Hot Water - Please!

[thaigene2]

I'm sure most expats living here have noticed how hot water in "most" places is non-existant except for the main bathroom (e.g. shower). Yes, I know the expensive condos have them - so pls don't post about how your bathroom in your 70,000 Baht per month pad has hot water in all 4 bathrooms, the maid's room and the kitchen!

But really - why don't Thais use hot water to clean anything?

There are armies of cleaners everywhere - mopping the floor at Tesco as you try to navigate them and the shelf-stackers (who seem oblivious to the fact they're in the way too), cleaning the toilets in big hotels, shopping malls, etc, etc.

But nothing ever seems to look very clean. Is this because they don't use hot water? I've noticed even in my own house where the same plastic dishes get washed over and over - but look really dirty after a while and I can only guess this is due to washing over and over with Sunlight and cold water. True? Not true? Ignorance? Cheapness? Laziness to go get some hot water (on my part perhaps too?)? Why isn't hot water a MUST HAVE in the kitchen at least? Even in Viet Nam there is hot water everywhere...Laos too (sometimes).

[majenta]

Yes I've noticed this after moving to BKK and there is hotwater in bathrooms except for the kitchen... Therefore my dishes and cutlery has a slight greasy feel to it...Noticeable only by me

as back home i exclusively use hot water only to wash the dishes.. Hot water is required to kill any bacteria and germs lingering...

[dave111223]

Hot water out of the average tap (that doesn't burn you) is not hot enough to kill germs anyway.

Edited November 20, 2007 by dave111223

[phutoie2]

Yep , plenty of hot water here!!

[Upcountry]

Unless your landlord won't allow it, you could install a hot water warmer/heater in your kitchen or bathroom sink if you want, right?

We have one in our kitchen. It definitely helps with greasy stuff, especially during the cool days or hours, and helps get things cleaner in general. We don't use it all the time, though. Usually the soap works well enough.

[thaigene2]

Unless your landlord won't allow it, you could install a hot water warmer/heater in your kitchen or bathroom sink if you want, right?

We have one in our kitchen. It definitely helps with greasy stuff, especially during the cool days or hours, and helps get things cleaner in general. We don't use it all the time, though. Usually the soap works well enough.

Yes correct. I could do that. But my question is 'why' donlt thais see this as a necessity when even 'poorer' neighbours do? Even pre-boom China has hot water in many, many public places...and in hotels etc routinely. I've stayed in so called boutique and 4 star joints in thailand with no hot water in the bathroom sink..It's funny in a way, they have all these fresheners and other things, but apparently after you take a dump you would then wash your hands in cold water..before raiding the mini-bar -- or worse -- before eating that little truffle they left on your pillow?

Edited November 20, 2007 by thaigene2

[bina]

lemon or vinegar cuts the grease, as do most detergents made for the country u are in;

we dont use hot water much either as we pay for electric and if we wash dishes, no hot water for showers; its actually a skilled job, washing dishes properly: good suds/detergent, washing each plate properly, rinsing in clean water, not just swishing the sponge over the plate and rinsing quickly. hot hot water is the only way to keep spots off your crystal though.

we use plastic plates but a good quality plastic, and have been handwashing for 22 years.

i find that my husband washes with a 'swish' but no real 'elbow power' put into the act and therefore everything does feel greasier. i use more scrubbing/pressure, things come out squeaky clean.

the thing is that plastic gets 'old' fast. unless u buy very good quality plastic, most people buy the cheapy stuff cause thats the point. its cheap. but it gets nasty faster.

hot water doesnt clean your hands any faster. i work with animals (salmonella, chlamydia, listeria, e.coli, u name it we could get it) and we wash between every set of animals or action with the animals. and its in 'freezing' bloody cold water, with liquid soap and paper towels. thats all. oh, and a fingernail brush. our hot water heater thingy blew up years ago, and for thw visitors we only have cold tap water. its the action of running water and liquid soap and lenghth of time u wash (10-15 minutes after touching turtles and things) that cleans ur hands. not bar of soap, not heat of water, but the running of water over the surface of your hands and clean liquid soap to slough off the accumulated stuff stuck on your skin.

oh. and those purell and other gel sterilizing things. well, unless u leave them on your skin 10+ minutes or so, they are inaffective. same as swabbing a site with alcohol. it just cleans surface dirt off a bit, doesnt sterilize at all. neither do those handy wipes that people use. useless except for psychological reasons of thinking u cleaned yourself up. yuck.

bina

Edited November 20, 2007 by bina

[thaigene2]

...but why not just have hot water? Instead of running the cold water all the time (to rinse properly) and buying vinegar etc? Is it an aversion to electricity (like in London where I can get a sandwich on every corner shop, but try getting 'hot' food other than fish/chips and the proprietor's brow furrows - hmm, that would mean eletricity just like keeping things cold requires the same - find a 'proper' restaurant mate!).

[lazeeboy]

...but why not just have hot water? Instead of running the cold water all the time (to rinse properly) and buying vinegar etc? Is it an aversion to electricity (like in London where I can get a sandwich on every corner shop, but try getting 'hot' food other than fish/chips and the proprietor's brow furrows - hmm, that would mean eletricity just like keeping things cold requires the same - find a 'proper' restaurant mate!).

i put in a flash heater in the kitchen ,4500b ,before that i boiled a big pot of water ,the wife thinks im crazy ......

[seonai]

and there's nothing worse than getting up in the rainy season and having to sloosh yourself with stagnant cold water... brrrrrrr... god knows how I did it all those years

[TonyLeung]

"Yes, I know the expensive condos have them - so pls don't post about how your bathroom in your 70,000 Baht per month pad has hot water in all 4 bathrooms, the maid's room and the kitchen!"

We keep the air conditioning on all day, too.

[thaigene2]

"Yes, I know the expensive condos have them - so pls don't post about how your bathroom in your 70,000 Baht per month pad has hot water in all 4 bathrooms, the maid's room and the kitchen!"

We keep the air conditioning on all day, too.

If you have a large book collection or expensive art collection you would need to do that. But that doesn't explain why others (and I don't mean the cheapest places Tony - I mean many, many middle-to-upper market too) simply won't spend the 4k for the under-counter water heater in the kitchen or bathroom. Why not? Spend 50,000 baht on floor tiles but not a poxy 4k to heat the water? And look - even Villa (except for the one hear Emporium) won't run the AC 24 hours a day. How big is their wine collection at the other branches - still pretty big right?

It must be an anti-electricity thing - but it defies logic (mine anyway).

[Upcountry]

When you wash your hands, you should use the soap for about 15 seconds to kill the germs.

Those waterless alcohol soap things do a faster job, so I've heard.

I've also heard that toilets are generally cleaner than computer keyboards. Maybe we should swab that waterless soap on them.

[uptou]

From what ive seen,thais are very concerned about personal cleanliness/hygene,but very relaxed when it comes to the house etc.

[kankaroo]

I'm sure most expats living here have noticed how hot water in "most" places is non-existant except for the main bathroom (e.g. shower). Yes, I know the expensive condos have them - so pls don't post about how your bathroom in your 70,000 Baht per month pad has hot water in all 4 bathrooms, the maid's room and the kitchen!

But really - why don't Thais use hot water to clean anything?

There are armies of cleaners everywhere - mopping the floor at Tesco as you try to navigate them and the shelf-stackers (who seem oblivious to the fact they're in the way too), cleaning the toilets in big hotels, shopping malls, etc, etc.

But nothing ever seems to look very clean. Is this because they don't use hot water? I've noticed even in my own house where the same plastic dishes get washed over and over - but look really dirty after a while and I can only guess this is due to washing over and over with Sunlight and cold water. True? Not true? Ignorance? Cheapness? Laziness to go get some hot water (on my part perhaps too?)? Why isn't hot water a MUST HAVE in the kitchen at least? Even in Viet Nam there is hot water everywhere...Laos too (sometimes).

Jesus this is such a gay topic !

Deal with it for gods sake man!!!!!!!!!!!

[torrenova]

I understand when there is a lack of cash but once that hurdle is over with, get hot water !

Actually, when looking for a new house to rent in Pattaya a few months ago, I was surprised at the number of places which did not have hot water in the kitchen nor in the bathrooms in some places and these were western owned. That said, a water heater can be had for as little as Bt2500 so it is hardly a major expense.

[Kerryd]

The answer is very easy when you think about it.

Many Thais grew up in rural areas where the only time they saw hot water was when they were cooking soup. Everything else is done with unheated water (which is still, what 24, 26 degrees on average, depending on the time of year ?). Many ex-pats come from countries where hot water is a must (try having a shower in Canada, even in the summer, using just the cold water tap !)

Heating water either requires more fuel for the fire, or more electricity. Either way, it means more money. Given time, as the lives of the average person improves (economically), you'll see more and more hot water heaters installed. Right now it is a luxury that many can not afford, nor see a need for. In some Western countries, hot water heaters are among the biggest wasters of electricity going. Huge tanks with the temperatures set far higher than needed, unused most of the day but still consuming large amounts of power to keep that temperature up there for when it's needed. Fortunately (for them) electricity isn't too expensive (comparatively). Jack up the cost of electricity in most Western countries and I'll bet you see a big change in the way they use hot water as well.

[TEFLMike]

Hot water in Washroom and Kitchen? Jeez!

Not in my rented 13 year old condo, there isn't.

Wet shave? I put the kettle on.

[grantbkk]

A little more than a year ago I went with a friend here in Bangkok on the final inspection of his new one bedroom condo that cost more than Baht 11M. Of course there were a few things that required attention but I thought I had lost my mind when I couldn't find the water heater(s). I looked for about 15 minutes and tested all the taps before I announced that he had no hot water. As he should he promptly told me I as out of my mind. In the end there was no hot water anywhere and when the builder was asked his one word reply was, "Extra". That could be explained as This is Thailand but it took about 2 hours of negoations to even get the builder to install hot water in the kitchen. This was the number one builder of condos in Thailand but the represenative implied that he has never heard of having hot water in the kitchen.

In my home the maid was trained by me regarding cleaning and hygiene. Thais like to push around their dirt and germs with mops and brooms. In your home you have to modify the way they do things and follow up to see that they don't backslide. This is a health issue and in the end it is just as good for them as we know it is for us.

[0Mix1up]

Thais like to push around their dirt and germs with mops and brooms

I'll add "some" not all.

In a rented apartment the in house cleaner used the same dirty cloth to wipe the kitchen table as the toilet!!!

Mop the floor with a wet black mop with no hot soapy water bucket to rinse in!!!

I watched in horror!!! tried in my modest Thai to not to worry about cleaning for me.

Then proceeded to redo Everything with a separate cloth for the different areas.

I ate enough dirt as a child

[SoCal]

When it comes to germs, I am a devout follower of George Carlin.

[bina]

i have a feeling we are dealing with culture not health here:

my (thai) husband still showers with cold water even today in jerusalem as the freezing rain/sleet pours down on us. he says my dry skin is cause i shower too hot (true) but i refuse to give in to that one.

when i first moved to israel, i was horrified to see that people dont use sponge mops to wash their floors. they pick up or move the furniture, dump a bucket of soapy water on the floor, use a broom to scrub everywhere, then squeegee the water out side, down flights of stairs, or into the shower (which was a big room with toilet shower no shower compartment, just a floor with a drain in the middle.). my mother needless to say was horrified even more when, 20+ years later, we still wash our floors that way. oh, and we use an old t shirt or a special floor rag to go over the floor so no tracks are left after. israelis think americans dont know how to clean floors. (put the mop in the bucket, mop, back in bucket again, etc. ick). my husband washes the floor by the bucket /squeegee method.

he does not wash the table however. he just sweeps it all on to the floor (the dogs wait underneath) and goes over the table with a dry cloth. i go over the table with a damp cloth. this comes from the fact that at his house, they eat on a fairly clean floor (no shoes in house, wooden planks, food falls thru cracks to the chickens, no mess/no fuss) and still hasnt gotten used to the idea of cleaning tables. same with kitchen cupboards and food. and cleaning out refrigerators. he just never had these so didnt know what and how to do what needed to be done.

in israel in a large percentage of apartments, there is an electric boiler that u have to put on before showering. most city people wash dishes in cold water cause its expensive to use hot water for dishes AND showers for 5+ people several of whom have long hair. including my doctor friend living in the city. she smacks me on the wrist when i start using hot water for the dishes.

using cold water is 'greener' since u dont need energy to heat it. unless u boil things, plain hot water that doesnt reach a certain temperature (like for a dish washing machine in a restaraunt/dining room)it is just comfortable and gives u a psychological feeling of cleanliness. it doesnt really do much.

besides, if thats the only thing that really bugs u....

bina

[chanchao]

I'm sure most expats living here have noticed how hot water in "most" places is non-existant except for the main bathroom (e.g. shower). Yes, I know the expensive condos have them - so pls don't post about how your bathroom in your 70,000 Baht per month pad has hot water in all 4 bathrooms, the maid's room and the kitchen!

Um, a 6000 Watt water heater is easily installed. That get's hot enough to make you want to not go full-blast or it'll be to hot on your hands. Actually I think this could be a reason why it's not that popular in Thailand: The belief that hot water on your skin is bad for you.

Or you could go with central hot water, but that usually means a lot of additional plumbing... Plus that with central hot water you lose some heat in the pipes and it takes longer before it's warm as you're first heating up all the tubes.

So really I think we're fortunate that electrical water heaters are so cheap to buy and install. Just you then need to change the tap to one that can mix hot/cold water, and those taps can get very fancy & pricy.

[thaigene2]

Jesus this is such a gay topic !

Deal with it for gods sake man!!!!!!!!!!!

Only thing "Gay" about this string is your Moniker buddy.. How "cute"

[phibunmike]

In Singapore there was generally no hot water in the kitchen, either. It is not necessary, the detergents are designed for cold washing and water you can put your hands in does not kill anything. In fact, bacteria prefer it a little warmer....

Warm water keeps your hands warm whilst doing the washing up, but that is not necessary here.

[CbrLad]

Quite true about using the right products for the colder water. You will find the reason why it isn't in the kitchen in many places is because of cost and many would see the need to do it anyway.

BTW my Aunt lives in Australia, in a house in Newcastle. Her kitchen and many of the houses around her don't have hot water in the kitchen either. I guess the oldies who live there are too fixed in their ways to both to have it run. In my aunts case all it would take is about 5m of copper to come off the hot water heater in the bathroom, which might I point out is one of those 120l jobbies, not the instant systems often found in asian bathrooms.

[Upcountry]

I used the water heater to wash dishes all the time until the soap and hot water started to bother my hands. Since then, I either use gloves with the hot water, or wash with cold water.

Until this thread came along, I thought we were one of maybe five households in the entire country to use a heater for the kitchen sink.

It's actually more of a 'warmer' than a heater, and I know it doesn't kill germs the way a dish washing machine would, but with the regular soap we buy it really does cut the grease. With cold water, the grease is really annoying, but with the warm water less soap and less time gets things clean. Especially at this time of year it makes the process of cleaning the dishes a bit less unpleasant.

Hate cold, greasy water.

[bina]

thai gene get a grip

my comparisons come from the country i live in which happens to be israel and not OZ or england or any of the other places most of the ex pats and married to thais live... and deal... u might, shock and horror, learn something interesting or useful, like, not everyone deals with things like americans or brits or aussies.... there are other methods... (and bugger off about politics, i dont do politics)

emperor tud: my grammar was incorrect: dining room/restaraunt dish washers DO use water over a certain temperature. at the risk of getting thai gene upset again, i will say, on kibbutz we are required by law to use a dish washer with water over a very high temperature (it is so hot it 'shrank' the trays we use to put our plates and stuff on, really annoying they are all sort of bent in the middle) for health and kosher reasons. although i suspect most food related diseases come more from personal hygiene or lack thereof in kitchens .

bina

in israel, thaigene, in israel, with thai husband....

[Scott]

I don't quite understand the need for hot water. The water is already warm when it comes out of the tap, why heat it (OK, except now during the cool season).

I have family who live in the desert area of the SW USA and they have their hot water heater turned off until about mid-Nov. It goes back off in mid-April. The water is then warm enough for showering, washing clothes etc.

If, for any reason I need hot water--such as particularly greasy dishes etc., I just heat a little on the stove.

[zorro1]

the water is usually warm enough out of the tap to get the suds going. Use a good scourer and put a bit of effort into it and i fail to see how you will end up with greasy dishes? if you dont have hot water and dont want to install then use your kettle it will take a few minutes longer but you will be happy or do what I do and never ever eat outside a resteraunt . I think we have a fear of changing life forming habits and its really all in the mind. cute name tag Thai Gene

Edited November 23, 2007 by zorro1