Never Taught In Thailand / Have Degree

[InFocus]

So my situation is, I have a bachelor's degree in an unrelated field, and have English teaching experience in other countries, not Thailand. I have no TEFL or other kind of teaching certificate.

So the million dollar question is, can I go to Thailand and teach legally? And what do I have to go through in order to do this? I'm very patient and can wait as long as it takes (outside of Thailand) for whatever to get processed.

I thought this would be a piece of cake, but not according to some new threads I've been reading these days.

[aussiestyle1983]

I think you need a TEFL since your bachelors degree is not relevant to English or Education. Thats all i know. good luck.

[InFocus]

I think you need a TEFL since your bachelors degree is not relevant to English or Education. Thats all i know. good luck.

According to what I've been reading, the Thai government doesn't even recognize a TEFL or CELTA certificate.

[PeaceBlondie]

Although I'm generally in favor of gaining a TEFL certificate, I understand that no office in the MoE or the MoL can point to a Thai law that requires it.

InFocus, there is no clear, definitive answer to your question. The current indication is that a new kid on the block, the Teachers Council of Thailand, wishes to impose extremely professional qualifications in a field which is not extremely professional. If they succeed, you may as well get a PGCE, or its equivalent (whatever that is).

Speaking of equivalents, somebody showed me the British Council's minimal requirements to be an IELTS examiner, and it stated..."an undergraduate degree or a qualification which can be demonstrated to be equivalent to an undergraduate degree." Huh? How about two Associate Degrees and a certificate in arc welding? Okay, so that example is slightly off topic, but there simply is no hard and fast absolutely for sure requirement here.

After you get here semi legally, you are expected to start working illegally, and then hope those guys and gals at the local govt. offices want to issue you something which may be entirely at their discretion, dependent partly on whether your boss has handed them an envelope with sufficient baht, or they went to the same school.

[InFocus]

Pardon my ignorance, but what's a PGCE?

[garro]

Pardon my ignorance, but what's a PGCE?

Post Graduate Certificate in Education.

I would say that is much better to have a degree and no TEFL than a TEFL with no degree.

[mopenyang]

From what I've read, you'd be wasting your money on a tefl type course if your intent were to use it to get legal these days. I haven't even seen it mentioned in any of the requirements that have been posted in conjunction with the latest changes. It seems to have gone the way of black & white TVs. With a legit Bachelor's degree and verifiable teaching experience, I don't think you'll have any problem landing a decent position. It may or may not take a while for you to get "legal," as the definition of same seems to be a work in progress. Your degree is absolutely the best thing you could have going forward to become legal these days,though. Good luck!

[dr_Pat_Pong]

So my situation is, I have a bachelor's degree in an unrelated field, and have English teaching experience in other countries, not Thailand. I have no TEFL or other kind of teaching certificate.

So the million dollar question is, can I go to Thailand and teach legally? And what do I have to go through in order to do this? I'm very patient and can wait as long as it takes (outside of Thailand) for whatever to get processed.

I thought this would be a piece of cake, but not according to some new threads I've been reading these days.

You'll need a national police clearance to even get a Business Visa.

[PeaceBlondie]

So my situation is, I have a bachelor's degree in an unrelated field, and have English teaching experience in other countries, not Thailand. I have no TEFL or other kind of teaching certificate.

So the million dollar question is, can I go to Thailand and teach legally? And what do I have to go through in order to do this? I'm very patient and can wait as long as it takes (outside of Thailand) for whatever to get processed.

I thought this would be a piece of cake, but not according to some new threads I've been reading these days.

You'll need a national police clearance to even get a Business Visa.

The gentleman has recently said that he is in another Asian country, so maybe he can get a police clearance through the post, or a local police clearance.

[InFocus]

So my situation is, I have a bachelor's degree in an unrelated field, and have English teaching experience in other countries, not Thailand. I have no TEFL or other kind of teaching certificate.

So the million dollar question is, can I go to Thailand and teach legally? And what do I have to go through in order to do this? I'm very patient and can wait as long as it takes (outside of Thailand) for whatever to get processed.

I thought this would be a piece of cake, but not according to some new threads I've been reading these days.

You'll need a national police clearance to even get a Business Visa.

The gentleman has recently said that he is in another Asian country, so maybe he can get a police clearance through the post, or a local police clearance.

So would I need the clearance (criminal record check) from my home country, the Asian country I'm working and living in, or both?

Also, does it have to include a VSS (vulnerable sector search)?

[mbkudu]

Also, does it have to include a VSS (vulnerable sector search)?

That sounds a bit nasty.

[mopenyang]

Sigmoidoscopy came to mind when I first read it.

No job is worth that!

[InFocus]

I'm sure you guys are joking, but just to clarify.

A VSS is an extended version of a police clearance that includes incidents of arrest without conviction if it involves vulnerable victims such as young people, disabled people, old people, or otherwise "vulnerable" victims. It also includes arrests for crimes that are violent or sexual in nature, even if there is no conviction.

However, since I've seen nothing about it on this forum, and judging by the reponse from you guys, I'm going to assume that it's not required.

[garro]

I think it would be very hard to implement with foreign teachers as many countries will not perform this search.

I come from Ireland and they will not provide police clearance for nationals. Instead all that is available is that you demand any information be released about you under the freedom of information act. Instead of police clearance all you get back is a letter saying that there is no information which they need to release to you under the act. This is accepted in lieu of police clearance. I think this happens with a few countries..

I worked as a nurse so needed to have a full police check in the past but these are not performed routinely.

[culicine]

I have a BSc, PhD, and recently gained the GradDipEd. When I first came here, I just had the first 2. But then gain I don;t teach english but teach mathematics. They have never asked for a TEFL certificate. As far as I'm aware you have just needed a Bachelor degree, but that seems to be changing now. Although a TEFL isn;t required, I would not feel comfortable teaching english (ESL/EFL) without it, so it's worthwhile for your professional development.

[PeaceBlondie]

Our good admin Dr Pat Pong, one of our gurus in Thai visas etc., is checking to see what police clearances may be required by which embassies and consulates, or by Thai immigration police. I cannot find our very long topic on page 1 or 2 of the teaching forum. On some other forums, the topic on police clearances went on for like 20 pages, mostly innuendo and third hand (Oi 'ad a mate who was a bloke from 'ampstead, and 'e told me blah blah blarney....). We Americans had to go to the FBI, for which we had to go to the embassy to get the card stock, and then....and then...and then the issue kind of faded away, I think. So now the TCT says something, and instead of 15 credit hours in education, four years later we are talking about 27 credit hours. That's almost an M.Ed.!!

[toptuan]

One very basic question no one has asked the OP:

What level of students do you desire to teach?

The requirements in Thailand vary tremendously depending upon your answer to that question. Everyone above is just blowing hot hair until they know that factor.

[Ijustwannateach]

Our very long topic discussing police clearance requirements is conveniently pinned- it's the third topic from the top of the list for the subforum, at the moment.

[Loaded]

Our good admin Dr Pat Pong, one of our gurus in Thai visas etc., is checking to see what police clearances may be required by which embassies and consulates, or by Thai immigration police. I cannot find our very long topic on page 1 or 2 of the teaching forum. On some other forums, the topic on police clearances went on for like 20 pages, mostly innuendo and third hand (Oi 'ad a mate who was a bloke from 'ampstead, and 'e told me blah blah blarney....). We Americans had to go to the FBI, for which we had to go to the embassy to get the card stock, and then....and then...and then the issue kind of faded away, I think. So now the TCT says something, and instead of 15 credit hours in education, four years later we are talking about 27 credit hours. That's almost an M.Ed.!!

It seems to me that most embassies and consulates are requesting if you are applying for a non-imm B for teaching purposes. However, there are exceptions. I know one in the States and one in the UK that don't ask. If you're an established user and you PM me, I'll be happy to tell you where. TIT immigration only seem to be interested in some provinces.

[BigA]

For what its worth I have one of these buggers

It says among other things, "No criminal record or sex offender information was found. Fingerprints were provided, and thus the result of the search is assured." It is notarized by the Highway Patrol and also certified by the Secretary of State.

I don't want to sound like a credentialist or anything but...

I think it should and will eventually be required. It is for the good of the education system.

Higher standards equates to higher pay due to supply and demand.

Put youself in my position why should I have to compete against anybody for a job who cannot produce at the standard required for certification of a persons character.

Edited February 18, 2008 by BigA

[Loaded]

For what its worth I have one of these buggers

It says among other things, "No criminal record or sex offender information was found. Fingerprints were provided, and thus the result of the search is assured." It is notarized by the Highway Patrol and also certified by the Secretary of State.

I don't want to sound like a credentialist or anything but...

I think it should and will eventually be required. It is for the good of the education system.

Higher standards equates to higher pay due to supply and demand.

Put youself in my position why should I have to compete against anybody for a job who cannot produce at the standard required for certification of a persons character.

I agree. However, a teacher in the UK/USA offered a job in Thailand may not be able to wait the 40 days for it to come through before applying for the non-imm B.

[stevemiddie]

For what its worth I have one of these buggers

It says among other things, "No criminal record or sex offender information was found. Fingerprints were provided, and thus the result of the search is assured." It is notarized by the Highway Patrol and also certified by the Secretary of State.

I don't want to sound like a credentialist or anything but...

I think it should and will eventually be required. It is for the good of the education system.

Higher standards equates to higher pay due to supply and demand.

Put youself in my position why should I have to compete against anybody for a job who cannot produce at the standard required for certification of a persons character.

I agree. However, a teacher in the UK/USA offered a job in Thailand may not be able to wait the 40 days for it to come through before applying for the non-imm B.

A teacher in the UK would already have been subjected to the full police check and should be able to provide a copy given to him / her by his current employer

[PeaceBlondie]

A properly credentialed B.Ed/PGCE applicant would be all fixed up with background checks, as would other such native speakers from other countries. A mere BA/BSc/MA type without teaching credentials would not already have such a clearance.

Perhaps Thailand has been one of those countries where a less-than-perfectly credentialed TEFLer could just wander in, take a course, and start teaching. Hey, it kind of worked for me, to come here and teach illegally!

Now it appears Thailand is trying to impose First World standards in a badly broken system that does not deserve the best teachers.

[garro]

I think times are definitely changing here.

Five years ago I had no teaching qualifications and no experience but picked up a job in 1 day.

Now I have more qualifications, a lot more experience, but I'm struggling to get interviewed.

[PeaceBlondie]

I suspect that unless you are in BKK, the hiring system can be dysfunctional. Even in BKK, for that matter. I can't believe there are boatloads of qualified people competing in the hinterlands for crappy jobs. Come to think of it though, when i walked into that second job with great local references, they had about sixty applications off the ajarn.com database. But many applicants were over 900 km away, unavailable for interviews. And, I had to wait two months for the interview, and started the job a few days later. Dysfunctional. There just aren't many good teaching jobs here, even for good teachers.

[Scott]

Thus far, we've had good luck with police clearances from the last country a person worked in. In my (limited) experience, you need a police clearance, they don't seem to quite know if it's the right one or not, so they take it. I have submitted a few for people who worked a short time in Korea, although they weren't Korea. They were accepted.

As far as your overall question, can you work without an education degree, yes. We hire people all the time as long as they have a BA/BS degree. Haven't run into a problem yet.