Now Health International & Best Doctors Insurance

[Desut]

Thanks to all the great advice in this forum I connected with a broker from AOC.

 

I am looking to retire to Thailand next year and I connected with this broker to get an idea of my options and prices for a health insurance plan. 

The broker provided quotes from Now Health International, April International and Cigna Global Health. He highly recommended the plans from Now Health International & Best Doctors Insurance.

He mentioned that Now Heath International & Best Doctors Insurance is a global insurer around the world with operation everywhere (United Kingdom, Dubai, South America, Belgium, Scotland, China, Indonesia , Singapore, Hong-Kong, Malta etc.) and reinsure by RGA in United States. He also recommended to avoid the local and regional players because they may be cheaper, but they offer no rights to the consumer and no long-term commitment.

 

I was wondering if anyone here has any experience with Now Health International? I did a search of these forums but have come up empty. 

 

https://www.aoc-insurancebroker.com/themes/wiredelta/aocinsurancebroker/files/2020-01/Now_Health-Best_Doctors_Insurance_Corporate_Brochure_2020.pdf

 

Thanks!

[simon43]

I signed up with Now Health International a few years ago, but terminated my policy 1 year later because I was not satisified with their customer service.  My emails to their offices went unanswered or were replied to with erronous information.  

[Etaoin Shrdlu]

I think it means something when insurers advertise their reinsurers' financial strength rating and not their own.

 

Reinsurance won't help a policyholder if their insurer goes bust.

 

Some interesting reading here, especially page 21:  https://www.bma.bm/viewPDF/documents/2023-10-04-10-14-06-Best-Doctors-Insurance-Limited---2022-Financial-Statement.pdf

[Desut]

Thanks for the replies

[Sheryl]

I would also be concerned about it being incorporated in Bermuda.

 

On of the key things to look at when considering an insurer is what recourse you have in the event of a dispute.

[Desut]

Thanks Sheryl, yes, I was put off as well by the Bermuda incorporation.

 

I will focus with either April France or Cigna Global. 

 

My US employer does currently offer a robust retiree health plan thru Cigna Healthcare but unfortunately, they only cover domestically in the states, no options for international coverage, and it comes with a steep premium.

Edited May 10 by Desut

[Presnock]

On 5/6/2024 at 10:15 PM, Desut said:

Thanks to all the great advice in this forum I connected with a broker from AOC.

 

I am looking to retire to Thailand next year and I connected with this broker to get an idea of my options and prices for a health insurance plan. 

The broker provided quotes from Now Health International, April International and Cigna Global Health. He highly recommended the plans from Now Health International & Best Doctors Insurance.

He mentioned that Now Heath International & Best Doctors Insurance is a global insurer around the world with operation everywhere (United Kingdom, Dubai, South America, Belgium, Scotland, China, Indonesia , Singapore, Hong-Kong, Malta etc.) and reinsure by RGA in United States. He also recommended to avoid the local and regional players because they may be cheaper, but they offer no rights to the consumer and no long-term commitment.

 

I was wondering if anyone here has any experience with Now Health International? I did a search of these forums but have come up empty. 

 

https://www.aoc-insurancebroker.com/themes/wiredelta/aocinsurancebroker/files/2020-01/Now_Health-Best_Doctors_Insurance_Corporate_Brochure_2020.pdf

 

Thanks!

Consider the various visas available as some require health insurance especially international companies and coverage.  As a retiree, you might want to check out the Long term visa from the Thai board of investment- depends on pension, financial and health insurance for people like me.  I had a retirement O until this LTR came about and saw that it fit my situation perfectly.  One can obtain it from an embassy or consulate also.  One of the benefits is any foreign funds remitted to Thailand are not taxable, one can still work with a work permit while other retirement visas do not and taxed at a different rate.  Can find info on this visa at "boi.com" or Long Term Visa Thailand.  Goodluck

[CanadaSam]

On 5/6/2024 at 10:15 PM, Desut said:

He also recommended to avoid the local and regional players because they may be cheaper, but they offer no rights to the consumer and no long-term commitment.

 

I was told the exact opposite by many brokers, with facts to back it up, that the local insurance companies are regulated by an "ombudsman" who is always on the side of the customer, but the international companies are not.

[Desut]

4 hours ago, Presnock said:

Consider the various visas available as some require health insurance especially international companies and coverage.  As a retiree, you might want to check out the Long term visa from the Thai board of investment- depends on pension, financial and health insurance for people like me.  I had a retirement O until this LTR came about and saw that it fit my situation perfectly.  

 

Thanks Presnock, yes, my aim is certainly the LTR visa if I am able to meet the 80k/year income threshold. We won't know our final numbers until early next year, but it will be very close. 

 

3 hours ago, CanadaSam said:

 

I was told the exact opposite by many brokers, with facts to back it up, that the local insurance companies are regulated by an "ombudsman" who is always on the side of the customer, but the international companies are not.

 

Thank you CanadaSam. That's interesting. So, if I now understand it correctly, local companies are governed by an ombudsman, whereas international companies fall under legal regulations of their home country? Which arrangement would be more beneficial for an expatriate living in Thailand is a question that pops into my mind.

[Etaoin Shrdlu]

3 hours ago, CanadaSam said:

 

I was told the exact opposite by many brokers, with facts to back it up, that the local insurance companies are regulated by an "ombudsman" who is always on the side of the customer, but the international companies are not.

 

It is true that the OIC here is quite consumer-friendly and it is easy to schedule a meeting to discuss a grievance. The downside is that insurers here may offer less broad coverage and have a poorer claims-paying attitude.

 

Offshore insurers may or may not be well-regulated and the relevant regulator may or may not be easy to engage. Large, well-established insurers in the EU and other developed markets probably are. Those incorporated in tax havens in places like the Caribbean might not be. 

 

 

[Sheryl]

45 minutes ago, Desut said:

 

 So, if I now understand it correctly, local companies are governed by an ombudsman, whereas international companies fall under legal regulations of their home country? Which arrangement would be more beneficial for an expatriate living in Thailand is a question that pops into my mind.

Yes  any policy will come under the laws and regulations of the issuing country.

 

Thai policies come under the OIC. I would not describe that as an "ombudsman", it is not. It is a regulating commission.  It is impartial and will decide any matter based on the terms of the policy and applicable Thai insurance regulations. Unfortunately both of these are pretty lax and allow things most western country regs would not. In addition the OIC is not specific to health insurance (most of its work is with vehicle and life insurance) and as far as I know it has no medically trained personnel or panels so is not in a good position to decide an issue based on medical details e.g. whether or not the fact that the insured had symptom or condition X years ago makes the condition they now gave a claim for pre-existing --- a very common point of contention due to most Thai companies not doing a thorough medical underwriting at intake but rather digging for evidence of (what they think are) related symptoms at the point of a claim years later. 

 

UK issued policies come under the UK Ombudsman.  Most policies issued out of Western Europe have a similar body. 

 

So in answer to your question as to which is more beneficial it depends on which foreign country you are comparing to. 

 

 

 

 

[Presnock]

9 hours ago, Desut said:

 

Thanks Presnock, yes, my aim is certainly the LTR visa if I am able to meet the 80k/year income threshold. We won't know our final numbers until early next year, but it will be very close. 

 

 

Thank you CanadaSam. That's interesting. So, if I now understand it correctly, local companies are governed by an ombudsman, whereas international companies fall under legal regulations of their home country? Which arrangement would be more beneficial for an expatriate living in Thailand is a question that pops into my mind.

FROM

[Presnock]

Based on the numerous articles and comments I have read about health insurance in Thailand, if one is healthy and has no previous history of any disease/health problems and doesn't plan to have to continue that insurance at a reasonable rate once the individual gets old (like retirees) then I would feel more comfortable with an international (US) insurance company so that I know that they would be totally responsible for what is in the benefits package and no ifs ands or buts, they pay.  I have of course a policy through the govt since prior to my retirement. Yes it is expensive but they just can't refuse to pay when I file any claim.  I am 77 and if I even tried to get a local insurance it would be extremely expensive and with lots of caveats written into the policy in the favor of the company, not me.  I am just saying, but I am talking about my and my family's health and my situation is totally personalble for me.  Any possible legal ramifications between a local (person/place or thing) the law sides most likely with the local and not the ex-pat is what we see/hear all the time on this forum and in the papers.  Just something to think about.  What you need to do is check out the costs of local insurance versus international/US companies.  I read that most EU countries health insurance is different so I can't speak for them.  You can always ask on the forum about getting health insurance locally vs intl - there will most likely be a lot of comments from folks and their own experiences. Or you can search too on this forum about health insurance and there should be many conversations about that issue just as there have been about the tax of money remitted into Thailand, and the visa/immigration experiences.  Good luck and if you have any questions about anything here, ask and if I have any experience I will be honest with in any case.  I could have retired in the US easily or anywhere else as I have lived and worked in many countries but the most beneficial in just about every way is Thailand.  It is not perfect but I love it still after 20 years of retirement here.  The LTR to me is the cheapest (long run) and most beneficial for me and also rids one of a couple of headaches maybe.  Good luck

[Letseng]

17 hours ago, CanadaSam said:

 

I was told the exact opposite by many brokers, with facts to back it up, that the local insurance companies are regulated by an "ombudsman" who is always on the side of the customer, but the international companies are not.

A Thai doctor once told me not to bother with local insurers as they will always wriggle out of their responsibility. I'm with Axa UK which many don't like but so far I had no issue. All done through a local broker.

[Desut]

On 5/11/2024 at 8:42 AM, Sheryl said:

So in answer to your question as to which is more beneficial it depends on which foreign country you are comparing to. 

 

 

Thanks for the information, Sheryl. It's very informative. I'm comparing this against the health insurance provided by my employer in the US. Ideally, I'd like to find similar coverage so that, if or when I get sick in retirement, I don’t have to worry about whether or not the insurance will cover me. Perhaps that's hoping for too much. 

 

15 hours ago, Presnock said:

Based on the numerous articles and comments I have read about health insurance in Thailand, if one is healthy and has no previous history of any disease/health problems and doesn't plan to have to continue that insurance at a reasonable rate once the individual gets old (like retirees) then I would feel more comfortable with an international (US) insurance company so that I know that they would be totally responsible for what is in the benefits package and no ifs ands or buts, they pay. 

 

Thank you, Presnock. I'll be 58 when I plan to retire early next year, and unfortunately, I'm not in the best of health due to some pre-existing conditions that I anticipate will impact me as I age. I'm hoping to find a suitable health plan that won’t cause me too much stress in my later years. I've budgeted up to $800/month if needed for a plan that provides comprehensive coverage with minimal worries. This is much more affordable than the retiree plan (limited to US coverage) my employer offers at $1,100/month, which I find absurd.

 

On 5/11/2024 at 8:20 AM, Etaoin Shrdlu said:

 

It is true that the OIC here is quite consumer-friendly and it is easy to schedule a meeting to discuss a grievance. The downside is that insurers here may offer less broad coverage and have a poorer claims-paying attitude.

 

Thanks, Etaoin. It's good to know that the OIC in Thailand can be quite consumer friendly when it comes to grievances. I found this interesting OIC update issued just a few months ago:

 

https://www.tilleke.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/01/Tilleke-Thomson-Reuters-Country-Update-Thailand-Insurance-January-2024.pdf

[Sheryl]

2 hours ago, Desut said:

I'll be 58 when I plan to retire early next year, and unfortunately, I'm not in the best of health due to some pre-existing conditions that I anticipate will impact me as I age. 

Unfortunately, depending on what these  conditions are, you may  be uninsurable.

 

Expat insurers are not required to cover people wirh pre existing conditions and for the most part, they don't.  If you can provide detsils of these confitions I can advise better. 

 

Yoh might need to maintain your US policy and then get a travel policy on top of that which includes "acute exacerbations of pre-existing conditions". That presumes you'll be spending some time in US each year and would be prepared to return to US for non urgent care.

 

Obviously this has cost implications for your retirement planning.  So too may the new changes to Thai tax law. If you will be receiving a private pension any remittances of same to Thailand are taxable in Thailand if you  are here 180 days a year or more (though under double taxation treaty can get credit for taxes paid in US). Government pension though is taxable only in US  Ditto SS when you become eligible. 

 

 

 

[Presnock]

6 hours ago, Desut said:

 

Thanks for the information, Sheryl. It's very informative. I'm comparing this against the health insurance provided by my employer in the US. Ideally, I'd like to find similar coverage so that, if or when I get sick in retirement, I don’t have to worry about whether or not the insurance will cover me. Perhaps that's hoping for too much. 

 

 

Thank you, Presnock. I'll be 58 when I plan to retire early next year, and unfortunately, I'm not in the best of health due to some pre-existing conditions that I anticipate will impact me as I age. I'm hoping to find a suitable health plan that won’t cause me too much stress in my later years. I've budgeted up to $800/month if needed for a plan that provides comprehensive coverage with minimal worries. This is much more affordable than the retiree plan (limited to US coverage) my employer offers at $1,100/month, which I find absurd.

 

 

Thanks, Etaoin. It's good to know that the OIC in Thailand can be quite consumer friendly when it comes to grievances. I found this interesting OIC update issued just a few months ago:

 

https://www.tilleke.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/01/Tilleke-Thomson-Reuters-Country-Update-Thailand-Insurance-January-2024.pdf

Yeah on all that has been mentioned.  I would not get health insurance for myself locally as any conflict will be decided in the favor against ex-pats as that situation is currently getting even stronger.  I was lucky in that I worked for the US govt so I kept my health insurance which is govt sponsored too so they pick up a larger chunk but my family coverage is over 800 a month and once I fade away, I hope it is at least 5 years away, and if so, then believe my wife who is Thai will drop that even if it could be continued at a higher cost (she will understand about that anyway) as she will continue to receive a portion of my retirement which will enable her to lead a comfortable life with a local insurer. I really have no knowledge of US health insurers other than this one which I have had since 1996.  Fortunately, I and my family members are healthy and healthy foods are abundant here at least in the major cities.  Houses are cheaper than cars here.  If one lives in Bangkok then a car is not even necessary at all with the train service.  I originally retired in Bangkok but grew tired of the traffic so moved to Chiang Mai 11 years ago and then when our daughter began college in Bangkok we moved back here while keeping the house we bought in CM.  We sold our car as we thought we would go to the US for daughter's college but had visa problems for my wife and although daughter had been accepted with scholarships in the US, she opted to just stay here at the #1 college in Thailand - she is doing a degree in Korean and World Culture so the degree will be great anywhere.  If you are retiring next year then you and the rest of us will know all about the new tax law interpretation about all remittances into Thailand are to be taxed - there are exemptions but nothing is really totally clear yet.  How familiar are you with life in Thailand?

[Desut]

On 5/12/2024 at 12:24 PM, Sheryl said:

Unfortunately, depending on what these  conditions are, you may  be uninsurable.

 

Expat insurers are not required to cover people wirh pre existing conditions and for the most part, they don't.  If you can provide detsils of these confitions I can advise better. 

 

Yoh might need to maintain your US policy and then get a travel policy on top of that which includes "acute exacerbations of pre-existing conditions". That presumes you'll be spending some time in US each year and would be prepared to return to US for non urgent care.

 

Obviously this has cost implications for your retirement planning.  So too may the new changes to Thai tax law. If you will be receiving a private pension any remittances of same to Thailand are taxable in Thailand if you  are here 180 days a year or more (though under double taxation treaty can get credit for taxes paid in US). Government pension though is taxable only in US  Ditto SS when you become eligible. 

 

 

 

 

We have certainly considered the scenario you suggested—maintaining my US policy after retirement and getting a travel policy for our time in Thailand. Since we do plan on traveling back and forth, but not sure how often those trips would be.

 

I further inquired about the retiree health plan offered by my employer, and the $1100/month quote I initially received was for a family plan. If I opt just for myself, it would be significantly less, around $400/month. My wife, who is younger and in perfect health, could get a separate policy, which might be a viable solution. She is also a Thai citizen and entitled to free universal health coverage. I also learned that I could opt out of my employer retiree plan but can reinstate it at a later time if I can prove that I maintained coverage with a comparable plan.

 

So, we have several options to consider. As we get closer to next year, I will begin getting detailed quotes from providers. Thank you for your help and suggestions; I appreciate it.

 

On 5/12/2024 at 4:39 PM, Presnock said:

Yeah on all that has been mentioned.  I would not get health insurance for myself locally as any conflict will be decided in the favor against ex-pats as that situation is currently getting even stronger.  I was lucky in that I worked for the US govt so I kept my health insurance which is govt sponsored too so they pick up a larger chunk but my family coverage is over 800 a month and once I fade away, I hope it is at least 5 years away, and if so, then believe my wife who is Thai will drop that even if it could be continued at a higher cost (she will understand about that anyway) as she will continue to receive a portion of my retirement which will enable her to lead a comfortable life with a local insurer. I really have no knowledge of US health insurers other than this one which I have had since 1996.  Fortunately, I and my family members are healthy and healthy foods are abundant here at least in the major cities.  Houses are cheaper than cars here.  If one lives in Bangkok then a car is not even necessary at all with the train service.  I originally retired in Bangkok but grew tired of the traffic so moved to Chiang Mai 11 years ago and then when our daughter began college in Bangkok we moved back here while keeping the house we bought in CM.  We sold our car as we thought we would go to the US for daughter's college but had visa problems for my wife and although daughter had been accepted with scholarships in the US, she opted to just stay here at the #1 college in Thailand - she is doing a degree in Korean and World Culture so the degree will be great anywhere.  If you are retiring next year then you and the rest of us will know all about the new tax law interpretation about all remittances into Thailand are to be taxed - there are exemptions but nothing is really totally clear yet.  How familiar are you with life in Thailand?

 

Thanks for your insights and experiences. I've been to Thailand about six or seven times since I met my wife 13 years ago. We just returned from a one-month trip in April. I love everything about Thailand—the people, the culture, the food, the easygoing way of life, and the acceptance of everyone, especially compared to where we live in NYC. We really love the southwest coast and plan to make our home somewhere around there—Hua Hin, Pran Buri, or Khao Kalok.

 

We are aware of the new tax laws, which is why I’d prefer to get the LTR visa, especially for the tax exemptions. However, I understand that these laws could change overnight.

[Presnock]

39 minutes ago, Desut said:

 

We have certainly considered the scenario you suggested—maintaining my US policy after retirement and getting a travel policy for our time in Thailand. Since we do plan on traveling back and forth, but not sure how often those trips would be.

 

I further inquired about the retiree health plan offered by my employer, and the $1100/month quote I initially received was for a family plan. If I opt just for myself, it would be significantly less, around $400/month. My wife, who is younger and in perfect health, could get a separate policy, which might be a viable solution. She is also a Thai citizen and entitled to free universal health coverage. I also learned that I could opt out of my employer retiree plan but can reinstate it at a later time if I can prove that I maintained coverage with a comparable plan.

 

So, we have several options to consider. As we get closer to next year, I will begin getting detailed quotes from providers. Thank you for your help and suggestions; I appreciate it.

 

 

Thanks for your insights and experiences. I've been to Thailand about six or seven times since I met my wife 13 years ago. We just returned from a one-month trip in April. I love everything about Thailand—the people, the culture, the food, the easygoing way of life, and the acceptance of everyone, especially compared to where we live in NYC. We really love the southwest coast and plan to make our home somewhere around there—Hua Hin, Pran Buri, or Khao Kalok.

 

We are aware of the new tax laws, which is why I’d prefer to get the LTR visa, especially for the tax exemptions. However, I understand that these laws could change overnight.

Since your wife is Thai, insurance for her is very cheap, while I have family coverage on my insurance, we still have local coverage for my wife and daughte since it is so cheap plus if serious, your wife can go to a government hospital - I have many friends who have been treated at govt hospitals because they are cheaper and in many cases the doctors there are also at the private hospitals.  Anyway enjoy your travels, I fully undertand about NY especially the taxes.  If you have a house there, if it is empty while you are here, I have read several stories about squatters moving in and NY is the wrong place to have to fight for your own property.  Take care.  good luck