3 hours ago, Yellowtail said:

100% of GDP vs 130% of GDP. assuming China is honest

Yeah, like the job figures in the US are honest?

1 hour ago, Lacessit said:

Yeah, like the job figures in the US are honest?

Grasping at straws pops?

1 hour ago, Chomper Higgot said:

The debt problem that is a threat to the U.S. economy is not the Federal debt but that of the Non Bank Loan Sector….

How so?

1 hour ago, Chomper Higgot said:

It’s unregulated...

No, it is not, liar.

1 hour ago, Chomper Higgot said:

..,and it is far from healthy.

How far?

11 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

Such a dumb war, and no end in sight. None of the objectives have been achieved. None. Dumb Don. Very, very dumb Don.

Trump says there’s a new regime that’s easier to deal with, but actually it’s the same regime but worse — run by hardened, fanatical generals. Iran has not turned over its enriched uranium, and negotiations are touch-and-go.

The Strait of Hormuz, which Trump keeps insisting is open, is closed. Trump is blockading the Iranian blockade.

When he was running in 2016, Trump deemed the invasion of Iraq “a big, fat mistake” that destabilized the Middle East and cost too much, in money and lives.

But, seduced by the detestable Bibi, he got suckered into the blood and sand. Unlike W., who had the good grace to trump up a case for war, Trump let Bibi lead him by the nose into this one, blowing off Congress, our allies and many furious MAGA acolytes.

His staff is resigned to a midterm electoral disaster brought on by higher gas prices and a lack of focus on the economy.

https://www.nytimes.com/2026/04/25/opinion/trump-iran-war-israel.html?smid=nytcore-android-share

“That’s a lot of assertions, but not much accuracy.

First, ‘none of the objectives achieved’ isn’t true. The stated goals have been degrading Iran’s military/nuclear capability and restoring deterrence. Iran has taken significant strikes to infrastructure and leadership — that’s not ‘nothing.’

Second, saying the Strait of Hormuz is ‘closed’ is just false. If it were actually closed, you’d see a full-scale global energy crisis overnight. Disruptions ≠ closure.

Third, ‘same regime but worse’ — maybe. But that’s not proof the campaign failed. Removing senior leadership and forcing a regime into reactive mode is part of applying pressure, not evidence of defeat.

On the uranium point — of course negotiations are messy. That’s been true with Iran for decades, under multiple administrations. That’s not new, and it’s not unique to Trump.

And comparing this to Iraq doesn’t really hold up. There’s no ground invasion, no occupation, and no attempt at regime change on that scale. Completely different strategy.

You can argue about costs, risks, or long-term outcomes — that’s fair. But saying ‘nothing has been achieved’ and calling it a total failure just ignores what’s actually happened.”**

6 minutes ago, ericthai said:

The stated goals have been degrading Iran’s military/nuclear capability and restoring deterrence.

Oh I remember Trump announced in July 2025 that those capabilities were not present anymore. The whole nuclear capabilities wre obliterated. What changed?

Obliterated means to be completely destroyed, wiped out, or removed from existence, leaving no trace. It describes something that is totally erased, made illegible, or obscured, such as a building destroyed in a war or a memory completely forgotten.

48 minutes ago, CallumWK said:

Oh I remember Trump announced in July 2025 that those capabilities were not present anymore. The whole nuclear capabilities wre obliterated. What changed?

Obliterated means to be completely destroyed, wiped out, or removed from existence, leaving no trace. It describes something that is totally erased, made illegible, or obscured, such as a building destroyed in a war or a memory completely forgotten.

Trump said the nuclear program was destroyed, not the military, the ballistic missel program or the drone program.

If you have a source saying Trump claimed Iran's military, ballistic missel program and the drone program were destroyed last July, bring it, otherwise quit lying,

15 hours ago, Roadsternut said:

Its probably more of a case of production capacity rather than lacking the moolah. For instance, it takes 24 months to build a single Tomahawk missile. A current use rate, 7 years to replenish the stockpile. Product rates are about 1000 per year, can increase to 2500 a year. There are quite a few rate limiting steps. First a foremost, the hardened electronics; there aren't many manufacturers with this capability. The energetics part is a tricky step.

One outcome might be that the Tomahawks aren't replaced like for like. Its a Rolls Royce solution when all that is needed is a Rover.

The Tomahawks were supposed to have a 30 year lifespan, with a 15 year recertification refresh. Most of the current stockpile was built 2000-2010. Come 2030, they'll be thinking about a replacement anyhow, and so will start scrapping or giving away those end of life weapons; this is what the UK did with the Storm Shadows and NLAWs given to Ukaine. These were of such an age, its unlikely the UK forces would actually use them. The NLAWs would be replaced by new build NLAWs. The Storm Shadows are due to be retired in 2028, to be replaced by MBDA Stratus family missiles.

Navy Tomahawks are due to be replaced in 2028; the Navy is still deciding which offering. But basically the costs of these are already baked into defence budgets. The weapons being used now were paid for 30 years ago or even 40 years ago, largely by long dead taxpayers. Defence capital spending now is on procurement for a war 10-15 years away.

In GW1, about 15% of the Tomahawk inventory was used. In the currently conflict, about 40-60% have been used,

The US made the choice to attack Iran now, and in the manner it has done. If and when China attacks Taiwan, then the US will have available what it has available at that time, and its response will be calibrated accordingly.

At the end of the Vietnam war, US stocks of artillery and air dropped bombs were seriously depleted. Stocks were not fully replenished until the mid-80s. But that replenishment wasn't like for like; the replacement bombs were a much newer design.

There will be no danger of the US being unable to defend it self, something that seems to frighten you right now. Current defence spending is far in excess of what is needed to defend the United States. You have repeatedly complained about US bases overseas, and the expense of operating those to no apparent benefit to the United States. So obviously you are in favour of significant cuts in the defence budget. Current defence spending is based on US foreign policy requirements, which are extra-territorial. When the US fired dozens of Tomahawk missiles at camps in Nigeria associated with attacks on small village chapels, did you feel that was necessary for the defence of Townville USA?

With that in mind, did you feel really scared in the late 70s and early 80s?

You forgot about rare earth metals. There's a shortage and they are required for all the modern artillery.

7 minutes ago, gargamon said:

You forgot about rare earth metals. There's a shortage and they are required for all the modern artillery.

Yup, that as well. Hadn't forgot about it.

Some materials, components, are cross sector. The military needs "rare earths". The car industry requires the same. So does aerospace, healthcare, power generation, consumer goods. Every facet of our life. There is also a shortage of plastics. Supply chains are in tatters since 2020. COVID-19 is part of the reason, but in reality everything has been on a bit of a knife edge since the 2008 Banking Crisis, which we see now as a genuine Civilisational event; its still not clear if in fact it started a chain of events that ultimaely destroys the world in which we all grew up in.

There is more than enough rare earths for Artillery shells. There isn't enough if you also want a new car, a pacemaker to be fitted, to maintain airliners that don't cost, to keep the lights on next winter. So society has to make choices. But, then, its at moment's like that when Plato's maxim becomes relevant;

our need will be the real creator

could have used these resources to end the Ukrainian war, and actually be a real life peace maker, instead he does this... bonkers.

8 hours ago, it is what it is said:

could have used these resources to end the Ukrainian war, and actually be a real life peace maker, instead he does this... bonkers.

It is nice that the Trump administration agreed to provide the advanced weapons to Ukraine that the feckless Biden refused ot provide.

If you remember correctly, when Russia invaded Crimea in 2014, Obama refused to provide Ukraine with defensive weapons.

When Trump came into office in 2017, Trump sanctioned Russia and began providing Ukraine with defensive weapons.

When Biden took office in 2021, he released the sanctions on Russia and stopped the arms shipments to Ukraine, and flushed Afghanistan down the toilet.

Then what happened?

5 hours ago, Yellowtail said:

It is nice that the Trump administration agreed to provide the advanced weapons to Ukraine that the feckless Biden refused ot provide.

If you remember correctly, when Russia invaded Crimea in 2014, Obama refused to provide Ukraine with defensive weapons.

When Trump came into office in 2017, Trump sanctioned Russia and began providing Ukraine with defensive weapons.

When Biden took office in 2021, he released the sanctions on Russia and stopped the arms shipments to Ukraine, and flushed Afghanistan down the toilet.

Then what happened?

The "warmonger" Biden freezed those shipments as a sign of goodwill before the Heldinki summit. He also did not relieve sanctions on Russia.

Anyway, it's not Biden who (by coincidence) got the GOP House to block funds for Ukraine during the fall 2024 Russian offensive. It's also not him who blocked crucial intelligence provision to Ukraine during the Russian surprise Kourskt offensive. It's also not him who systematically adopted and diffused the Russian narrative about the war and praised Putin.

Edited April 27Apr 27 by candide

On 4/26/2026 at 2:23 PM, Yellowtail said:

Grasping at straws pops?

Trying to embrace a haystack, sonny jim.

7 minutes ago, candide said:

The "warmonger" Biden freezed those shipments as a sign of goodwill before the Heldinki summit. He also did not relieve sanctions on Russia.

Oh, sorry, he froze (freezed?) the Trump arms shipment that congress had authorized, and he didn't "relieve" sanctions, he waived them. Oh, and what about all the financial exemptions Biden gave Russia? Oh no/

7 minutes ago, candide said:

Anyway, it's not Biden who (by coincidence) got the GOP House to block funds for Ukraine during the fall 2024 Russian offensive. It's also not him who blocked crucial intelligence provision to Ukraine during the Russian surprise Kourskt offensive. It's also not him who systematically adopted and diffused the Russian narrative about the war and praised Putin.

Oh, and let's not forget in 2012 when Obama told Medvedev to tell "Vladamir" that he would have more flexibility on missile defense, if he could have some "space" until after the election.

Putin gave him space, and Obama cancelled the missile defense program following the election.

Obama sure loved him some Russia!

55 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

Oh, sorry, he froze (freezed?) the Trump arms shipment that congress had authorized, and he didn't "relieve" sanctions, he waived them. Oh, and what about all the financial exemptions Biden gave Russia? Oh no/

Oh, and let's not forget in 2012 when Obama told Medvedev to tell "Vladamir" that he would have more flexibility on missile defense, if he could have some "space" until after the election.

Putin gave him space, and Obama cancelled the missile defense program following the election.

Obama sure loved him some Russia!

55 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

Oh, sorry, he froze (freezed?) the Trump arms shipment that congress had authorized, and he didn't "relieve" sanctions, he waived them. Oh, and what about all the financial exemptions Biden gave Russia? Oh no/

Oh, and let's not forget in 2012 when Obama told Medvedev to tell "Vladamir" that he would have more flexibility on missile defense, if he could have some "space" until after the election.

Putin gave him space, and Obama cancelled the missile defense program following the election.

Obama sure loved him some Russia!

55 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

Oh, sorry, he froze (freezed?) the Trump arms shipment that congress had authorized, and he didn't "relieve" sanctions, he waived them. Oh, and what about all the financial exemptions Biden gave Russia? Oh no/

Oh, and let's not forget in 2012 when Obama told Medvedev to tell "Vladamir" that he would have more flexibility on missile defense, if he could have some "space" until after the election.

Putin gave him space, and Obama cancelled the missile defense program following the election.

Obama sure loved him some Russia!

2012! 😂

Let's look at recent history. it's not Biden who (by mere coincidence) got the GOP House to block funds for Ukraine during the fall 2024 Russian offensive. It's also not him who blocked crucial intelligence provision to Ukraine during the Russian surprise Kourskt offensive. It's also not him who systematically adopted and diffused the Russian narrative about the war and praised Putin. Right?

6 hours ago, candide said:

2012! 😂

Let's look at recent history. it's not Biden who (by mere coincidence) got the GOP House to block funds for Ukraine during the fall 2024 Russian offensive. It's also not him who blocked crucial intelligence provision to Ukraine during the Russian surprise Kourskt offensive. It's also not him who systematically adopted and diffused the Russian narrative about the war and praised Putin. Right?

Of course, let's just look at the moment, and not how Obama and Biden got us in the mess.

Trump praises everyone, so what? Anyone that is honest and not a moron can see that Trump has been tougher on Putin than Obama or Biden,

Remember Obama saying "the '80s called and they want their foreign policy back" when Mittens answered that Russia was our greatest geopolitical threat?

Remember the Russian-reset?

Remember Trump having 200 Russian mercenaries with the Wagner Group wiped out in Seria?

Per you, it was great that Biden stopped weapons shipments to Ukraine, lifted sanctions, and provided financial exemptions to Russia as a goodwill gesture for Putin's visit, but it's the end of the world when Trump withholds intelligence while trying to negotiate a peace agreement.

"As of mid-2025, the Trump administration has focused on supplying high-tech, precision defense systems to Ukraine, notably aiming to provide Patriot air-defense systems to intercept Russian missiles, funded by European allies. Discussions have also included long-range Tomahawk cruise missiles, with other supplied equipment including precision-guided GMLRS rockets and Hellfire air-to-surface missiles."

What was Biden sending again? But oh yeah, Trump says Putin is smart, so that makes Trump Putin's puppet.

On 4/26/2026 at 8:27 AM, Yellowtail said:

How so?

No, it is not, liar.

How far?

He's not a liar.

Putin's puppet is certainly making Putin and Xi happy - I imagine that Xi is bringing forward his Taiwan "reclaiming" invasion with the USA in such a weak position, and increasingly disengaged with Asia.

3 hours ago, Roadsternut said:

He's not a liar.

Trump? I never said he was, but I did not expect to hear it from you.

15 minutes ago, JimHuaHin said:

Putin's puppet is certainly making Putin and Xi happy - I imagine that Xi is bringing forward his Taiwan "reclaiming" invasion with the USA in such a weak position, and increasingly disengaged with Asia.

So not Netanyahu's puppet today?

Hey, remember in 2012 when Trump told Medvedev to tell "Vladamir" that he would have more flexibility on missile defense, if he could have some "space" until after the election.

So, Putin gave him space, and Trump cancelled the missile defense program following the election?

Oh no wait, that was the feckless Obama.

9 hours ago, Yellowtail said:

Of course, let's just look at the moment, and not how Obama and Biden got us in the mess.

Trump praises everyone, so what? Anyone that is honest and not a moron can see that Trump has been tougher on Putin than Obama or Biden,

Remember Obama saying "the '80s called and they want their foreign policy back" when Mittens answered that Russia was our greatest geopolitical threat?

Remember the Russian-reset?

Remember Trump having 200 Russian mercenaries with the Wagner Group wiped out in Seria?

Per you, it was great that Biden stopped weapons shipments to Ukraine, lifted sanctions, and provided financial exemptions to Russia as a goodwill gesture for Putin's visit, but it's the end of the world when Trump withholds intelligence while trying to negotiate a peace agreement.

"As of mid-2025, the Trump administration has focused on supplying high-tech, precision defense systems to Ukraine, notably aiming to provide Patriot air-defense systems to intercept Russian missiles, funded by European allies. Discussions have also included long-range Tomahawk cruise missiles, with other supplied equipment including precision-guided GMLRS rockets and Hellfire air-to-surface missiles."

What was Biden sending again? But oh yeah, Trump says Putin is smart, so that makes Trump Putin's puppet.

So as you quote, Europe is paying.

A quote from where btw?

13 hours ago, Yellowtail said:

Of course, let's just look at the moment, and not how Obama and Biden got us in the mess.

Trump praises everyone, so what? Anyone that is honest and not a moron can see that Trump has been tougher on Putin than Obama or Biden,

Remember Obama saying "the '80s called and they want their foreign policy back" when Mittens answered that Russia was our greatest geopolitical threat?

Remember the Russian-reset?

Remember Trump having 200 Russian mercenaries with the Wagner Group wiped out in Seria?

Per you, it was great that Biden stopped weapons shipments to Ukraine, lifted sanctions, and provided financial exemptions to Russia as a goodwill gesture for Putin's visit, but it's the end of the world when Trump withholds intelligence while trying to negotiate a peace agreement.

"As of mid-2025, the Trump administration has focused on supplying high-tech, precision defense systems to Ukraine, notably aiming to provide Patriot air-defense systems to intercept Russian missiles, funded by European allies. Discussions have also included long-range Tomahawk cruise missiles, with other supplied equipment including precision-guided GMLRS rockets and Hellfire air-to-surface missiles."

What was Biden sending again? But oh yeah, Trump says Putin is smart, so that makes Trump Putin's puppet.

"What was Biden sending again?"

Patriot defense systems, HIMARS, ATACMS, GMLRS? 😃

Edited April 28Apr 28 by candide

31 minutes ago, candide said:

"What was Biden sending again?"

Patriot defense systems, HIMARS, ATACMS, GMLRS? 😃

Two batteries in two years, woo-hoo

6 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

Two batteries in two years, woo-hoo

How many Patriot batteries has Trump sent? 🤣

1 hour ago, candide said:

How many Patriot batteries has Trump sent? 🤣

Six, including the two from Germany and one from Israel that we have to replace.

6 hours ago, Yellowtail said:

Trump? I never said he was, but I did not expect to hear it from you.

Was not referring to the American President.

4 minutes ago, Roadsternut said:

Was not referring to the American President.

Okay, thanks, glad we got that cleared up.

56 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

Six, including the two from Germany and one from Israel that we have to replace.

Of course, it's not true! 🤣

It's 0 so far. The ones from Germany and other countries don't count, unless you want to add 4 under Biden.

11 minutes ago, candide said:

Of course, it's not true! 🤣

It's 0 so far. The ones from Germany and other countries don't count, unless you want to add 4 under Biden.

So three under Trump, in a year and a half.

If you remember correctly, when Russia invaded Crimea in 2014, Obama refused to provide Ukraine with defensive weapons.

When Trump came into office in 2017, Trump sanctioned Russia and began providing Ukraine with defensive weapons.

When Biden took office in 2021, he waived sanctions on Russia and froze the arms shipments to Ukraine.

Then Biden flushed Afghanistan down the toilet, and Russia invaded Ukraine

Remember Obama saying "the '80s called and they want their foreign policy back" when Mittens answered that Russia was our greatest geopolitical threat?

Remember the Russian-reset?

Remember Trump having 200 Russian mercenaries with the Wagner Group wiped out in Seria?

Remember in 2012 when Obama told Medvedev to tell "Vladamir" that he would have more flexibility on missile defense, if he could have some "space" until after the election.

Putin gave him space, and Obama cancelled the missile defense program following the election.

That missile defiance system sure would be handy right along about now, huh?

39 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

So three under Trump, in a year and a half.

If you remember correctly, when Russia invaded Crimea in 2014, Obama refused to provide Ukraine with defensive weapons.

When Trump came into office in 2017, Trump sanctioned Russia and began providing Ukraine with defensive weapons.

When Biden took office in 2021, he waived sanctions on Russia and froze the arms shipments to Ukraine.

Then Biden flushed Afghanistan down the toilet, and Russia invaded Ukraine

Remember Obama saying "the '80s called and they want their foreign policy back" when Mittens answered that Russia was our greatest geopolitical threat?

Remember the Russian-reset?

Remember Trump having 200 Russian mercenaries with the Wagner Group wiped out in Seria?

Remember in 2012 when Obama told Medvedev to tell "Vladamir" that he would have more flexibility on missile defense, if he could have some "space" until after the election.

Putin gave him space, and Obama cancelled the missile defense program following the election.

That missile defiance system sure would be handy right along about now, huh?

39 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

So three under Trump, in a year and a half.

If you remember correctly, when Russia invaded Crimea in 2014, Obama refused to provide Ukraine with defensive weapons.

When Trump came into office in 2017, Trump sanctioned Russia and began providing Ukraine with defensive weapons.

When Biden took office in 2021, he waived sanctions on Russia and froze the arms shipments to Ukraine.

Then Biden flushed Afghanistan down the toilet, and Russia invaded Ukraine

Remember Obama saying "the '80s called and they want their foreign policy back" when Mittens answered that Russia was our greatest geopolitical threat?

Remember the Russian-reset?

Remember Trump having 200 Russian mercenaries with the Wagner Group wiped out in Seria?

Remember in 2012 when Obama told Medvedev to tell "Vladamir" that he would have more flexibility on missile defense, if he could have some "space" until after the election.

Putin gave him space, and Obama cancelled the missile defense program following the election.

That missile defiance system sure would be handy right along about now, huh?

39 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

So three under Trump, in a year and a half.

If you remember correctly, when Russia invaded Crimea in 2014, Obama refused to provide Ukraine with defensive weapons.

When Trump came into office in 2017, Trump sanctioned Russia and began providing Ukraine with defensive weapons.

When Biden took office in 2021, he waived sanctions on Russia and froze the arms shipments to Ukraine.

Then Biden flushed Afghanistan down the toilet, and Russia invaded Ukraine

Remember Obama saying "the '80s called and they want their foreign policy back" when Mittens answered that Russia was our greatest geopolitical threat?

Remember the Russian-reset?

Remember Trump having 200 Russian mercenaries with the Wagner Group wiped out in Seria?

Remember in 2012 when Obama told Medvedev to tell "Vladamir" that he would have more flexibility on missile defense, if he could have some "space" until after the election.

Putin gave him space, and Obama cancelled the missile defense program following the election.

That missile defiance system sure would be handy right along about now, huh?

Not three, zero. Patriot batteries supplied by others don't count

Obama's time. 😂

Remember at that time, Trump was sheering the invasion of Crimea!

9 minutes ago, candide said:

Not three, zero. Patriot batteries supplied by others don't count

Obama's time. 😂

Remember at that time, Trump was sheering the invasion of Crimea!

That all you have is lies brother?

Again:

When Russia invaded Crimea in 2014, Obama refused to provide Ukraine with defensive weapons.

When Trump came into office in 2017, Trump sanctioned Russia and began providing Ukraine with defensive weapons.

When Biden took office in 2021, he waived sanctions on Russia and froze the arms shipments to Ukraine.

Then Biden flushed Afghanistan down the toilet, and Russia invaded Ukraine

Remember Obama saying "the '80s called and they want their foreign policy back" when Mittens answered that Russia was our greatest geopolitical threat?

Remember the Russian-reset?

Remember Trump having 200 Russian mercenaries with the Wagner Group wiped out in Seria?

Remember in 2012 when Obama told Medvedev to tell "Vladamir" that he would have more flexibility on missile defense, if he could have some "space" until after the election.

Putin gave him space, and Obama cancelled the missile defense program following the election.

That missile defiance system sure would be handy right along about now, huh?