อีกเลยมา

[Lizphuket]

Bit stuck on understanding the use of the อีกเลยมา in the following sentence. Can anyone help please?

ฉันไม่คิดอีกเลยมาฉันจะมีครอบครัวอีกครั้งแต่คุณก็ดีกับฉันและ ครอบครัวมาก

[DavidHouston]

ฉันไม่คิดอีกเลยมาฉันจะมีครอบครัวอีกครั้งแต่คุณก็ดีกับฉันและ ครอบครัวมาก

Did the writer mean to say,

"ฉันไม่คิดอีกเลยว่าฉันจะมีครอบครัวอีกครั้ง" ?

I did not expect that I would have a family again.

แต่คุณก็ดีกับฉันและ ครอบครัวมาก

But, you and I are good together and (you get along) very (well with) my family (also).

[riga]

ฉันไม่คิดอีกเลยมาฉันจะมีครอบครัวอีกครั้งแต่คุณก็ดีกับฉันและ ครอบครัวมาก

Did the writer mean to say,

"ฉันไม่คิดอีกเลยว่าฉันจะมีครอบครัวอีกครั้ง" ?

I did not expect that I would have a family again.

แต่คุณก็ดีกับฉันและ ครอบครัวมาก

But, you and I are good together and (you get along) very (well with) my family (also).

Hi David

I wasn't able to find the meaning of the sentence, because I couldn't give at เลยมา a proper sense.

Then I was guessing it could have been เลยไป and with this I would have translated the first part more or less like this

"I don't think I will have another family again in the future".

The second part was also confusing me. I would have guessed something like

"But you are doing very well with me and my family a lot"

I know, it sounds completely wrong and the translation you gave probably the correct one: the reason I've posted my interpretation is because I would like to know how you can understand that the first part is a past sentence (I did not expect) instead of a present one (I don't expect, or how I've translated "I don't think").

Sorry, I know I am a completely newbie in this field (Thai language) and I'm not good in english too, that's why I need all the help I can get from the more experienced and learned members

ขอบคุณล่วงหน้า

[DavidHouston]

Don't put too much stock in my answer either. Several points:

1. The apparent past tense of my first sentence is really a subjunctive and indicates that what actually happened was contrary to what the speaker would have expected. I would equally accept, "I do not expect to have a family again" or "I never expected to have a family again." Remember, tenses in Thai are more implied than explicit in many cases. A speaker and writer of Thai can be very specific about tenses if he or she wants to but my experience is that in common speech and much writing, tenses are loosely written and loosely interpreted.

2. Because of the unusual syntax in the Thai sentence, I had to do my best to make it sound reasonable in English. I claim poetic license.

3. Your interpretation of the second part of the subject Thai piece is fine with me. We are trying to get to the essence of the fellow's sorrow, not to parse out how technically correct the translation might be.

Again, I would be happy to hear other's opinions. Thanks.

Edited April 1, 2008 by DavidHouston

[mangkorn]

Because of the unusual syntax in the Thai sentence, I had to do my best to make it sound reasonable in English. I claim poetic license.

You've said a mouthful (as they say in Texas).

Thai syntax is the most difficult thing about learning the language - for me anyway.

Cheers.

[Rikker]

I also think ว่า makes more sense in this context..

[riga]

Remember, tenses in Thai are more implied than explicit in many cases. A speaker and writer of Thai can be very specific about tenses if he or she wants to but my experience is that in common speech and much writing, tenses are loosely written and loosely interpreted.

Thanks for your explanation David. Mmmmhh, but this attitude can make it more difficullt to interpret the correct essence of a sentence out of its context

So, supposed that the intention of the writer was to write

ฉันไม่คิดอีกเลยว่า....

may I ask you to help me (and maybe this will also clarify the doubts of OP) the meaning of อีกเลย in this sentence.

I perfectly understand the meaning of ฉันไม่คิดว่า....

So, if the sentence were ฉันไม่คิดอีกว่า.... then I can guess the verb here is คิดอีก (for this I don't know the correct translation, but at least I have an idea of what it means)

And finally in the sentence ฉันไม่คิดอีกเลยว่า.... the presence of the word เลย just emphasizes the verb คิดอีก

Did I get this right?

Sorry again to bother with this.

[meadish_sweetball]

I agree ว่า would make a lot more sense from a Standard Thai point of view.

But I also get a hunch that อีกเลยมา could be a dialect expression meaning approximately อีกต่อไป ... Just another one of my hunches, could be all wrong.

EDIT: And probably is all wrong too. I don't find any similar examples through googling, and if it really is a dialect expression it should be more frequent.

Is it possible that the อีก is the equivalent of beginning the sentence with อีกทั้ง = furthermore but is placed differently because the writer wrote quickly in a 'stream of consciousness' style?

อีกทั้ง ฉันไม่คิดเลยว่า ฉันจะมีครอบครัวอีกครั้ง ...?

"Further, it never crossed my mind that I would start a family again. "

[Lizphuket]

ฉันไม่คิดอีกเลยมาฉันจะมีครอบครัวอีกครั้งแต่คุณก็ดีกับฉันและ ครอบครัวมาก

Did the writer mean to say,

"ฉันไม่คิดอีกเลยว่าฉันจะมีครอบครัวอีกครั้ง" ?

I did not expect that I would have a family again.

แต่คุณก็ดีกับฉันและ ครอบครัวมาก

But, you and I are good together and (you get along) very (well with) my family (also).

Hi David

I think you are right about the past tense in this sentence because his preceeding sentence was 2 ปีที่แล้วที่เราเจอกัน - We met each other 2 years ago so that fits. I still get very confused about the tenses as the other correspondent does. Thanks for your help.

[Lizphuket]

I agree ว่า would make a lot more sense from a Standard Thai point of view.

But I also get a hunch that อีกเลยมา could be a dialect expression meaning approximately อีกต่อไป ... Just another one of my hunches, could be all wrong.

EDIT: And probably is all wrong too. I don't find any similar examples through googling, and if it really is a dialect expression it should be more frequent.

Is it possible that the อีก is the equivalent of beginning the sentence with อีกทั้ง = furthermore but is placed differently because the writer wrote quickly in a 'stream of consciousness' style?

อีกทั้ง ฉันไม่คิดเลยว่า ฉันจะมีครอบครัวอีกครั้ง ...?

"Further, it never crossed my mind that I would start a family again. "

Your point about a dialect expression is a distinct possibility. Nook is from Chiang Mai but grew up in the deep South so he has a confusing mix at times. I guess the other thing that I need to say is that the letter was written when he was very distressed and contained a couple of typos that I have picked up so far so correct grammar may not have been uppermost in his mind at the time! Thanks for you help.

[mangkorn]

Right Liz: typos are for everyone. No borders nor cultural differences can stop that from happening...

Also somewhat heartening to know that Thais can get their grammar wrong, since I do get it wrong so very often.

Good luck to you.

[siamesekitty]

sorry to be a bit late on this one, but pretty good interpretations so far!

let me just correct the last one though:

แต่คุณก็ดีกับฉันและ ครอบครัวมาก

But you have been very good to me and my family.