Stickman Reports Bkk 1st World Prices, 3rd World Quality

[davejonesbkk]

ah yes... the 55+ never left their home countries until three years ago crowd, the 'love it or leave it authorites' on thailand. they speak no thai, never eat oin food stalls, never used a squat toilet, the same guys that fly to penang, same guys that hassle for O visas, same guys that pay lawyers to do their visas, same guys live in palaces in air-conditioned bliss.

you guys pay full freight stupid farang price and always have so youre prices havent gone up. plenty of 'wiggle room' when youre already paying 350% over any thai or 'local/expat farang' meanwhile - if youre living like stick, myself and thai people - youd notice it. really that simple. you may be living in thailand - BUT YOURE STILL A TOURIST.

telling stickman (and the rest of us) who have been living and working her for decades how it is. pretty rich really.... these guys are almost exclusively from uk and us - id bet my left nut. in both cases, they are the most self centered, pathetic lot that scour the internet. hooray for me and the heII with you.

i always have a good laugh when i see the 'how much does it cost to live in thailand" threads. the guys above post like - oh, if you dont have 60k per month, dont even bother BLAH BLAH. these are exactly the same guys that have not a clue about anything in thailand. thats how much they spend NOT to live in thailand - to keep themselves throughly above the fray.

i cant beleive the likes of some of these people criticising valid analysis from a guy whose lived here for DECADES. what stick knows about thailand couldnt in all your heads put together.

for all the love it or leave it folks out there .... this is thailand. you are alien, martians completely detatched from 'thailand' - so i would retort. if you cant live with thais and like... YOU leave it.

we made a decision decades ago to come and live in a wild, exotic sexy, crazy countires. these have caught up to what we left behind - pricey, staid, dull, overly legal, pretentious places. unfortunately - thailand has evolved and modernized into much of that. thats why its now acceptable for the likes of you guys> its clean, modern, air-con'd - plus it has pretty women youve never slept with even at your most 'hansum'. so go ahead - tell stick to go home again PLEEEZE

Agree to everything you've said here, just one small thing....for the love of God can you please change your avatar pic cos its the scariest thing Ive ever seen....

[plachon]

I live very well..........................on frogs, snakes, shellfish, insects, eels, red ants eggs and whatever else happens to look tempting in the local fresh market or is foolish enough to cross my lawn in a rain storm......so what you talking about? What's more my pad only costs 3,000 B/month, which leaves more money left over for the essentials in life...........like beer n' Lao coffee.

PS. for shaving foam, I always find some nice lathery soap works just as well and costs a fraction the price. There - another bottle of beer in the fridge.

I have no problem with your lifestyle.The main thing is that you are happy and contend.Please accept my apology, if I came across as criticizing it. What I wanted to say was, that for the Bangkok city dwellers, these changes might be a little of a shock,and seeing Thailand outside of Bangkok(rural areas) will not be the same Thai experience, as to what they are used to.Of course the ones with the long weekend country holiday and the rented van, will certainly have more experience.I've only been here 5 years,and I'll be the first one to say that I have a lot to learn,but I've lived in the countryside the entire time.

I also use soap to shave.I boycott anything were I feel I'm getting ripped off,or have to pay more than a Thai pays.

No need to apologise Mellow.........it's each man to his own as far as I am concerned and if some people can only get by on 80,000 B/month while others can survive quite nicely on 20,000 B/month, then that's their own business. I didn't take it as criticism and the Thai experience can be whatever you make of it.......with generally the people at the lower end of the income scale and living upcountry getting a bit closer to the action and heart of LOS, than those stuck in a Bangkok condo and needing all the Western creature comforts to live in Thailand. Of course Bangkok is much more expensive, esp the CBD, which I always think is best illustrated by the price of an hour on the Net. I've forked out 200 B/hr on several occasions in central BKK, versus a standard 20 B/hr in the local Isaan Net cafes. Quite a difference - almost as much as the National Parks entry for foreigner vs Thai price gouge, eh?

[PeaceBlondie]

Somebody suggested that instead of asking another farang, ask the Thai closest to you. Boyfriend just said all the prices have gone up in Chiang Mai: gasoline, chicken, vegetables, everything (except for rent, which kind of went up 500 baht/month this year). Prices at Sizzler went up so badly, and the service went down so far, that we've stopped enjoying that place altogether. Of course, the meat there is imported, so...should be cheaper than last year, right?

[Ulysses G.]

For years I've been listening to all these expats laughing about how AMAZINGLY cheap it is to live here because the dollar was so strong. Now you are all crying like babies because the tables have turned a little. Maybe Thailand should be paying dirt-bag losers to come live here. I'm sure that they don't want to lose such a bunch of high-class princes if they can help it .

[rgs2001uk]

now may be the time for the financially challenged to reasses their reasons for being in thailand, and if need be to resort to plan a,b or c, if indeed such plans exist.

i dont care about the prices in other countries, i dont live there, but a dollar will always be a dollar in america.

as for prices here in bkk, the other week i walked into a dentist, 45 minutes later i paid 200 baht for a filling and walked out the door, no way that would have happened in the uk.

prices were mentioned for lt and st, the reason these prices are asked for is because the 3 week millionaires pay them, if you think they are expensive try some places where the prices are 5000 baht st and 20,000 baht lt.

if i was in the uk i would be paying over 20,000 baht a month in property taxes, here in bkk i pay 20 baht a month for the eqivalent of whatever poll tax is called these days.

i wont bother going on about petrol, some smaller cars, toyota and honda etc being cheaper here, electrical goods are about the same price as the uk, then again singapore is no longer the bargain it used to be.

yes people who operate in us dollars are feeling the pinch, i wonder how many brits here remember the days of 32 or 33 baht to the pound, i planned on 40 baht to the pound and anything over to be a bonus, i also havent burned any bridges, if it no longer suits me to be in thailand i will go elsewhere.

it maybe time for some people to take a much needed reality check, and go back to their home countries for a holiday, then come back to thailand and ressses.

if you arent getting as much bang for your buck it may be time to ask for a pay rise, but the law of supply and demand always wins, next year the latest batch of freshmen will be just as happy to do your job for what you are earning now.

hang on tight, we are in for a rough ride, not for the fainthearted or the financially unprepared.

[Jingthing]

Life is always a rough ride. Rich or poor. And nobody gets out alive. Make adjustments and cope. Overall, to me Thailand is still a great deal compared to the US. But I don't live the same way as in the US. For some things better, for some things worse. I won't pay the wine prices here, for example, just not worth it to me.

[dog412]

For years I've been listening to all these expats laughing about how AMAZINGLY cheap it is to live here because the dollar was so strong. Now you are all crying like babies because the tables have turned a little. Maybe Thailand should be paying dirt-bag losers to come live here. I'm sure that they don't want to lose such a bunch of high-class princes if they can help it .

i'm certainly not crying, even though i use us dollars. who is crying is the small retailers that i used to do my buying with. i now buy all my "drinks" through the deliver to my room distributor, at a large pct. saving, at least two of us and may catch on to more. no taxi fare either. it's somewhat easy to cut your expenses in this country if you try, and really not give up any standards to boot. as always, unfortunately, those at the lower ends will suffer. but ,hey, this is thailand, and it IS their country?

[pumpuiman]

Come to Isaan.....we can have a contest to see how many days it takes to spend 1000 baht

It used to take my ex-girlfriends family about 5 minutes.

....true.....But, last visit I took my wife and 18 (yes eighteen) of her friends out for dinner and drinks, then karaoke and more drinks,then a late night snack (second dinner) and spent 3000 baht total.

Try that in BKK

[bangkoksingapore]

my friend told called me last month from up north and said he got off the plane w/ his girl friend and there 20 people waiting for them. it seems that the waiting party decided that he was taking them all out to dinner to celebrate. everyone ate and drank whiskey and then ordered food to take away for later, and of course no one reached for the bill when it came. lol.

[Tinkelbell]

I live very well..........................on frogs, snakes, shellfish, insects, eels, red ants eggs and whatever else happens to look tempting in the local fresh market or is foolish enough to cross my lawn in a rain storm......so what you talking about? What's more my pad only costs 3,000 B/month, which leaves more money left over for the essentials in life...........like beer n' Lao coffee.

PS. for shaving foam, I always find some nice lathery soap works just as well and costs a fraction the price. There - another bottle of beer in the fridge.

I have no problem with your lifestyle.The main thing is that you are happy and contend.Please accept my apology, if I came across as criticizing it. What I wanted to say was, that for the Bangkok city dwellers, these changes might be a little of a shock,and seeing Thailand outside of Bangkok(rural areas) will not be the same Thai experience, as to what they are used to.Of course the ones with the long weekend country holiday and the rented van, will certainly have more experience.I've only been here 5 years,and I'll be the first one to say that I have a lot to learn,but I've lived in the countryside the entire time.

I also use soap to shave.I boycott anything were I feel I'm getting ripped off,or have to pay more than a Thai pays.

Totally agree 'Mello 1'

Your experiences combined your observation are truely correct. The five years of living in LOS had done wonderful on your intellectual.

Thailand loves to have you here.

Koh-hai-khun-chook- dee- na-ka

[Tinkelbell]

Well, the price of most things rises with time, inside of Thailand and out (in my day, a chocolate bar was a nickel, etc...) -- the question is -- are the prices rising more in Thailand than elsewhere?

But you know -- it could be worse: I was reading that in Nigeria, inflation is officially estimated to be 3700%, (how do you even estimate once the figure is so ridiculous? I guess this means that a chocolate bar that cost $1 last year now costs 387$!) with real rate of inflation guessed to be many times higher.

Well I understand that ..."most things rise with time..." That's the way ecomomy adjusts to the inflation.

From my experience, having staying at this particular hotel since 1993, the hotel raised the prices on me twice, first, 100THB, which stayed for 4 years, then 200THB for 5 years after that.

Since 2004 (Remember? The year of Tsunami), from that year upward, the hotel charged me 350THB more each year. Manu prices also up, including everything else. In the past three years I really feel inflation really catching up fast in LOS.

Absolutely agree with the posts from 'BAF' who said....."The prices keeping up but not the services", that's exactly what I feel about the costs of living in BKK. While I'm paying more, the hotel haven't done any thing more to make you feel you get your money worths, consider the building ages as time goes by, the services weren't improved. I still get the same amenities as I first checking in 14 years ago.

To those who came out with the cheap shot...."If you're not happy with Thailand, just leave".

I find it is quite offensive even a native Thai like myself. I would never dream of using the derogatorily term to any expats who choose to call TL home. That said a lot about you.

[JRinger]

thailand is going through a transitional period. normal. whether you want to get involved is up to you. I've seen it happen in hong kong, china, even in america.

do I like it? no. but I realize it is normal.

personally, I hope all factories go back to america. I don't like globalization.

Thailand is always "going through a transitional period", is it not?

For the record (and information).

The local hotel that I stayed in 12 years ago charged 550 baht/night. Now, after completely remodeling/upgrading the rooms they charge 550 baht including ABF.

I've been renting the same townhouse for many years @ 15,000 baht per year. 2-story, 2-bedroom, 2-bath, marble floors, quiet neighborhood, etc.

Electric bill: 1,000 baht/month,

water: 100 baht/month.

bottled water: 12 baht/20 liters-delivered.

Delicious curry with noodles: 10 baht.

Of course you've already figured out that I'm not talking about Bangkok, Phuket or Samui and sorry, I'm not going to tell you where I'm talking about.

About the only thing that's gone up here is land prices, mostly due to extravagant farang who've come here thinking the asking price is cheap enough.

Edited August 7, 2007 by JRinger

[gzu88bv]

For some things better, for some things worse. I won't pay the wine prices here, for example, just not worth it to me.

...... nor do I. You cannot have everything, therefore it is best you just adjust. If you want good wine at reasonable prices, then go where that is grown.

And always ask yourself why you choose the place or country you are living in right now in the first place.

[mellow1]

For years I've been listening to all these expats laughing about how AMAZINGLY cheap it is to live here because the dollar was so strong. Now you are all crying like babies because the tables have turned a little. Maybe Thailand should be paying dirt-bag losers to come live here. I'm sure that they don't want to lose such a bunch of high-class princes if they can help it .

i'm certainly not crying, even though i use us dollars. who is crying is the small retailers that i used to do my buying with. i now buy all my "drinks" through the deliver to my room distributor, at a large pct. saving, at least two of us and may catch on to more. no taxi fare either. it's somewhat easy to cut your expenses in this country if you try, and really not give up any standards to boot. as always, unfortunately, those at the lower ends will suffer. but ,hey, this is thailand, and it IS their country?

I'm not crying.We own our home and car,have no debts.Pay only for electric,phone, school,and insurances(our highest costs).Have,TVs,computers etc..There is nothing out there that we NEED to buy,except food,and clothing.My pension income in US dollars is far better, than the vast majority of Thais income in Baht,and who are working.I don't see this changing for a very long time,if ever.

I also don't buy from small retailer hardly at all, unless you want to count 8 cigarettes a day and a coke now and then.We buy all our stuff at big stores such as Big C where the prices are clearly marked and the items clean.As for loosing about 20% do to the Baht getting stronger in the last year,I just cut a day off the workers around here and got it back.Everything here is well set up,and nothing more is really needed.

[onzestan]

Just one question.

How much has the cost of living gone up in your home countries the last 5 years?

onzestan

[samran]

Just one question.

How much has the cost of living gone up in your home countries the last 5 years?

onzestan

In OZ...too much.

When we moved to London we were suprised to find that our grocery shop was cheaper in the UK than in OZ. Housing in OZ is also approaching UK prices.

General cost of services in OZ is expensive. None of my UK based mates earning pounds now come back home for Christmas rejoicing that Australia is so cheap...which tells you a lot.

Bangkok at least is fast approaching the prices for the west if you want t live a particular lifestyle. Of course, you are going to get varying prices in different areas, but the bonus at least in Thailand is you can choose to minimise many of your costs, if you want to.

[onzestan]

Just one question.

How much has the cost of living gone up in your home countries the last 5 years?

onzestan

In OZ...too much.

When we moved to London we were suprised to find that our grocery shop was cheaper in the UK than in OZ. Housing in OZ is also approaching UK prices.

General cost of services in OZ is expensive. None of my UK based mates earning pounds now come back home for Christmas rejoicing that Australia is so cheap...which tells you a lot.

Bangkok at least is fast approaching the prices for the west if you want t live a particular lifestyle. Of course, you are going to get varying prices in different areas, but the bonus at least in Thailand is you can choose to minimise many of your costs, if you want to.

My thoughts exactly. Of course it hurts when you came here because a more or less western lifestyle was a lot cheaper here than back home, but I don't think it has changed much in comparison to the changes in the west.

I know for a fact that just the living costs in Belgium have risen dramatically since the introduction of the Euro, and that's not so long ago.

Thailand is still cheap to live in, and of course there are cheaper options elsewhere but Thaliand is where I want to live, and if it takes certain adjustments then so be it.

My 3 cents

onzestan

onzestan

[samran]

My 3 cents

see, there is even 50% inflation in sayings these days as well

[bangkoksingapore]

ah yes... the 55+ never left their home countries until three years ago crowd, the 'love it or leave it authorites' on thailand. they speak no thai, never eat oin food stalls, never used a squat toilet, the same guys that fly to penang, same guys that hassle for O visas, same guys that pay lawyers to do their visas, same guys live in palaces in air-conditioned bliss.

you guys pay full freight stupid farang price and always have so youre prices havent gone up. plenty of 'wiggle room' when youre already paying 350% over any thai or 'local/expat farang' meanwhile - if youre living like stick, myself and thai people - youd notice it. really that simple. you may be living in thailand - BUT YOURE STILL A TOURIST.

telling stickman (and the rest of us) who have been living and working her for decades how it is. pretty rich really.... these guys are almost exclusively from uk and us - id bet my left nut. in both cases, they are the most self centered, pathetic lot that scour the internet. hooray for me and the heII with you.

i always have a good laugh when i see the 'how much does it cost to live in thailand" threads. the guys above post like - oh, if you dont have 60k per month, dont even bother BLAH BLAH. these are exactly the same guys that have not a clue about anything in thailand. thats how much they spend NOT to live in thailand - to keep themselves throughly above the fray.

i cant beleive the likes of some of these people criticising valid analysis from a guy whose lived here for DECADES. what stick knows about thailand couldnt in all your heads put together.

for all the love it or leave it folks out there .... this is thailand. you are alien, martians completely detatched from 'thailand' - so i would retort. if you cant live with thais and like... YOU leave it.

we made a decision decades ago to come and live in a wild, exotic sexy, crazy countires. these have caught up to what we left behind - pricey, staid, dull, overly legal, pretentious places. unfortunately - thailand has evolved and modernized into much of that. thats why its now acceptable for the likes of you guys> its clean, modern, air-con'd - plus it has pretty women youve never slept with even at your most 'hansum'. so go ahead - tell stick to go home again PLEEEZE

Agree to everything you've said here, just one small thing....for the love of God can you please change your avatar pic cos its the scariest thing Ive ever seen....

the only thing worse then the guys he described are the ones like himself who complain about the prices in thailand. maybe he can write an open letter to the businesses of thailand asking them to please lower their prices so its more affordable to him. i think the lot of you might consider cambodia. i hear its cheap there and all the people from back home are still scared of it.

[bendix]

My apartment in Sukhumvit has been the same rent for the last three years. The landlord recently told me he would keep it at the same rate for another year if I want to stay. The place costs the equivalent of 900 pounds sterling a month. The same place of the same quality would cost close to 3000 quid a month in London for the equivalent location.

I've just bought a house in Hua Hin. Expensive by Thai standards because of the quality, it is around a quarter of what I'd pay in the UK and a third what I'd pay in Australia.

Most of the things I pay for regularly are the same now than when I arrived - taxis, flights, orange juice on the street, a couple of pieces of fruit for breakfast. The same for internet, mobile phone and UBC. Supermarket shopping seems a bit more expensive. My regular imported magazines and books are slightly more. Restaurant eating doesnt seem to have changed much, although I don't stay in the same places. A beer Singh at my local bar costs 70 baht; it used to cost 65 baht when i arrived.

Fuel and imported luxury goods - yes, they are up but not enough to impact my lifestyle.

It's not all gloom and doom.

I still maintain that this is probably one of the best value / quality places to live in the world. There are places where things are cheaper - Philippines, Cambodia (although that's debatable), but next to no choice in those places.

I'm happy enough.

[mrtoad]

I'd have to agree with Bendix that Thailand is still one of the best value for money places around.

Rents are still reasonably sensible, and you can certainly find something pretty reasonable from 15k up, although that means you are living out of the Sukhumvit/ Silom areas.

Transport around is reasonable, eating out is still good value and the price of beer is still pretty good.

Ok, I have af ew gripes about the cost of wine and cheese, but as most of that is imported you have to expect to pay more. Magazines are a rip off, and it is cheaper for me to have them sent from the UK. UBC is still not expensive, but it is not a good service when compared to Sky,

[mrtoad]

I'd have to agree with Bendix that Thailand is still one of the best value for money places around.

Rents are still reasonably sensible, and you can certainly find something pretty reasonable from 15k up, although that means you are living out of the Sukhumvit / Silom areas.

Transport around is reasonable, eating out is still good value and the price of beer is still pretty cheap.

Ok, I have a few gripes about the cost of wine, cheese and a few other western food goods, but as most of that is imported you have to expect to pay more. Magazines are a rip off, and it is cheaper for me to have them sent from the UK. UBC is still not expensive, but it is not a good service when compared to Sky, but then you are paying three times as much and the football coverage along with the News channels is more than ample to satisfy my needs.

I don't have what I would call a high paying job, but I am able to live more than comfortably on what I earn. It's to simplistic to take into account just the monetary aspects, for me It's also about the lifestyle.

All in all, given the choice of going back to the UK or remaining here, I know what I would choose without much hesitation.

[dog412]

My apartment in Sukhumvit has been the same rent for the last three years. The landlord recently told me he would keep it at the same rate for another year if I want to stay. The place costs the equivalent of 900 pounds sterling a month. The same place of the same quality would cost close to 3000 quid a month in London for the equivalent location.

I've just bought a house in Hua Hin. Expensive by Thai standards because of the quality, it is around a quarter of what I'd pay in the UK and a third what I'd pay in Australia.

Most of the things I pay for regularly are the same now than when I arrived - taxis, flights, orange juice on the street, a couple of pieces of fruit for breakfast. The same for internet, mobile phone and UBC. Supermarket shopping seems a bit more expensive. My regular imported magazines and books are slightly more. Restaurant eating doesnt seem to have changed much, although I don't stay in the same places. A beer Singh at my local bar costs 70 baht; it used to cost 65 baht when i arrived.

Fuel and imported luxury goods - yes, they are up but not enough to impact my lifestyle.

It's not all gloom and doom.

I still maintain that this is probably one of the best value / quality places to live in the world. There are places where things are cheaper - Philippines, Cambodia (although that's debatable), but next to no choice in those places.

I'm happy enough.

no offence,but you might attempt to realize how obscene 2000 u.s. seems to many of us for a month of rent. my guess is someone is getting your bill.

mont

[chinthee]

My apartment in Sukhumvit has been the same rent for the last three years. The landlord recently told me he would keep it at the same rate for another year if I want to stay. The place costs the equivalent of 900 pounds sterling a month. The same place of the same quality would cost close to 3000 quid a month in London for the equivalent location.

I've just bought a house in Hua Hin. Expensive by Thai standards because of the quality, it is around a quarter of what I'd pay in the UK and a third what I'd pay in Australia.

Most of the things I pay for regularly are the same now than when I arrived - taxis, flights, orange juice on the street, a couple of pieces of fruit for breakfast. The same for internet, mobile phone and UBC. Supermarket shopping seems a bit more expensive. My regular imported magazines and books are slightly more. Restaurant eating doesnt seem to have changed much, although I don't stay in the same places. A beer Singh at my local bar costs 70 baht; it used to cost 65 baht when i arrived.

Fuel and imported luxury goods - yes, they are up but not enough to impact my lifestyle.

It's not all gloom and doom.

I still maintain that this is probably one of the best value / quality places to live in the world. There are places where things are cheaper - Philippines, Cambodia (although that's debatable), but next to no choice in those places.

I'm happy enough.

no offence,but you might attempt to realize how obscene 2000 u.s. seems to many of us for a month of rent. my guess is someone is getting your bill.

mont

You're very intuitive. Unless someone is a successful entrepreneur or a corporate stiff on an expat package, these types of rents would be stupid in Thailand. A smart man would rent cheaply and invest for buying a place later.

[bendix]

Your guess might be right. I get an accommodation allowance.

But thanks for the advice on how to spend my money. I appreciate it.

I choose to have a large, quality place with all mod cons in one of the most convenient locations in the city. That means paying for it, obscene or not. As i already said, a similar place in New York, Sydney or London would be four times that price. I know many people paying considerably more, for less, even in Bangkok.

[Jimjim]

Bangkok may be getting more expensive but it is eons away from getting near London, etc. What are you all smoking? Certain things have always been similar to the West, and of course Western groceries are going to put you back a few baht, duh. Electronics, etc. have never seemed to be cheaper in Thailand. But for the whole cost of living, it is still much cheaper, just not perhaps as utterly dirt cheap as before.

[kmart]

Some people need a "refresher course" on prices back in their home countries. Thank Ker-ist I still kept my house in the UK, I'm not sure I could buy another one if I had to leave here....

[thai_narak]

if we are feeling the pinch then what about the thais? has the somtam lady across the road already increased her prices yet? or maybe it's it just our lifestyle? i have read that stickman had a buffet dinner at sheraton for 990++ baht, that's a "no go" for thais isn't it?

so where do farang go and spend money anyway?

[onlooker]

For an example of a very good value apartment where rents haven't increased in a decade see the back of the Nation Classifieds for the ad for Rio Monte Apartment . I moved in 9 and a half years ago and paid 7,200 baht/month for brand new studio ( list price 8,000 but 12 month contract so got 10% off)

[dog412]

Your guess might be right. I get an accommodation allowance.

But thanks for the advice on how to spend my money. I appreciate it.

I choose to have a large, quality place with all mod cons in one of the most convenient locations in the city. That means paying for it, obscene or not. As i already said, a similar place in New York, Sydney or London would be four times that price. I know many people paying considerably more, for less, even in Bangkok.

hey, best to you, but pls. forgive me, if i could afford 8000 us a month for rent in N.Y. i would be in N.Y. while i have a high affinity for BKK. at those rates it offers very little of value, although the oj is cheaper.