The Referendum

[thaigene2]

When you think about it, who will most likely vote? Maybe those who live at home? Maybe only those who's familes are hi-so? In bangkok etc, cause it's easy for them - and they suffered under Thaksin's rule - taking their daddy's hand out of the cookie jar?

How many working class Thais are willing to get on a bus and ride to Ubon/Udon wherever for 8 hours to vote in a referendum?

And how many of them would have voted no? How many of this group feel they were ripped off by the coup?

I'll report this myself to the mods to make sure it's ok - because it is so close to voting time. But ya gotta wonder how legit a poll can be when so many things seem loaded in favor of the YES guys..Of course whatever the outcome, that doesn't mean the Democrats will be drinking champagne and doing little deals between establishment families just yet..I'll bet the Issarn Thais will DEFINITELY ride the bus home for the BIG one! We'll see.

[thaigene2]

Okay - seems there is no way to 'report' your own post! Assume the Mod will be policing. Up to him/her.

[farangene]

When you think about it, who will most likely vote? Maybe those who live at home? Maybe only those who's familes are hi-so? In bangkok etc, cause it's easy for them - and they suffered under Thaksin's rule - taking their daddy's hand out of the cookie jar?

FWIW, one of the big weekly magazines expects the constit. vote to pass easily.

A thai told me that they dont have to go home (Isan) to vote and can do it in Bangkok. Dont know if that is correct or not.

The only person I heard from who is voting no in my circle of friends/relatives is a senior citizen who is afraid of losing the 30 baht med care. Other than that one person, rest (15-20 people) are voting yes.

[lannarebirth]

My girlfriend has read it and is voting "yes", against my unsolicited advice. Her mother has not read it, and has a slight case of dementia. I believe she is voting "aroi".

[ColPyat]

My girlfriend has read it and is voting "yes", against my unsolicited advice. Her mother has not read it, and has a slight case of dementia. I believe she is voting "aroi".

My wife read the pamphlet, is disgusted by the whole thing including propaganda, and went home to vote "No".

Her brothers won't understand nothing other that they are too scared of her to vote anything else than she commands.

[Mid]

left the better 1/2 to her own opinion , just happy that she's interested in voting ..............

as to the thread ? . I think it will pass because most believe it's the way forward and amendments can be made later .........................

I have my doubts .

[endure]

My Thai friends in the UK usually get voting forms from the Thai Embassy in London when there's an election on but they've received nothing this time. Is the referendum only for Thais living in Thailand?

[ColPyat]

My Thai friends in the UK usually get voting forms from the Thai Embassy in London when there's an election on but they've received nothing this time. Is the referendum only for Thais living in Thailand?

London - what do you expect?

Frank is lurking over there.

[Mid]

apparently there was some provision for absentee voting in country , registration closed about a month ago , if my memory is correct .

[lannarebirth]

My girlfriend has read it and is voting "yes", against my unsolicited advice. Her mother has not read it, and has a slight case of dementia. I believe she is voting "aroi".

My wife read the pamphlet, is disgusted by the whole thing including propaganda, and went home to vote "No".

Her brothers won't understand nothing other that they are too scared of her to vote anything else than she commands.

This is my girlfriends view. Who evr come to power, a person has to have their own group of contacts to be able to fully participate as a citizen. She has literally dozens of friends in good posts, and even more in the military. She looks at something and thinks , "can we survive this". She believes her contacts will allow her to ride out this next leadership cycle. Also, they've promised some land reforms that are important to her. Whether they carry through with any of it is anybodys guess.

[endure]

My Thai friends in the UK usually get voting forms from the Thai Embassy in London when there's an election on but they've received nothing this time. Is the referendum only for Thais living in Thailand?

London - what do you expect?

Frank is lurking over there.

I thought he was too busy playing football

[ColPyat]

My Thai friends in the UK usually get voting forms from the Thai Embassy in London when there's an election on but they've received nothing this time. Is the referendum only for Thais living in Thailand?

London - what do you expect?

Frank is lurking over there.

I thought he was too busy playing football

He has a cunning plan...

[Filer]

A good overview of the new constitution

----------------------------------------------

I've unsuccessfully searched the Thai English language press for some time for a good analysis of the issues involved in the proposed new constitution. The same with the international press. Then today I came across an article in Thursday's London Financial Times which seems to be quite a masterly overview of what is now at stake. It's written by the FT Bangkok bureau chief, a veteran of the Bangkok scene, whose reports on Thailand and SE Asia are just about the only honest ones that appear in the English-language press in Europe.

I found this on the FT Web site through Google. For those who're interested the following link should take you there:

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/a38f4de8-4b90-11dc...00779fd2ac.html

If any body has problems, PM me and I'll email a downloaded copy.

[Tony Clifton]

My Thai friends in the UK usually get voting forms from the Thai Embassy in London when there's an election on but they've received nothing this time. Is the referendum only for Thais living in Thailand?

London - what do you expect?

Frank is lurking over there.

I thought he was too busy playing football

He has a cunning plan...

...that includes going nowhere near that Embassy.

[Heng]

Yes or no, the status quo will remain. Not voting, thanks.

[LaoPo]

Yes or no, the status quo will remain. Not voting, thanks.

That's interesting Heng...willing to share your view ?

IMHO every single vote is important; that's what democratic countries believe in...

LaoPo

[OneeyedJohn]

Pamphlet ?? My wife has a 190 page booklet.

Basically it ravages most everything Frank brought in or renames the good stuff he initiated.

Yes box on the left, No box on the right.

[jumnien]

Obviously, this is not a democratic country.

A yes vote means the military's constitution wins, a no vote means the military chooses any constitution it wants and rewrites it.

[LaoPo]

Obviously, this is not a democratic country.

A yes vote means the military's constitution wins, a no vote means the military chooses any constitution it wants and rewrites it.

That's the best short analysis I read so far.

LaoPo

[jumnien]

Many people are voting yes hoping it will make the military go away quicker; others are voting no to let the military know they want them out. Either way the military wins this vote and almost certainly the next two or three major elections.

[Heng]

Yes or no, the status quo will remain. Not voting, thanks.

That's interesting Heng...willing to share your view ?

IMHO every single vote is important; that's what democratic countries believe in...

LaoPo

Every vote is important in determining what an election outcome is... of course.

What I'm saying is new constitution or not (or X party in power, X prime minister in office, etc.), the game will remain the same. You can write anything you want into a rule book... but it doesn't mean a thing if folks don't play by the rules. Kind of like...

"Steroids will no longer be tolerated in professional sports!"

And so goes... "Politicians will no longer be allowed to milk the system!" (big deal... so there will be background checks and audits of assets of extended family members).

[sbk]

I always understood that people had to return home to vote as well, given the images of hordes of Isaan people returning home to vote every election year.

Imagine my surprise when one of our employees, who was from up near Bangkok, not only did not return home to vote but voted on our little island a few days early. When I asked her why she didn't have to return home to vote but all those other people did, she replied "Because the man who is running in my district doesn't pay people to go home and vote".

[Gravelrash]

A good overview of the new constitution

----------------------------------------------

I've unsuccessfully searched the Thai English language press for some time for a good analysis of the issues involved in the proposed new constitution. The same with the international press. Then today I came across an article in Thursday's London Financial Times which seems to be quite a masterly overview of what is now at stake. It's written by the FT Bangkok bureau chief, a veteran of the Bangkok scene, whose reports on Thailand and SE Asia are just about the only honest ones that appear in the English-language press in Europe.

I found this on the FT Web site through Google. For those who're interested the following link should take you there:

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/a38f4de8-4b90-11dc...00779fd2ac.html

If any body has problems, PM me and I'll email a downloaded copy.

Thanks for that link, an excellent summation of what the coup was really about, what the constitution is supposed to achieve, and what the longer term strategy of those behind the coup intend.

Naturally there will still be those here, blinded by their anti-Taksin paranoia, that think this referendum has something to do with democracy. Also generally in a referendum the government outlines the YES and NO cases for the population to evaluate, whereas here that was far from the case, more a vote YES or else.

[gzu88bv]

apparently there was some provision for absentee voting in country , registration closed about a month ago , if my memory is correct .

Absolutely correct, people do not have to go home to vote. Government made the necessary provisions. But those who are late will be late all them time.

[Sanpatong]

I think it will pass because most believe it's the way forward and amendments can be made later

With half of the senate appointed and not elected (i.e. (ex) military & cronies), making amendments may prove not as easy as it would in a normal country.

My wife is going to vote no of course, though she's not under any impression that it will be a fair vote and is fully expecting major fraud.

In any case it this vote is illegitimate and won't matter anyway.

Edited August 19, 2007 by Sanpatong

[Mid]

With half of the senate appointed and not elected (i.e. (ex) military & cronies), making amendments may prove not as easy as it would in a normal country.

true , was addressed by Thai academics prior ,

voices lost in the wilderness , unfortunately

[spot]

A good overview of the new constitution

----------------------------------------------

I've unsuccessfully searched the Thai English language press for some time for a good analysis of the issues involved in the proposed new constitution. The same with the international press. Then today I came across an article in Thursday's London Financial Times which seems to be quite a masterly overview of what is now at stake. It's written by the FT Bangkok bureau chief, a veteran of the Bangkok scene, whose reports on Thailand and SE Asia are just about the only honest ones that appear in the English-language press in Europe.

I found this on the FT Web site through Google. For those who're interested the following link should take you there:

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/a38f4de8-4b90-11dc...00779fd2ac.html

If any body has problems, PM me and I'll email a downloaded copy.

Thanks for that, a good read-although it didn't explore the possibility that Thaksin was maybe/possibly as corrupt as anybody else that has held power.

If you have a look at the potted history of Thailand's route to democracy over the last 75 years, it shows that absolutely nothing has ever changed. The same people hold the real power.

How can a country even elude to democracy when real free speech is not allowed, and archaic laws prevent speaking up against the certain factions which have always held back any chance of real democracy.

Doing anything other than the normal today would be a waste of energy.

Vietnam/China etc have no democracy, but at least it's not ambigous...at least you know where you are.

At least in those places politically, the only way is up.

[roietjimmy]

General concensus here is to vote "no" thinking it will get the military out. As with all issues put to vote, at the village level, few have (or can) read the draft. Therefore, their yes/no decision is driven by the opinion and hear say of others. When I explained no matter how they voted the military will "win", comment was "then why waste time and money voting". Ummm..uneducated but not stupid!!

Edited August 19, 2007 by roietjimmy

[backflip]

"I think it will pass...I have my doubts."

Mr. Decisive has left the room.

[lazeeboy]

A good overview of the new constitution

----------------------------------------------

I've unsuccessfully searched the Thai English language press for some time for a good analysis of the issues involved in the proposed new constitution. The same with the international press. Then today I came across an article in Thursday's London Financial Times which seems to be quite a masterly overview of what is now at stake. It's written by the FT Bangkok bureau chief, a veteran of the Bangkok scene, whose reports on Thailand and SE Asia are just about the only honest ones that appear in the English-language press in Europe.

I found this on the FT Web site through Google. For those who're interested the following link should take you there:

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/a38f4de8-4b90-11dc...00779fd2ac.html

If any body has problems, PM me and I'll email a downloaded copy.

Thanks for that, a good read-although it didn't explore the possibility that Thaksin was maybe/possibly as corrupt as anybody else that has held power.

If you have a look at the potted history of Thailand's route to democracy over the last 75 years, it shows that absolutely nothing has ever changed. The same people hold the real power.

How can a country even elude to democracy when real free speech is not allowed, and archaic laws prevent speaking up against the certain factions which have always held back any chance of real democracy.

Doing anything other than the normal today would be a waste of energy.

Vietnam/China etc have no democracy, but at least it's not ambigous...at least you know where you are.

At least in those places politically, the only way is up.

unless it goes the way the military wants you can garantee there will be a recount and another vote next month ,like every other vote in the past.........