Australian Aged Pension

[Lacessit]

15 minutes ago, Will27 said:

You didn't really answer the question.

 

I'm talking about this part that you posted.

Where is that stated?

 

"The ATO will then instruct the banks to tax the interest at non resident rates of account holders outside of Australia for more than 183 day, and forward it to them." 

LOL, who cares anyway? Anyone with two brain cells would not be deriving most of their income from bank deposits.

Last FY, I earned $70 in bank interest. The ATO is welcome to 32.5% of that.

[KhunHeineken]

20 minutes ago, Will27 said:

You didn't really answer the question.

 

I'm talking about this part that you posted.

Where is that stated?

 

"The ATO will then instruct the banks to tax the interest at non resident rates of account holders outside of Australia for more than 183 day, and forward it to them." 

It's not stated in the link.

 

The ATO and banks are just doing it for fun.  Nothing will come from the information collected, ever.  ????  

[Lacessit]

1 minute ago, giddyup said:

How do they get their money, assuming I owed them something? Can they debit my bank accounts?

I'm not sure, but the ATO may have the power to issue garnishee orders. The Family Court and Centrelink certainly do.

[KhunHeineken]

Just now, Lacessit said:

LOL, who cares anyway? Anyone with two brain cells would not be deriving most of their income from bank deposits.

Last FY, I earned $70 in bank interest. The ATO is welcome to 32.5% of that.

Yes, that's what I said about savings accounts.

 

Have a rental property, or two, and some shares, or super payments, then that's a different story.

 

The thing is, once they get your 30% of $70, you are in their system, and then they chase everything else.     

[KhunHeineken]

6 minutes ago, giddyup said:

How do they get their money, assuming I owed them something? Can they debit my bank accounts?

You could be sent a bill, which then goes into the collections discussion we have had on this thread if you don't pay, or, they withhold some of your pension, and instruct your superfund to do the same, in the same way they instruct your bank to tax interest at non resident rates.

 

It means you just get less a month to transfer to Thailand.  Around 32.5% less, from dollar number one.  

[Will27]

7 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

LOL, who cares anyway? Anyone with two brain cells would not be deriving most of their income from bank deposits.

Last FY, I earned $70 in bank interest. The ATO is welcome to 32.5% of that.

You might want to laugh and say "who cares", but you're not seeing the big picture.

It's not about bank interest.

 

KhunHeineken said the ATO would instruct the bank to tax as you a non-resident.

If that is correct, which I don't think it is, it would mean you have been classed as a non-resident

which mean all income will be taxed at those rates.

 

[LosLobo]

31 minutes ago, KhunHeineken said:

Your link is dealing with residents for taxation purposes.

 

Check out this link.

 

https://simplyretirement.com.au/tax-super-overseas

 

Quote:

 

"Additionally, should you draw a pension from an untaxed superannuation fund, and these are largely limited to Government, public sector funds, then you may be taxed on your pension on a non-resident basis in Australia should you retire overseas. Non-resident tax rates are higher than residents tax rates because there is no tax free alowance. That tax may, or may not, be available as a tax offset in the country of residency."

 

Also, Australia and Thailand have a tax treaty, but of course, this is nothing to worry about.

 

 

 

 

As usual when facts don't agree with your narrative you make stuff up.
 

Where does my link say it's only "dealing with residents for taxation purposes".

 

Your link is dealing only with untaxed superannuation funds. Most are taxed superannuation funds where income is deemed non assessible for over 60's for taxation by ATO.

Super income stream tax tables | Australian Taxation Office (ato.gov.au)



 

Edited May 4, 2022 by LosLobo

[Will27]

12 minutes ago, KhunHeineken said:

It's not stated in the link.

 

The ATO and banks are just doing it for fun.  Nothing will come from the information collected, ever.  ????  

Thought so, you're guessing again.

[giddyup]

9 minutes ago, KhunHeineken said:

You could be sent a bill, which then goes into the collections discussion we have had on this thread if you don't pay, or, they withhold some of your pension, and instruct your superfund to do the same, in the same way they instruct your bank to tax interest at non resident rates.

 

It means you just get less a month to transfer to Thailand.  Around 32.5% less, from dollar number one.  

They could have done that with the $600 I owed them previously, but they said because I was in Thailand they chose not to pursue the matter. I paid it anyway, just for my own peace of mind.

[KhunHeineken]

2 minutes ago, giddyup said:

They could have done that with the $600 I owed them previously, but they said because I was in Thailand they chose not to pursue the matter. I paid it anyway, just for my own peace of mind.

You are in different circumstances now.  They will tax it before it gets to you.

[KhunHeineken]

15 minutes ago, Will27 said:

Thought so, you're guessing again.

Seriously?

 

If you don't supply a TFN (Tax File Number) to your bank, how much tax does the bank take on behalf of the ATO?  It's at the top marginal rate of around 48%.

 

Either you tell your bank you are a non resident, or the ATO tells your bank you are a non resident, and they will take the 32.5%. 

 

Commbank's page.

 

   https://www.commbank.com.au/support.banking.add-a-tax-file-number-tfn.html

 

Quote:

 

"Withholding tax may apply to interest earned on your account(s) unless you’ve provided us with your ABN, TFN or TFN exemption. You’re not obliged to provide your ABN, TFN or TFN exemption but if you don’t, we’re required by law to withhold tax.

The money we withhold is paid to the Australian Taxation Office (ATO).

Anyone over 16 who has earned more than $120 interest p.a. will have tax withheld if they haven't told us their ABN, TFN or TFN exemption.

Anyone under 16 who has earned $420 or more in interest p.a. will have tax withheld if there’s no TFN linked to the account. If the account’s held by their parent (not as a formal trust), the parent may quote their TFN. If there’s a formal trust, the TFN for that is used instead.

And if you’re a non-resident we’re required to withhold tax.

Go to Interest & tax summary in NetBank to check you’ve told us your TFN or TFN exemption and see if we’ve withheld interest."

 

 

Read the second last sentence.  

 

[giddyup]

17 minutes ago, KhunHeineken said:

You are in different circumstances now.  They will tax it before it gets to you.

No, you said they could possibly garnish my aged pension or my super, obviously that was not an option otherwise they would have done it.

[KhunHeineken]

26 minutes ago, LosLobo said:

As usual when facts don't agree with your narrative you make stuff up.
 

Where does my link say it's only "dealing with residents for taxation purposes".

 

Your link is dealing only with untaxed superannuation funds. Most are taxed superannuation funds which are deemed non assessible for over 60's for taxation by ATO.

Super income stream tax tables | Australian Taxation Office (ato.gov.au)



 

Please show me on your links where is says something like, "applicable to residents and non residents for taxation purposes."  

 

Can you provide a link showing most super funds are taxed, or are you making that up?

 

I have an untaxed super fund.  There are more common than you think.  

 

How can I make up what I have linked to? The link speaks for itself.

 

Some members have taxed funds, some members have untaxed funds.  It's up to each member to know what they have, and where they stand.

 

 

[KhunHeineken]

8 minutes ago, giddyup said:

No, you said they could possibly garnish my aged pension or my super, obviously that was not an option otherwise they would have done it.

Are you talking about your $600 bill from selling a house, or what may happen to your pension and super payments into the future?  

 

If it's about the $600 bill, I never said they would garnish your pension.  They would need to get a judgement, which means serving papers on you, which isn't going to happen in Thailand.  

 

Into the future, the ATO, through immigration, will definitely flag you as a non resident, regardless of your false declaration you made to your bank  The 183 day rule makes that so simple for them now. 

 

Considering they also pay you the part pension, they may tax that at non resident rates, as it's income generated in Australia, or it may be exempt, being a government pension.  We will have to wait and see.

 

Like the banks taxing interest on non residents, your super fund may do the same on your super payments.  As discussed with another member, it may depend on what type of fund you have.

 

As you can see, you will be legal, as the tax may taken out before you receive your money.    You may just receive less money than you have been.  

[LosLobo]

31 minutes ago, KhunHeineken said:

Please show me on your links where is says something like, "applicable to residents and non residents for taxation purposes."  

 

Can you provide a link showing most super funds are taxed, or are you making that up?

 

I have an untaxed super fund.  There are more common than you think.  

 

How can I make up what I have linked to? The link speaks for itself.

 

Some members have taxed funds, some members have untaxed funds.  It's up to each member to know what they have, and where they stand.

 

 

You are obviously unfamiliar with the principle of the "burden of proof".

 

You make claims that you are unable to provide evidence to support.

 

The ultimate onus of proof is on you not me to prove otherwise.

 

In my generosity, I have already provided evidence to support all of my comments.

 

I suggest you stop trying to provide advice to others on matters that are obviously beyond your level of expertise.

.

Edited May 4, 2022 by LosLobo

[scorecard]

1 hour ago, KhunHeineken said:

Your link is dealing with residents for taxation purposes.

 

Check out this link.

 

https://simplyretirement.com.au/tax-super-overseas

 

Quote:

 

"Additionally, should you draw a pension from an untaxed superannuation fund, and these are largely limited to Government, public sector funds, then you may be taxed on your pension on a non-resident basis in Australia should you retire overseas. Non-resident tax rates are higher than residents tax rates because there is no tax free alowance. That tax may, or may not, be available as a tax offset in the country of residency."

 

Also, Australia and Thailand have a tax treaty, but of course, this is nothing to worry about.

 

 

 

 

You don't know what's ahead from the government on this overall subject, and you don't know whether certain folks will be exempted etc., etc. 

 

Perhaps you could move on to another subject, you've done this one to death, and quite possibly upset a lot of pensioners. Leave it please and wait and see. 

[Will27]

44 minutes ago, KhunHeineken said:

Seriously?

 

If you don't supply a TFN (Tax File Number) to your bank, how much tax does the bank take on behalf of the ATO?  It's at the top marginal rate of around 48%.

 

Either you tell your bank you are a non resident, or the ATO tells your bank you are a non resident, and they will take the 32.5%. 

 

Commbank's page.

 

   https://www.commbank.com.au/support.banking.add-a-tax-file-number-tfn.html

 

Quote:

 

"Withholding tax may apply to interest earned on your account(s) unless you’ve provided us with your ABN, TFN or TFN exemption. You’re not obliged to provide your ABN, TFN or TFN exemption but if you don’t, we’re required by law to withhold tax.

The money we withhold is paid to the Australian Taxation Office (ATO).

Anyone over 16 who has earned more than $120 interest p.a. will have tax withheld if they haven't told us their ABN, TFN or TFN exemption.

Anyone under 16 who has earned $420 or more in interest p.a. will have tax withheld if there’s no TFN linked to the account. If the account’s held by their parent (not as a formal trust), the parent may quote their TFN. If there’s a formal trust, the TFN for that is used instead.

And if you’re a non-resident we’re required to withhold tax.

Go to Interest & tax summary in NetBank to check you’ve told us your TFN or TFN exemption and see if we’ve withheld interest."

 

 

Read the second last sentence.  

 

That's totally different.

You're quoting people who don't provide TFN's.

 

You said the ATO will instruct the bank to charge non-resident tax rates.

If they did this, they're (ATO) basically saying you're a non-resident for tax purposes and all income will be taxed.

 

That's just an assumption.

It's not factual at all.

 

 

[deej]

14 minutes ago, LosLobo said:

4 minutes ago, scorecard said:

 

 

Perhaps you could move on to another subject, you've done this one to death, and quite possibly upset a lot of pensioners. Leave it please and wait and see. 

 

 

 

I suggest you stop trying to provide advice to others on matters that are obviously beyond your level of expertise.

.

YES i agree????

This particular Member has more answers then Scomo, all BS

[Will27]

6 minutes ago, scorecard said:

You don't know what's ahead from the government on this overall subject, and you don't know whether certain folks will be exempted etc., etc. 

 

Perhaps you could move on to another subject, you've done this one to death, and quite possibly upset a lot of pensioners. Leave it please and wait and see. 

He's just like to be a scare monger.

 

He keeps passing his opinions on as fact.

Don't listen to him.

[KhunHeineken]

54 minutes ago, Will27 said:

You might want to laugh and say "who cares", but you're not seeing the big picture.

It's not about bank interest.

 

KhunHeineken said the ATO would instruct the bank to tax as you a non-resident.

If that is correct, which I don't think it is, it would mean you have been classed as a non-resident

which mean all income will be taxed at those rates.

 

Like I said, the ATO has instructed the banks to tax accounts that do not have a TFN supplied at the highest rate of around 48%.  This has been around for years.  I am not making it up.  I am not guessing it.  

 

https://www.ato.gov.au/Individuals/Investments-and-assets/Investing-in-bank-accounts-and-income-bonds/#:~:text=If your bank doesn't,you lodge your tax return.

 

Quote:

 

"If your bank doesn't have your tax file number (TFN), it will withhold tax from your interest at the highest marginal tax rate. You can claim a credit for the amount of tax withheld when you lodge your tax return."

 

The same applies to non residents.  Those accounts will be taxed at non resident rates of around 32.5%.  I posted a Commbank like showing this.

 

The difference is, which many don't seem to grasp, the ATO is making it bloody easy from themselves to declare EVERYONE outside of Australia for 183 days a non resident.  

 

The ATO already knows your bank account details, your pension details, your super details, the houses you own, the business you own, and so on. 

 

It's about how easy it will be to declare you a non resident.  The old criteria was open to interpretation and the "intention" of the individual. The new criteria is black and white.  183 days in = resident.  183 days out = non resident.      

 

I, and many like myself, have never hidden anything from the ATO.  We have slipped through the net because the net had complex criteria that went to proving certain things. That proof took manpower, with no guaranteed result of a positive outcome for the ATO.

 

That burden of proof will soon be non existent and come down to two things.  Those two things are, were you outside of Australia, and was it for 183 days or more.  That's it, nothing more.  It's like driving through a red light.  The light was either red, or it wasn't.  If red, here's your fine.  If 183 days, here's your bill.

 

To put it bluntly, they are making it so simple for them to tax so many people at higher rates.  That's the guts of the matter.  It's not about your Paul Hogan's and your old age pensioners.  This scoops up everyone in the same net.  I have admitted, what remains to be seen is if government pensions will be exempt.

 

We can go on and on about making stuff up, asking for links, guessing, opinions,  who posted what and when, what's accurate and what's not, what's right and what's wrong, and so on.  

 

The Tax Man Cometh, deal with it the best you can for your own circumstances. 

 

In my opinion, it will effect all expats in some way, from some simply receiving correspondence of little relevance that they can throw in the bin, to big lifestyle changing financial impact for some.  

 

The very nature of these tax changes targets expats.  It's what the 183 days is all about.  That's most on this thread.

 

Good luck to all of us with it in the future.

[KhunHeineken]

26 minutes ago, LosLobo said:

You are obviously unfamiliar with the principle of the "burden of proof".

 

You make claims that you are unable to provide evidence to support.

 

The ultimate onus of proof is on you not me to prove otherwise.

 

In my generosity, I have already provided evidence to support all of my comments.

 

I suggest you stop trying to provide advice to others on matters that are obviously beyond your level of expertise.

.

Your links were general in nature.  They made no reference to either residents, or non residents.

 

My links specifically mentioned non residents.

 

I don't have to prove anything to you, or any member on this thread.

 

It's really just a "heads up" to everyone that changes are coming from the ATO, and those changes are very clear, and can not be refuted by the individual, because they are based on time, and geographic location.   

 

I'm not giving advice.  I've supplied links to the changes.  We had a lot of comments.  Everything from it will never happen because it will be in the papers, to I'll worry about it when it happens, to comments like yours, shooting the messenger, being me.  It's all good, some of it even funny.  That's what the internet is about.   

 

I admit I have given some opinions, and I have said they were my opinion when posting them.  

 

I've made some predictions, and I have said they were my predictions when posting them.

 

We are all Aussies, and if we have any assets, or generate an income in Australia, we are connected to the ATO in some way.  Therefore these changes are relevant to all of us.  

 

What everyone does with the information supplied about the changes is up to them.

 

Once again, good luck to all of us with it.  

[Will27]

11 minutes ago, KhunHeineken said:

Like I said, the ATO has instructed the banks to tax accounts that do not have a TFN supplied at the highest rate of around 48%.  This has been around for years.  I am not making it up.  I am not guessing it.  

 

https://www.ato.gov.au/Individuals/Investments-and-assets/Investing-in-bank-accounts-and-income-bonds/#:~:text=If your bank doesn't,you lodge your tax return.

 

Quote:

 

"If your bank doesn't have your tax file number (TFN), it will withhold tax from your interest at the highest marginal tax rate. You can claim a credit for the amount of tax withheld when you lodge your tax return."

 

The same applies to non residents.  Those accounts will be taxed at non resident rates of around 32.5%.  I posted a Commbank like showing this.

 

The difference is, which many don't seem to grasp, the ATO is making it bloody easy from themselves to declare EVERYONE outside of Australia for 183 days a non resident.  

 

The ATO already knows your bank account details, your pension details, your super details, the houses you own, the business you own, and so on. 

 

It's about how easy it will be to declare you a non resident.  The old criteria was open to interpretation and the "intention" of the individual. The new criteria is black and white.  183 days in = resident.  183 days out = non resident.      

 

I, and many like myself, have never hidden anything from the ATO.  We have slipped through the net because the net had complex criteria that went to proving certain things. That proof took manpower, with no guaranteed result of a positive outcome for the ATO.

 

That burden of proof will soon be non existent and come down to two things.  Those two things are, were you outside of Australia, and was it for 183 days or more.  That's it, nothing more.  It's like driving through a red light.  The light was either red, or it wasn't.  If red, here's your fine.  If 183 days, here's your bill.

 

To put it bluntly, they are making it so simple for them to tax so many people at higher rates.  That's the guts of the matter.  It's not about your Paul Hogan's and your old age pensioners.  This scoops up everyone in the same net.  I have admitted, what remains to be seen is if government pensions will be exempt.

 

We can go on and on about making stuff up, asking for links, guessing, opinions,  who posted what and when, what's accurate and what's not, what's right and what's wrong, and so on.  

 

The Tax Man Cometh, deal with it the best you can for your own circumstances. 

 

In my opinion, it will effect all expats in some way, from some simply receiving correspondence of little relevance that they can throw in the bin, to big lifestyle changing financial impact for some.  

 

The very nature of these tax changes targets expats.  It's what the 183 days is all about.  That's most on this thread.

 

Good luck to all of us with it in the future.

You're making stuff up again and then post a long winded reply hoping to cover your mistakes.

I wasn't talking about TFN's.

You keep trying to bring other stuff in to muddy the waters.

 

I was specifically talking about this quote of yours

 

"It's my understanding that the ATO has instructed the banks to ask everyone with an account that earns interest to declare their residency for tax purposes. 

 

This information is then sent to the ATO to be cross referenced, which is going to be a hell of a lot easier after the 183 day rule comes in.  The ATO will then instruct the banks to tax the interest at non resident rates of account holders outside of Australia for more than 183 day, and forward it to them".

 

I have no problem with the first paragraph, but the highlighted part is just an assumption by you.

Unless of course you can post a link somewhere where the ATO will instruct banks to pretty much

change someone from a resident to a non-resident.

 

Which is what you're saying they will do,

 

Don't keep going on about a rule that hasn't been implemented yet.

[Will27]

3 minutes ago, KhunHeineken said:

Your links were general in nature.  They made no reference to either residents, or non residents.

 

My links specifically mentioned non residents.

 

I don't have to prove anything to you, or any member on this thread.

 

It's really just a "heads up" to everyone that changes are coming from the ATO, and those changes are very clear, and can not be refuted by the individual, because they are based on time, and geographic location.   

 

I'm not giving advice.  I've supplied links to the changes.  We had a lot of comments.  Everything from it will never happen because it will be in the papers, to I'll worry about it when it happens, to comments like yours, shooting the messenger, being me.  It's all good, some of it even funny.  That's what the internet is about.   

 

I admit I have given some opinions, and I have said they were my opinion when posting them.  

 

I've made some predictions, and I have said they were my predictions when posting them.

 

We are all Aussies, and if we have any assets, or generate an income in Australia, we are connected to the ATO in some way.  Therefore these changes are relevant to all of us.  

 

What everyone does with the information supplied about the changes is up to them.

 

Once again, good luck to all of us with it.  

You said this.

 

The ATO will then instruct the banks to tax the interest at non resident rates of account holders outside of Australia for more than 183 day, and forward it to them".

 

Is it you opinion, prediction or factual?

Because you've posted it as fact.

Edited May 4, 2022 by Will27

[KhunHeineken]

36 minutes ago, scorecard said:

You don't know what's ahead from the government on this overall subject, and you don't know whether certain folks will be exempted etc., etc. 

 

Perhaps you could move on to another subject, you've done this one to death, and quite possibly upset a lot of pensioners. Leave it please and wait and see. 

We all have different circumstances.  I admit it will have little impact on some, and big impact on others.  

 

We are going around in circles, and it's resulted in people personally attacking me, shooting the messenger, so to speak.  I gather they are the ones possibly upset by it.  To be honest, I never expected so much backlash.  Look what the ATO does to people.  ????  

 

I don't think there's much more I can post on the changes.   They are there for all to see.  You are correct, we don't know if, how, and when, the government will implement these changes. It's a wait and see. 

 

I'll check in on the thread, because it's obviously relevant to me, as it is to many others, but more than happy to move on to another topic within the thread. 

 

I finalize some replies, then refrain from posting on this topic, within this thread, because I don't think there's much more to say about it.

 

 

[Will27]

4 minutes ago, KhunHeineken said:

We all have different circumstances.  I admit it will have little impact on some, and big impact on others.  

 

We are going around in circles, and it's resulted in people personally attacking me, shooting the messenger, so to speak.  I gather they are the ones possibly upset by it.  To be honest, I never expected so much backlash.  Look what the ATO does to people.  ????  

 

I don't think there's much more I can post on the changes.   They are there for all to see.  You are correct, we don't know if, how, and when, the government will implement these changes. It's a wait and see. 

 

I'll check in on the thread, because it's obviously relevant to me, as it is to many others, but more than happy to move on to another topic within the thread. 

 

I finalize some replies, then refrain from posting on this topic, within this thread, because I don't think there's much more to say about it.

 

 

TBF, you've posted a lot of unfounded information as fact.

When you do that, you should expect to get questioned.

[KhunHeineken]

41 minutes ago, Will27 said:

That's totally different.

You're quoting people who don't provide TFN's.

 

You said the ATO will instruct the bank to charge non-resident tax rates.

If they did this, they're (ATO) basically saying you're a non-resident for tax purposes and all income will be taxed.

 

That's just an assumption.

It's not factual at all.

 

 

The system is already in place for bank accounts with no TFN.

 

They may use the same system for taxing accounts at non resident rates because the account holder is a non resident, because they are outside of Australia for 183 days?  

 

Of course it's an assumption.  Of course it's not factual.  The new changes haven't even come in yet. 

 

Can't you see the writing on the wall?  Why do you think the banks are asking?  Who are they forwarding the information to?

[KhunHeineken]

44 minutes ago, deej said:

YES i agree????

This particular Member has more answers then Scomo, all BS

I'm done with it also.

 

Good luck with the new changes.  

[KhunHeineken]

45 minutes ago, Will27 said:

He's just like to be a scare monger.

 

He keeps passing his opinions on as fact.

Don't listen to him.

I'm done with it.

 

It's the government bringing this down upon us.  It's real, and not a figment of anyone's imagination.  

 

Good luck with the new changes.

 

 

[KhunHeineken]

35 minutes ago, Will27 said:

You're making stuff up again and then post a long winded reply hoping to cover your mistakes.

I wasn't talking about TFN's.

You keep trying to bring other stuff in to muddy the waters.

 

I was specifically talking about this quote of yours

 

"It's my understanding that the ATO has instructed the banks to ask everyone with an account that earns interest to declare their residency for tax purposes. 

 

This information is then sent to the ATO to be cross referenced, which is going to be a hell of a lot easier after the 183 day rule comes in.  The ATO will then instruct the banks to tax the interest at non resident rates of account holders outside of Australia for more than 183 day, and forward it to them".

 

I have no problem with the first paragraph, but the highlighted part is just an assumption by you.

Unless of course you can post a link somewhere where the ATO will instruct banks to pretty much

change someone from a resident to a non-resident.

 

Which is what you're saying they will do,

 

Don't keep going on about a rule that hasn't been implemented yet.

We are going around in circles.

 

My last several posts have been proving with links what the last several posts before them have been about.

 

I, and others, have posted links to the new changes.  (THEY ARE NOT IN YET - NO ONE SAID THEY WERE) In my opinion they will come in, if others feel differently, that's fine.

 

Good luck with the new changes, should they come in.  

[scorecard]

18 minutes ago, KhunHeineken said:

The system is already in place for bank accounts with no TFN.

 

They may use the same system for taxing accounts at non resident rates because the account holder is a non resident, because they are outside of Australia for 183 days?  

 

Of course it's an assumption.  Of course it's not factual.  The new changes haven't even come in yet. 

 

Can't you see the writing on the wall?  Why do you think the banks are asking?  Who are they forwarding the information to?

-