Were They Ungrateful?

[warrenuk]

I hope some of you are not too hard on me,but im going back to LOS in July.

My story sort of hurts me,but here goes,Im 28yo and have been going to Thailand since i was 24.

I am gay and back in 2004 i met a Thai guy in a bar,he was older than me by 3 years.

Whilst no sexual relationship took place i enjoyed his company and we went on trips back to his village etc.He is not gay,but bisexual.

He left the bar not long after and we kept in contact,he went on to drive trucks.

Every year on going back i have always visted him,at his rented flat,usually he has a different girl everytime.We went fishing togther etc,mostly with his friends in tow and yes i paid for everything but at that time i didnt mind.

Whilst he didnt give me anything,i felt like he was a friend.

Last xmas i went back on my vacation for a 3 week holiday and i went to visit him,he was with another girl and he was drinking a lot of whisky.

I enjoyed his company,i dont know why.Some days i would spend a day with him at the weekend where we would drink whisky all day.

Anyway i felt something was not quite right with the thai lady,it seems she didnt want me around,she still spoke to me etc but i just had this feeling about her.

Anyway he had lost his phone and he kept hinting at me about a blackberry phone etc,so going towards the end of my holiday,i decided to buy him a phone with camera,email etc,but it wasnt a blackberry because plainly i couldnt afford it,so i bought a similar phone that cost me 8000 baht.

A few days before leaving,i surprised him with it,but he looked at it with his thai girlfriend and he handed it back telling me it was no good and went on and on about how it isnt a blackberry and we could go to buy one now etc.and it is "a cheap one".

I didnt even have a mobile myself of this quality.

His girlfriend even told me"Lek not like phone,phone only cheap"

I was disapointed but i said ok i will see you tomorrow but i never went back,i felt sort of heartbroken ,anyway i never saw him since and i have decided to avoid him on this trip.I kept the phone myself and its a great phone with video and camera etc.

On speaking to another expat he told me this is their culture and it was not bad mannered to hand me the phone back and he didnt like it,i should of purchased a blackberry to make him happy."phone no good" etc.

Since a few months have passed,i have gotten over it,even though i have lost a good friend,i wonder why i needed him as a friend,sometimes i think if it is their culture to be unitentionally ungrateful.

On another occassion i went to a cafe ,not a bar but a genuine cafe,,where the waiter was a ladyboy and whilst im not attracted to Ladyboys after hearing her complain about her long working days etc,and i spoke how i was going to the movies afterwards,she wanted to come so i waited until the end of her shift and we agreed to meet.

When i went to meet her she was with 2 other guys who apparently were waiters so i didnt say anything,we went to a MK Restaurant first where i paid for all 3 of them to eat and then to the movies,after she/he wanted me to take them to a disco but i was tired so i said not today plus i was a little pissed off with her/him bringing his 2 friends who i must say didnt talk to me unless i spoke to them,i dont know why they had a "arrogant" sort of attitude to me.I tried to smile and get a conversation from them but they pretended not to understand.

On leaving the movies ,i didnt talk to the 2 others,but they spoke to the ladyboy in Thai who then asked me for money for transport for them and a motorbike taxi ride for one of them.

i was a bit shocked,but then they carried on saying they couldnt get home etc so i gave them 40 baht each,the 2 waiter guys didnt say thankyou or anything to me.

They waiied to the ladyboy,i then got onto a motorbike taxi myself and left without saying anything.

I dont know why people can be so ungrateful,is it not a Thai thing to say thankyou?

All i invited was the ladyboy to go to the movies,it turned out to be half the cafe going who couldnt even talk to me.

Maybe because im a feminine type guy ,Thai people think im a pushover?

But i like to make friends,not for sex but because i like to meet people when im on vacation.,

I was so hurt from my friend telling rejecting my phone that i mentioned to my friends in the UK who are Thailand regulars and they say its a culture thing and isnt wasnt a show of disrespect.

My ex thai friend is emailing me asking when im coming back to Thailand,but i want to avoid him this time,i still think he was ungrateful.

[JetsetBkk]

[DP25]

Returning the phone was definitely a show of disrespect. The majority of Thais will happily, and gratefully, accept any gift from a friend, and it isn't expected that you buy them anything at all anyway. The fact that this guy handed it back and told you to buy a better one tells me he wasn't a friend at all, and was only using you because of money. You say you're only 28, you shouldn't be hanging out with people who expect you to pay for everything all the time and buy them gifts.

[ChangMaiSausage]

Maybe but there is certainly some truth in what the OP has said some Thai's are happy taking advantage of the weak. You need to be firm (excuse the pun) and stick by your guns only give what you want to and no more.

[warrenuk]

Well im sorry darl,i wasnt "trolling" whatever that means exactly.

What really gets up my jumper is when other posters continually say someones "trolling".

I once saw a post on where this guy asks for advice on ATM s only to get others saying he s trolling.

Sometimes i wonder if people are scared to post because they will be acused of being a troll so they dont bother.

For your information,my Thai friend did that to me,i still miss him because he felt like a friend to me,however im sure im my own mind its not a cultural thing,well even if it is im getting that way now where im older that i feel like everybody should have manners whether they are from Africa or Arabia.

"Wellits their culture" not to say thankyou,i always say thankyou when someone gives me something,i felt hurt he said those things to me,it coist me a days wages to buy it,i felt bad.

I felt like staying away from Pattaya on this trip,because it seems everyone in Pattaya wants to rip you off.

Edited March 2, 2008 by warrenuk

[farang prince]

Actually Jetset, I'm not sure the OP is a troll. His experiences are fairly common for farangs. The "ganging up" scam in which the Thai date brings along other "friends" for dinner and after-dinner entertainment is a very common occurance. And the "branding" that goes on among younger Thais is well-known. They want brand names that will increase their prestige among their friends. If you don't buy the brand name, it is a sign that you don't place the proper "value" on your Thai partner and therefore it is a loss of face. This scene is very familar with most of us who have been in relationships with Thais. At some particular point in the relationship, there will come a time when you will realize that you are not appreciated for your looks, your nice personality or your wisdom...you are appreciated for the thickness of your wallet. This isn't only a Thai issue. Quite frankly, it is an issue in virtually every Third World country in which foreigners are viewed more for their largesse and less for their "good heart."

Edited March 2, 2008 by farang prince

[warrenuk]

Thankyou to all of you.

Should i bring a gift for thai "friends" when i arrive.

Friends as in male but not sexually ,say someone i know .

If i bring them some deoderants or t shirts,would that be ok,or would they then want more.

Should i bother to bring gifts for some guys i know.

[submaniac]

Well im sorry darl,i wasnt "trolling" whatever that means exactly.

What really gets up my jumper is when other posters continually say someones "trolling".

I once saw a post on where this guy asks for advice on ATM s only to get others saying he s trolling.

Sometimes i wonder if people are scared to post because they will be acused of being a troll so they dont bother.

Yeah, I have the same feelings on this board. I wonder if any of those throwing out "troll" at the very slightest opportunity have any lives. This is a discussion board. We are here to discuss. You don't like the discussion, you don't have to read it and go elsewhere. Frankly, I think the ones yelling "Troll!" are the trolls....but I digress.

As a part of Thai culture, giving gifts actually is a part of it. But for friends, and the people you discuss here, they are small gifts. Maybe gifts of food, or little trinkets. A 'blackberry'? Little out of the range. That is not something you give to your friends--EVEN IN THAI CUSTOM--that is for your mother, father, sister, or other FAMILY members. The people that you met, they arent' 'quality' ties, and it is pretty obvious. Your friend says he is bi-sexual, and you met him in a bar. Do you think maybe he is a rentboy, and stumbled upon you. He is used to taking things from foreginers, and probably so you as that. Some rentboys aren't actually gay, which would explain the girls. I mean, you visit, there is a girl. Yet he is bi-but nothing happens between you two. I think he is just a straight guy working as a rentboy and you are his 'trick'. Think about the Bar Girls and how good they are at extracting money and gifts. That is what he is doing.

As for the Katoey, I would think that a Katoey would just be happy to have someone care about them. But alot of them 'waitresses' also rent themselves out. I think here she was thinking of you as her deep pockedted 'john'.

[t.s]

Actually Jetset, I'm not sure the OP is a troll. His experiences are fairly common for farangs. The "ganging up" scam in which the Thai date brings along other "friends" for dinner and after-dinner entertainment is a very common occurance. And the "branding" that goes on among younger Thais is well-known. They want brand names that will increase their prestige among their friends. If you don't buy the brand name, it is a sign that you don't place the proper "value" on your Thai partner and therefore it is a loss of face. This scene is very familar with most of us who have been in relationships with Thais. At some particular point in the relationship, there will come a time when you will realize that you are not appreciated for your looks, your nice personality or your wisdom...you are appreciated for the thickness of your wallet. This isn't only a Thai issue. Quite frankly, it is an issue in virtually every Third World country in which foreigners are viewed more for their largesse and less for their "good heart."

i pity you the company you keep, but you certainly arent descibing any of my thai realtionships romantic or otherwise.

perhaps this behavior is common among rent boys and katoey and bargirls but it certainly isnt amongst the people i call friends.

OP, take a little pride in yourself, there is no cultural excuse for taking the piss.

Edited March 2, 2008 by t.s

[0Mix1up]

Same story as Boy meets Girl, boy loosers $

but there would be a multiple times more.

[lopburi3]

This is a certified troll