Hydroponic Farming

[rice555]

Hello guyshown, do you mean Chinese Kale? From your question you have been yahoo/googling about the type of system you have chosen and should be able to find your answers there.

All your answers are showing or given in the links provided in this thread, except your system.

1.picture of it growing in an DFT system and a picture of root size(they are trimed a bit, but you can use other leaf vegetables as ballpark info, they show that when lifting up the floating board)

2. nutrients, its easier to buy nutrients than try to make them if you are just starting, also 1 less problem on the learning curve. MOST all nutrients are from the ingredients, only changed to the crop grown. My first tomatoes were grown in lettuce nutrients because lettuce nut's were all ACK had at the time.

3. Buy a EC meter!

LOOK!!!!! http://en.bangsaiagro.com/Soilless_culture_Tour4.asp

you may find answers here? http://www.hydroponicsearch.com/

Papaya like I said! http://www.greenroofs.com/archives/gf_nov-dec05.htm

If you still want to make nut's, the only place I've found micronutrients is in Singapore, all the rest you can buy at ag stores and chem supply stores, I did in Korat.

If someone know where to get micro-nuts in LOS, please post info. Yes I know Bangsai has it listed, but do not have.

rice555

[guyshown]

rice555 thanks for the advice and the links. I will check about the ec meter- have been real busy the few days so have not had much time to spend on the pc or time to research things should slow down in a few days and will get back into it. Im not sure of the english name of Pak Ka naa it could be chinnese kale

thanks again

guyshown

[kbvicar]

[quote name='rice555'

Hi GreenHydroponics Farm in Trat 02-337-6640 .

Netafim sells green house & hydro systems. Accent/ACK/Fresh Garden

sell NTF systems. Dutch Greenery (I think from my e-mails) does mostly rockwool slabs and perlite buckets with the strawberry. Chia Tai parent Co does G-Houses and they do sell cocopeat/bags.

rice555

Hi rice555

Thanks for all that info^^^. I'm just getting set up and have made some purchases from Bangsai and ACK both.

Do you have contact info/ email for Chia Tai (parent Co) and Netafim for the greenhouses and cocopeat/bags. Rainy season is approaching and I'm getting weary from washing all the salty coco from the garden shops. Thanks

[rice555]

Hello kbvicar. Chia Tia's ; www.chiataigroup.com , you should be able to get contact info, they may work with/through Netafim??

Netafim, the names i have Ukit Thongnum as Greenhouse Projects Manager [email protected]

Netafim 02-2717-8167 I have his cell as 1 8072801, but this off an old business card when they were on the 5th floor, this address was given before on one thread and they had been moved behind the building to the far L/H corner of the parking lot some year and a half earlier now going on 3 years, they just changed their address in Thai ag magazines about 4 months back.

Also give ATC a call, they are the main Naan Dan and Met and do large ag projects like Netafim. 117/92 Moo 10, Ladprao Wang-Hin Rd. Ladprao. BKK 10230 www.atc1993.com 2-931-7700.

I don't know the amount you need, but they may not sell small quantities, it might not be a bad idea to see if the other places may now stock it.

C-T shows syrefoam<sp> plug trays for sell, you have to order 100, one of the seed stores here will order for me. At the C-T seed store in BKK across the street from the business offices doesn't sell them. but has the best selection of the (square plug) black trays.

It dated, but a good read. http://www.usu.edu/cpl/PDF/CoconutCoirPaper.pdf

and do you do this?? http://www.vgrove.com/support/growbags.html

What are you growing now?? rice555

[rice555]

Hello steveheigh, of the 4 places in BKK I listed, I would "not miss" Accent and Bangsai. NTF and DTF, the two main salad players, the two places are working farms and you can walk around and look, more English friendly. At A you can see the pumps and meters/doser and back up system.(pump) At B, they show us around, from seeding to final packaging, their units would be good size/space for a nursery(between sprouting and final planting), they have the small net cups/foam cubes.(no perlite to buy)

ACK you go through a guard shack to sign in, don't really have a store that you can go through, all you can see is a NTF system in big connected net houses. I was there on 2 4 08 to pick up some nutrients, sat on the front porch of the office waiting for them to return form lunch and took a picture. This week it dawned on me something was different, the removed all the big end vent fans, I'm slow on the up take sometimes. I don't know if this was to save $electric$ or they used them at there new farm. The sales girl's I have contact with when there is about 100 words English which goes with my 200 words Thai.

Fresh Gardens off Suk, about 1/2 mile down on the L/H side next to the rugrat school. Close to BTS station and is a nice shop/store with small hobby to small grower systems to look at.(they can be expanded)

Most lettuce seed is imported, it is much easier to handle pelleted seed than non-pelleted seed. If you look at one of the last pictures I posted on the tomato thread, you can just make out the corner of my friends NTF system made from 2.5" white PVC.

The small net pot with the cube is cleaner and saves space and easier to keep your product clean till sale.

At one of the 2 stores that sell hydro here, they still are rooted in the net pot, and cut at time of sales, the green cup and the perlite is trshed.

rice555

[kbvicar]

Hello rice

The Chia Tai website is not very helpful and ATC is under construction. I think Netafim will have what I need.I'll try the phone #s tomorrow.

The Utah study was interesting but really didn't tell me anything I don't already know lol. We would love to grow in coco slabs but need to rob a few more banks to afford the shipping costs from Oz ...hence the questions re coco coir. We hope to do lettuce, tomatoes, cucumbers and rock melons. Thanks for the info.

[rice555]

Hello kvbicar, have you tried just cubed husk? It has worked well for me also, I don't know if this is goes through a wash as this is not a byproduct like coir. but used to grow plants. I will try to find out about a place close to Phi Mai that was setting up a small mill.

C-T's web site(seed part) has not workes for over a year or more. The seed store has vegetable netting, I've used it for cucks and long beans, it's 24cm X H1.8m X L18m and one about 60M long.

This the only place I've found that sells a full range of micro-nutrients, I'm still looking here also for white poly bags, a store downtown where I buy supplies gave me 30kilo mag of the white bags as nobody had bought any. Most of them are brittle and break and are now useless for growing. http://singaporehydroponics.com

rice555

[kbvicar]

Hi rice

I like that Singapore site, thanks. It sounds like Netafim has what I want--Khun Ukit is out today but will call.

Cubed husks like in the orchid-growing media??? If thats what you mean, no, haven't tried it.

If you are looking for micronutes I found some at Thai Dairy Farm 02 618 3668 Khun Wasana. She's at Jatajak Market. She seems to have everything or can get it. These have worked well with tomatoes, corn and melons:

[rice555]

Hello kbvicar, yes the orchid kind. It worked very well.

Hydro melons here at The Mall Korat are going for 99B@kilo. Thanks for the info, will be down there next month.

rice555

[rice555]

Hello kbvicar, this the cubed coconut husk. Plants ready to be moved to growing area.

rice555

[kbvicar]

Rice

Those chunks look nice and uniform. What size are they...??? About 1.5 cm x 1.5 cm is what I'm after. I reckon those chunks mixed 50% with the fine coir dust would be ideal.

This stuff is LOADED with salt and takes a weeks soaking to be usable:

[rice555]

Hello kbvicar, you could go to any "big" market that husk's whole coconuts for cream and buy the pieces, next is buy a chipper and make your own. If you read the thread about small tillers?? the same company makes chippers that work very good, saw one in action at the ag show in Korat a few weeks back. You can use anything from dust to 1" pieces, it doesn't need to be uniform size, if you want perfection, get rockwool. Or you could get a few people to chop the large pieces to small pieces for a quick fix to keep moving forward.

rice555

[kbvicar]

That sounds like way too much work for this fella. Where did you find your pieces???

I've seen them ages ago but can't remember where now. I don't mind flushing them because I've got to treat the coir dust anyway.

[rice555]

Hello kbvicar, most all the garden(nursery's) stores I go to have both powder and pieces, same price. The price before was Bt80, this was 4-5 month's back, it's most likely more now.

Some pictures I've seen of tomatoes and things growing here, the plant is in a smaller bag maybe 3"X3" which looks like coir and is planted in a 8"X8" with pieces.

I start my plants in a mix of good tray substrate and coir, and plant directly to coir, cubed or mix, sometimes mixed with rice hulls.

Japan sponsored a test here(LOS) and a mix coir, rice hulls and sand did better than coir by it's self. They were doing tomatoes.

rice555

[kbvicar]

Hi rice

I hear what you're saying about the chunks. We start our shoots in coco but have found the dust holds too much water and the large chunks don't retain enough. I'm working on getting some smaller chunks to resolve those issues.

Khun Ukit from Netafim called me and he only has large commercial greenhouses so I'm back to square one with that prob. Do you have any info who has greenhouses for sale??? Say maybe 3 x 3 meters...

[rice555]

Hello kbvicar, this a picture of 2 different media types being used. You can find it here; http://www.kmitl.ac.th/hydro/Visitfarm/Lanna.htm

About a greenhouse, try Bangsai<sp> as they have someone bend up there frames for there system, the may also make other agro related parts. The other place that might sell them or have a contact for is ACK, the have a 4X6M demo/research GH. Most all use plastic "C"-clips to hold the covering on. Super Products has the clips, 1/2", 3/4" and 1".

You could also check out a local tent/awning shop as they may be able to bend and weld up the trusses and ends, or any shop that makes the portable displays racks for street vendors.

Sorry for the bad picture, this is off an ACK flyer and shows the GH I'm talking about.

rice555

[kbvicar]

Hi rice

Sorry for late reply, just returned from an offshore job.. Gonna check out your info today. Thanks. I've got the coco chips and dust sourced now...waiting on delivery. How did it go with the micronutes??? Did Khun Wasana help ya out???

[rice555]

Hello kbvicar, how much per bag on the coco? The last time I paid Bt 80 per big bag for both kinds.

I will be going to ACK this Fri(4-4) for nutrients, need some pictures of their small GH? I find myself running behind and will have to put home made nutes to a later date. I've got 1 Rai dirt here at the house to transplant and 2 more at the farm to run LDPE and drip tape.

My hydro at the house will be some melons and some "Bhut Jolokia" and some NuMex Sandia. Hydro melons at The Mall Korat are going for 99@K, if you can get 1/4 that price, it sure beats selling watermelons for 10B each off the back of a pickup.

rice555

[kbvicar]

Hi rice

I paid the same for the unwashed coir. A new shop in Chantaburi promises clean coc fo 100 baht a bag... worth it to me if it's clean. Greenhouse pics would be great -- ACK sent me info on everything BUT greenhouses.

Khun Wasana sells "store-bought" nutes and she's shipped to me in Koh Chang...call her if you want. Thanks & good luck.

[rice555]

Hello kbvicar, the new issue of House Agriculture Magazine on the stands now, Chia Tai has an add for a 1.8mX2.4m "gardening greenhouse", coming soon. Give them a call;02 813 4586. Will take pictures tomorrow at ACK, maybe have some on sat night.

rice555

[kbvicar]

Hi rice

I was looking for a greenhouse 2 or 3 times that size...Have a good trip and lemme know what you found.

Are they (ACK) gonna have your nutes???

edit: Please ask ACK if they have wormcastings or know where to get them..Last week the girl I spoke to didn't have a clue... .thanks

[rice555]

Hello kbvicar, due to the light show, fan, H2O and no juice,(big storm last night around Korat) I'll tell you what info I got at ACK on GH's. We talked with Sales Rep. Khun Kanueng Noppornpitak, P/N 02 333 1125 ext. 154, Mobile 084 006 0900, e-mail [email protected] . She's the one to call or @ for info or to order accessories and nutrients. Khun Moo(Kanueng) gave me card for Sales Executive Khun Yuttaphong Chirasirichote, design & construction of mini and commercial greenhouse, consulting services for hydroponics growers. P/N 02 333 1125 Ext, 153

Mobile 084 422 3139. e-mail [email protected]

I don't know if they sent you a printed sheet "Accessories", has 3 pictures, #1 is the small GH when it was when it was in the parking lot in front of the office R/H side. #2 is the same GH now moved to the L/H side of the office, now as an evap GH. #3 is of one of the large gutter connected net-houses.

The attached pictures #1. inside the small epap-GH showind 2 NTF and 1 DFT system with alum-a-net shade cloth. #2. part of the top & side wall film covering, butter head in a NTF. #3. end wall with 1 of the evap pads, feed lined to a NFT. #4. NTF with ??, I'm not a lettuce grower, the door and frame, 2 of the exhaust fans. #5 more of the door and frame, EC panel. #6. Some run-to-wast systems to the L/H of the small GH, next to 1 of the large evap-houses. You open the valve at the tank to water 3-4 times a day, I do the same thing with a watering can, I need to switch and one day to timer and pump. #7. some more run to waste systems, I've seen them grow cucumbers, sweet pepper's and tomatoes with these systems also in the small GH.

No worm castings in hydroponics that I know of, only OG gardening, try the Thai OG magazine is all I can suggest. They had my Nutrients, but I didn't ask about Micro Nutrients, thats on hold now till I get my well cleaned out to see where things go.

rice555 ATTN. TONY, try the sales EX at ACK, can't use PM's

[kbvicar]

HI rice

Thanks for all that info. I'm calling ACK today -- sure sounds like they can fix me up. And no, they didn't send me the "accessories" brochure but I'll get it this time. Thanks

[BobbyCullen]

Hi Rice,

Looking through this thread you seem to be the font of all knowledge re hydroponics and to have been extreamly helpful to all who have asked. I see you live in Korat so could you please advise the addressses of suppliers in Korat. I am in Ban Pai and just setting up - have stuff on order from Bangsai but their delivery is very slow!

I am looking for nutrient solution/mix (one lot rather than Bangsai"s A& and also growing medium. By builder supplier assures me that her sand is river sand so shall try that in one bed in the (very) hothouse for tomatoes, but would be more interested in something a little less solid!

All best Wishes

[rice555]

Hello Bobby Cullen, the media is all I get in Korat, mostly at a small nursery along the Hwy. going E towards the Korat Airport, about 3K after you turn L at the Y junction on the E side of town. If you go straight you will soon be hit with the foul smell of drying tapioca and starch production and the you come to Do Home, you went the wrong way. Do Home has good price on dripers, drip stakes and other irrigation things at a low price.

All the nutrients I've ran across in LOS are 2 part, A-B and tomatoes and pepper's use Grow A-B and Bloom/Flower/Fruit A-B, back in the US and OZ you can get a one bottle mix. If you want to use regular fertilizer do a google on "Scotts Miricle Grow hydroponics" of something like that with the correct spelling.

All the nutrients I have used the past 6 years are from ACK, I have no real complaints. If you go back a few posts I talked about the sales rep., call her and tell her what you want and you want her to mail it to you. She will give you a price+mailing cost(should still be BKK-Korat for 5L kit B100. to mail), I get the dry mix, the have 5L. & 10L. kits, you can get more, but 5-10 is easy to mail. After you make your order they will give you a bank account # to deposit the amount and then Fax them a copy of the deposit slip and they will then process you order. Order on mon early and you should have before fri.

The place in CM I listed also sales A-B nutrients.

I'm growing a few chilies now and and ran out of Grow and have just been using Bloom. I'm also trying using a small bag with a coir-perlite mix and pieces in the bucket. Their was a picture in another post with this type of setup. Being the wet part of the year and having too many irons in the fire, I am happy with this set up, oh, I water 3 times a day.

Pictures are of: a modified poly bag, watering plants, close up of Bhut Jolokia starting to blossom(if you have to ask what it is, you ain't a "HOT" eater), as it looked today(the bamboo poles are to try to keep the 4 cats out)

rice555

[Smithson]

I did hydroponics as a hobby years ago and really enjoyed it. Now I have a property and am doing some organic gardening. There's a heap of large diameter bamboo growing and I was thinking about using this together with coco husks and nutrient from worm castings in a hydro system.

I realize because the materials used aren't inert it's not true hydroponics, but still think I could get good growth rates with practice.

It would be for fun, rather than business and set up costs would be very low. I'd be interested to hear others thoughts on this idea.

[BobbyCullen]

Hi Rice 555,

Many thanks fot that - I have to go to Korat on mOnday for 90 days report so shall try to find them. The other day I got a set of DVDs from the States on simplified hydroponics - very interesting and simple for those of use who have forgotten most of our chemistry! I'll burn you a set if you like - just email me an address to send them to @ [email protected]

Best Wishes

[desbo]

I am looking at setting up a small hydroponic farm on about 1.5 rai of land, just outside Pattaya. Would appreciate any advice or information from members as to where I can buy the necessary equipment for this and any tips you may have.

I am in Australia and visit Bangkok regular. I know the Hyroponics well and have contacts here for equipement etc.. There are many business's here selling to large supermarkets. You can PM me.

[rice555]

Hello Smithson, after seeing the video's from BobbyCullen I see at what your looking at. The video's has a part about Cuba and their use of worm castings in their form of hydroponics. Most of the media in other systems were 50/50 rice hulls and sand, and used inorganic nutrients.

With the worm castings, it took 3 times the area to grow the same amount, and longer than inorganic nutrients growing the same crop. They also go into O-G crop protection. In fact, I was going to post to Licky's mealy bug problem and the video's covered "the bug" and ants spreading them. We use to use Tanglefoot, a safe product without poison. I will check if the place I shop has anything like it. It's a sticky stuff you but a band/bead/swath around around the trunk/stem/post and acts as a sticky trap. I have a small can of rat trap sticky which is too thick to spread ease, so will try to thin with rubbing alcohol after it stops raining a day.

After watching the video's I looked for there www. http://www.carbon.org/ and also ran across this site for a online calculator for nutrient formulation.(inorganic) http://www.hal-pc.org/~menendez/hydrocal.html

While still in google mode, I ran back across the regular fertilizer(water soluble) and epsom salts. It was Petters fertilize, not Scotts brand. http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/hs184 UofF has a lot on hydro on its site.

Sorry for the OT stuff. The tomato's that have worked best here in LOS are from U of F.

rice555 PS it goes into how Cuba started its worm farming.

[rice555]

Hello All,

I've been looking for 'micro-nutrients' in bulk(1Kg) for a while and ran across a place in BKK that sells 3 different brands of premix-micros. Mixes have a the trace elements(7) packaged together, instead of having to mix 7 different elements, you have 1 box of premix. If you need to adjust the amount 'iron', you can buy just a box of iron to add. 1Kg costs less than B500. Rexolin APN.

The first picture is from a few years back, This is a chemical/medical supply store in downtown Korat, They gave the price and the country of origin. What I've used www.hydro-gardens.com , as a info and price ref.

When you go to 99% of hydro sites to look for info, or for single chemicals, they just throw a bunch of A-B mix products, not make your own. At the time I started looking, you could only get nutrients for lettuce, that is what started the hunt. You can now get tomato, pepper, cucumber, lettuce and melon maybe more??

Having 3 times bought lettuce-nutrients to grow tomatoes, you can see the difference it makes to have the proper nutrients.

I talked to Khun Veerapol at Wesco, and in his e-mail: "Wesco make special pack for hobby hydroponics growers comprise completed dry A and B fertilizers which can make final liquid solution about 10,000 lts at 2500 baht per packing (or stock A 100 lts Stock B 100 lts at 1:100 concentration). Normally, we sell all fertilizer in 25 kg original bag from oversea supplies."

This sounds like it's for lettuce/greens. and is a "low price", for me to buy 10K liter's of dry A-B tomato nutrients from ACK would cost B16,000.He also said they supplied several hydro Co's, ACK's name came up.

They packed and COD'ed my order here to Korat the same day. Now if it made it on a truck to get here, thats another thing. Sure is quite with the truck strike.

WESCO CHEMICALS (THAILAND) CO.,LTD. HAIFA CHEMICALS LTD. ROTEM AMFERT NEGEV LTD.

9/40 Ladprao Soi 71

Ladprao Rd.

Bangkok 10310

Tel : 02-539-9003 Fax : 02-538-4609

[email protected]

While on looking up one of the premix micro's from Cibi, I came across this link: http://www.howardresh.com/home.html

I've read a couple of his books years back, but the links for lettuce has some good pictures, I like the 3rd page the best, now I can go back and read the whole story.

Muskmelons are my next crop to try,but without the green house like in the picture.

rice555