Feed The Kitties

[sylviex]

Indeed, and would be nice to see similar happenings at other wats. Plus, there's no shortage of Ghecko protein hereabouts .

The cat metabolism is a unique one, by the way. Their physiological conversions are quite different to those of other ( = lesser ) mammals, like us.

Eek, the cats look significantly healthier and happier. Any bigger and they'll be running the taxi cartels.

Three cheers for you, again.

[eek]

Eek in one of the books I've promised you there's a whole chapter on the diet and it goes in on the subject of commercial cat food as well. It takes a bit longer than expected before it reaches you. Hopefully this week. Solly!

Nienke

Noooooooo problem Nienke, please take your time. I understand that with all the dogs you must have a busy lifestyle. Just let me know whenever you get round to it, even if not this week.

[Calico]

Let's all pause to thank David Ritchie, even though he's not reading this forum, for sending a donation all the way from Seoul, Korea. I have just under 800 subscribers to my newsletter, and he's the only one to contribute.

I'm going to tell myself that my other subscribers are helping kitties in their own neighborhoods because that'll make me feel better.

Meanwhile, David rocks.

[Flatouthruthefog]

I couldn't find any dirt sois anywhere near Chiang Mai Gate Hotel, so I noticed 20 dogs at the wat across the road and gave them a big bag of dry dog food. And for the record, they don't like bicycles.

Anyway, 10 farangs suddenly dropping by could cause someone to lose face, which could be bad for the dog. Presumably that's why FlatOut suggested one person, preferably Thai or at least Thai speaking. This could just be poverty, given the eventual bath and the daily walks etc. Since my effort to anonymously donate some food failed, I pass the torch onto someone else. Keep us posted.

Oh, and I learned today that my little newspaper article reached some folks who have never heard of this thread. Yes!!

Lines 4 and 5 of my post give Very clear directions. It's the first soi on the right down that road. Nowhere near the Hotel or any temple.

Can a Thai speaker, with or without torch - please - take a look? I may be crying "wolf" but I don't think so.

"David rocks." Great.

But like Dafietjie I would like to see more people helping animals.

Maybe some Thai speaking dog lover has reacted to this Dogplea (my 3rd time of asking now) and i just don't know about it.

Maybe not.

Maybe I have to start a new doggie thread? Is that the problem? Or is it apathy?

[FolkGuitar]

"David rocks." Great.

But like Dafietjie I would like to see more people helping animals.

Maybe some Thai speaking dog lover has reacted to this Dogplea (my 3rd time of asking now) and i just don't know about it.

Maybe not.

Maybe I have to start a new doggie thread? Is that the problem? Or is it apathy?

It could be the 'bystander syndrome...'

The more people involved as bystanders at an accident, the less likely it is that one person will take action. People will feel that 'someone else' it deal with the problem. This why it is recommended that if you are the person actually trying to help, that you tell TWO people to go/call, etc. together, for more assistance.

We need everyone who cares to take action.

[Ulysses G.]

One very good-hearted doggie lover came to my shop and reported that he could not make head or tales of the directions and had tried to find the poor little puppy twice. I have to admit that he put me off from trying.

Edited July 3, 2008 by Ulysses G.

[sylviex]

Maybe I have to start a new doggie thread?

Why not do that ?

[eek]

"David rocks." Great.

But like Dafietjie I would like to see more people helping animals.

Maybe some Thai speaking dog lover has reacted to this Dogplea (my 3rd time of asking now) and i just don't know about it.

Maybe not.

Maybe I have to start a new doggie thread? Is that the problem? Or is it apathy?

Flatouthruthefog..i think im correct in saying most people here are just average people. What I mean is we are not attached to any animal welfare charity or specialists in animal care of any kind. We have other agendas in our lives, but we are taking time out to try help a small percentage of animals that need help in CM. To my (little) knowledge there seems to be quite a lot of Dog charities in Thailand/CM, but little focus on cats. Wat Pa Pao is a Wat which only accepts cats, so it is a good place to try help cats for those of us who have a particular love of them. I am not saying that any of us would not help a dog in need, just I believe that we are trying to focus on one thing in order to do that one thing well..rather than overstretch ourselves.

May I suggest being a little more pro-active on your concern for this dog. Maybe make a video/take photos, mark a location on a map for people to see where exactly you mean, maybe get in touch with a local English speaking Thai vet for advice, maybe contact a local Dog Charity direct and make an appointment to show them the photos/video and see what they suggest.

Im sure there must be different ways for you to help directly, but im not exactly sure what to recommend, as im no expert. Maybe ask for advice in what you can do and ask for support, rather than suggest that others are being apathetic. I get the impression from the way you wrote your post that you are chastising people who are really just trying to do the best they can. Rather than giving information and expecting people to do something about it, you could consider ways you can help the doggy yourself.

I also agree that creating a new thread would be more useful in your plea. As I suggested too, would probably help if you included directions on a map, lots of info, and some photos too.

It is wonderful that you show such concern for animal welfare. I really do sincerely hope that your doggy gets help and assistance. Good luck.

[Calico]

Our kitties have a little listing in the latest issue of City Life. The word just keeps spreading.

[Flatouthruthefog]

Maybe I have to start a new doggie thread?

Why not do that ?

Yup, that's what I should have done, rather than assuming (makes an 'ass' of 'u' and 'me') that someone here might understand 2 lines of brief, crystal clear directions and take an interest.

Unlike me, A THAI SPEAKER who might actually have achieved a result is ALSO what I said, which is why I was not so 'pro-active' as some of you may have wished.

Well, it's too doggone late now. The dog has been gone for 3 consecutive days, the cage door hangs open and the floor is more badly broken than before.

I have failed this poor animal badly. It's got to be a prompt phone call to Care 4 Dogs or some similar laudable and ACTIVE outfit next time. If there is a next time.

[sylviex]

Hey, .

I understand how upsetting these situations can be.

Can you call Ally at Care for Dogs ? She speaks English and has Thai-speaking staff.

[Calico]

I'm always sad to hear that about a dog. They are the majority of my animal experience, and they tend to forgive me for smelling worse than they do.

On a lighter note, I just read about a couple in Texas who bought some new matching T-shirts.

Agenda for the day:

Let dog out.

Let dog in.

Let dog out.

Let dog in.

Let dog out...

Edited July 4, 2008 by Calico

[Ulysses G.]

We have 3 cats and one dog that we have taken in off the street and they are all happy, loving pets who provide us and our customers with companionship and hours of entertaiment for the price of a few mouthfuls of food. We have had several others that have eventually died after being hit by a car or from natural causes. We are overjoyed that we could make their lives full and enjoyable instead of slowly starving to death on the street with no one to touch them or care about them.

This thread is about hope and love, giving them homes and fixing these animals so that their numbers can be controlled.

We are all doing something positive and it is working. God bless people who care!

[eek]

Im sorry to say fiscalist, but i think you havent read this thread in detail, or properly, or you would not have raised points that are already being covered.

Even if there was not a donation, vaccination, and neuter programme already being put in place, I wonder what your alternative suggestion would be if all people could do was feed a small percentage of cared for cats in a local Temple? Nothing? If so, i fear its this all or nothing attitude that causes people to often not even try to help or find solutions.

Rome was not built in a day. Re-education of pet responsibility and care is a huge project. What we can do is take steps to try make the situation better. Your words are passionate, I hope passionate enough to spare a few baht to donate to the neuter fund at Gecko books.

[Bill97]

I think it is a better idea to teach people about their responsibility.

Think of that!

People supporting this cat program are teaching in the best way, by example.

Fiscalist: Please try reading the threads before you post. Think of that!

[weary]

Did I just miss the cat fight?

[Priceless]

If fiscalist had been less interested in criticizing he would have read the thread and found out what it is about and what we are trying to do:

- Feed the cats so that they survive

- Vaccinate them so that they don't catch (and spread!) any diseases

- Neuter/spay them so that they don't multiply

The first two steps have already been undertaken and the third one will be completed in the next few weeks.

If fiscalist can tell what would be better to do, I for one would appreciate that information. Otherwise I think he should keep his fingers from his keyboard as far as this thread is cencerned.

Criticizing people that are trying to help, and claiming that they should instead do exactly what they are already doing, is less than brilliant to say the least!

/ Priceless (in an angry mood about inane posts )

[Calico]

This is a nine-page thread, so in the event that Fiscalist didn't find time to read them all, I'll just be sure that this page says we are spaying/neutering these cats. Ideally we'll spay and neuter every cat in Chiang Mai. We're not all as dumb as I look.

And hey, if someone wants to start a thread about soi dogs and bicyclists, I'll be there.

[sylviex]

Fiscalist, please contact "Care for Dogs" regarding the dog with inflamed genitals, or publish its exact location in this thread.

chiangmai-chiangrai.com/care_for_dogs.html

Costs per month Baht

Sterilisations of 20 dogs + cats 16.000,--

Vet bills + medicine for shelter 14.000.--

Vet bills for sick + injured street-/temple dogs 20.000,--

Vaccinations 5.000.--

Food for shelter 10.000,--

Feeding programmes temples 8.000,--

Rent for shelter/ Salary Dog Care Taker / Electricity / Maintenance of shelter / Misc.15.000,--

Total per month 90.000,--

Would you consider sponsoring one of our shelter dogs? Or would you prefer supporting our activities by pledging for a monthly contribution (e.g. 250 Baht for vaccinating and deworming a puppy, 800 Baht for a sterilization, or 1'200 Baht for medical treatments such as VD)?

If you choose to help, please contact us directly or deposit to our bank account (see below).

I would like to support the activities of Care for Dogs with:

• sponsoring a shelter dog with ……….. Baht per month
  
• a monthly contribution of ………………….. Baht
  
• a donation of ……………. Baht
  
• a dog food donation
  

Also see Ally's blog at allycfd.blogspot.com/ .

I believe you can also contact Care for Dogs about cats and other animals who are suffering.

Edited July 5, 2008 by sylviex

[Ulysses G.]

By the way, one of our most supportive members brought the cats the collars and says it is fine to remove the bells, so anyone that visits and is so inclined, feel free to take them off.

[Calico]

I haven't seen the dog, but I remember from Ally's talk to CEC that there's a condition in which these dogs get those tumors at about 6 months of age. A few shots clears up the condition, but too many people either lack the knowledge or the money, so there's another stray out there. It's sad.

I think there's also a common condition among workaholic farangs who come here to retire and then don't know what to do with themselves. Going from no free time to nothing but free time. I choose to focus my excess energy on the kitties, and if I gain more from it than they do, so what? They still come out ahead.

[Ulysses G.]

Calico Posted Today, 2008-07-05 12:27:54

I think there's also a common condition among workaholic farangs who come here to retire and then don't know what to do with themselves. Going from no free time to nothing but free time. I choose to focus my excess energy on the kitties, and if I gain more from it than they do, so what? They still come out ahead.

[Nienke]

Just had Karin from Care for Dogs on the phone and they will check out this dog.

Nienke

[Nienke]

When you take a cat or a dog you are responisble for the animal.

Yes you are, Fiscalist. Interesting that you say that.

All the cats and dogs, being on the streets, somehow belonged to some owners or were a product of breed because the owners did not take care of these animals.

And owners who let their uncastrated male(s or females) run loose on the streets.

I think it is a better idea to teach people about their responsibility.

I agree. There is only a difference in how much you take your own responsibility for this seriously.

Feed the kitties, feed the dogs. Make them breed more because we are feeding them and make their lifes more comfortable. .

Didn't you recently ask for a male rottie to breed with your female? Does she have a pedigree (if that means anything anyway. I've seen too many mixed-breeds or dogs totally out of standard with pedigrees already)? What do you know about her and the male's blood lines? What do you know about breeding and genetics? What do you know about the behavior development of the pups? And where are the pups going to? Will you carefully select the new owners, will there be a contract? Will the pups be spayed and neutered, so they can't reproduce and put even more pups in this dog over-populated world? Are you planning to sell the pups, which will mean you are planning to run a breeding business? Etc.

Like the pigeons in Amsterdam on "the Dam". They became sick because of inbreeding etc

Maybe the feeding of white bread and white rice caused a lot of malnutrition as well?

Waiting for the Chinese doctor, I saw a dog with an inflammation on his penis and balls. The whole thing (I could not see the difference between the penis and balls) was really hanging about one centimeter above the ground. He was licking it every two steps.

What to do with this dog? Take it to a vet (if he even let me)?

Now, I understand that people (including me) can't safe every ill animal they come across, pretty much every day unfortunately. It's not only the medical treatment, although costs can run high, it's what you do with the animal after it recovers?

But in stead of posting this on this forum and playing the victim and criticizing others who do a great job, just a simple phone call which takes maybe 2 to 5 baht and a 1 minute would have made a huge difference to this dog.

Same story in Chiangmai? Take the kitties home?, take the dogs home? They are wild already and really will dissappoint you.

Really, Fiscalist? Have you talked with all these dog and cat owners who have adopted rescued animals?

Think of that!

Yes, I do, Fiscalist. I have a wonderful German Shepherd Dog that does a great job in the educational program for children. Can't wish for a sweeter and gentler dog than this one! Remember this dog?

Don't feed them! Let some vet sterilize or castrate them!

Make a fund or whatever to realise that. Give your money to that solution, if it is one.

A lot of words, a lot of telling others what to do.

As some members already observed, you obviously didn't read the whole thread. Did you do yourself already something, at the very least give some donation?

And let these animals live their natural life. Untill they die of natural causes.

Hard-hearted thinking? Yes I think so.

But more honest and real to you And the animals.

Not so much hard-hearted thinking, more like no thinking at all. Having an opinion ready about a subject you have very obviously not much knowledge about, let alone empathy.

Nienke (another one in an angry mood about an inane and very hypocritical post. )

[Calico]

We're moving way off topic here, folks. This thread is for those of us who are helping the kitties at Wat Pa Pao to coordinate our efforts.

[sylviex]

We're moving way off topic here, folks. This thread is for those of us who are helping the kitties at Wat Pa Pao to coordinate our efforts.

Absolutely . Let's not have any dog or cat fights in this thread, please.

To be quite honest, I think I can understand where fiscalist is coming from.

However, I see no reason not to applaud this particular effort to support the work of Khun Dee and other Thais at the wat, and help develop a sterilisation program for cats in CM.

Back to the cats ...

[sylviex]

What triggerd my way of thinking was especial the various posts about the bells on the collars for the cats (with them they cannot hunt)

I looked into this issue a little and it seems the bells are ineffective in stopping cats from hunting. They simply learn how to move without making the bell ring, and adjust their hunting techniques. If that is correct -- and it sounds extremely likely to me -- the bells may as well be taken off.

[Priceless]

About the cats and dogs:

When you take a cat or a dog you are responisble for the animal. If you dump the animal on the street, very simple, the animal will become wild. You won't do that to your children, although yes, some do.

All the cats and dogs, being on the streets, somehow belonged to some owners or were a product of breed because the owners did not take care of these animals.

And now WE feel responsible for these animals? Because we are the "Rich Farangs, not knowing what to do with our money?"

I think it is a better idea to teach people about their responsibility.

How about the street dogs in many soi's? You even cannot walk or ride a bike because in groups they attack you.

Waiting for the Chinese doctor, I saw a dog with an inflammation on his penis and balls. The whole thing (I could not see the difference between the penis and balls) was really hanging about one centimeter above the ground. He was licking it every two steps.

What to do with this dog? Take it to a vet (if he even let me)?

This whole thread is, in my opinion, a fake.

Feed the kitties, feed the dogs. Make them breed more because we are feeding them and make their lifes more comfortable. Like the pigeons in Amsterdam on "the Dam". They became sick because of inbreeding etc.

At the end they had to poison them, and still do, because their life is Too easy.

Like many dogs and cats in the south of Europe, same story.

Same story in Chiangmai? Take the kitties home?, take the dogs home? They are wild already and really will dissappoint you.

Think of that!

Don't feed them! Let some vet sterilize or castrate them!

Make a fund or whatever to realise that. Give your money to that solution, if it is one.

And let these animals live their natural life. Untill they die of natural causes.

Hard-hearted thinking? Yes I think so.

But more honest and real to you And the animals.

I have certainly read your thread, several times at that. What you suggest (see the bold red text) is exactly what we are doing, since more than a month, except for two things:

1/ Letting animals starve, possibly to death, may seem logical to you, but it is not something I could willingly do as long as I can help them.

2/ We are also seeing to it that they are vaccinated, so they don't get (or spread) any diseases.

This is, in my opinion, a humane approach to the problem. I won't say what I think of your approach. I do however think that the world might be a better place if all tax lawyers were castrated and then left to starve to death.

/ Priceless

[Bill97]

I do however think that the world might be a better place if all tax lawyers were castrated and then left to starve to death.

/ Priceless

Great new project.

Do we donate our castration funds at Geko Books ?

Can some other categories of lawyers be included in the program?

[Ulysses G.]

Yet another member who cannot accept a different view and calls the post inane. It would be brilliant to read what I wrote instead of giving this kind of comment.

Out of order? It is pretty obvious that Priceless and Nienke read exactly what you wrote, quoted you and responded to it quite accurately. What more do you want? You propose to starve a bunch of innocent animals to death because their irresponsible owners abandoned them. You are out of order.

Sorry, if we just can't accept that as just another point of view, but it doesn't even make any sense. We are sterilizing the animals so that they can not reproduce, just what would be the point of depriving them of anything to eat as well?

Even a lawyer couldn't convince anyone to buy "logic" like that.