Promise By A Work Permit Then Fired!

[windbraker]

I use to work in a Five star resort in krabi as a IT supervisor they only offer me 15000baht they should give me double than that bec. Im the only IT in the whole 5 star hotel and its peak season alot of problems so i work 830am till 10pm or even until 5am but they dont give me over time pay!!! my boss promise me work permit at higher salary but they dont give me anything... they dont give me overtime pay, no service, charge no work permit, underpayed and then when my tourist VISA nearly expire i told my boss where is my permit then he said just wait after 1 week... 1 day before expired date of my VISA i went to the office of my boss and he said this is your salary dont go back bec. you dont have any work your terminated!!! and another thing when i can back to my bedroom no more bed!!!

In all i done work more than 13 hour a day no day off no permit no overtime no service charge underpayed and Fired!!!

WHAT CAN I DO?

[richard_smith237]

That sounds like quite a harsh deal. It sounds as though you were taken advantage of and manipulated a little.

However, You have been a victim of your own naivety and a boss who was willing to take advantage of that.

If you were waiting for a work permit, you should have had a Non-immigration type B visa or something similar, you should have also been involved in the work permit application process (i.e. providing passport photos, qualification certification etc)…

With just a tourist visa you were working illegally and I doubt you have a leg to stand on or any right to claim unfair dismissal.

You were paid what a Thai would be paid in a similar role and there are plenty of Thai’s with a strong IT base.

I believe you might have to put this one down to experience and use what you have learnt when negotiating for further work with other companies.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Taking action against the employer would only alert the authorities about your illegal situation.

[sriracha john]

WHAT CAN I DO?

Not start working until you have a non-immigrant visa AND work permit FIRST.

Edited May 1, 2008 by sriracha john

[Sunbelt Asia]

I use to work in a Five star resort in krabi as a IT supervisor they only offer me 15000baht they should give me double than that bec. Im the only IT in the whole 5 star hotel and its peak season alot of problems so i work 830am till 10pm or even until 5am but they dont give me over time pay!!! my boss promise me work permit at higher salary but they dont give me anything... they dont give me overtime pay, no service, charge no work permit, underpayed and then when my tourist VISA nearly expire i told my boss where is my permit then he said just wait after 1 week... 1 day before expired date of my VISA i went to the office of my boss and he said this is your salary dont go back bec. you dont have any work your terminated!!! and another thing when i can back to my bedroom no more bed!!!

In all i done work more than 13 hour a day no day off no permit no overtime no service charge underpayed and Fired!!!

WHAT CAN I DO?

I surmise you were working less than three months so you are not entitled to any severance pay as you were in the 90 day probationary period.

The most you would be entitled to would be 15,000 Baht because you were not given a one pay period notice. If the pay period was every month then you are entitled to 15K.

However in my opinion, it’s not worth the hassle to go after them in Labor Court for this amt as you did not have a work permit. The best avenue is tell them to check with the Labor Court, that you are owed this amount and see if they will give you anything.

We have won in labor court up to 800,000 Baht for clients even though they did not have a work permit. But of course this was years they were working and had a contract.

We STRONGLY advocate have a work permit in the future.

Good luck.

[ovenman]

WHAT CAN I DO?

Did you leave any potentially useful back doors into their system?

[britmaveric]

Nothing - you are working illegally. In future, don't work without a work permit!

[kiakaha]

i've heard of so many cases like this over the years, in many industrys....employers dangling carrots ,talking the talk, false promises about work permits etc..... Thailand seems to breed dishonest/ethicless losers by the dozen.

[toptuan]

In the USA, employers get away with paying illegal workers (mostly Mexican) less than the legal minimum wage, and can make them work extraordinarily long hours, without work breaks, or work many hours of overtime without OT compensation. Sometimes they become victims of sexual harassment, emotional and physical abuse at the workplace.

If the illegal complains, the boss can just fire them and then report them to the authorities. The illegal, himself, cannot complain to the authorities for fear of drawing attention to themselves or their workplace (possible raid by immigration authorities).

If you work here illegally (without a permit), unfortunately you're in the same boat. It just encourages abuse all the way around.

[seagull]

WHAT CAN I DO?

Did you leave any potentially useful back doors into their system?

I was thinking about that too. I mean he's in IT systems. Ring ring ............. sawadee khrap khun Windbraker. When can you come back to work ? We have your work permit ready for you!

Sorry to hear about your predicament. Nothing you can do about it. You arn't supposed to work in the first place without wp.

[SiamFalcon]

What was the name of the hotel. we can boycott this place, let us know or forever hold your peace

[Asia4Play]

About the only thing you can do is NAME THE HOTEL and PEOPLE to help warn others.

[robint]

More fool you, working for that kind of money with no work permit. You cant be very IT upstairs

[SeanPhuket]

I have worked for a Thai woman like this, little pay, no contract, promise of a work permit etc. ... This was in property sales on Phuket. ... I thought it was great as she took me on with no experience, which I thought was great, but it didn't even take me a week to work out why... As she didn't even have the business set-up, in the interview she was talking about having taken over half the world already and now it was Phukets time... I arrived for work on the 1st day, and there wasn't even a office... lol... we was working from Wine Connection in Bang Tao, there was no listings, I had to get them, the website was a joke, everything was a joke... anyway I stayed there for 2 months, giving the benefit of the doubt, but the employment contract and WP was always tommorrow then tommorrow... eventually I asked for a little money, in a very soft kind way, as I was running everything, right from the top to the bottom, and then suddenly she jumps on the no experience bandwagon, despite the fact I was taking care of everything and showed what I lacked in experience I made up in braun, then she starts talking about a time when she sent the 'bad boys' round to one of her employees to take care of them, then she starts about me having a crush on her and how it wasn't good for the business, then about the sexual tension I was giving of toward another girl who was working, a fat philipino twice the size of my beautiful gf.

There is more but its to much to write, after saying all this she said to me I wasn't aware of the above as i am a in-experienced person, right o sweetheart, after all this bullsh*t she then started telling me how good I am and how much 'we' need you, going on about how I will be making 30 million baht commissions 'very soon'.

I tell you what I have never been so embarrassed in my entire life!! I was so embarrassed that someone could think I am so stupid, I was sitting there laughing in her face, not in a 'I think i'm the man' way, but just because I couldn't believe what I was hearing... Anyway I sat through it, knowing I would leave, got my money from her (in cash) which happened to be a month less as she forgot I worked an extra month, then I just took of with as many official documents as I could... I told her a few days later in a very professional way that I was leaving and thanked her for everything, she then issued me with a death threat, twice if I didn't return, I then said the same to her, then she suddenly started kissing my arse...

Anyway to the OP... The moral of my story is - don't worry, you are not the only one who has had problems here, some people are so bad, as soon as you have doubt about something, think about it, then get the hel_l outa there if you are proven right, and take the experience with you, I did and now although little worse of cash wise i'm better of in other ways. But remember not everyone is sh*t people.

Anyone want to know the 'business' woman and her company? Just let me know...

Warm Regards

Sean

[OxfordWill]

As the only IT person in the whole hotel I would expect you to own their hotel by now.

You need to make it so that they need you.

Edited May 5, 2008 by OxfordWill

[singa-traz]

Nothing - you are working illegally. In future, don't work without a work permit!

That's incorrect.

The fine for the employer are higher than the one for the employee.

Even if you do not have a work permit, labor law still apply.

I'm just wondering how the hotel is running without IT ...

[block2]

I have worked for a Thai woman like this, little pay, no contract, promise of a work permit etc. ... This was in property sales on Phuket. ... I thought it was great as she took me on with no experience, which I thought was great, but it didn't even take me a week to work out why... As she didn't even have the business set-up, in the interview she was talking about having taken over half the world already and now it was Phukets time... I arrived for work on the 1st day, and there wasn't even a office... lol... we was working from Wine Connection in Bang Tao, there was no listings, I had to get them, the website was a joke, everything was a joke... anyway I stayed there for 2 months, giving the benefit of the doubt, but the employment contract and WP was always tommorrow then tommorrow... eventually I asked for a little money, in a very soft kind way, as I was running everything, right from the top to the bottom, and then suddenly she jumps on the no experience bandwagon, despite the fact I was taking care of everything and showed what I lacked in experience I made up in braun, then she starts talking about a time when she sent the 'bad boys' round to one of her employees to take care of them, then she starts about me having a crush on her and how it wasn't good for the business, then about the sexual tension I was giving of toward another girl who was working, a fat philipino twice the size of my beautiful gf.

There is more but its to much to write, after saying all this she said to me I wasn't aware of the above as i am a in-experienced person, right o sweetheart, after all this bullsh*t she then started telling me how good I am and how much 'we' need you, going on about how I will be making 30 million baht commissions 'very soon'.

I tell you what I have never been so embarrassed in my entire life!! I was so embarrassed that someone could think I am so stupid, I was sitting there laughing in her face, not in a 'I think i'm the man' way, but just because I couldn't believe what I was hearing... Anyway I sat through it, knowing I would leave, got my money from her (in cash) which happened to be a month less as she forgot I worked an extra month, then I just took of with as many official documents as I could... I told her a few days later in a very professional way that I was leaving and thanked her for everything, she then issued me with a death threat, twice if I didn't return, I then said the same to her, then she suddenly started kissing my arse...

Anyway to the OP... The moral of my story is - don't worry, you are not the only one who has had problems here, some people are so bad, as soon as you have doubt about something, think about it, then get the hel_l outa there if you are proven right, and take the experience with you, I did and now although little worse of cash wise i'm better of in other ways. But remember not everyone is sh*t people.

Anyone want to know the 'business' woman and her company? Just let me know...

Warm Regards

Sean

Hi All,

Nice post Sean....

Had similar thing happen to me this week to OP. I have met a nice girl, daughter goes to the local private school. 5 months ago, I approached the school about a teaching job. I have no teaching experience, I am English, but only have a BA Hons degree. Previously the school had employed teachers from the Phillapines and Singapore.

I was offered a job, plus a teachers licence and work permit. 10,000 baht a month, ( no holiday pay ).....teaching 500+ children. I have just had the best 5 months of my life. The children really took to me...Why?.

My girlfriend Wan, said to me, before I started teaching 5 months ago, her/our daughter would never say, the 1's an 2's..and the a' an b's, days of the week and the months of the year. My girlfriend explained..I't's because you farang, students like you....they listen...they take notice.....you no same same Phillapino, Singapore...Phillapino and Singapore look/same same as Thai.

I was told on Monday, by the owner of the school....the work permit and teachers licence was going to be too much hassle for the school, but they would like me to work there as long as I could, on my current visas. I explained I was on Tourist visa...." Tourist Visa work not permitted. "......Goodbye.

Truly Gutted.

I will really miss the 3 - 5 year olds doing the okee kokee. They had me tears.

R&R

Block

[block2]

Nothing - you are working illegally. In future, don't work without a work permit!

That's incorrect.

The fine for the employer are higher than the one for the employee.

Even if you do not have a work permit, labor law still apply.

I'm just wondering how the hotel is running without IT ...

Hi Singa,

So regarding teaching, no work permit...what's the worse that can happen? Can you please explain labour law or post a link?

R&R

Block

[singa-traz]

Nothing - you are working illegally. In future, don't work without a work permit!

That's incorrect.

The fine for the employer are higher than the one for the employee.

Even if you do not have a work permit, labor law still apply.

I'm just wondering how the hotel is running without IT ...

Hi Singa,

So regarding teaching, no work permit...what's the worse that can happen? Can you please explain labour law or post a link?

R&R

Block

Some information regarding Labour Law:

http://eng.mol.go.th/law_labour.html

Working without a work permit, here is what the law says:

(Sunbelt Asia Reference : http://www.sunbeltlegaladvisors.com/Thaila...ork-Permit.php)

Any alien who engages in work without a Work Permit, or in violation of the conditions of his work as stipulated in his Permit, may be punished by a term of imprisonment not exceeding three months or a fine of up to 5,000 baht, or both. Aliens engaged in work prohibited to them by Royal Decree (as listed in the " Restricted Occupations ") shall be liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding five years or to a fine ranging from 2,000 to 100,000 baht, or both.

An employer who permits an alien to work in his organization without a Work Permit or to act in violation of the nature of the work specified in the Permit may be punished with imprisonment not exceeding three years or fined up to 60,000 baht or both.

To come back to the OP, even if you do not have a work permit, the employer has no right to abuse you, and the labor law still apply.

Of course, you should not work without a work permit.