Mai Ped Versus "not At All Spicy"

[edwardandtubs]

Everyone knows that "mai ped" is supposed to mean "not spicy" but when buying som tam from a street seller it seems to mean "not very spicy" so they still put in the teaspoon of dried chili and sometimes they even include one fresh chili. I think to Thais "som tam mai ped" means "papaya salad made according to the usual spicy recipe but with only one chili added". What I actually want to ask for is som tam with no added chili at all, or not at all spicy. I usually have to wave my hands around in front of the bowl of dried chili shaking my head to get it the way I want but I feel like a tool so there must be a better way.

[KhaoNiaw]

What I actually want to ask for is som tam with no added chili at all, or not at all spicy. I feel like a tool .

Just kidding. But hardly surprising they don't get it. Somtam with no chili at all . That's not somtam. There's probably nothing you can say just one time. Try "mai sai prik". Receive look of disbelief and repeat.

Actually, my wife used to do it for my daughter when she was younger but once she reached her teens, she started taking with chilis.

Edited November 20, 2007 by KhaoNiaw

[edwardandtubs]

You still get a mild taste of chili because it sticks to the mortar and pestle, even if it's washed. Places like the Carrefour food court serve it to me with no chili at all if I ask for it "mai ped". My favourite street seller "gets it" that white face = no chili. Served that way it's my favourite dish in Thailand. I'm sure more westerners would eat it if they tried it that way.

You say som tam served with no chili is not somtam but I believe that's the way they serve it in Laos which is where it comes from?

Edited November 20, 2007 by edwardandtubs

[KhaoNiaw]

You say som tam served with no chili is not somtam but I believe that's the way they serve it in Laos which is where it comes from?

I've no idea about that. There are certainly many regional and local varieties so I wouldn't be surprised if there are chili-less versions.

Anyway, I was just joshing - I can't imagine the wife ever contemplating making somtam without the chili.

Seriously, try the 'mai sai prik' phrase.

[pete_r]

I'm with KhaoNiaw, "Mai sai prik" (don't put chilli), is the way to go.

[edwardandtubs]

You say som tam served with no chili is not somtam but I believe that's the way they serve it in Laos which is where it comes from?

I've no idea about that. There are certainly many regional and local varieties so I wouldn't be surprised if there are chili-less versions.

Anyway, I was just joshing - I can't imagine the wife ever contemplating making somtam without the chili.

Seriously, try the 'mai sai prik' phrase.

Thanks I will, even if it makes me feel like a prik instead of a tool.

Edited November 20, 2007 by edwardandtubs

[stateman]

I'm with KhaoNiaw, "Mai sai prik" (don't put chilli), is the way to go.

I think that is a good one to say.

You can also try "Mai au Ped" (don't want it hot). Can then add "Mai sai prik" to confirm.

The way the OP said "Mai Ped" is the Thai way of maknig an affirmative statement that "(it is) not hot". Being a people who routinely eat hot food, 100% of the vendor hearing that phrase would add more pepper. So the OP's statement has the opposite effect from what was intended.

[edwardandtubs]

That worked a lot better. I asked my local som tam seller for som tam "my sigh prick" and she replied "my sigh prick, loy?" She might have thought the request was a bit weird because she proceeded to go through all the ingredients to check I wanted them included, which was a thoughtful if a bit unnecessary. I got it the way I wanted though.

[sbk]

Gin phed mai dai would also work (I can not eat spicy food).

[gburns57au]

You can also try...."Mai chai ped"....that will emphasise that you dont want it too hot.

[p_brownstone]

The way the OP said "Mai Ped" is the Thai way of maknig an affirmative statement that "(it is) not hot". Being a people who routinely eat hot food, 100% of the vendor hearing that phrase would add more pepper. So the OP's statement has the opposite effect from what was intended.

Not wanting to get into a discourse on how tense can change a Statement but "mai pet" can encompass various tenses in Thai.

Yes, it would translate as "(it is) not spicy" if you are actually eating the dish at that precise moment.

However it is equally translatable as "I do not want it (to be) Spicy" if you are ordering the food for later consumption.

On a more practical note, when ordering food, to say "mai pet" or "mai ow pet" (I would personally say "mai dongarn pet" but that's just my own idiosyncrasy) simply means "I don't want it to be spicy" and therefore, obviously, leaves the level of spiciness up to the cook - and she will invariably use her own idea of what is spicy as a benchmark and just ratchet it down a notch or two in deference to the Farang request. You have no way of knowing what she considers "Pet" so what you end up with could be way outside your own idea of what is reasonable!

"Mai Sai Prik" is definitely the thing to say if you are really concerned - you can always add Chilli later if it's too bland.

Patrick

Edited November 21, 2007 by p_brownstone

[DavidHouston]

Seriously, try the 'mai sai prik' phrase.

Folks, I have a question:

If you say, "mai sai prik", aren't there a number of Thai dishes which are hot by means other than adding peppers during the cooking process? I am thinking for example of the almost infinite variety of "kaeng"s, prepared both with coconut oil and without (แกงป่า) . Also, in this category are some varieties of sausage.

Be careful when ordering!

[H2oDunc]

And theres me with the opposite problem. Whenever I go o a som tam stall that doesnt know me they do it with little or no chillis. No good. If I get a Thai to go for me its lovely, nice and hot. Getting them to realise farang can eat spicy takes a while.

[percy2]

Seriously, try the 'mai sai prik' phrase.

Folks, I have a question:

If you say, "mai sai prik", aren't there a number of Thai dishes which are hot by means other than adding peppers during the cooking process?

Pepper is known as Prik Thai

I would personally say "mai dongarn pet" but that's just my own idiosyncrasy) simply means "I don't want it to be spicy"

"mai dongarn pet" would actually be "I don't need spicy"

Cheers

[meadish_sweetball]

ต้องการ tawngkaan can be translated as 'to need', but it is also a more polite synonym for เอา ao.

[meadish_sweetball]

Seriously, try the 'mai sai prik' phrase.

Folks, I have a question:

If you say, "mai sai prik", aren't there a number of Thai dishes which are hot by means other than adding peppers during the cooking process? I am thinking for example of the almost infinite variety of "kaeng"s, prepared both with coconut oil and without (แกงป่า) . Also, in this category are some varieties of sausage.

Be careful when ordering!

Yes - in those cases there is no way of avoiding the spiciness apart from abstaining altogether. For people who cannot tolerate anything spicy whatsoever, the bottom line is 'never try to order something you are not already familiar with unless you can ask the staff if it is spicy or not and understand the answer'.

อันนี้เผ็ดไหมคะ/ครับ 'an nii phed mai kha/khrap'

[PeaceBlondie]

I waited for many responses before commenting, because this was precisely a question I asked years ago on ThaiVisa, a question vital to my attempts to eat Thai food. If you check the topic, I doubt mai sai prik was exactly mentioned. And here, there's some doubt as to whether vendors or waitresses will understand "absolutely no spices or spicyness at all."

I cannot eat anything spicy, except a few easily pronounced kinds of Mexican food, easily ordered in Texas or Mexico, in English or Spanish. Cannot, will not, do not eat spicy Thai food. Long ago, in south and north and central Thailand, I lost any patience or ability to communicate this. They do not understand, when told in their own dialect, what I mean, so forget it. Sapalote (ba'ka'naht), tang mo (ba'tao), pomelo (som oh), longan (lamyai), and kaow phat gai (however spelled or pronounced, usually after three times) - that's all I can put in my mouth. Sorry; no offense intended.

Thai cooks understand that most farang can only eat some of the fires of Hel-, and Thais can eat Hades all day long. Their cuisine and cooking methods seem to include so many fiery ingredients in the chillies and the sauces that they couldn't remove them if they tried. Nice country, lovely people, difficult language, impossible food. Enjoy.

///Added later: Okay, I found the old topic http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?sh...mp;hl=Hot+spicy

And I'm mistaken. Several posters did say to say "mai sai prik" or something similar, and I only started telling the vendors "mai prik." I don't normally discuss my genitals, but.... Mai Sai sounds like the border town opposite Tachilek. Anyway, I'm also convinced that in context, when a waitress hears a farang mangling the language, she'll assume I'm getting the vowel tones wrong, even if I wasn't. And somebody suggested chicken and cashew nuts - precisely what almost had me throwing my plate on the floor on the southern train, the openair restaurant in Hua Hin, and an S&P restaurant! That convinced me it's impossible. Besides, there are coconut and ginger and garlic flavors I don't like, either; they nauseate me.

[mangkorn]

I think you could also say "yaa sai prik na ka/khrab."

As for พริกไทย, that's pepper from peppercorns (black or white), not chile peppers.

But the real question is: how many pickled peppers did Peter Piper pick?

[edwardandtubs]

And somebody suggested chicken and cashew nuts - precisely what almost had me throwing my plate on the floor on the southern train, the openair restaurant in Hua Hin, and an S&P restaurant! That convinced me it's impossible. Besides, there are coconut and ginger and garlic flavors I don't like, either; they nauseate me.

So you're the westerner I see when I walk past KFC.

[meadish_sweetball]

Mai Sai sounds like the border town opposite Tachilek.

I guess it could work as a mnemonic in which case it is all good, but I still have to pick nits here - the pronunciation is quite different even if you disregard the tones. A lot of expats pronounce the name of the town like 'My Sy' but that ain't the way it should sound.

แม่สาย [F]mae: [R]saai is the name of the town. Note both vowel sounds should be loooong. The first syllable is not 'mai' as in 'no, not' which sounds close to 'My' in English. It is แม่ as in 'mother'... the same prefix is in many other place names in the North, generally romanized as 'Mae'.. but the 'ae' fools people into thinking of a vowel glide from /a/ to /e/... In reality it represents a constant vowel with a quality in between /a/ and /e/.

The first word in the border town's name is 'mae' as in close to the RP English pronunciation of 'air' (bar the posh glide into schwa)...

Think of how you would mimic a goat or sheep bleating, or the vowel sound a newborn baby would make when screaming.

That's approximately the vowel quality.

ไม่ 'mai' on the other hand, is a vowel glide (diphthong).

and ใส่ meaning 'to put' has the same vowel sound as ไม่ 'mai', although the tone is low.

[PeaceBlondie]

Now, Meadish (we've had this conversation in person; it's all in fun ), that's part of my point about ordering Thai food in Thai language when I don't speak the language. Any time I try to say a single syllable word starting with m and continuing in a, I don't know whether I'm calling the waitress a mother, a horse, or a dog. So, it's no wonder that the poor dears have no idea what I'm ordering! And they have every bit as much right to insist on pronunciational purity as a meatball from Sweden has! Besides, I don't know how proper Brits speaking Her Majesty's Ainglish pronounce 'air' with or without a posh schwa, and I know a schwa from a Swede!

[p_brownstone]

Seriously, try the 'mai sai prik' phrase.

Folks, I have a question:

If you say, "mai sai prik", aren't there a number of Thai dishes which are hot by means other than adding peppers during the cooking process? I am thinking for example of the almost infinite variety of "kaeng"s, prepared both with coconut oil and without (แกงป่า) . Also, in this category are some varieties of sausage.

Be careful when ordering!

With “Kaengs”, sausage (such as Sai Ua) etc., you’re usually wasting time to ask for it to be “mai pet” since the stuff is cooked in large batches and you just have to take pot luck (pun intended!).

My personal hate in Thai food is sugar, lashings of which are apparently essential to satisfy modern taste in most dishes – even simple Noodles, but here again it’s a waste of time for me to say “mai sai nam tarn” because the liquid in which the Noodles are cooked is, in most cases, already chock full of sugar. Even if you order “haeng” – i.e. without the soup, the Noodles are still heated in the sugary broth before serving and arrive coated with syrup. (OK, there I exaggerate, but I really hate that sugar!!).

Patrick

[meadish_sweetball]

Even if you order "haeng" – i.e. without the soup, the Noodles are still heated in the sugary broth before serving and arrive coated with syrup. (OK, there I exaggerate, but I really hate that sugar!!).

Agreed, that's my pet hate as well.

[stateman]

Even if you order "haeng" – i.e. without the soup, the Noodles are still heated in the sugary broth before serving and arrive coated with syrup. (OK, there I exaggerate, but I really hate that sugar!!).

Agreed, that's my pet hate as well.

I too share the feeling.

However the complaints among Thais which I read in the media is msg - not sugar! No longer laced in sugar, but dumped with msg! Some posters watch with grave concern the vendors dumping msg. It is said that even peeled fruits and desserts now use msg.

If true, I wonder what the effect on health will be.

Someone said Japan bans the sale of msg, but freely export them. They even open factory in Thailand.

[JaiDamJungLoei]

In Japan MSG is sold everywhere, When I was working in Narita I found it hard to buy restaurant food without MSG. A lot of Japanese people sprinkle it on veggies and fruit, both fresh and cooked, to eat as a snack. Aji-No-Moto (sp?) brand is made by the Japanese company that first invented a method to artificially make MSG.

Asian people have been extracting MSG from fish for more than 2000 years. I don't there is too much of a health risk from it. Except for me, it acts like an amphetamine, much more powerful than caffeine.

MSG is my big complaint with som tum, and Asian food in general. When my wife makes som tum she takes out some for me before she puts in the MSG. Watching street vendors make som tum, they generally put in more MSG than sugar.

As for chili: I can't believe anyone would not want spicy som tum! If I'm not leaking from every facial orifice and writhing on the ground in pain after the fifth bite, it's not any good. It's a very strange dish, I have not yet found another food that I'll put up with pain to eat. I've tried less spicy and not spicy som tum, it just doesn't taste as good.

Some advice: Quite often when I'm in Isaan, I see friends, family and some vendors/restaurants use home made crab sauce in som tum. If you eat this, take worn medicine regularly. The sauce is made from river crabs, and fermenting of the sauce does not kill any worms that may be in the crabs. Most of the Isaan people I know get anti worm medication at a pharmacy and take it every few months.

[phibunmike]

MSG is my big complaint with som tum, and Asian food in general. When my wife makes som tum she takes out some for me before she puts in the MSG. Watching street vendors make som tum, they generally put in more MSG than sugar.

I agree that MSG (ajin-no-moto, chu-lot) is very popular in Thailand. However I think it is a bigger risk in western food. At least in Thai and Chinese cooking it is consciously added, and you can ask for it not to be (mai sai chulot kap). But in western prepared (canned/bottled) foods and sauces, it is often present but disguised (as hydrolised vegetable protein, or something similar).

Cheers,

Mike

By the way, near me the crabs in som tam come from the rice fields - along with snails, rats, vegetables - a veritable larder !

[DavidHouston]

By the way, near me the crabs in som tam come from the rice fields - along with snails, rats, vegetables - a veritable larder !

You mean, "low-fat sources of protein", no?

[rgs2001uk]

MSG is my big complaint with som tum, and Asian food in general. When my wife makes som tum she takes out some for me before she puts in the MSG. Watching street vendors make som tum, they generally put in more MSG than sugar.

I agree that MSG (ajin-no-moto, chu-lot) is very popular in Thailand. However I think it is a bigger risk in western food. At least in Thai and Chinese cooking it is consciously added, and you can ask for it not to be (mai sai chulot kap). But in western prepared (canned/bottled) foods and sauces, it is often present but disguised (as hydrolised vegetable protein, or something similar).

Cheers,

Mike

By the way, near me the crabs in som tam come from the rice fields - along with snails, rats, vegetables - a veritable larder !

i always thought ayin no moto, was a brand name and the correct term for msg was pong chu rot tair.

i usually say mai sai pong chu rot as oppossed to mai sai ayin no moto.

waiting for the mighty ms to enlighten.

[meadish_sweetball]

I ain't so mighty really. Ask my wife.

You're right that pong chu rot is more correct. Due to Ajinomoto being the first brand of flavour enhancer on the Thai market though, many people still use 'ayinomoto' as a generic word and not only specifically to that brand...

Cf. kleenex, band-aid, velcro and even coke (in some states) that despite being brand names are used generically by many people.

[phibunmike]

I agree that MSG (ajin-no-moto, chu-lot) is very popular in Thailand. However I think it is a bigger risk in western food. At least in Thai and Chinese cooking it is consciously added, and you can ask for it not to be (mai sai chulot kap). But in western prepared (canned/bottled) foods and sauces, it is often present but disguised (as hydrolised vegetable protein, or something similar).

Cheers,

Mike

By the way, near me the crabs in som tam come from the rice fields - along with snails, rats, vegetables - a veritable larder !

i always thought ayin no moto, was a brand name and the correct term for msg was pong chu rot tair.

i usually say mai sai pong chu rot as oppossed to mai sai ayin no moto.

waiting for the mighty ms to enlighten.

Hmmm. I think the Isaan influence in my (very poor) Thai is showing again

edit> typo

Edited November 26, 2007 by phibunmike