American Shot Dead In Chiang Mai

[sriracha john]

It's also very quick... it's over...

Aussie man jailed in Thailand over tourist's murder

A 60-year-old Australian man has been sentenced to jail in Thailand for the murder of an American tourist earlier this year.

William Thomas Douglas will serve two years and nine months for killing Gary Poretsky of Hawaii in March.

The pair had been drinking at a restaurant in the northern city of Chiang Mai and in the early hours of the morning, got into an argument. Douglas took out a gun and shot Poretsky dead.

He was initially sentenced to five and a half years in prison, but the court reduced his term because he confessed.

It also determined that the murder was not premeditated.

Douglas was originally from Perth, but had been a long time resident of Thailand.

He will serve out his sentence in Chiang Mai.

- ABC News (Australia) (today)

[Spee]

two years and nine months for killing Gary Poretsky

Douglas was originally from Perth, but had been a long time resident of Thailand.

Wow, less than 3 years for taking a life. Every time I see these or lesser sentences where a life has been taken, all I can do is shake my head at what the courts could possibly be thinking. At least he is going to do time, unlike some of the other murder-for-hire specialists mentioned in other threads.

Now for the $100 questions. Does he have a chance to get out early or will he be required to serve the entire sentence? Will he have his visa revoked, be declared PNG, and sent back to Aus?

[papajohn]

Very interesting, all you Yank haters better be careful, we are aware now !!! 2 years ?? We get more time for an OZ of pot !! Any more <deleted> from you guys and its 2 in the face. Dodge City has come to CM what a shame.

[david96]

Australian convicted in Thailand for killing American tourist

August 19, 2008 - 7:31AM

An Australian man has been jailed in Thailand for the shooting murder of an American tourist during a drunken quarrel.

William Douglas, 65, admitted to shooting Gary Poretsky, 46, in March this year after the two got into a drunken argument at a restaurant in the northern city of Chiang Mai.

Poretsky, from Hawaii, suffered three gunshot wounds to his face and chest.

A court yesterday sentenced Douglas to two years and nine months in jail after deciding the murder was not premeditated.

Douglas was originally from Perth, but had been a long time resident of Thailand, the ABC reported. He will serve out his sentence in Chiang Mai.

AP/AAP

Source. The Age newspaper, Melbourne, Australia.

Edited August 18, 2008 by david96

[dotcom]

DISGUSTING.

Sure hope he gets deported after.

[Tolley]

Hard to believe the sentence that he gets for taking a life when you consider the sentences handed out for tiny amounts of drugs.

[vagabond48]

DISGUSTING.

Sure hope he gets deported after.

I was told by an acquaintance that he is well connected so he may be allowed to stay.

edit: spelling

Edited August 19, 2008 by vagabond48

[Rama]

trial was today; friend at trial couldn't stay to hear the verdict. Aussie pleaded guilty. Anybody know what he was sentenced to?

[dingdongrb]

I agree it's a shame that taking someone's life is less time behind bars than a few yaba tabs. I wonder if his time is reduced as well for time already served. Does anyone know whether any Poretsky's family members attended the trial/sentencing? Are families of the victims allowed to speak during the sentencing such as in the USA?

[Tony Clifton]

Cut his sentence by half...

Is there a possibility this nutter had money and was able to use it during the investigation and trial?

[dotcom]

He got about the same amount of time as a kiddie rapist in UK.

[Krungthepian]

Re influence and money.. they are valid questions given such a soft sentence.

It appears the judge asked the prosecutor for advice on what was an appropriate term and it was the prosecutor who said four years.

There was also a curious incident with 100,000 baht allegedly brought to the court and paid - prior to the verdict - to a Thai woman who claimed she was Poretsky's girlfriend and that they had been building a house together.

This woman reportedly wore a dental nurse's outfit but she was not the lady he had arranged to meet at the restaurant who witnessed the slaying (and told the court what happened).

Gary was here for dental treatment but this woman's unsworn evidence apparently contradicted earlier reports by police or investigators .. that he was here for the first time in 15 years and had only been in Thailand a week - which makes you wonder why prosecutors or the court thought her claim to be his girlfriend was credible.

Douglas was allegedly grinning like a Cheshire cat when he walked out.

And now the victim's mother is very upset, according to journalist John Le Fevre. Some details on his website.

If this verdict goes unchallenged - and that appears hard to believe - Douglas could be out to celebrate Christmas 2008.

That seems very unjust considering he put two bullets into another man's chest and a third into his head.

The Thai justice system is generally pretty good in its appeal courts. We just have to hope this matter is the subject of an appeal .. on behalf of the victim's family, or the US embassy. I would think they urgently need to review this case.

[Krungthepian]

Apologies, an error in my previous entry..

He would be out by Christmas 2010, if there is no appeal and he behaves himself while in custody.

[photojourn]

A 61-year-old former Perth resident will serve just two years and nine months imprisonment for the murder of a 46-year-old Hawaii resident in the northern Thailand city of Chiang Mai after making a cash payment of Bt100,000 (US$2,955) to a woman who claimed to be the girlfriend of the victim in a trial that lasted less than three hours.

William Thomas Douglas, formerly of Willetton, pleaded guilty in the Chiang Mai Provincial Court to shooting Gary Bruce Poretsky at the Keari restaurant on the morning of March 22, this year and was sentenced to four years imprisonment for murder, one year for having an unregistered firearm and a further six months for carrying a firearm in public.

This is an excerpt from the full story which can be found at: <broken link deleted>

I wasn't able to paste it in here earlier due to commercial reasons. Due to the bizarre nature of the proceedings the story is extremely long.

I was the only working journalist in the court. The ABC version was written from Bangkok and both Fairfax and News Ltd have embellished the story.

I suggest it is worth reading the full story. If the mods remove the reference link Google: "Cash payment lightens sentence for Australian Murderer".

After reading the full story people can make up there own mind about what really happened in the trial.

<h3 class="storytitle">

</h3>

Edited August 28, 2008 by Crow Boy
broken external link deleted

[sriracha john]

trial was today; friend at trial couldn't stay to hear the verdict. Aussie pleaded guilty. Anybody know what he was sentenced to?

Read Post #151. Two years and nine months.

[Loaded]

She said “Douglas then left the table and a few minutes later returned. He pulled out the gun and shot Gary two times in the chest. Gary fell to the ground and then Douglas fired a third shot into his head.”

Strange to describe this as a spontaneous act and not pre-meditated. Sounds like a scene from the Godfather.

Financial compensation is a common way to make ammends here so the payment to the 'girlfriend' isn't suspicious. Just wonder which dentist the judge uses though.

[jackspratt]

A 61-year-old former Perth resident will serve just two years and nine months imprisonment for the murder of a 46-year-old Hawaii resident in the northern Thailand city of Chiang Mai after making a cash payment of Bt100,000 (US$2,955) to a woman who claimed to be the girlfriend of the victim in a trial that lasted less than three hours.

William Thomas Douglas, formerly of Willetton, pleaded guilty in the Chiang Mai Provincial Court to shooting Gary Bruce Poretsky at the Keari restaurant on the morning of March 22, this year and was sentenced to four years imprisonment for murder, one year for having an unregistered firearm and a further six months for carrying a firearm in public.

This is an excerpt from the full story which can be found at: http://photojourn.worpress.com

I wasn't able to paste it in here earlier due to commercial reasons. Due to the bizarre nature of the proceedings the story is extremely long.

I was the only working journalist in the court. The ABC version was written from Bangkok and both Fairfax and News Ltd have embellished the story.

I suggest it is worth reading the full story. If the mods remove the reference link Google: "Cash payment lightens sentence for Australian Murderer".

After reading the full story people can make up there own mind about what really happened in the trial.

<h3 class="storytitle">

</h3>

Bad link above. Should be "wordpress", not "worpress"

[photojourn]

A 61-year-old former Perth resident will serve just two years and nine months imprisonment for the murder of a 46-year-old Hawaii resident in the northern Thailand city of Chiang Mai after making a cash payment of Bt100,000 (US$2,955) to a woman who claimed to be the girlfriend of the victim in a trial that lasted less than three hours.

William Thomas Douglas, formerly of Willetton, pleaded guilty in the Chiang Mai Provincial Court to shooting Gary Bruce Poretsky at the Keari restaurant on the morning of March 22, this year and was sentenced to four years imprisonment for murder, one year for having an unregistered firearm and a further six months for carrying a firearm in public.

This is an excerpt from the full story which can be found at: http://photojourn.worpress.com

I wasn't able to paste it in here earlier due to commercial reasons. Due to the bizarre nature of the proceedings the story is extremely long.

I was the only working journalist in the court. The ABC version was written from Bangkok and both Fairfax and News Ltd have embellished the story.

I suggest it is worth reading the full story. If the mods remove the reference link Google: "Cash payment lightens sentence for Australian Murderer".

After reading the full story people can make up there own mind about what really happened in the trial.

<h3 class="storytitle">

</h3>

Bad link above. Should be "wordpress", not "worpress"

Thanks JackSpratt.

My apologies to everyone.

Indeed it should be photojourn.wordpress.com

There will be an update to this later today but the essential information is that the family of Gary Poretsky are absolutely devastated by this decision.

They have also confirmed that Gary had not been in Thailand for many years so could not have had a girlfriend here from several months prior to the shooting.

[dotcom]

I fail to see what paying 100,000 baht to anyone other than the victims family would have in sentencing guidelines.

A deal was made. The perp pled guilty to the charge in exchange for a slap on the wrist sentence.

The third bullet makes it a lot more than self defense.

This is quite a blow to the reputation of Thai justice system.

[Tony Clifton]

I fail to see what paying 100,000 baht to anyone other than the victims family would have in sentencing guidelines.

A deal was made. The perp pled guilty to the charge in exchange for a slap on the wrist sentence.

The third bullet makes it a lot more than self defense.

This is quite a blow to the reputation of Thai justice system.

What goes on in the provincial courts is a complete farce compared to the major cases we are seeing in Bangkok these days.

Seems not only the police force is in need of a major reform.

Ask the Del Pinto, Henry and Poretsky families how they rate the justice system and the concerned judges that allow more abuse on those families in their very courtrooms.

Sickening.

Edited August 20, 2008 by Tony Clifton

[Loaded]

I fail to see what paying 100,000 baht to anyone other than the victims family would have in sentencing guidelines.

A deal was made. The perp pled guilty to the charge in exchange for a slap on the wrist sentence.

The third bullet makes it a lot more than self defense.

This is quite a blow to the reputation of Thai justice system.

You are thinking like a farang not a Thai.

Thais view of the world revolves around the philosophies of Buddhism (karmic law, lack of conflict etc). The Middle Path means compromise when there's a conflict. Traditionally Thai mediators try to find compromises and avoid judgement. Judgement normally leads to a winner and a loser. That's not the Middle Path and will lead to an angry loser continuing to seek revenge. This is not the Thai way. Financial compensation leads to a compromised solution without an angry loser. The jails contain many people jailed who could be free if they could have afforded a compensation payment during their court case. Thais believe 100% that the victim was a victim of his past karma and that the killer will become a victim of his karmic deeds either in this life or a future one. The belief is unshakeable.

The courts of Bangkok when dealing with cases that may involve international publicity tend to stick to written laws as they want the international (Western) community to have confidence in their country and hence invest their dollars. Two examples of the differences are 1) a friend of mine was sued in the civil court in Chiang Mai. At the start of the case the judge told the defendant that the reason she is in court today is the result of her previous karma. She was judged before evidence was heard. The court was a veneer. 2) The courts of Bangkok are bravely not allowing Thaksin to use his status as the number 2 puu yai in Thailand to influence their decisions. Most people understand why.

A few years ago I would have described the above description as rubbish as I couldn't think without the mores and cultural confines of a Westerner. I have a better understanding of how the world works here now.

Edited August 21, 2008 by Loaded

[Tolley]

I fail to see what paying 100,000 baht to anyone other than the victims family would have in sentencing guidelines.

A deal was made. The perp pled guilty to the charge in exchange for a slap on the wrist sentence.

The third bullet makes it a lot more than self defense.

This is quite a blow to the reputation of Thai justice system.

You are thinking like a farang not a Thai.

Thais view of the world revolves around the philosophies of Buddhism (karmic law, lack of conflict etc). The Middle Path means compromise when there's a conflict. Traditionally Thai mediators try to find compromises and avoid judgement. Judgement normally leads to a winner and a loser. That's not the Middle Path and will lead to an angry loser continuing to seek revenge. This is not the Thai way. Financial compensation leads to a compromised solution without an angry loser. The jails contain many people jailed who could be free if they could have afforded a compensation payment during their court case. Thais believe 100% that the victim was a victim of his past karma and that the killer will become a victim of his karmic deeds either in this life or a future one. The belief is unshakeable.

The courts of Bangkok when dealing with cases that may involve international publicity tend to stick to written laws as they want the international (Western) community to have confidence in their country and hence invest their dollars. Two examples of the differences are 1) a friend of mine was sued in the civil court in Chiang Mai. At the start of the case the judge told the defendant that the reason she is in court today is the result of her previous karma. She was judged before evidence was heard. The court was a veneer. 2) The courts of Bangkok are bravely not allowing Thaksin to use his status as the number 2 puu yai in Thailand to influence their decisions. Most people understand why.

A few years ago I would have described the above description as rubbish as I couldn't think without the mores and cultural confines of a Westerner. I have a better understanding of how the world works here now.

In reality it is not that simple.

We can ascertain that this guy had good connections and paid money to get a lighter sentence.

However if the person he killed had better connections he may well have had the book thrown at him.

Sometimes you can pay your way out in Thailand if you pay before you get formally charged. After you get formally charged it can be very difficult to pay your way out unless you are extremely well connected.

It can also depend on who you are dealing with.

Believe it or not you cannot always buy your way out.

High level Thai connections and plenty of money are the key to things and your connections and money need to better than who you are opposing.

[Thai at Heart]

Thais believe 100% that the victim was a victim of his past karma and that the killer will become a victim of his karmic deeds either in this life or a future one. The belief is unshakeable

This still doesn't adequately explain only a 2 and a bit year sentence. What on earth is going on. If this was Thai to Thai it would have been longer.

[Tony Clifton]

Thais believe 100% that the victim was a victim of his past karma and that the killer will become a victim of his karmic deeds either in this life or a future one. The belief is unshakeable

This still doesn't adequately explain only a 2 and a bit year sentence. What on earth is going on. If this was Thai to Thai it would have been longer.

Seems to me it`s clear as day, just another corrupt provincial court.

Accused was ordered to compensate victim`s mystery girlfriend of a few weeks with 100 000$.

Police and justice officials involved get their share.

Unforgettable Thailand

[photojourn]

It's interesting to note that two days after Douglas received his four year sentence -reduced to two years for a guilty plea- Thailand's Court of Appeals upheld a lower court's life sentence given to a Pakistani man for murdering a Thai female teacher and then dismembering her body in 2006.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Pakistani-Ma...urd-t68675.html

[Tony Clifton]

Although one was much more gruesome than the other, the Douglas case was just as cold blooded.

Two years, what a joke. Lower courts are just that, lower than low.

[peekint]

One to the head, two to the body is standard for special ops. This guy knew his stuff and was a professional at one time or other, no doubt.

[pathumthani]

I would suggest that we wait until there is more information about the shooting before we all go off half-cocked.

I agree!

[Tony Clifton]

I would suggest that we wait until there is more information about the shooting before we all go off half-cocked.

I agree!

HUH?

Case is over and he bought his way out in two years from now for 100, 000$ he paid to a mystery girlfriend, corruption made that possible.

How much more information about the shooting do you think we're going to get now???

[Loaded]

One to the head, two to the body is standard for special ops. This guy knew his stuff and was a professional at one time or other, no doubt.

My wife's family's business had an officer from the Special Forces unit in Chiang Mai visit them as a customer. He became a regulare customer. One day the family told him about a problem they had with someone who cheated them. He asked whether they wanted a body. They smiled and said Thai-style no thank you. Scarily easy to find a professional killer here.