Can't Do The Language, Eat The Food, Or Work Legally, So....

[Ulysses G.]

Everybody refers PB as he , I always thought he was a she ?

Don't know where I got this impression from ?

PB is gay.

[Neeranam]

Here's your first lesson - don't procrastinate = ya plaat wan bpragan pruung

ya plaat wan bpragan pruung = don't miss out on insurance day seasoning?

I think he meant ผัดวันประกันพรุ่ง

I'm not allowed to write Thai on this forum.

But, yes that's what I mean.

[Screws]

Should I bother to stay in Thailand

Chiang Mai has an expats club. Have you been?

[Jingthing]

Destination - Ecuador - just happens to be the farthest country away from Thailand on the face of the earth...

Ecuador is on my radar also. What visa are you going on? I have heard you can get a perm visa there just for buying a house or condo over 30K USD. Is this really true? The info about Ecuador is alot harder to dig up than about Thailand.

[garro]

I was just thinking PB.

Is there any reason why you couldn't come back to Thailand if it didn't work out somewhere else?

If you can still come back again, why not give elsewhere a try.

If it will mean burning bridges then think carefully.

Best of luck either way.

There is more to life than Thailand. Apparently

[chicowoodduck]

Maybe it's just me, but how come every time I move the grass is always greener on the other side?

[YoungFarangNa]

No offence man but 4 years and you can't say 'Tao Rai'?? I've seen guys like that who have lived here for 5+ years and they strugle on a daily basis to get by, not financially but oher ways.

Two farang missionaries just left my house - when they left, I asked them how long they'd been here - their answer, 3 months. The whole conversation we had was in Thai(apart from a couple of words). They said they had studied one hour a week for 2 months before they came. It's all a matter of attitude - some people expet Thais to speak English, others make an effort to learn.

they must be really serious about saving souls

[brahmburgers]

I would suggest that if you can, take a holiday to wherever you would consider living next. Maybe this will help you reach some conclusion. Maybe you will see that you are just going through a bad stage at the moment or maybe you will see that Thailand just isn't for you.

Life is too short to waste it spending time in a place where you're not really happy.

I admire PB's frankness - particularly on an open forum where some are quick to thrash others behind their veil of anonymity - though the lion's share of the responses have been decent and thoughtful. I too have had doubts about residing here - especially during a several-year phase when things were getting stolen by hill tribe workers who I thought I could trust (I have since been a lot less trusting). I also have had trouble getting a decent handle on the language, and am not keen on the food. However, I do have tangible activities that I enjoy (gardening, writing, etc) some of which generates a bit of income - though money is tight at best of times for me - which is a big reason for having no significant other. I agree with garro's post (above). I would do the same ('take a holiday.......') but it's also a 'money thing' so some of us stay put and make the best of things.

As for being 'happy' - I think that word is bandied around too much. 'Being content' is a better phrase. Few people other than kids are really happy in life, other than occassional spurts. ....or perhaps it's just a matter of semantics. Really though, look around you at the people you see day to day - how many adults appear to be genuinely happy? In my view, if one attains sustained contentment, that's a big plus.

[josefbl]

I am a dutchman living in Holland and wiil live in Thailand in 2008.Beying many times in Thailand ,I love the culture,the people ,the food the nature in fact everytthing of Thailand .My wife ( Belgian national )and I will emigrate to Thailand in 2008.

I will be 63 and my wife 59.BUT................. we TRY to learn allready the Thai language BEFORE setling in Thailand ! I was just an officer in the Royal Dutch navy but I do speek 6 languages ( Dutch , English ,French,German,Russian,Ukrainian and some Swedish and some Spanish ) Could it be that you are a little to easy saying that you not speek the language ( after 4 years ! ) . How can this be?.We ar not in Thailand yet but we ar learning already to speek ,read and write the Thai language ! Not going to an expencive school but by ourselfs .NOT liking or not eat the Thai food ? With all the veriythy there is ???? Please explane me ,I do not understand your arguments !!!!!

[Ulysses G.]

NOT liking or not eat the Thai food ? With all the veriythy there is ???? Please explane me ,I do not understand your arguments !!!!!

To some of us it tastes like sheeet. Too sweet. Too spicy. Too hot. Don't like bugs and worms and fishheads. Some "varieties" smell and taste terrible.

If you like it fine. That doesn't mean that everyone else does!

[PeaceBlondie]

For a guy who has never met me in person, Ulysses knows me fairly well. Yes, I absolutely cannot eat Thai spicy food, not, not. My first years here were spent learning that there are no words in Thai that successfully convince the cook, "leave out all the freakin' spices, all the smelly sheeeet, insects, worms, guts, and all the nasty tastes!" I would feel better eating broken window glass; it would be less painful to my mouth. However, I eat tang mo (ba'tao), sapalote (ba'ka'not), pomelo (sum-o) and Kit Kat bars until I'm im lao (katong). See, I can speak fruit in central and northern Thai!

Thai language is another no-can-do, mae dai thing. Alphabet, tones, 'your mother is a dog horse,' - look at the American-Sino-Thai Heng correcting another poster! I bought Benjaman Poontang's basic intro to Thai, and she made no sense to my brain. A buddy gave me the CD's that go with her intro book, and I've never listened to them. Mae dai. My younger Italian-American friend is on his fourth course and can barely order food at Italian restaurants here.

Work. Teaching English. I did that for two years, but never could get a work visa or work permit. I had 'better employers' in certain respects, but the most educated of those educators did not have the beginning of a clue as to the problems a farang has in becoming legal in Thailand. Public education is, overall, a lost cause. If your child is in public school here, they are being ruined educationally.

A practice run to Mexico is in order, but the round trip equals going around the world (expensive), and my last trip to Ireland soured me on extensive flying. I'm 92.5% convinced to just pick up stakes and move permanently.

Again, thanks to all for the comments and suggestions.

[Sir Burr]

You have it down to a margin of 0.5%? Sheeeesh!

[pop_corn]

if you are feeling unhappy here I recommend u to leave ASAP. your menthal health is very important part in your life, so just listen to your self very carefully. if is screaming to go away, do it, but if is screaming to stay, then stay here and fight back the things that are making you sad.. hehehe..

luv!

[meadish_sweetball]

I am a dutchman living in Holland and wiil live in Thailand in 2008.Beying many times in Thailand ,I love the culture,the people ,the food the nature in fact everytthing of Thailand .My wife ( Belgian national )and I will emigrate to Thailand in 2008.

I will be 63 and my wife 59.BUT................. we TRY to learn allready the Thai language BEFORE setling in Thailand ! I was just an officer in the Royal Dutch navy but I do speek 6 languages ( Dutch , English ,French,German,Russian,Ukrainian and some Swedish and some Spanish ) Could it be that you are a little to easy saying that you not speek the language ( after 4 years ! ) . How can this be?.We ar not in Thailand yet but we ar learning already to speek ,read and write the Thai language ! Not going to an expencive school but by ourselfs .NOT liking or not eat the Thai food ? With all the veriythy there is ???? Please explane me ,I do not understand your arguments !!!!!

Hi josefbl, welcome to Thaivisa.

No need to show old PB the angry face I think; he claims he has really tried to learn Thai but not been successful in his attempts - that is, the locals still do not quite understand what he is saying. I also think he could learn some more if he put his mind to it and found the right person to teach him though...

As for the food, we all have different opinions. I love Thai food even after 6 years of eating it almost every day, but even if it sounds strange to you now, I promise that if/when you do move here you will find that after a while you crave other things than only Thai food, too.

If you try something and find you don't like it - do you have to force yourself to keep eating it? I don't think so.

[bingobongo]

the old adage the "grass is greener on the other side" comes to mind , but in reality, "the grass is greener where you water it"

Edited October 28, 2007 by bingobongo

[Jingthing]

sounds strange to you now, I promise that if/when you do move here you will find that after a while you crave other things than only Thai food, too.

So true. I was one of those, if I move to Thailand I will eat Thai food everyday, but I have never eaten so much pizza in my life! Like anything that is pervasive, it gets boring. The variety is not as great as people often think, flavorwise, for example fish sauce.

If I had to be "stuck" with one kind of food, it would be Chinese food, not Thai food. Unfortunately, most of the Chinese food you find in Thailand is Thai-Chinese food.

I also find it very hard to learn Thai. Being American, I am bad at foreign languages by default, but it is even harder the older you get. Your brain isn't as compliant not to mention your eyes, all those tiny squigglies and multiple fonts for Thai script ...

Also, and I have said this before, becoming fluent in Thai is a huge investment in time and effort. The Thai visa system gives us one year at a time, and for retirees there is no path whatsover to improve your status above that. So you become fluent in Thai and then have to leave. Where does that leave you? Some kind of freak at Thai restos in the west where you can impress Thai waiters?

Edited October 28, 2007 by Jingthing

[AlexLah]

I see many kind replies here but I think it is time to ask a bit harder questions to PB.

Should I bother to stay in Thailand if it's obvious that I will never speak or read Thai, never hold an in-depth conversation with many Thais?

So you already decided never to learn to speak or understand Thai language?

Cannot eat the food, although

There is a lot of non spicy food on the Thai menu, did you ever take the effort to find out?

I like the climate and the people?

I see you put a question mark after people. How can you state that if you cannot talk Thai, what is it that you like about the Thai people?

And after four years, it seems unlikely or impossible that I will work legally?

If you have your certificates for English language teaching there is no problem getting a work permit, what is it, are you not certified?

PB what is your real reason you want to move?

You cannot find a partner?

You wanna be with your family?

Do not try to come up with BS reasons like not able to speak Thai and not liking Thai food.

These are not the real reasons why you are thinking to leave Thailand.

Be true to yourself and others, do not try to blame it on you not able to learn the language or eating Thai food and such.

Sorry for the bit harsh reply but you need to get your act straight and not try to find more reasons here why you could leave.

Kind regards,

Alex

[Jingthing]

The last post was too harsh on PB. I take his point more emotionally. As blacks in the US say, he ain't feeling it (Thailand) anymore. It isn't speaking to him so much anymore, if it ever did very much. I think he has already made his decision, and I give him much credit for being open about it.

[PeaceBlondie]

Alex, that does seem harsh. I suggest you go back and read the thread and my relevant posts here.

The question mark about the Thai people was part of a series of questions. I have found Thais to be polite, friendly, helpful, to a point. And do I have to justify what I like, such as the climate? I think not.

After 53 months in this country, based on my direct personal experience, I have 'already' decided I cannot learn Thai. Cannot. Do you understand "Mae dai"?

Teaching qualifications: I came to Thailand with a BA, some teaching experience, and a one year B visa. I immediately got my TEFL certification, and the rest of the story is too long to tell, involving Thai ajarns, old tie schools, ignorance, indifference, pension rules, etc.

I have stated my 'real reasons for wanting to leave Thailand.' I have had one partner for almost the entire time. Hating the food is not BS, it is fact. Not just the spices, but the basic ingredients, how it's cooked, the seasonings, etc. I cannot eat the shit. Cannot. Again, mae dai. Family is one of my stated reasons for wanting to be in the same time zone.

Alex, go argue reasons with somebody else, please. If you cannot accept that these are true reasons (language, food, communication, the work impossibilities, family, etc.) please go find someone else to doubt.

[lazeeboy]

Alex, that does seem harsh. I suggest you go back and read the thread and my relevant posts here.

The question mark about the Thai people was part of a series of questions. I have found Thais to be polite, friendly, helpful, to a point. And do I have to justify what I like, such as the climate? I think not.

After 53 months in this country, based on my direct personal experience, I have 'already' decided I cannot learn Thai. Cannot. Do you understand "Mae dai"?

Teaching qualifications: I came to Thailand with a BA, some teaching experience, and a one year B visa. I immediately got my TEFL certification, and the rest of the story is too long to tell, involving Thai ajarns, old tie schools, ignorance, indifference, pension rules, etc.

I have stated my 'real reasons for wanting to leave Thailand.' I have had one partner for almost the entire time. Hating the food is not BS, it is fact. Not just the spices, but the basic ingredients, how it's cooked, the seasonings, etc. I cannot eat the shit. Cannot. Again, mae dai. Family is one of my stated reasons for wanting to be in the same time zone.

Alex, go argue reasons with somebody else, please. If you cannot accept that these are true reasons (language, food, communication, the work impossibilities, family, etc.) please go find someone else to doubt.

peaceblondie ,sounds like you've made up your mind on this one ,take care mate...

[Austhaied]

I speak the language, I love the food and I was working legally in Thailand, but moved on because there were other things that we as a family needed that Thailand could not give us.

Think about what you want in life, and don't fixate on Thailand as being the only option - things will become clearer that way.

What things?

Mate, if you don't know now, you never will.

[uptou]

Dont you have a kitchen PB? (hope the stroke hasnt affected your mobility too much)

I'm actually very bored with eating out & looking at menus.I'm really looking forward to getting a place & trying out some recipes from around the world with my girlfreind,whos a good cook.The supermarkets seem to have as much as you could hope for over here.

[samran]

PB,

My only advice is don't burn any bridges until you are 100% sure. To do that, you have to make your decision objectively, and I'd argue that you can't be in Thailand to do this. We all go through our love hate relationships with Thailand. I've been 'back' for 2 years after a 2 year hiatus to Australia and the UK in 2004/2005. I'm enjoying being back, but I know I'm due for a 'sick of Thailand' phase any time now.

Take a few months out, head back to the US, Mehico and the one or two other places (ireland?) where I believe you've spent some quality time in the past.

A bit like visiting and old lover and seeing if you've made the right decision to actually stay in LOS. Or, go find a new country to have an affair with. Variety is the spice of life. I'd quite like to retire to Switzerland, if only I can scam an EU passport and a million bucks!!

[the gent]

Sounds to me you should return to work back home.

Perhaps you are simply not ready for the prolonged life of indolence and ease that most might regard as the prerequisite of a satisfying retirement.

In which case, strikes me that your decision is obvious. Why procrastinate further? The inability to ingest the local fodder or to understand the lingo ( quite why you would wish to converse with a Thai who cannot speak English is quite mystifying since those of that ilk have in my experience very little to say for themselves that may be of the remotest interest to anyone of any intelligence ) are silly excuses and should not preoccupy you further.

Get on with it and stop being such a silly self absorbed old goose. Remember, nothing matters very much and very little matters at all.

[Jingthing]

Yep, most of us aren't teenage boys with unlimited potential anymore (and that was also an illusion). This is it. We chose to live here. We can choose to leave. Most Thais don't have that luxury. Thailand isn't just any country though. It has an addictive power over westerners that lures them in but the reality ain't the fantasy.

Edited October 28, 2007 by Jingthing

[Austhaied]

Sounds to me you should return to work back home.

Perhaps you are simply not ready for the prolonged life of indolence and ease that most might regard as the prerequisite of a satisfying retirement.

In which case, strikes me that your decision is obvious. Why procrastinate further? The inability to ingest the local fodder or to understand the lingo ( quite why you would wish to converse with a Thai who cannot speak English is quite mystifying since those of that ilk have in my experience very little to say for themselves that may be of the remotest interest to anyone of any intelligence ) are silly excuses and should not preoccupy you further.

Get on with it and stop being such a silly self absorbed old goose. Remember, nothing matters very much and very little matters at all.

I have had nothing but fantastic experiences and conversations with the rural Thais that i guess you're referring to.

I pity you. You need to wash the dust from your eyes pal.

PB. Whatever you choose to do will be the right decision. Just go with your feelings mate. Don't take any notice of the negative replies, as they will only sew seeds of doubt, and you don't need any more confusion..Right ??

[Thanh-BKK]

@PeaceBlondie

Sadly i still didn't have the chance to get to know you personally. But as you probably know i am pretty much in the same situation as you - apart from the fact that you are (possibly?) old enough to get a retirement visa (i'm 20 years too young for that) and that you have a university degree which makes it easy to get legal work (i do NOT have a university degree).

Apart from that i too live with a partner of the same sex whom i can't marry here, can't get any form of legal work, find it difficult to learn the language and have some problems with the food, especially the very spicy kind. HOWEVER...........

"Learning the language" is best, altough slow, done by actually speaking it. You will sure get things wrong, that's part of the process. But as for me (and the lazy bastard that i am) i am able to order food, ask prices or directions, and have simple conversations in Thai. If you want "not spicy" food, just say "mai pet", that does the trick I myself would never have the patience for sitting in a class room and studying the language...... but having thai friends helps greatly

About the work situation, i have no pension or other income from my home country so i DO work here....... somehow food must get onto the table. There are possibilities and keeping a low profile helps. I do not encourage doing illegal things but if they (i.e. government with it's artficially high requirements for work permits) leave me no other choice? But i don't sell drugs or teach English (as i am REALLY not qualified for that, even tough i think i can speak English better than some "English teachers" that i know).

Oh, and by the way i also don't chat with taxi drivers - they first ask me where i come from, and as soon as i mention "Germany" they start talking about football, Mercedes Benz and Adolf Hitler. All things about which i know nothing and am not interested in. I anyway take taxis rarely - having an own car AND a motorbike takes care of my transportation

But as soon as immigration makes it impossible for me to stay here (i.e. obtain a B-Visa at least) i too will have to leave..... but not without my boyfriend, and since i can't bring him to MY country for the same BS reasons (money, money, money... oh, and $$) there are very limited options, for me it would be Vietnam (as i speak vietnamese) but he would not want to go there.... and Malaysia.

Best regards.....

Thanh

[meom]

You've got plenty of reasons to leave so I'm wondering what kept you here this long in the first place?

[onethailand]

You've got plenty of reasons to leave so I'm wondering what kept you here this long in the first place?

PB obviously had reasons to stay as well - otherwise he wouldn't have asked the question, he would've just said goodbye.

Like I said - the food shouldn't be a big reason unless you are upcountry in rural areas. Not hard to find something else to eat, but I guess being in Bangkok is an advantage.

Whatever you decide, there's no reason to make any decision permanent. You can stay or go later, or you can go and come back later. Just follow your own desires wherever they may take you.

[sabaijai]

If you have doubts sufficient enough to vocalize them, then they are real enough to demand attention. even if you decide to stick it our a few months, those doubts will come back. Time for a break as other contributors advise.

Leaving Thailand doesn't necessarily mean a return to the "west", but you may wish to consider a place with less extremes in your environment. Places that come to mind are Panama & Costa Rica. In point form, here's what Costa Rica offers versus Thailand;

- less than 3hrs to Miami and from there, anywhere in the USA.

- Highest literacy rate in latin America @ 96%. Free highschool education.

- Locals as friendly as Thais.

- Lower residency financial requirements

- Easier to get permanent residency (2 yrs.). With that you can get a job. Even without a job, you an operate a business with less paperwork than in Thailand.

- Comparable cost of living

- Predominately "middle class" with less extremes in poverty.

- Government tuned into the needs and requirements of foreign residents.

- The army was abolished

- Corruption is not as stifling

- Robust spirit of democracy and a free press

- Massive tourism industry which government protects and invests in.

- Water and electricity supplies are reliable.

- Environmental protection is a priority and a source of national pride

- Boasts a stong Chinese, Indian and European presence that goes back over a century

- A diversity of food and customs that will leave you with a spoilt palate.

- No religious strife. No one is running around beheading anyone.

- Best of all, one of thebest community health networks in Latin America.

A social service network that provides effective health care, education and pensions. It's health care system exceeds some european nations and regions in North America.

Costa Rica is what Thailand could have been had the Thai government chosen a different root for development. In Costa Rica, its actions, not empty slogans.

Bet you can tell where I'm headed eventually.

Agree with many points, but all in all CR lacks the cultural diversity Thailand has. By comparison, CR feels rather monotonous. Esp the food. People are not as friendly either, and I don't think personal security is comparable with Thailand. No place in Thailand, for example, is as hairy as Puerto Limon. Higher cost of living, nearly double.