Minimum Daily Wage Raised

[TAWP]

As I said, talk is cheap.

[ZukiSuzuki]

As I said, talk is cheap.

You seem to do a lot of it.

[Mid]

You are welcome to set up a biz and give your workers 50% higher wage then other companies, for the same job and same qualifications, out of your goodness of heart.

Talk is cheap.

hence the need for a minimum wage ....................................

[Heng]

Is it not so that if you pay workers enough to put something aside, to have that car and that TV, washing machine you create consumers. Factory owners, by paying their workers a decent and fair wage, you are also enabling them to purchase the products they are making.

It's not as black and white as that. That's like saying corruption will disappear if you just raise, double, triple, quadruple policy, army, and politician salaries. Or that there wouldn't be crime in the world if everyone were wealthier. Or that Somchai or Somying the factory worker wouldn't be spending 2,000 Baht on their mobile phone bill if they were making 8,000 instead of 6,000 Baht a month.

Yup, be a nay sayer. Do nothing, just leave it as it is.

So I have to fire the hundred or so workers we employ, pull the folks we're putting through school out of their various programs, nevermind our free take home cafeteria (since they're all being fired), etc.? That's the problem with the armchair hand out brigade, they always have their hands out.

[Heng]

You still haven't explained where the 2K extra per worker should come from...

Becouse that is what this is. And investment in human capital. In the long run they will regain their investment becouse they are now selling more products, becouse there are now more money circulating ammong people.

Also since their workers are now highly skilled, they are making better quality products at a faster pace, at reduced cost becouse labour turnover is reduced.

One can invest in human capital without raising the national minimum wage. Training, increasing skill sets + increasing job satisfaction and minimum wage are two entirely different things.

[Heng]

A quick comment. My aim was to broaden the discussion from just the minimum wage through to the supporting associative infrastructure, wisely or not. I wasn't intending to over personalise this discussion, however, the 'armchair manager' comment is, in the reality of the analogue hysterically funny. Suffice it to say my responsibilities in life have included multiple hundreds employed simultaneously across three continents.

Your intent wasn't to over personalise this discussion by referring to me specifically? If you were referring to some other orchid exporter that you were making assumptions about, then I may have been mistaken in replying to that comment.

I was assuming armchair manager status from your quick assumptions (without gathering data first). If I was mistaken, then I withdraw the comment.

[somtaamgaiyang]

You still haven't explained where the 2K extra per worker should come from...

Becouse that is what this is. And investment in human capital. In the long run they will regain their investment becouse they are now selling more products, becouse there are now more money circulating ammong people.

Also since their workers are now highly skilled, they are making better quality products at a faster pace, at reduced cost becouse labour turnover is reduced.

One can invest in human capital without raising the national minimum wage. Training, increasing skill sets + increasing job satisfaction and minimum wage are two entirely different things.

When will anyone realise in this country, that education is way down the list of priorities for this country. Grippen fighters and personnel carriers are the flavour of the day right now. I won't get onto the level of unpaid taxes in this country which could be used to build thousands of schools which by definition would negate the need for a minimum wage since Thailand would be flush with better educated workers instead of minimum wage workers.

Companies do so only so much, it is the peoples responsibility to demand better education for their kids but then I haven't seen too many of the new parties running on an education platform, but then again none of them have ever had a platform.

[TAWP]

As I said, talk is cheap.

You seem to do a lot of it.

You are full of air.

You don't know what I do, what we [the family] does or what I/we have done in the past. You don't know me.

I however don't request others to pay more ut of social guilt.

Again the handout-fans cannot think longer than their nose.

[TAWP]

You are welcome to set up a biz and give your workers 50% higher wage then other companies, for the same job and same qualifications, out of your goodness of heart.

Talk is cheap.

hence the need for a minimum wage ....................................

The most inane argument sofar.

Are you saying that we should raise the minimum wage with 50% every year and everything would be fine?

Try acctually reading what I type before you say that my post in any way say minimum wage is needed.

[Mid]

nothing inane about having a base to measure your 50% increase against ......................................

now what was it your saying ?

[TAWP]

That you don't make any sense.

Any argument that minimum wage is needed so a post can be written saying 'x+50%' is useless for any argument if the minimumwage is needed.

So you were saying?

[Mid]

it's really quite simple ,

to do any quantitative measurements you'll need a base ,

welcome to the minimum wage concept .

[TAWP]

You are confused and your assumption isn't based on reality.

Please tell me how minimum wage affects the salaries for a doctor, police officer or automobile mechanic.

Ps. There is a reason why minimum wage ISN'T used in several of the most socialistic countries in the west. Perhaps you should look it up. Ds.

[Mid]

as you please , this obviously isn't going anywhere .

[Heng]

You still haven't explained where the 2K extra per worker should come from...

Becouse that is what this is. And investment in human capital. In the long run they will regain their investment becouse they are now selling more products, becouse there are now more money circulating ammong people.

Also since their workers are now highly skilled, they are making better quality products at a faster pace, at reduced cost becouse labour turnover is reduced.

One can invest in human capital without raising the national minimum wage. Training, increasing skill sets + increasing job satisfaction and minimum wage are two entirely different things.

When will anyone realise in this country, that education is way down the list of priorities for this country. Grippen fighters and personnel carriers are the flavour of the day right now. I won't get onto the level of unpaid taxes in this country which could be used to build thousands of schools which by definition would negate the need for a minimum wage since Thailand would be flush with better educated workers instead of minimum wage workers.

Companies do so only so much, it is the peoples responsibility to demand better education for their kids but then I haven't seen too many of the new parties running on an education platform, but then again none of them have ever had a platform.

And why is your comment a reply to mine? I'm not running the country. I'm running a few companies (in a manner I dare say is well above the status quo in terms of mutual benefits: to us, the owners, and to our employees).

Edited October 20, 2007 by Heng

[samsara]

so one side is completely disillusioned with human nature and the other is completely idealistic...

[Choscura]

I'm all for a wage hike. I'd gladly shell out a little extra if it means the guy on the bottom is making a bit more to feed their family. but I don't think thai culture will ever allow for something like this, or at least not in a way that really makes a difference- thus we have the ruling class who have no idea of what the expenses for the people under them are making decisions that are going to cost them more. being rich isn't just about having a lot of money, it's about being able to keep yourself in the flow of money. the best analogy I can make is that of a river- the money being the water- and the poor people are the streams where very little water (money) flows. if the rich want to be a dam, by all means, let them, dams are a good way of producing something greater than the sum of it's parts- hydroelectric dams are vital to the economy where I'm from, and without them, the water's going to flow anyway. but when you have larger deltas, with more money going into the small streams, you can build dams there too- after all, the water from the river doesn't STAY behind the dam, it goes out in such a way that it does things, and I'm all for that- economic developement and so on. but it seems like the dam thai upper classes can't figure out how it's supposed to work, and think that frivolous spending on parties and so on is water going out of the dam in such a way as to make something useful, and it's not- it's like the water is evaporating from behind the dam faster than it's powering the turbines.

I wonder if anybody out there could follow this... but I'm not gonna retype it now. you figure it out.

[Heng]

Dam straight, although a common theme in these discussions is folks extending their own standards of "enough" "frivolous" etc., from their own standard of living. In the big picture, the poor here aren't suffering nearly as much as they are made out to be, and the well to do aren't wasting or showing off as much as you'd like to think.

Edited October 22, 2007 by Heng

[wineman]

So what exactly is the minimum wage at the present time please?

[Mid]

^

varies by Provinces ,

lowest is around 140 B / day and highest close to 200 B / day .

Edited October 22, 2007 by Mid

[wineman]

^

varies by Provinces ,

lowest is around 140 B / day and highest close to 200 B / day .

Thanks Mid