Wise vs Revolut - This is what I've found out

[Freddy42OZ]

13 hours ago, RSD1 said:

In my opinion, neither Wise or Revolut is ideal for exchanging money between dollars, pounds, euros, or for holding cash in multiple currencies.

 

A better alternative is an Interactive Brokers account, which can be set up online quickly. Once your funds are in the account, you can exchange between these three currencies as well as Australian dollars, New Zealand dollars, Canadian dollars, Japanese yen, Hong Kong dollars, and Singapore dollars. In total, Interactive Brokers supports 26 currencies, and all exchanges are done at the mid-market rate with no fees. By comparison, while Wise also provides the mid-market rate for most of these currencies, it charges an average fee of about 0.3% of the amount being exchanged.

 

Additionally, if you hold U.S. dollars in your Interactive Brokers account, they are FDIC-protected, unlike with Wise. For spending purposes, you can transfer funds from your Interactive Brokers account to your Wise account. Interactive Brokers allows one free transfer to Wise per month, with subsequent transfers costing just $1 each. It’s also very easy to link an Interactive Brokers account directly to a Wise account, and transfers typically arrive within 24 hours.

 

 

How would Interactive Brokers feel if you used them as a bank account rather than a trading account?

[33 RPM]

So i pose this to you learned folk

if i needed to transfer a quite sizeable amount of Thai Baht { sale of a property ]

back to Australia,,, it can be done is numerous transactions,

which would you think is the best value way , ie less fees etc,  and of course secure

to do this

Thanks.

[RSD1]

53 minutes ago, Delta Shift said:

 Thx 👍

 

I spoke with Interactive Brokers earlier, and while Thai baht is listed among the available currencies for conversions on the drop down menu when performing a currency exchange on the platform, this can be a bit misleading. They explained that baht appears on the list because, in some cases, people sell Thai securities, which settle in baht before being automatically converted to the currency of their choice. However, Thai baht is not currently available for standard currency conversions on the platform. That said, they mentioned it could be added in the future, so it’s worth keeping an eye on.

[RSD1]

14 minutes ago, Freddy42OZ said:

 

 

How would Interactive Brokers feel if you used them as a bank account rather than a trading account?

 

Interactive Brokers is primarily designed as a trading platform for equities and securities rather than a traditional bank. While they offer features like multi-currency accounts, FDIC protection on cash balances, excellent exchange rates, and the ability to hold cash, using the platform purely as a “bank account” may not align with their intended purpose.

 

That said, IBKR generally doesn’t restrict how you use your account, provided you comply with their terms and conditions. However, if your activity involves little to no trading or investing, and instead focuses only on depositing, holding, converting, exchanging, and withdrawing cash, they might take notice, particularly if it is large amounts that might raise regulatory concerns for them.

 

To avoid potential issues, it’s a good idea to conduct occasional trading activity on the account. Their trading fees are very low, almost negligible, so making one or two small stock trades per year, such as trading penny stocks, can demonstrate satisfactory trading activity on the account, but without requiring a financial investment of more than a few dollars.

[bradiston]

25 minutes ago, Delta Shift said:

 

Revolut is the cheapest only for card payments. I don't know many people out there spending $1000 a month on CC alone in Thailand. They probably exist but most of them do so using thai banking services as expats. The long-term tourist / digital nomad type uses mainly cash and shouldn't use Wise or Revolut to withdraw anyways.

 

Imo the best configuration without thai accounts and cards is to use the best service you can find for each type of transaction knowing that Thailand remains very much a cash society.

I see only phone payments in 7 by Thai people. They never pay cash. I use scan mostly too, in Makro, Big C etc. No change given, clean and quick. Shows immediately in my KT account. Don't even need a card. Stuck behind somebody paying 15,374 THB cash. OMG!

[Millian]

28 minutes ago, Delta Shift said:

 

Revolut is the cheapest only for card payments. I don't know many people out there spending $1000 a month on CC alone in Thailand. They probably exist but most of them do so using thai banking services as expats. The long-term tourist / digital nomad type uses mainly cash and shouldn't use Wise or Revolut to withdraw anyways.

 

I'm one of those and yes I use my UOB (previously Citi) CC.  Although I'm pondering the idea to switch to using Revolut card as my 'daily driver' for card payments.

[RSD1]

1 hour ago, Delta Shift said:

Revolut is the cheapest only for card payments.

 

Yes, but with the caveat that this only applies to payments in Thailand totaling less than the equivalent of $1,000 per month on a Revolut card. When comparing the card spending costs of Revolut to Wise, which is the focus of the original post, Wise will only charge between $3 and $5 in currency exchange fees on $1,000 worth of purchases made with your Wise card. In my opinion, the cost difference between these two Fintech companies is so minimal that it’s not even worth worrying about.

 

1 hour ago, Delta Shift said:

I don't know many people out there spending $1000 a month on CC alone in Thailand. They probably exist but most of them do so using thai banking services as expats.

 

I’m not entirely sure what point you’re making, but I believe there are many foreign residents in Thailand who spend over $1,000 a month for purchases using their Wise debit cards. In fact, I think this number has increased this year. And yes, I am referring mainly to foreign residents in Thailand rather than tourists or digital nomads, because the majority of the people posting on this site are mainly residents. 

 

The increase in spending on Wise cards in Thailand is likely due to the recent changes in Thai tax regulations where money transferred from overseas into a Thai bank account is now subject to personal income tax if you reside in Thailand for more than 180 days per year, and this applies to both foreigners and to locals alike. As a result, many people are now choosing to spend money in Thailand using overseas credit and debit cards to avoid transferring funds into their Thai bank accounts and potentially being taxed on that money. 

 

[Surasak]

13 hours ago, RSD1 said:

I don't understand what you mean. I make lots of card payments from my Wise account using both physical and digital Wise cards and it never costs me anything to use those cards. No fees of any kind. So how could Revolut be cheaper for this purpose?

I will keep using my Revolut card, its cheap enough for me.

[RSD1]

4 minutes ago, Surasak said:

I will keep using my Revolut card, it's cheap enough for me.

 

Yep, no reason for you to switch. Wise and Revolut are essentially the same when it comes to making card payments. Wise charges a small fee of $3 to $5 on your first $1,000 of purchases per month when it involves a currency conversion, while Revolut has no fees on the first $1,000. However, the fee difference is so minimal that it’s not worth switching from Wise to Revolut just to save a few dollars over the course of a month, at least not for me.

[Surasak]

3 hours ago, Millian said:

When using a Revolut card to mark card payments, either using physical card or online, is there a surcharge levied by the merchant for using a foreign card?  (not talking about atm fees, or currency exchange fees, just a fee for using a foreign card)

I've seen some people say yes, others say no, other say sometimes, so wonder if any one with actual experience?

I transfer £1000/month to THB on my Revolut card a no charge. I then us this for Thai purchases with no merchant charges. If used in an ATM the usual fees apply.

[chilly07]

17 hours ago, KannikaP said:

If you need the transfer to show as an International Transfer, then WISE to Bkk Bank is by far the best, Depending on the time you instigate the transfer, and from where can make a difference.

I did UK WISE to Bkk Bank last week, 08am here, arrived 14.01 same day,

Problem with BB is their appaling branch service - sheer lack of  branches and sheer lack of staff in the branches they have left open. Wise to BB yes but need to  transfer monies to  another bank to obtain service.  And don't start me on BB facial (farcical) recognition!!

[RSD1]

5 minutes ago, chilly07 said:

Problem with BB is their appaling branch service - sheer lack of  branches and sheer lack of staff in the branches they have left open. Wise to BB yes but need to  transfer monies to  another bank to obtain service.  And don't start me on BB facial (farcical) recognition!!

Yes BBL poses many banking inconveniences. And there are lots of better banking options in Thailand; SCB, KBank, and UOB are all good alternatives. So no reason to stick with BBL if you aren't happy with their service.

[Millian]

12 minutes ago, Surasak said:

I transfer £1000/month to THB on my Revolut card a no charge. I then us this for Thai purchases with no merchant charges. If used in an ATM the usual fees apply.

That's great to hear that confirmed there is no surcharge for using a foreign Revolut card for card payments. Thanks.

I'll order a card and start using it.

How long does it take them to sent the card to Thailand?

[Surasak]

3 hours ago, RSD1 said:

Yes, they both offer the midmarket rate. But Interactive Brokers has no limit on exchanging at the mid market rate without fees whereas Revolut does have a limit and then starts charging fees. See below:

 

When converting US dollars (USD) to Thai baht (THB) in your Revolut account, the fees depend on your subscription plan, the amount exchanged, and the timing of the transaction.

 

Here’s a breakdown:

 

• Standard Plan:

• Exchanges up to $1,000 per month are free on weekdays.

• A 1% fee applies to amounts exceeding this limit.

 

• Plus Plan:

• Exchanges up to $3,000 per month are free on weekdays.

• A 0.5% fee applies to amounts exceeding this limit.

 

The plus plan carries a fee of £40 per year. So Revolut is free on currency exchange only up to a maximum of $1,000 per month on their free standard plan.
 

Revolut also charges a standard 1% fee on all weekend currency exchanges, regardless of plan or account type. 

I would challenge you on the last statement. Last month I sent £1000 from my Revolut A/C to my Kasikorn bank on a Sunday. It arrived

within one minute and no fee involved. I am of course using UK Revolut A/C, not a USD A/C, so there my be a difference?

[chilly07]

27 minutes ago, RSD1 said:

 

Yes, but with the caveat that this only applies to payments in Thailand totaling less than the equivalent of $1,000 per month on a Revolut card. When comparing the card spending costs of Revolut to Wise, which is the focus of the original post, Wise will only charge between $3 and $5 in currency exchange fees on $1,000 worth of purchases made with your Wise card. In my opinion, the cost difference between these two Fintech companies is so minimal that it’s not even worth worrying about.

 

 

I’m not entirely sure what point you’re making, but I believe there are many foreign residents in Thailand who spend over $1,000 a month using their Wise debit cards. In fact, I think this number has increased this year.

 

This is likely due to the recent changes in Thai tax regulations, where money transferred from overseas into a Thai bank account is now subject to personal income tax if you reside in Thailand for more than 180 days per year and this applies to both foreigners and to locals. As a result, many people are now choosing to spend money in Thailand using overseas credit and debit cards to avoid transferring funds into their Thai accounts and potentially being taxed on that money. 

 

Theoretically you have to declare all foreign income if tax resident in Thailand but how this will  be enforced by Thai Revenue especially where there is a Dual Tax agreement meaning you can't be tax resident in more than one country is very very unclear!

[Surasak]

1 minute ago, Millian said:

That's great to hear that confirmed there is no surcharge for using a foreign Revolut card for card payments. Thanks.

I'll order a card and start using it.

How long does it take them to sent the card to Thailand?

You may find they wont. Plus, if you don't have a UK address and a UK TEL number, you will miss out. Or do you have family in the UK?

[Delta Shift]

1 hour ago, Hardcastle P said:

Wise have recently increased their charges for Thai bht.so the saving is minimal compared to standard bank transfers. I send pounds sterling to my Thai bank  who then give me a competitive exchange rate. 

 

Good to know. Thanks.

[chilly07]

6 minutes ago, RSD1 said:

Yes BBL poses many banking inconveniences. And there are lots of better banking options in Thailand; SCB, KBank, and UOB are all good alternatives. So no reason to stick with BBL if you aren't happy with their service.

Problem is BB is heavily favoured by Thai Immigration and Agents. One reason for poor branch service is the high percentage of expats queuing for Immigration certs and follow up queries 

[chilly07]

5 minutes ago, Surasak said:

You may find they wont. Plus, if you don't have a UK address and a UK TEL number, you will miss out. Or do you have family in the UK?

Wise will provide without and will send card to Thailand 

[Delta Shift]

54 minutes ago, bradiston said:

I see only phone payments in 7 by Thai people. They never pay cash. I use scan mostly too, in Makro, Big C etc. No change given, clean and quick. Shows immediately in my KT account. Don't even need a card. Stuck behind somebody paying 15,374 THB cash. OMG!

 

I wish this f3cking country could roll back the entire restrictive garbage thing on local bank accounts...

Such an annoyance.

Frankly they could at least let people with DTV and Ed visas open accounts freely.

The entire thing is moronic...

Same goes for True Money wallet. Why not accept foreign cards for top-up purposes ?

I dunno...

[Surasak]

3 hours ago, Zack61 said:

There have been a couple of occasions where a retailer (in Thailand) imposed a fee on my Wise card. The worst was 5% at a Honda dealership for a car service. I ended up paying with a direct bank transfer to avoid it. 
I have found quite a few businesses that won’t accept it but I think this may be because they were set up for scan payments. The biggest issue I have is the limited ATM withdrawal amount and the associated withdrawal fee imposed by the host bank. I’ve tried at most and they all impose the same high fee. I thought I read somewhere on a Wise advertisement that their card was fee free but I may be mistaken. 

If the merchant imposes a 3 - 5% on the use of a card, that is the merchant, not the card issuer.

[RSD1]

1 minute ago, Surasak said:

I would challenge you on the last statement. Last month I sent £1000 from my Revolut A/C to my Kasikorn bank on a Sunday. It arrived

within one minute and no fee involved. I am of course using UK Revolut A/C, not a USD A/C, so there my be a difference?

I doubt there would be any difference in Revolut’s fees between the UK and the USA.

 

For comparison with Wise though, if you exchanged £1,000 into baht within your Wise account, they would charge a fee of roughly 0.54% for the currency conversion, which would be just under £6. Wise would then charge an additional ฿44.76 to transfer the baht from your Wise account to your KBank account in Thailand. With Wise, transfers under ฿50,000 typically take only a few seconds to reach your Thai bank account too.

 

The key difference between Revolut and Wise is that if you transferred £1,000 a second time within the same month from your Revolut account to your Thai baht bank account, Revolut would charge a 1% fee, whereas Wise would still only charge around 0.54%. This means that after the first £1,000 transfer in a month, Revolut is no longer cheaper or fee-free when compared to Wise.

[Surasak]

2 minutes ago, chilly07 said:

Wise will provide without and will send card to Thailand 

I was referencing a Revolut card, not a Wise card. As I have no use for a Wise card, I wouldn't know.

[RSD1]

13 minutes ago, chilly07 said:

Theoretically you have to declare all foreign income if tax resident in Thailand but how this will  be enforced by Thai Revenue especially where there is a Dual Tax agreement meaning you can't be tax resident in more than one country is very very unclear!

Correct on both. But at this point it seems that the TRD is really only focused on taxing residents on their overseas bank transfers into Thailand. 

[Surasak]

2 minutes ago, RSD1 said:

I doubt there would be any difference in Revolut’s fees between the UK and the USA.

 

For comparison with Wise though, if you exchanged £1,000 into baht within your Wise account, they would charge a fee of roughly 0.54% for the currency conversion, which would be just under £6. Wise would then charge an additional ฿44.76 to transfer the baht from your Wise account to your KBank account in Thailand. With Wise, transfers under ฿50,000 typically take only a few seconds to reach your Thai bank account too.

 

The key difference between Revolut and Wise is that if you transferred £1,000 a second time within the same month from your Revolut account to your Thai baht bank account, Revolut would charge a 1% fee, whereas Wise would still only charge around 0.54%. This means that after the first £1,000 transfer in a month, Revolut is no longer cheaper or fee-free when compared to Wise.

I didn't make it clear. The transfer was in THB from Revolut not GBP. Maybe that was the reason of no fee??

[RSD1]

8 minutes ago, chilly07 said:

Problem is BB is heavily favoured by Thai Immigration and Agents. One reason for poor branch service is the high percentage of expats queuing for Immigration certs and follow up queries 

In the past I used to use a BBL deposit for extending my Visa, but when I discovered that it takes a week for them to generate a 12 month bank statement, which requires two trips to the bank, one to order the statement and then a second trip to pick it up, I simply stopped banking with them. Too much hassle. Most other banks can give you a printed twelve month statement on your account within a matter of minutes normally. No one week delay and multiple trips to the bank required like with BBL.

[Delta Shift]

45 minutes ago, RSD1 said:

The increase in spending on Wise cards in Thailand is likely due to the recent changes in Thai tax regulations where money transferred from overseas into a Thai bank account is now subject to personal income tax if you reside in Thailand for more than 180 days per year, and this applies to both foreigners and to locals alike. As a result, many people are now choosing to spend money in Thailand using overseas credit and debit cards to avoid transferring funds into their Thai bank accounts and potentially being taxed on that money.

 

I didn't know that. Interesting.

It is indeed pretty good news for neobanks.

Kind of a dumb decision on the part of the Thai government imo.

But yeah it changes the entire logic one should follow if living here more than 180 days.

 

[RSD1]

2 minutes ago, Surasak said:

I didn't make it clear. The transfer was in THB from Revolut not GBP. Maybe that was the reason of no fee??

According to the following link, they charge £1.5 for a bank transfer to a Thai bank account:

 

https://www.revolut.com/money-transfer/send-money-to-thailand/

But as a comparison, Wise would only charge you ฿44.76 as a transfer fee. So Wise would be slightly cheaper on the bank transfer fee.

[Surasak]

2 hours ago, Delta Shift said:

 

The problem ain't Revolut, it's you. Revolut - just like Wise - has tremendous reviews all over the internet.

 

"I couldn't close because I didn't fill in the required documents" lol

With Revolut you can actually close the A/C within the APP.

[RSD1]

19 minutes ago, Delta Shift said:

Same goes for True Money wallet. Why not accept foreign cards for top-up purposes ?

I dunno...

Yes, that was eventually a dealbreaker for me too. I was using it for a while initially and had it connected to a local Thai bank account. But then eventually, they wanted a photo of me holding up my passport in order for me to continue using their service. Basically, I'm not particularly comfortable sending a photo of me holding up my passport via an app in Thailand to a Thai fintech company for security reasons. So that's when I stopped using it completely. In my non-expert opinion, I feel like it's only a matter of time before these Thai companies get hacked and all their customer data gets compromised. I rather not take the risk of a bunch of hackers getting hold of a photo of me holding up my passport. But now I don't need to use it anyway. I have my Wise digital card saved in my smart phone wallet and in my smart watch wallet and I just make payments wirelessly throughout Thailand that way which is much faster than scanning a QR code from the True Money Wallet app to make a payment. I now just tap my phone or my watch on a payment proximity sensor and my payment is done in a second.