]

Hey Snapshot, those are nice answers no doubt. But I wonder, just how long they will keep accepting such if and when they decide to do otherwise.

Ah, keep in mind, you may have lived here all these years, but if the Thai Immigrations or authorities ever decide to dig deeper into you or to anybody else or want you out or to find a reason etc, they can do it at their own time, without you ever knowing what is going on.

The Ajarn case was a clear example.

And at the current pace, these laws are changing fast. In fact some new ones came up when I was in process for work permits etc. as my example. It is indeed changing quickly and being applied faster than I can keep up with it.

Daveyo