Borrowing Money In Wife's Name

[choppychugger]

Tried searching for this one with no luck.

I earn good money out of the country and have no work permit for Thailand.

Have been based here for 6 years with my partner, have a joint bank account with my partner as-well as credit cards.

Is it possible to borrow money for a house in my partners name if I guarantor for her and we hold the land title in the bank until it is paid off?.

Could anyone advise me on my options, if any?

Thanks

Choppy

[quiksilva]

Yep thats fine, this is what my wife and I did.

My wife's income was very important to the whole process (it was not sufficient to make monthly payments on her own but her income covered 75% of the payments) plus we had to be legally married, and I also had to waive any rights to the land too.

That was fine with me, and we ended up with a 95% mortgage from UOB and a beautiful home.

[WilliamJarvis]

This type of structure is something that always made me laugh in Thailand.

Yes, it is doable. There will, however, be no "we" in the hlding of the land. Most likely you will be asked to sign an affidavit agreeing that all money to purchase the land belongs to wife. Shortly afterwards you will sign your guarantee of the home mortgage loan.

TiT

[quiksilva]

I think I mentioned that I must waive all rights to the land to do this. At the end of the day you give your wife a house, so what? No big deal, if you trust her.

If you don't trust her, then perhaps its not the real estate structure you should be looking at, and whilst you are evaluating deal structures to safeguard your personal war chest, perhaps you should take a closer look at your marriage too.

[choppychugger]

Hi.

Just got back from a meeting with the bank now.

It looks like we can get a 50 % finance.

Not bad considering my partner hasn't worked for the time we have been together, and I work outside of Thailand.

Basically if it goes ahead, then i will act as guarantor for her.

Could anyone tell me roughly how long the process of sorting all this out will take? the seller of the house is a close friend of ours, who also knows the bank manager. Who we all sat down with today.

Thanks

Choppy

[malcolminthemiddle]

Can you disclose the terms of the mortgage.

1. Interest rate?

2. Fixed or variable?

3. Term?

4. Penalty for early payback?

5. Bank?

Many thanks.

[Nowhereman60]

Me and my girl friend are getting a loan from Government Housing Bank. We us this bank because of the low interest rate. She was told if we were married or she had a child with a foriegner she couldn't get a loan.

[WilliamJarvis]

I think I mentioned that I must waive all rights to the land to do this. At the end of the day you give your wife a house, so what? No big deal, if you trust her.

If you don't trust her, then perhaps its not the real estate structure you should be looking at, and whilst you are evaluating deal structures to safeguard your personal war chest, perhaps you should take a closer look at your marriage too.

Agree with what you are saying. Sorry, my point was that on one hand you are saying the money has nothing to do with you, and on the other you are signing a guarantee agreement!

[sibeymai]

Me and my girl friend are getting a loan from Government Housing Bank. We us this bank because of the low interest rate. She was told if we were married or she had a child with a foriegner she couldn't get a loan.

My legal Thai wife was told today by the Government Savings Bank that she could not get a loan because she is married to a foreigner. Yet 2 years before the Kasikorn Bank told us we had to be married otherwise we could not get a loan. Go figure.

[choppychugger]

Can you disclose the terms of the mortgage.

1. Interest rate?

2. Fixed or variable?

3. Term?

4. Penalty for early payback?

5. Bank?

Many thanks.

Don't mind disclosing just not to sure yet as nothing has been signed nor fully agreed. It was an informal meeting to see if we could qualify for a loan. Upon verbally agreeing to us, the manager seemed happy that we could pay a minimum of 50,000thb a month to a maximum of 100,000thb from proof of earnings and my work contract.

The bank was S.C.B. ( Siam City Bank )

Will hopefully give you some figures for the above Q's if and when I get them

Choppy

[choppychugger]

Me and my girl friend are getting a loan from Government Housing Bank. We us this bank because of the low interest rate. She was told if we were married or she had a child with a foriegner she couldn't get a loan.

Thats weird - Toady the manager asked for a copy of our sons passport and birth certificate. My partner and I aren't married, maybe that had something to do with it??

[quiksilva]

It all depends on the bank you are speaking with. My wife and I had to prove that we were legally married to qualify for a mortgage with UOB.

[AFKAFSinLOS]

Me and my girl friend are getting a loan from Government Housing Bank. We us this bank because of the low interest rate. She was told if we were married or she had a child with a foriegner she couldn't get a loan.

My legal Thai wife was told today by the Government Savings Bank that she could not get a loan because she is married to a foreigner. Yet 2 years before the Kasikorn Bank told us we had to be married otherwise we could not get a loan. Go figure.

You need to bear in mind that the Government Savings Bank "Tanakarn Omsin" is a state owned entity. It's mission and values differ from commercially run/private sector banks. It has a strong social development, grass roots and community aspect to its banking activities, which is aimed at benefiting Thais, in addition to simply being a bank. As such it has little or no interest in anything to do with foreigners.

On the other hand Kasikorn as a commercially run bank was looking to see that the foreigner is legally married to the Thai, so that there is some form of binding link between the Thai borrower, and presumably the foreign guarantor. If the guarantor is not married to the Thai, they could quite easily skip country without redress or any comeback whatsoever.

Edited July 3, 2008 by AFKAFSinLOS

[AFKAFSinLOS]

I think I mentioned that I must waive all rights to the land to do this. At the end of the day you give your wife a house, so what? No big deal, if you trust her.

If you don't trust her, then perhaps its not the real estate structure you should be looking at, and whilst you are evaluating deal structures to safeguard your personal war chest, perhaps you should take a closer look at your marriage too.

Totally agree. If you trust your spouse then there's no big deal about having the house/condo/land or whatever in their name.

Additionally I'd add that in terms of tax planning it often makes sense too. eg inheritance tax is often payable by foreigners. Putting assets in a spouse's name reduces this.

I see no need to split every single asset in a marriage 50/50. Might as well have some in one name and some in another if it suits the rules of the game... Broadly under Thai law, for any communal assets that have come into being since marriage, the spouse is entitled to 50% if they split up anyway. So even for a pessimist for every $50 (net) you put in a house for your spouse, you just put $50 in other investments/ savings / assets in your name...

[sibeymai]

Me and my girl friend are getting a loan from Government Housing Bank. We us this bank because of the low interest rate. She was told if we were married or she had a child with a foriegner she couldn't get a loan.

My legal Thai wife was told today by the Government Savings Bank that she could not get a loan because she is married to a foreigner. Yet 2 years before the Kasikorn Bank told us we had to be married otherwise we could not get a loan. Go figure.

You need to bear in mind that the Government Savings Bank "Tanakarn Omsin" is a state owned entity. It's mission and values differ from commercially run/private sector banks. It has a strong social development, grass roots and community aspect to its banking activities, which is aimed at benefiting Thais, in addition to simply being a bank. As such it has little or no interest in anything to do with foreigners.

On the other hand Kasikorn as a commercially run bank was looking to see that the foreigner is legally married to the Thai, so that there is some form of binding link between the Thai borrower, and presumably the foreign guarantor. If the guarantor is not married to the Thai, they could quite easily skip country without redress or any comeback whatsoever.

One positive things is that now my wife understands first hand that foreigners are not treated well in Thailand as far as their rights are concerned. Even as a Thai she is now denied the support of the Government Savings Bank which is available to other Thais, even though she already has a loan from the same bank for another property. It would seem that Thais married to foreigners are no longer treated as Thai even in their own country. At least that's one more Thai (plus relatives, friends, colleagues and associates) who now realise what's going on in Thailand is racist and wrong.

[ThaiLawOnline]

All banks have different policies but it's normally difficult for a foreigner to get a mortgage. It's easier when the foreigner is legally married to a Thai and I posted what is required from 3 banks in our city about 2 weeks ago. We are not talking about condos but mortgage on land and house. The highest salary you and your partner has, the most part of the payment you can do as cash down will easy the process. It was posted here:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Farangs-Mortgages-t105446.html

I was told that it was CRAP by another member but it looks like some people here got it and are happy with it. I understand your concern William but like Quicksilva said, if you know what you are doing and the risks, if it's a way for you, why not. Not everybody wants to live in a Condominium or setup companies to protect themselves. I personnally trust my wife and maybe one day, when time will come, a mortgage could suit me too.

The letter you sign at the land department is called a "Confirmation letter" and attached to this post. (I hope).

[Paul MBMG]

All banks have different policies but it's normally difficult for a foreigner to get a mortgage. It's easier when the foreigner is legally married to a Thai and I posted what is required from 3 banks in our city about 2 weeks ago. We are not talking about condos but mortgage on land and house. The highest salary you and your partner has, the most part of the payment you can do as cash down will easy the process. It was posted here:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Farangs-Mortgages-t105446.html

I was told that it was CRAP by another member but it looks like some people here got it and are happy with it. I understand your concern William but like Quicksilva said, if you know what you are doing and the risks, if it's a way for you, why not. Not everybody wants to live in a Condominium or setup companies to protect themselves. I personnally trust my wife and maybe one day, when time will come, a mortgage could suit me too.

The letter you sign at the land department is called a "Confirmation letter" and attached to this post. (I hope).

Every case is different and I've no doubt that we're talking about decent genuine people here but what is the divorce rate in

1) farang Thai marriages?

2) any cross cultural marriages

3) any same cultural marriages?

In all 3 cases that makes this a risk that on pure probability is higher than most people would rationally accept

What's more, sign away your rights and it makes the inheritance position interesting in the event that you and your spouse don;t decease at exactly the same time

And to make matters worse, depending on where you're from the argument about IHT, while very creative, doesn't hold good with many tax authorities who, despite the practical realities can deem that you own some/all of the property in question and include it inwith your estate - taxed on something you've signed away!

Each to their own, works for some, but my advice would be caveat emptor!

[choppychugger]

Just a quick update - Siam City Bank valued the property we are interested in @ 9.2 million and have agreed to lend us 4.6 million.

We have to discuss the rates, payback, fixed/variable etc in the next few days, and I shall post them as and when I get them.

I will be paying 100% towards the house. We are not married and have a 2 year old son and have been together for approx 5 years now. I trust her as she has never given me any reason not too. It's just my mum and dad split after 20 years of marriage, and it got messy - as happy as I am in my relationship what safeguards could be put in place to protect all our interests. I don't want to set up a company just to purchase the house? any advice appreciated.

choppy

[gregb]

Me and my girl friend are getting a loan from Government Housing Bank. We us this bank because of the low interest rate. She was told if we were married or she had a child with a foriegner she couldn't get a loan.

Yep. That is the policy of GHB. I took this one all the way to Khan Prachaubmoh's office. They tried to tell me it was the law in Thailand, until I showed them the government regulation in Thai a decade ago that rescinded this restriction.

Then it just became "bank policy".

Don't even try GHB if you are married and it isn't a condo. They won't do it.

[Sophon]

The bank was S.C.B. ( Siam City Bank )

Just to avoid confusion.

SCB is generally the accepted shortened form of Siam Commercial Bank while Siam City Bank uses SCIB.

Sophon

[choppychugger]

The bank was S.C.B. ( Siam City Bank )

Just to avoid confusion.

SCB is generally the accepted shortened form of Siam Commercial Bank while Siam City Bank uses SCIB.

Sophon

sorry I meant Siam Commercial bank.

[ash3356]

ood that getting a loan at the bank under your wives name worked out for you. Just in case you have money needs again I can recommend borrowing money via social lending platforms. This is quite a new concept (you can read up on it on Wikipedia) but I tried it and must say it is quite convenient for obtaining loans.

Concerning your last question - I don't think you have too many options here. I guess you will have to trust your wife - but probably some other experts here can give you some tips.

[choppychugger]

Can you disclose the terms of the mortgage.

1. Interest rate? approx 4.5% for the firstyear

2. Fixed or variable? fixed for first year thereafter approx 7-8%( variable )

3. Term? 18 years @ 48,000 thb min payment

4. Penalty for early payback? On 5.5 million would have to pay back approx 1.2 mill. Can not payback until 3 years have gone by

5. Bank? Siam Commercial bank

Many thanks.

Bit flummoxed after the meeting yesterday with the bank Manager - It was our first sit down discussion of figures and the likes.

They have agreed to now give us 5.5 million towards the purchase of a new house.

Never gone for a mortgage before and was a little shocked that on 5.5 mill we would have to pay back a little over 4 mill. Signing up for minimum repayment of 48,000thb a month, he kept going on about 18 years or so that we would have to pay.

Next time we visit the manager we will be taking a bilingual lawyer with us, in the mean time could anyone out there shed any light on this please.

cheers

Choppy

[Farma]

Take a look through their website and it should give some answers. www.scb.co.th/en/pnb/pnb_ln_pln_housing.shtml

[cosmont]

Just a quick update - Siam City Bank valued the property we are interested in @ 9.2 million and have agreed to lend us 4.6 million.

We have to discuss the rates, payback, fixed/variable etc in the next few days, and I shall post them as and when I get them.

I will be paying 100% towards the house. We are not married and have a 2 year old son and have been together for approx 5 years now. I trust her as she has never given me any reason not too. It's just my mum and dad split after 20 years of marriage, and it got messy - as happy as I am in my relationship what safeguards could be put in place to protect all our interests. I don't want to set up a company just to purchase the house? any advice appreciated.

choppy

Have you ever think to put the house into the name of your Kid who is Thai.

Maybe the Bank will not accept it

[dclaryjr]

My brother-in-law (a teacher in Bangkok) arranged for the mortgage for the house I built, and put up his house as collateral. So it's a two-way trust going on here. He's trusting he'll get that monthly wire transfer from me for the next few years, and we're trusting he'll sign the thing over to my wife once it's paid for.

[choppychugger]

My brother-in-law (a teacher in Bangkok) arranged for the mortgage for the house I built, and put up his house as collateral. So it's a two-way trust going on here. He's trusting he'll get that monthly wire transfer from me for the next few years, and we're trusting he'll sign the thing over to my wife once it's paid for.

UPDATE - The big boss in Bangkok has cleared us for the money to purchase our property. We should be moving in about 6 weeks

Thanks Choppy

[Livinginexile]

Just a quick update - Siam City Bank valued the property we are interested in @ 9.2 million and have agreed to lend us 4.6 million.

We have to discuss the rates, payback, fixed/variable etc in the next few days, and I shall post them as and when I get them.

I will be paying 100% towards the house. We are not married and have a 2 year old son and have been together for approx 5 years now. I trust her as she has never given me any reason not too. It's just my mum and dad split after 20 years of marriage, and it got messy - as happy as I am in my relationship what safeguards could be put in place to protect all our interests. I don't want to set up a company just to purchase the house? any advice appreciated.

choppy

Have you ever think to put the house into the name of your Kid who is Thai.

Maybe the Bank will not accept it

Great idea. It locks in the deal for 16 years as the child cannot sell untill he is 18 (or is it 21?)

The problem would be trying to convince the Thai wife that this is a fair compromise.

Sure would test the loyalty though