An Evolutionary Analysis Of Thai-farang Relationships

[Solosiam]

If we're still on the subject of a bit on the side, allow me a brief comment here please.

In my younger, wilder, richer days I often philandered with married women.

They were in fact my main target and preference because they always go home after the act and don't kiss and tell.

On the occasions I asked them why they strayed the answers were remarkably similar.

They'd married young, borne and reared children, nursed hubby through an embryonic career while staying home like a good girl and keeping house.

The kids are now growing up, hubby is well entrenched in his job and often travels or comes home late, full of boring stories about office politics.

So why take the risk of rocking the boat?

Simple, they were bored and neglected and I often had the feeling that putting out was a minor favour in return for a little adventure.

So all you guys out there with tasty wives, pay them lots of attention because if you don't, there's bound to be young replacements

for guys like me out there.

lol, picking up desperate sloppy seconds from bored old housewives.

Hardly something t be boasting about really, I mean why weren't you with young, beautiful women like other people your age? I needn't ask?

[Jimjim]

"Surprising? Certainly was."

It is not surprising at all.

Actually, it is to the majority of people, just that, surprising.

[qwertz]

If we're still on the subject of a bit on the side, allow me a brief comment here please.

In my younger, wilder, richer days I often philandered with married women.

They were in fact my main target and preference because they always go home after the act and don't kiss and tell.

On the occasions I asked them why they strayed the answers were remarkably similar.

They'd married young, borne and reared children, nursed hubby through an embryonic career while staying home like a good girl and keeping house.

The kids are now growing up, hubby is well entrenched in his job and often travels or comes home late, full of boring stories about office politics.

So why take the risk of rocking the boat?

Simple, they were bored and neglected and I often had the feeling that putting out was a minor favour in return for a little adventure.

So all you guys out there with tasty wives, pay them lots of attention because if you don't, there's bound to be young replacements

for guys like me out there.

lol, picking up desperate sloppy seconds from bored old housewives.

Hardly something t be boasting about really, I mean why weren't you with young, beautiful women like other people your age? I needn't ask?

Who mentioned boasting, SS?

Anyway, to answer your question: young beautiful women know they're sought after and make no effort to be more than visually interesting.

Sloppy seconds? You obviously need to get out more if you consider women in their 30's old and sloppy.

There are some very trim women in that age group with a lot to offer but please, don't take my word for it.

I'm sure you're a person of impeccable taste with young tasty girls standing in line for you.

And you're sprucing up right now to get out there and do your stuff.

Have fun.

[Robski]

Isn't it amazing the things you learn on the internet. Marvellous.

I fell asleeeeeeeep zzzzz..... safe in the knowledge that Guesthouse has got all basis covered with evolution, theory, and sub thesis.

Who is Kimera

[al warner]

Guesthouse,

Everything I have stated was previously written in various books on evolution that I digested. You can try The Selfish Gene and The Red Queen to start.

I am not sure you feel the need to use profanity. As far as I can tell, the moderators of this board have placed a profanity filter to prevent the use of this language. By typing the word that way, you insult them and make the profanity filter pointless.

Dawkins is an ass.

[BFD]

I think he's made some pretty important contributions to both science and the concept of free expression. The poor dude would have been lynched even 40 years ago, so at least he's a great example of free speech.

Why is he an ass? Is it because you don't agree with him? Well, I don't agree with you

BFD!

[somtaamgaiyang]

In pure Buddhism, and please correct me if I am wrong, women are not supposed to have possesion of the 5 deadly sins, one being lust. Therefore, sexual attraction in Buddhist ideas is very low in the list of priorities for a woman when selecting a partner.

Hence, being with an older man be it farang or Thai is less of an issue in Thailand than it is in the West.

Oh my goodness, we've even got a Buddhist justification going now !

Buddhist women are not supposed to have what we would suppose to be the 5 deadly sins (from a Christian perspective). They are a centre of calm and good. Therefore, lust is not a major prerequisite for choosing a partner.

Why does society get so wound up when they hear of "free sex" and giks. It is not necessarily about preventing women having greater freedom in society, it is that it is a complete anathema to buddhist thought. Now whether we believe it to be true or not, I am not saying it is a justification of behaviour rather an explanation of why possibly long term security outweighs the physical attractiveness or age of a partner.

Why is it that a woman can never touch a monk?

[OxfordWill]

I am always amused by the assumption that youth necessarily entails a lack of the ability to provide support (financial or otherwise).

"You can be the youngest, best looking but poor farang in town but I guarantee you that thai girls (or any girl) will stick around with you unless she's desperate. Along comes the sugar daddy and he'll be the one with the feathered nest at night!"

Translation: Hello! I am a bar monger and have no experience of Thai girls beyond those who get paid to sleep with me. I also am kidding myself, but that's ok, I've been doing it for so long I believe it.

"A guy takes a walk down the street in Thailand and he's got a young twenty-year old girl on his arm and he's fifty everyone (apart from a few puritan farangs who may see them) couldn't give a flying fck. As long as the're both happy whats the problem?"

You've no idea what the vast majority of Thais (all ages) and farangs (younger than you) are thinking. But that's ok, I don't want to upset you. But you are "in a river in Egypt", as the Jamaicans might put it.

Thanks to whoever posted the link re: sperm competition. I had never heard of that before.

[bangkoksingapore]

JT you are full of it. there have been studies where thousands of women were hypnotized and told to select the sexiest male. the 80 year olds scored the highest, followed by the 70 year olds and then the 60 year olds. for millions of years, it was the older men who had the power and controlled the women. young men worked under them. that is why ALL women have a subconscious fondness of older men and are most sexually and physically satisfied by them.

it is because of Buddhism and thai culture that allows thai women from isaan to openly show their feelings for these men. western society is much more controlling and will not accept this nature. the young men hate the older men, but in Buddhism older men are more respected.

also, i have seen tons of thais stop farang-thai couples with 30 year age gaps and comment on how sweet they look. ive seen people stop and ask to take a photo and say 'na-rok na-rok'. Thai people view these couples like they view teenagers, they think they are so sweet.

[OxfordWill]

I heard about this study which proved studies dont prove anything. They hypnotised a bunch of surveyists and asked them if they found 80 year olds more or less blue than 60 year olds, and they all confirmed they preferred bananas over laptop computers.

Sorry I must get offline now as there is a queue of adoring Thai people trying to take photos of the 60 year old German guy and his 19 year old girlfriend on the terminal next to me. They just love it how Hans has come and taken care of nong lek. They really appreciate him coming all the way to make their landscape that little bit cuter.

[Maigo6]

You've no idea what the vast majority of Thais (all ages) and farangs (younger than you) are thinking.

But OxfordWill does know, so there you have it folks. you've been officially told by OxfordWill how the majority of Thai people think.

Oh, and younger Farangs also.

So I guess all you guys with younger wifes had better leave them and look for an older women, just to please younger Farangs and the majority of Thai people, forget about how you feel, think of those younger Farangs and what they think about your relationship...lol

Oxford Will or Oxford Won't, who cares.......

You know what I think when I see an old guy with an attractive young woman, I think " You lucky barsteward ". Though I doubt that he gives a flying frig what I think anyway.

Edited August 31, 2007 by Maigo6

[Dupont]

The logical conclusion of that argument is the evolutionary pre-programmed urges to reproduce, eat/survice, defend one's survival (and the things needed to survive) would justify Rape, Theft, any level of violence including murder.

Very good post, GH. I agree with you.

This is one of the big reasons evolutionary psych is such a controversial field -- there must be some good in there somewhere, but it's always getting trotted out by every jerk with some axe to grind (Op, I'm not accusing you of this) or some racist or sexist bull to back up.

I usually encounter it in some bogus argument about why men are better than women at mathematics.

This is very typical of the way people in the west think.

Anybody that dare put forward anything that runs counter to the current PC laws of the west, is a "Jerk" spouting "sexist/racist" bull! Maybe its wrong, maybe its right. The thing is, these theories are put forward, researched, published and argued over in scientific papers and universities etc. This process is vital and people shouldn't be screamed down for suggesting anything, providing they have carried out the research dilligently.

Most people get more bitter as they get older, but I fear you are not leaving yourself anywhere to go in this direction.

I agree with Maigo, its about envy, jeolosy and its cowardice from people who want to do it but are held back by fear of peer disaproval.

How dare "lowely" Harry the lorry driver have a beautiful wife, and how dare anybody suggest she is not a prostitue or that she is happy, or that she isn't getting laid by all and sundry behind his back. As for his happiness, he is due only rejection, poverty and misery according to the laws of political correctness.

It was an intereseting OP though and I have seen a few of these thories over the years. Tend to shed more heat than light usually.

Keeps the sponsors happy though when we lay into each other like this in the low season! I'll miss all this mud slinging when high season comes and I have to do some work.

Edited August 31, 2007 by Dupont

[canadiangirl]

This is very typical of the way people in the west think.

Anybody that dare put forward anything that runs counter to the current PC laws of the west, is a "Jerk" spouting "sexist/racist" bull!

Most people get more bitter as they get older, but I fear you are not leaving yourself anywhere to go in this direction.

I agree with Maigo, its about envy, jeolosy and its cowardice from people who want to do it but are held back by fear of peer disaproval.

How dare "lowely" Harry the lorry driver have a beautiful wife, and how dare anybody suggest she is not a prostitue or that she is happy, or that she isn't getting laid by all and sundry behind his back.

You accuse me of crying "sexism! racism!" about a "brave soul" "daring" to question "PCness", as you call it, by saying that men are better at mathematics than women are.

For one making such accusations, you seem rather quick to sling around insults of bitterness, envy, jealousy and cowardice at anyone daring to questioning your point of view.

I repeat myself: you have yet to present any real arguments based on facts, rather than pointless personal insults on this thread or any other.

"Money plays no part in Thai-farang relationships, my wife loves me for myself ....", yaddy yaddy yadda -- Fine. If the hat doesn't fit, why do you keep putting it on?

[Maigo6]

I agree with Maigo

Jeeez................. That's never happened on this forum before.

[kmart]

Just think about all the frenetic shagging going on whilst some of you pretentious twits hammer out your dry witterings on your lonely cum-stained PC's....? Seek Help.

[Maigo6]

Just think about all the frenetic shagging going on whilst some of you pretentious twits hammer out your dry witterings on your lonely cum-stained PC's....? Seek Help.

Hahaha...............classic.

[meemiathai]

"Surprising? Certainly was."

It is not surprising at all.

It is surprising! And alarming!

Most people don't like to believe in reality! That's why!

Very good posts! Johnny!

[meemiathai]

If we're still on the subject of a bit on the side, allow me a brief comment here please.

In my younger, wilder, richer days I often philandered with married women.

They were in fact my main target and preference because they always go home after the act and don't kiss and tell.

On the occasions I asked them why they strayed the answers were remarkably similar.

They'd married young, borne and reared children, nursed hubby through an embryonic career while staying home like a good girl and keeping house.

The kids are now growing up, hubby is well entrenched in his job and often travels or comes home late, full of boring stories about office politics.

So why take the risk of rocking the boat?

Simple, they were bored and neglected and I often had the feeling that putting out was a minor favour in return for a little adventure.

So all you guys out there with tasty wives, pay them lots of attention because if you don't, there's bound to be young replacements

for guys like me out there.

lol, picking up desperate sloppy seconds from bored old housewives.

Hardly something t be boasting about really, I mean why weren't you with young, beautiful women like other people your age? I needn't ask?

Because a lot of housewives are just drop dead bloody gorgeous!

[Dupont]

This is very typical of the way people in the west think.

Anybody that dare put forward anything that runs counter to the current PC laws of the west, is a "Jerk" spouting "sexist/racist" bull!

Most people get more bitter as they get older, but I fear you are not leaving yourself anywhere to go in this direction.

I agree with Maigo, its about envy, jeolosy and its cowardice from people who want to do it but are held back by fear of peer disaproval.

How dare "lowely" Harry the lorry driver have a beautiful wife, and how dare anybody suggest she is not a prostitue or that she is happy, or that she isn't getting laid by all and sundry behind his back.

You accuse me of crying "sexism! racism!" about a "brave soul" "daring" to question "PCness", as you call it, by saying that men are better at mathematics than women are.

For one making such accusations, you seem rather quick to sling around insults of bitterness, envy, jealousy and cowardice at anyone daring to questioning your point of view.

I repeat myself: you have yet to present any real arguments based on facts, rather than pointless personal insults on this thread or any other.

"Money plays no part in Thai-farang relationships, my wife loves me for myself ....", yaddy yaddy yadda -- Fine. If the hat doesn't fit, why do you keep putting it on?

Because I am a mere man!

Don't care a jot who is better, it's not important. What is, is that people can hold views contrary to the likes of you, without been shouted down. What seemed odd was your standard, University taught knee jerk responses that they are racist and sexist jerks. Teach you to say yaddy yaddy yadda to block out things you don't like to hear I suppose. See a lot of that on campus in your supposed superior Universities. Also see a lot of people coming out of them totally unprepared for real life.

Ah, education, tis a wonderful thing. My 15 years in Thailand count for nothing compared to a good "wimmins" course at an American uni, and a few weeks lying on the beach here complaining that all the men have thai girl friends.

Perhaps you are better at maths than men! So long as I can count me blessings though, I am ok.

Sorry that you are flying the nest and not finding the world to your liking.

We don't offer you any answers, coz, we don't profess to know everything. I only reply out of a duty I feel I have to counter intolerance and bigotry wherever I find it. And I find it in your posts. you may prefer anti-intorleance and anti-bigotry when you use it, but its the samething. There are other views than your own and, dare I say it, my own.

Anyway, its the weekend. Time for beer, dancing, karaoke, football, FUN!! , laughter and as KMART put it, frenetic shagging. Time for us racist/sexist jerks to disprove your jibes by spending another weekend in the company of foreigners and ladies!

Good luck changing the world, and see you on Monday.

Edited August 31, 2007 by Dupont

[JohnnyThai]

Men are better at mathematics than women. Men were hunters. The hunters who survived did so because of their good hunting skills. Those with bad hunting skills died. Those successful at hunting were adept at map reading and the mental skills associated with mathematics.

Please note that this does not mean that every man on this planet is better than every women on this planet at math, but in general, because of their evolutionary past, men are better at mathematics than women.

If it makes you feel better, women are better at lying.

[meemiathai]

Men are better at mathematics than women. Men were hunters. The hunters who survived did so because of their good hunting skills. Those with bad hunting skills died. Those successful at hunting were adept at map reading and the mental skills associated with mathematics.

Please note that this does not mean that every man on this planet is better than every women on this planet at math, but in general, because of their evolutionary past, men are better at mathematics than women.

If it makes you feel better, women are better at lying.

[Jimjim]

Your evolutionary ideas simply lack much tangible evidence to back them up, and this evidence would be almost impossible to find. So go on blathering.

[WaiWai]

young beautiful women know they're sought after and make no effort to be more than visually interesting

I really don't think that is true; it was perhaps more the case in the past, not because beautiful young people can not be intelligent but because this was not a quality valued by their potential partners (rather the opposite, in fact, or at least, there was the idea that the dominant partner must be made to look more smart at all times ).

Edit : yes, I know that is why some people seek their partners from certain cultures.

And if we try to apply an "evolutionary" explanation for the selection of an unintelligent mate, I am not sure where we end up .

Buddhist women are not supposed to have what we would suppose to be the 5 deadly sins (from a Christian perspective). They are a centre of calm and good. Therefore, lust is not a major prerequisite for choosing a partner.

Why does society get so wound up when they hear of "free sex" and giks. It is not necessarily about preventing women having greater freedom in society, it is that it is a complete anathema to buddhist thought. Now whether we believe it to be true or not, I am not saying it is a justification of behaviour rather an explanation of why possibly long term security outweighs the physical attractiveness or age of a partner.

Why is it that a woman can never touch a monk?

Attitudes of this kind are hardly unique to Buddhism, though.

Edited August 31, 2007 by WaiWai

[qwertz]

Men are better at mathematics than women. Men were hunters. The hunters who survived did so because of their good hunting skills. Those with bad hunting skills died. Those successful at hunting were adept at map reading and the mental skills associated with mathematics.

Please note that this does not mean that every man on this planet is better than every women on this planet at math, but in general, because of their evolutionary past, men are better at mathematics than women.

If it makes you feel better, women are better at lying.

No they're not, JT, it's just that men are more gullible.

Edited August 31, 2007 by qwertz

[JetsetBkk]

Men are better at mathematics than women. Men were hunters. The hunters who survived did so because of their good hunting skills. Those with bad hunting skills died. Those successful at hunting were adept at map reading and the mental skills associated with mathematics.

Please note that this does not mean that every man on this planet is better than every women on this planet at math, but in general, because of their evolutionary past, men are better at mathematics than women.

If it makes you feel better, women are better at lying.

Cave men had maps?

[sleepyjohn]

The logical conclusion of that argument is the evolutionary pre-programmed urges to reproduce, eat/survice, defend one's survival (and the things needed to survive) would justify Rape, Theft, any level of violence including murder.

Very good post, GH. I agree with you.

This is one of the big reasons evolutionary psych is such a controversial field -- there must be some good in there somewhere, but it's always getting trotted out by every jerk with some axe to grind (Op, I'm not accusing you of this) or some racist or sexist bull to back up.

I usually encounter it in some bogus argument about why men are better than women at mathematics.

Hang on....

Guesthouse I suggest the logical conclusion is not that genetic hardwiring and wetwiring JUSTIFIES the behaviour but that it may EXPLAIN it. It doesn't nullify the need for law, which is basically society wielding power as it sees fit, it may in fact reinforce it. The same applies to personal laws or morals, which in the face of all this stuff may be all the more desirable. Understanding things can only help us deal with them better though can't it?

Canadian Girl you still haven't told us the reasoning behind your strong opinions. There's a danger that without the backup that you demand of others your views enter into the realm of proclamations or god-talk, and I for one am not interested in proclamations or god-talk.

Edited August 31, 2007 by sleepyjohn

[meemiathai]

The logical conclusion of that argument is the evolutionary pre-programmed urges to reproduce, eat/survice, defend one's survival (and the things needed to survive) would justify Rape, Theft, any level of violence including murder.

Very good post, GH. I agree with you.

This is one of the big reasons evolutionary psych is such a controversial field -- there must be some good in there somewhere, but it's always getting trotted out by every jerk with some axe to grind (Op, I'm not accusing you of this) or some racist or sexist bull to back up.

I usually encounter it in some bogus argument about why men are better than women at mathematics.

Hang on....

Guesthouse I suggest the logical conclusion is not that genetic hardwiring and wetwiring JUSTIFIES the behaviour but that it may EXPLAIN it. It doesn't nullify the need for law, which is basically society wielding power as it sees fit, it may in fact reinforce it. The same applies to personal laws or morals, which in the face of all this stuff may be all the more desirable. Understanding things can only help us deal with them better though can't it?

Canadian Girl you still haven't told us the reasoning behind your strong opinions. There's a danger that without the backup that you demand of others your views enter into the realm of proclamations or god-talk, and I for one am not interested in proclamations or god-talk.

Now this is what I think of a good post.

[qwertz]

Men are better at mathematics than women. Men were hunters. The hunters who survived did so because of their good hunting skills. Those with bad hunting skills died. Those successful at hunting were adept at map reading and the mental skills associated with mathematics.

Please note that this does not mean that every man on this planet is better than every women on this planet at math, but in general, because of their evolutionary past, men are better at mathematics than women.

If it makes you feel better, women are better at lying.

Cave men had maps?

Better than that, they could read sign and judge from an animal turd how long since it had crapped and in which direction it was headed.

[OxfordWill]

Yea I do know, I know exactly what the vast majority of Thai people think when they see 60 year old westerner walking hand in hand with 19 year old girl. And it is -not- how cute they look together. Exactly how naive do you want to be?

Edited August 31, 2007 by OxfordWill

[canadiangirl]

This is one of the big reasons evolutionary psych is such a controversial field -- there must be some good in there somewhere, but it's always getting trotted out by every jerk with some axe to grind (Op, I'm not accusing you of this) or some racist or sexist bull to back up.

I usually encounter it in some bogus argument about why men are better than women at mathematics.

Canadian Girl you still haven't told us the reasoning behind your strong opinions. T

I made a big post about this yesterday, and it was swallowed by the interweb. I've been too busy to write it up again.

Evolutionary psychology is so controversial people write entire books called "controversies in evolutionary psychology". Just google it -- you don't need to take my word for it. It doesn't mean ev psych is entirely wrong, or that the OP is wrong -- but it does mean that "ev psych says so" is not a sufficient argument for me.

It's one of those scientific fields that seems "close enough" to common sense that everyone is always reading one book on the topic and feeling like they understand what is going on. Most of them lack the grounding in science to understand that scientific theories, especially the big ground-breaking ones, are often subtle, complex and getting some small detail wrong means that the whole thing falls apart.

But because ev psych concerns human behavior, it is often use to lend the credibility of "science" to some rather dubious and politically-motivated arguments (not always, and I am NOT accusing the OP this, I am speaking about ev psych in general). It's often accused of being the new eugenics.

I hope this answers your question. I also hope you're not trying to pick a fight with me, as I can hardly see what offense you can take at my opinion on the validity of evolutionary psychology. It seems a rather philosophical issue, hardly worth debating any longer than this.

Edited August 31, 2007 by canadiangirl