Can Americans afford vacations anymore?

[KhunLA]

14 minutes ago, SiSePuede419 said:

Another fool who thinks their opinion is superior to actual data.

Nope.

I was in the Midwest heartland in 1997 and most people there did not have ANALOG cell phones 

Most people used landlines.

Yeah, lots of lonely farmers used AOL chat rooms.

Had some Republican call me up because his wife called me trying to cheat on him.

He said she worked 2nd shift at the slaughterhouse.

 

You're out of touch Elitist.  You're not rich and you are a snob. 🤣

I used Yahoo chat, and travelled all over the USA to hook up with women, 1990s, when I worked for airlines.  How I got to see many of the cities that we flew to.  From about 1993-2000 I worked 2 days a week, and played the other 5 day  

 

Gave me 3 days to hang out in cities that we flew to, with free place to stay and some female company while there ... what a life  

 

All possible because of the internet.

[Yellowtail]

41 minutes ago, SiSePuede419 said:

Out of touch Elitist. 😂

 

 

That's correct!  In December 1999, the majority of Americans did not have cell phones or home internet access. 

 

Only about 38% of Americans owned a cell phone in 1999.

 

Around 41.5% of U.S. households had internet access in 2000, meaning the majority did not have it in late 1999.

 

Once

Once

Once

 

Again!

MAGA proves they have no clue about the struggles of working class people in America, now or ever. 😄

One reason Americans were slow to adopt cell phones is because virtually everyone had phones in their homes, and there were working payphones everywhere. 

[sanabavy IV]

On 3/22/2025 at 2:35 AM, SiSePuede419 said:

You can sit on a sidewalk and do fen.

You can beg for money.

You can carjack a car at a parking lot.

You can call American protestors "commies" and Soros supporters.

 

So much! 😀

On a brighter side you can visit all those " ethnic" barrios spread all over the country, it's worth a round the world trip 😅

[jas007]

1 hour ago, SLOWHAND225 said:

Nobody cares. 
I also don't know anyone who didn't have a cell phone and a PC by 1999.
We got our first ones in 1990 and our first PC by 1993 and we were one of the last ones to get a PC out of all the people we knew.
 

You might want to pay attention to where your numbers come from because my experience (I was there)  tells me they're way off.

How did this thread devolve into an argument about who had cell phones and computers in 1999? 

 

Why does it matter?

 

In 1999, everyone I worked with had cell phones. Everyone I worked with had high speed internet access both at home and at work. As for myself, I had a computer at home since the early 1980s, although back then everyone had dial-up modems for online access and phone bills could get expensive. Comouserve and Genie were also expensive and the charges were by the hour.  I first looked at the Internet way back then, but I had to dial into a university to see it, and it was text based, as I recall.  Internet browsers didn't come along until Netscape? in the 1990s.  I think I bought my first cell phone in the mid 90s sometime.  A little Motorola flip phone.  

 

Anyway, from what I can tell, most people in America are having a hard time affording much of anything these days without going into debt, which pretty much rules out any kind of extensive travel.  Inflation is not much fun. 

[Yellowtail]

I got my first PC in about '92, and not many of the people I knew had them. I got my first cell phone for work in '99 when I relocated to Thailand, and it seems like not many of the people I knew had them at that time. 

 

It seems to me, that in the US people generally have more, work less, and travel more than at any time in my life. 

[jas007]

5 hours ago, Yellowtail said:

I got my first PC in about '92, and not many of the people I knew had them. I got my first cell phone for work in '99 when I relocated to Thailand, and it seems like not many of the people I knew had them at that time. 

 

It seems to me, that in the US people generally have more, work less, and travel more than at any time in my life. 

When was the last time you were back in the USA?  Up until recently, people were doing OK.  That all changed, though, with runaway inflation, and now it's affecting just about everyone there, even the well to do. For the most part, anyone who looks like they're doing fine is probably living on credit of some kind. 

[SiSePuede419]

9 hours ago, KhunLA said:

I had a cell phone in my work truck, huge damn thing, and that was around 1990.

So what?

You're an elitist.

In 1990, 95% of Americans DID NOT have a cell phone.

Anecdotes aren't data. 

The majority of Americans didn't have analog cell phones even by 1999.

It doesn't matter what your experience is.

It wasn't typical.

Anyone that says it was is lying.

My grandfather smoked his whole life and lived to 90, so smoking isn’t dangerous.

"Hasty generalization fallacy" 😭

 

 

 

[KhunLA]

2 minutes ago, SiSePuede419 said:

So what?

You're an elitist.

Anecdotes aren't data. 

The majority of Americans didn't have analog cell phones.

It doesn't matter what your experience is.

It wasn't typical.

Anyone that says it was is lying.

My grandfather smoked his whole life and lived to 90, so smoking isn’t dangerous.

"Hasty generalization fallacy" 😭

Maybe not your's, but it was typical in mine and with my peers.  And we were far from elitist.  

 

Seems a couple other members agree with me ... hmm.   You can keep repeating it, but won't make it true, except to you 

 

Have a nice day ... BYE BYE

[Walker88]

On 3/22/2025 at 12:01 AM, TedG said:

Joe Biden made a mess of things.  We lost 20%. Buying power. 

Maybe you and MAGAs lost 20%, but clever people took advantage of the greatest economic boom since the 1990s and ramped up our net worth.

 

It really must suck to be a MAGA. Lose, lose, lose and whine, whine, whine, and blame, blame, blame. Such gentle snowflakes!.

 

Has your messiah made America great again? How's your 401K doing lately?

 

Thanks, Joe, for filling the financial coffers of those clever enough to benefit. Darwin rules.

[TedG]

2 hours ago, Walker88 said:

Maybe you and MAGAs lost 20%, but clever people took advantage of the greatest economic boom since the 1990s and ramped up our net worth.

 

It really must suck to be a MAGA. Lose, lose, lose and whine, whine, whine, and blame, blame, blame. Such gentle snowflakes!.

 

Has your messiah made America great again? How's your 401K doing lately?

 

Thanks, Joe, for filling the financial coffers of those clever enough to benefit. Darwin rules.

 

You're an idiot.  Everyone lost 21% of their buying power under Joe Biden. 

[Etaoin Shrdlu]

30 minutes ago, TedG said:

 

You're an idiot.  Everyone lost 21% of their buying power under Joe Biden. 

 

The S&P 500 gained almost 60% between January 20, 2021 and January 20, 2025.  Lots of people made lots of money under Joe Biden. Trump seems to be taking the markets in the other direction.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[mogandave]

4 minutes ago, Etaoin Shrdlu said:

 

The S&P 500 gained almost 60% between January 20, 2021 and January 20, 2025.  Lots of people made lots of money under Joe Biden. Trump seems to be taking the markets in the other direction.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

No one has argued the rich did not get richer under Biden. 

 

It’s been two months….

[hotsun]

22 minutes ago, Etaoin Shrdlu said:

 

The S&P 500 gained almost 60% between January 20, 2021 and January 20, 2025.  Lots of people made lots of money under Joe Biden. Trump seems to be taking the markets in the other direction.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Inflation is outpacing however much americans gained

[Oliver Holzerfilled]

12 hours ago, jas007 said:

How did this thread devolve into an argument about who had cell phones and computers in 1999? 

 

Why does it matter?

 

In 1999, everyone I worked with had cell phones. Everyone I worked with had high speed internet access both at home and at work. As for myself, I had a computer at home since the early 1980s, although back then everyone had dial-up modems for online access and phone bills could get expensive. Comouserve and Genie were also expensive and the charges were by the hour.  I first looked at the Internet way back then, but I had to dial into a university to see it, and it was text based, as I recall.  Internet browsers didn't come along until Netscape? in the 1990s.  I think I bought my first cell phone in the mid 90s sometime.  A little Motorola flip phone.  

 

Anyway, from what I can tell, most people in America are having a hard time affording much of anything these days without going into debt, which pretty much rules out any kind of extensive travel.  Inflation is not much fun. 

 

Some may be going into debt but it seems it isn't hurting vacation travel,  Business travel never recovered from work from home policies yet traffic increased in 2024.  

"December 2024 saw a strong increase in demand, with overall demand rising 8.6% year-on-year." -

https://www.iata.org/en/pressroom/2025-releases/2025-01-30-01/#:~:text=Domestic full-year traffic for,and domestic demand by 5.5%.

 

Premium demand is increasing and so airlines are retrofitting and/or ordering planes with more business class and premium economy seating.  These are leisure fliers driving this demand.

https://www.businessinsider.com/airline-recovery-premium-seats-american-delta-united-2024-10

 

In summary (and as I also illustrated up-thread) the original OP of this thread might as well be Bozo the 🤡.

[TedG]

50 minutes ago, Etaoin Shrdlu said:

 

The S&P 500 gained almost 60% between January 20, 2021 and January 20, 2025.  Lots of people made lots of money under Joe Biden. Trump seems to be taking the markets in the other direction.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Do I need a crayon font to explain this to you?   Buying power went down by 21% under Joe Biden.  

[Patong2021]

13 hours ago, KhunLA said:

I used Yahoo chat, and travelled all over the USA to hook up with women, 1990s, when I worked for airlines.  How I got to see many of the cities that we flew to.  From about 1993-2000 I worked 2 days a week, and played the other 5 day  

 

Gave me 3 days to hang out in cities that we flew to, with free place to stay and some female company while there ... what a life  

 

All possible because of the internet.

So you were a trolley dolley? Are you sure it wasn't grndr you were using?

https://slate.com/human-interest/2018/10/gay-flight-attendant-grindr-connection.html

 

Have you read this  published item?

Air Male: Exploring Flight Attendant Masculinities in North America and Thailand

Jane M. Ferguson & Arratee Ayuttacorn. Pages 328-343 | Published online: 03 Jul 2019

https://doi.org/10.1080/14442213.2019.1634137

Flight attendant work, although now referred to with gender-neutral terminology, continues to be archetypically feminine. 

 

[Patong2021]

24 minutes ago, TedG said:

Do I need a crayon font to explain this to you?   Buying power went down by 21% under Joe Biden.  

 

Perhaps you should use that crayon for yourself. Please advise where you obtained the 21% value as the data  released does not agree with that claim.

 

https://home.treasury.gov/news/press-releases/jy1984

New U.S. Department of the Treasury Analysis: Purchasing Power for American Households Now Surpasses Pre-Pandemic Levels

December 14, 2023

The median American worker can afford the same goods and services as they did in 2019, plus an additional $1,000 to spend or save 

WASHINGTON – Today the U.S. Department of the Treasury published an analysis on how President Biden’s economic agenda has raised the purchasing power of American households. As Americans continue to feel the pain of higher prices, President Biden’s economic agenda focuses on giving middle class families more breathing room and easing costs. And, thanks to rising real wages (wages adjusted for inflation) and rising employment, the typical American can afford more goods and services than before the pandemic. The analysis by Assistant Secretary for Economic Policy (P.D.O.) Eric Van Nostrand, Laura Feiveson, Deputy Assistant Secretary for Microeconomics, and Tara Sinclair, Deputy Assistant Secretary for Macroeconomics, explores the interplay of wages, employment, and prices to unpack this dynamic.  

Key conclusions from the analysis:

- Real wages have risen since the pandemic across the income distribution. In particular, middle-income and lower-income households have seen their real earnings rise especially fast. And in the past 12 months, real wages overall have grown faster than they did in the pre-pandemic expansion.

- Household purchasing power has increased as a result. In 2023, the median American worker can afford the same goods and services as they did in 2019, plus an additional $1,000 to spend or save—because median earnings rose faster than prices.

- The U.S. economy now has over 2 million more jobs than pre-pandemic forecasters expected. Therefore, more and more workers are benefitting from increased purchasing power, thanks to the strong and resilient labor market.

 

[KhunLA]

1 hour ago, Patong2021 said:

So you were a trolley dolley?

 

no

[TedG]

4 hours ago, Patong2021 said:

 

Perhaps you should use that crayon for yourself. Please advise where you obtained the 21% value as the data  released does not agree with that claim.

 

https://home.treasury.gov/news/press-releases/jy1984

New U.S. Department of the Treasury Analysis: Purchasing Power for American Households Now Surpasses Pre-Pandemic Levels

December 14, 2023

The median American worker can afford the same goods and services as they did in 2019, plus an additional $1,000 to spend or save 

WASHINGTON – Today the U.S. Department of the Treasury published an analysis on how President Biden’s economic agenda has raised the purchasing power of American households. As Americans continue to feel the pain of higher prices, President Biden’s economic agenda focuses on giving middle class families more breathing room and easing costs. And, thanks to rising real wages (wages adjusted for inflation) and rising employment, the typical American can afford more goods and services than before the pandemic. The analysis by Assistant Secretary for Economic Policy (P.D.O.) Eric Van Nostrand, Laura Feiveson, Deputy Assistant Secretary for Microeconomics, and Tara Sinclair, Deputy Assistant Secretary for Macroeconomics, explores the interplay of wages, employment, and prices to unpack this dynamic.  

Key conclusions from the analysis:

- Real wages have risen since the pandemic across the income distribution. In particular, middle-income and lower-income households have seen their real earnings rise especially fast. And in the past 12 months, real wages overall have grown faster than they did in the pre-pandemic expansion.

- Household purchasing power has increased as a result. In 2023, the median American worker can afford the same goods and services as they did in 2019, plus an additional $1,000 to spend or save—because median earnings rose faster than prices.

- The U.S. economy now has over 2 million more jobs than pre-pandemic forecasters expected. Therefore, more and more workers are benefitting from increased purchasing power, thanks to the strong and resilient labor market.

 

 

 

Shall I do the CPI math for you?

[Clapped out]

Y'all are posting like long holidays used to be a thing

 

Well, Anyone who thinks that is just wrong 😞

 

I worked in NC for some time in the 70's

 

1st year of employment : no holidays ( just the 3 days ...... Christmas,  4 July & some other one...)

 

2nd year of employment ( if there was a 2nd year .... )  one week of time off + the 3 days above

 

Worked on then with a couple of days extra each year untill you got to 3 weeks off.....which was the peak....

[hotsun]

8 minutes ago, Clapped out said:

Y'all are posting like long holidays used to be a thing

 

Well, Anyone who thinks that is just wrong 😞

 

I worked in NC for some time in the 70's

 

1st year of employment : no holidays ( just the 3 days ...... Christmas,  4 July & some other one...)

 

2nd year of employment ( if there was a 2nd year .... )  one week of time off + the 3 days above

 

Worked on then with a couple of days extra each year untill you got to 3 weeks off.....which was the peak....

Best to work at a school. 2 month summer break

[SiSePuede419]

12 hours ago, KhunLA said:

Maybe not your's, but it was typical in mine and with my peers.  And we were far from elitist.  

So what?  Once again anecdotes aren't facts. 

I had an analog cell phone, too. 

SO WHAT

I WAS EXCEPTIONAL

That wasn't typical. 

The majority of Americans didn't want crappy reception cell phones back then and still used landlines. 

I went landline free in 2001, never to return. 

That wasn't typical. 

My family thought I was a "drifter" because I didn't want a landline. 

It was unusual at the time, even by the early 00s. 

Only young people and innovative thinkers like myself were cord cutters.

 

I guarantee you still had a landline in 2001 and cable TV. ✅

 

Because you are a MAGA lemming. 😄

[SiSePuede419]

3 hours ago, Clapped out said:

Y'all are posting like long holidays used to be a thing

Back in the 60s and 70s a middle class family could afford a week or two vacation to drive the family station wagon and stay in a cheap roach infested hotel on some Florida beach and let the kids play on some White Trash redneck beach where they have a boardwalk with tshirts with feet one pair up one pair down (true story, I remember that as a kid) and still afford a day trip to Orlando back when prices were still reasonable.

 

Yes. 

"Once in a lifetime" 😄

[TedG]

3 minutes ago, SiSePuede419 said:

Back in the 60s and 70s a middle class family could afford a week or two vacation to drive the family station wagon and stay in a cheap roach infested hotel on some Florida beach and let the kids play on some White Trash redneck beach where they have a boardwalk with tshirts with feet one pair up one pair down (true story, I remember that as a kid) and still afford a day trip to Orlando back when prices were still reasonable.

 

Yes. 

"Once in a lifetime" 😄

 

Got any data to back up this point? 

[SiSePuede419]

1 minute ago, TedG said:

 

Got any data to back up this point? 

Yup. 😂

 

During the 1960s and early 1970s, many middle-class American families experienced significant economic prosperity, which enabled them to afford annual family vacations.

 

This period is often referred to as the "golden age" of family vacations, characterized by road trips and explorations across the country. 

 

The post-World War II era saw substantial income growth across various economic strata.

 

* From 1950 to 1960, the mean income for families increased at an average annual rate of 2.9%, with the lowest income quintile experiencing a 3.7% annual increase.

 

*This upward trend continued into the 1960s, with income growth accelerating to an annual rate of 4.9% for the lowest income quintile. 

 

*However, the economic landscape began to shift in the mid-1970s. Two recessions during this decade slowed family income growth to an average annual rate of 0.9%.

 

Despite this deceleration, the overall financial stability of many middle-class families during the early part of the decade still allowed for discretionary spending on activities such as vacations. 

 

It's important to note that while many middle-class families could afford annual vacations during this era, not all had the financial means to do so.

 

Economic disparities persisted, and factors such as regional cost of living, family size, and individual financial obligations influenced the ability to allocate funds for leisure travel.

 

In summary, the economic prosperity of the 1960s and early 1970s enabled a significant portion of middle-class American families to afford annual vacations. However, this trend was influenced by broader economic conditions and individual financial circumstances.

 

[Etaoin Shrdlu]

9 hours ago, TedG said:

Do I need a crayon font to explain this to you?   Buying power went down by 21% under Joe Biden.  

 

If one has 60% more dollars, but each dollar is worth 21% less, do you think one is better or worse off?

[Etaoin Shrdlu]

10 hours ago, mogandave said:

No one has argued the rich did not get richer under Biden. 

 

It’s been two months….

 

Do you think billionnaires have the working man's best interest at heart?  They're already going after Medicaid and are making noises about Social Security.

[Etaoin Shrdlu]

1 hour ago, TedG said:

 

Got any data to back up this point? 

 

Here is an article for you: https://www.nytimes.com/2024/10/28/business/economy/inflation-wages-pay-salaries.html?smid=nytcore-ios-share&referringSource=articleShare

[SiSePuede419]

Middle Class Americans used to be able to afford a family vacation.

 

Then they went to Florida and saw how white trash and redneck it was there.

 

Have fun in your inflatable pool this year kids.

 

We're saving money so you don't have to go to college at Florida State 😄

[spidermike007]

The quality of life in America has been declining for decades now but over the past 5 years inflation has been bordering on insanity, and the cost of living has gone up very dramatically, so at least 70% of Americans are simply struggling to get by.

 

It's likely only 10% of Americans are traveling overseas. The other aspect of this is that many Americans have always preferred to travel close to home, and they've rarely been long-haul travelers.