jumnien Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 It's not a tremendously well-written piece by Kitty, but it does have its moments. I think we all have to agree with the toilet analogy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plus Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 You can say that Thais flaunt their mia nois, but being a mia noi is absolutely not the same as being a whore. Wholesale versus retail? Mia noi is a relationship with all that it entails. Prostitution is anything but a relationship. I'm not saying you can't have a relationships with prostitutes, but the interesting thing is - once people think that it IS a relationship, they stop thinking about their partners as whores and get mightily offended if others continue to do so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
somtaamgaiyang Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 If this were my country (and I am repeatedly reminded that it is not), if I hated the existence of this industry so much I would try to do something onstructive about it. I have given up wondering why the rich complain about it but don't do anything about it. Do what exactly? Make prostitution illegal? It already is. Eliminate it? No rich country has succeeded at this, why would one expect Thailand to? Try to find alternative employment for the women? Many NGOs, run by foreigners and Thais already do this. Most people don't care about prostitution as long as it's not shoved in their face. In my understanding, Thai men treat prostitution as something that happens behind closed doors --- which is also the attitude of most Western countries to the matter. For example, I live in one of the major sex tourism destinations for North America -- and you'd never know, by how much day-to-day contact a normal person has with the industry. You won't find it unless you go looking for it. It's discrete. I suspect that a great part of what offends Thai sensibilities, rich or poor, on this matter is the lack of discretion of so many farang, as well as the "Thailand is my playground, what are you going to do about it?" attitude of entitlement. I would hardly be pleased if someone treated my own country this way. Oh, how inconvenient of the Thai people to have opinions which interfere with farang having fun in Thailand! How dare they? Well then they should close it down shouldn't they! Bulldoze Pattaya, Nana, Patpong and all the rest. A few well placed campaigns by the more well to do classes of this country would close it in a second. I was looking it at the point of view of people looking down on the girls working there. I pity them, but in no way look down on them because most of them would choose to do something else in a heartbeat if there was an alternative. I don't look down on them morally and probably have more respect for them than all the corrupt businessmen and law enforcers that gouge millions out of this country every year. If the best they could do would be to keep it discrete it would be an amazing achievement. Bearing in mind that 3 out of the 4 biggest spots in Bangkok are on the two best known streets in the city and the other is an entire beach resort it shouldn't be too difficult for them to find them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaiWai Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 (edited) QUOTE(geriatrickid @ 2007-09-19 03:41:54) I read the lady's blog. Guess what, she observes and says the same thing alot of westerners say. Interesting that those that have read the blog aren't so critical of her. /snip To save repeating the above . . I actually thought it was quite an amusing read! The only people who would take offense at that article are the types of people who are criticised. Hmmm .... I don't think those "types" would recognize themselves. As for how to reduce the massive prostitution of Thai youth, a social security system for the aged would be a big help (there's no shortage of funds in some sectors ), plus decent education which includes instilling some belief in one's ability to have meaningful employment, and vocational training. The latter seems desperately lacking. Edited September 19, 2007 by WaiWai Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plus Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 I think the topic title is misreading, there was no example of how rich Thais treat poor Thais, and now it all boiled down to how they treat prostitution. >>> most of them would choose to do something else in a heartbeat if there was an alternative. I seriosly doubt that. Elsewhere you really have to work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prakanong Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 If this were my country (and I am repeatedly reminded that it is not), if I hated the existence of this industry so much I would try to do something onstructive about it. I have given up wondering why the rich complain about it but don't do anything about it. Do what exactly? Make prostitution illegal? It already is. Eliminate it? No rich country has succeeded at this, why would one expect Thailand to? Try to find alternative employment for the women? Many NGOs, run by foreigners and Thais already do this. Most people don't care about prostitution as long as it's not shoved in their face. In my understanding, Thai men treat prostitution as something that happens behind closed doors --- which is also the attitude of most Western countries to the matter. For example, I live in one of the major sex tourism destinations for North America -- and you'd never know, by how much day-to-day contact a normal person has with the industry. You won't find it unless you go looking for it. It's discrete. I suspect that a great part of what offends Thai sensibilities, rich or poor, on this matter is the lack of discretion of so many farang, as well as the "Thailand is my playground, what are you going to do about it?" attitude of entitlement. I would hardly be pleased if someone treated my own country this way. Oh, how inconvenient of the Thai people to have opinions which interfere with farang having fun in Thailand! How dare they? Well then they should close it down shouldn't they! Bulldoze Pattaya, Nana, Patpong and all the rest. A few well placed campaigns by the more well to do classes of this country would close it in a second. I was looking it at the point of view of people looking down on the girls working there. I pity them, but in no way look down on them because most of them would choose to do something else in a heartbeat if there was an alternative. I don't look down on them morally and probably have more respect for them than all the corrupt businessmen and law enforcers that gouge millions out of this country every year. If the best they could do would be to keep it discrete it would be an amazing achievement. Bearing in mind that 3 out of the 4 biggest spots in Bangkok are on the two best known streets in the city and the other is an entire beach resort it shouldn't be too difficult for them to find them. Yes but thats only the farang oriented area's - what about the Thai and Asian scene which is much larger? In the population as a whole a higher % of Thai and Asian men have used the services of "Working Girls" than the same in the vast majority of western countries! Just how many guy's on this board would have never been with a working girl in their home country but have in Thailand (whether they deny it or not ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FarangNoi21 Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 Many of these hi-so Thais you see in Paragon and The Emporium would be middle class or lower in the West. When they travel to Hong Kong or Singapore, they stay in 3 star hotels and they realize the kind of money that there is first world countries. They are well aware of this, and that is why I always see looks of insecurity and admiration in their eyes towards farang. I have never heard a Thai male complain that farang date Thai women from poor backgrounds, maybe they joke about it, but that is the end of it. Yet many of these hi-so Thai girls are jealous of these girls who do absolutely nothing but hook up with a farang and now they have access to more money than these hi-so girls do! I get the feeling that some of these girls wish that they were doing the same thing these BGs are doing but they care too much about what other people will think about them. Three ugly girls are eating lunch and a pretty girl walks by in a short skirt with a good looking guy. What happens? They call her a slut. Because her skirt is short? Nah, its because she is prettier than them and many women are by nature jealous and vindictive. Especially Thai women! Lets be straight up, socially Thailand is about 100 years behind the modern world. Every single day living here I have to hear the word hi-so. Jesus Christ. Hi-So this, Hi-So that. Like I mentioned previously, put all of these hi-so Thais on a plane to Hong Kong and most of them are no longer hi-so. Those who would still be upper class in Hong Kong are certainly not going to give two shits about a BG grubbing money off a rich old farang. fwiw, ive read this girls blog before and i don't think she is all that bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 "Elsewhere you really have to work" is a very true statement. I lived for a number of years near one of the "entertainment" areas and quite a large number of the working girls lived in the same apartment. I knew them well, occasionally ate with them, helped them write letters about the families sick buffalo etc. There were a few (very few) who were turning tricks to fund their college education. They were in and out of the game as quickly as possible. By and large these were reasonably respectable gals who dressed modestly other than swinging their <deleted> around a poll. They had aspirations and this was a means toward achieving their goal. Most were rather lazy, slovenly gals who had no plan to do anything other than make the easiest money possible. The only redeeming quality was that they were consumed by their profession. Even if they 'found' someone they looked like a tart and couldn't keep their eyes from straying toward the next possible customer. They were cunning and most were thieves and liars--keeping a husband/boyfriend upcountry and two or three farangs on the side sending money. The one thing I never did encounter was one who was "forced" to work as a sex worker. All of them chose it. And more than a few were so sexually charged they flaunted it all the time and this is where the problem comes. You can't walk around Emporium looking like a tart and expect to get any kind of respect from others. It doesn't matter much to me how you dress, but if it's respect you want dress modestly and behave appropriately and leave the bg lingo at home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
t.s Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 it seems that for some here a thai woman should not have an opinion. for some, thai people should not be offended by in your face, blatant prostitution and the image their country has received as a result of accepting it. i disagree. good for her. sorry she made you think twice about going shopping with your new "girlfreind" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FarangNoi21 Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 good for her. sorry she made you think twice about going shopping with your new "girlfreind" yes, apparently it is not okay to take them shopping, they should only be used like toilets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilko Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 thailand is an incredibly class devided society - something which might remind of the cast system in India. I am able to mix in england, maybe not with the ruling class, but with descendants of nobility, lords etc without such problems as in thailand. In fact, on the whole, they are nice, open and sociable people and their only superiority is their wealth. "wealth"???? actually you might want to hear what they say about you after you've left Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilko Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 (edited) Thailand or what is now Thailand, was originally a Hindu society and there are still quite a lot of vestiges of the caste system left lying around..... Edited September 19, 2007 by wilko Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
somtaamgaiyang Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 it seems that for some here a thai woman should not have an opinion. for some, thai people should not be offended by in your face, blatant prostitution and the image their country has received as a result of accepting it.i disagree. good for her. sorry she made you think twice about going shopping with your new "girlfreind" Well who owns 99% of the sex industry in Thailand? Close it down and it will no longer be in anyone's face and in the end Thailand will be fine without it. She can have whatever opinion she likes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FarangNoi21 Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 (edited) talking behind people's back is the national past time in thailand and a person living in a 3 bedroom shack will look down on a person living in a 2 bedroom shack just a fast as a hi-so will look down on a bg. its a class society and anyone with darker skin than you is lower than you. anyone who has less money than you is lower than you. Edited September 19, 2007 by FarangNoi21 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilko Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 sounds like a case of the pot calling the kettle black to me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDon Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 Its because most Hiso Thai girls get proper jobs and are very proud of there country, they dont like people thinking there a country known for prostitutes. Its like any country really, prostitutes are veiwed by everyone as low because they let them selves be used. But most of them come from a really poor place and do it as a only way out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bkkmadness Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 I had a brief look at the blog, wasn't long before I read her complaining about hi so thai show offs as well. Might be worth a few other people reading it as well before judging a person's whole character on 'one post'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kmart Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 Rich Thais or locals just one step up from having to resort to the oldest profession as a livelihood can sneer or look down their noses all they want. A lot of the supposed "cream" of Thai society similarly seem to have the morals of insects themselves... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDon Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 Its one girl expressing her veiws, pretty harmful. I mean people on here express very different views of Thai people and other farang ppl all the time. So you cant say this is how rich Thai's view the poor because of one random. She probaly just venting which makes people say things more strongly then they mean too. Who knows though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acquiesce Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 I wonder if Will is getting any action or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prakanong Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 Rich Thais or locals just one step up from having to resort to the oldest profession as a livelihood can sneer or look down their noses all they want. A lot of the supposed "cream" of Thai society similarly seem to have the morals of insects themselves... Most of them started off as concubines, mia noi's or courtesans anyway a few generations back - so they made their way up Thai society on their backs too! Just what are Hi-So's anyway - some seem to view a hi-so as anything lower middle class and above!!! I suppose so - we have had those with names we can not talk about here working as ofice girls earning a paper boy's salary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDon Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 Acquiesce, Your missus is definately a looker. Nice one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FarangNoi21 Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 I had a brief look at the blog, wasn't long before I read her complaining about hi so thai show offs as well. Might be worth a few other people reading it as well before judging a person's whole character on 'one post'. seems unlikely that a line like this "take them shopping in shops that their town neighbors could only be maids in" and this "obviously frustrated bitch who was dying to take those clothes back to her little cell." and "To me, they're like toilets that you just relieve yourself in and move on." paint a pretty good picture of her mindset. then again, its hard to imagine a privilaged kids growing up in Bangkok and not turning into complete jerks. I am sure she is not a bad person, is probably smart, fun to hang out with, etc, but she probably also has a bunch of bad qualities that were ingrained in her since childhood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acquiesce Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 paint a pretty good picture of her mindset. then again, its hard to imagine a privilaged kids growing up in Bangkok and not turning into complete jerks. I am sure she is not a bad person, is probably smart, fun to hang out with, etc, but she probably also has a bunch of bad qualities that were ingrained in her since childhood. Summed up prety well there FN21 but i still want to know if the wannabe DJ Will is getting any ass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bkkmadness Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 Ok, it's a fair cop, she is of course snobbish, but like you said lots of people born into money, especially in this country are. I think she does admit to being snobbish and bitchy in the blog doesn't she? And I guess to have a successful blog it helps to be outspoken and cause a bit of controversy sometimes, look at the publicity she gets from this thread. Never heard of her before myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prakanong Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 (edited) Ok, it's a fair cop, she is of course snobbish, but like you said lots of people born into money, especially in this country are. I think she does admit to being snobbish and bitchy in the blog doesn't she? And I guess to have a successful blog it helps to be outspoken and cause a bit of controversy sometimes, look at the publicity she gets from this thread. Never heard of her before myself. Yes you are right. A bit like the "Sarong Party Girl" from Singapore and her blog but she was snobbish in favour of white men There was a snobbish one as well but from some Ministers daughter last year in Singapore too. Edited September 19, 2007 by Prakanong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acquiesce Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 Nah Maddy, i'm sure you have heard of her before, can you not remember the last outrage her website caused on here? i'm sure you were involved somewhere along the lines. It had a shit load of pages and Miss Kitty came on here and made some comments, will see if i can find the thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bkkmadness Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 That is ringing a bell actually, maybe I have heard of her before, but forgot her since. I get a bit bored reading blogs to be honest. Find the thread though if you can, cheers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acquiesce Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 (edited) Here she is, doing a good job of defending Thai uni girls after some idiot said 50 - 80 percent of them were prostitutes. http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?s=...st&p=837821 Edited September 19, 2007 by Acquiesce Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bkkmadness Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 Here she is, doing a good job of defending Thai uni girls after some idiot said 50 - 80 percent of them were prostitutes.http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?s=...st&p=837821 She does do a good job of defending them, and I understand why. The stereotype pisses of most of the Thai girls I know too, and it's a stereotype reinforced all too often on this forum. Would be interesting to see the trouble caused should a large number of Thai people join this forum to refute some of these opinions. Always seems to be the case that when a Thai joins this forum posters start calling their nationality into question because they use good english. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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