Clear Or Tinted Window Glass In New House?

[gdhm]

Is it worth getting tinted windows instead of clear glass for a new house

I often hear 15% tinted but does this reflect heat only from direct sun light. What I mean by this question is;

IF the windows are not in direct sunlight are they any better at heat reflection than clear glass.

Is there a best tinting percentage for most private houses taking into account a reasonable balance between heat reflection efficiency, cost and reduced light?

Many thanks

Dave

[kamalabob2]

I would recommend tinted. There is plenty of information on the Internet about windows and energy, BUT that is not always what is possible to purchase for a "reasonable price" in Thailand. However EVERY one of the Major glass manufactures has a web site for Thai operations and they all have a customer service department which will have someone who can communicate with you in English. I had many "pre conceived notions" of what I thought "practical" in windows based on my experiences in California. I had to quickly come to grips with what is really available in Thailand at a reasonable budget. There are several major glass manufacturers in Thailand including Guardian. There are top notch actual window fabricators who make your window frames with the glass of your choice to the EXACT size of each opening. It is not a difficult or time consuming process to install great windows IF you look around at the better firms. The price need not be more than the "local aluminum window" shop once you look and compare what exact glass you are getting in the profile.

I spoke on the telephone and via e-mail to Carl Brenden at Guardian and am real happy with his suggestions. He gave me a list of three window fabricators (Guardian does not sell direct to end users) to check their work and prices. We selected " 5 mm green glass" that was tempered at an authorized Tempering facility for our home. I observed how much time it takes the "make window on site by local aluminum shop" at some other homes under construction. We had all of our windows installed and caulked in less than two days by four men. The tinted glass seems to give a bit more privacy during the day time and might keep it a bit cooler.

There are advertisements for many window fabricating companies in the 80 baht "house design and decorating magazines" on any Thailand newsstand. The firm we selected just completed windows at the Rest Detail Hotel in Hau Hin. We do not have the flashy floor to ceiling windows, but most all the good firms can do that sort of window and it will not leak.

A word of warning: If you have a 2 story house at some point they painters will come and use bamboo scaffolding to do the exterior upper floor and under the eaves and fascia painting. They WILL stick bamboo into your window openings (windows installation is the step PRIOR to exterior painting) and I suggest you be there in person to make sure 100% of the bamboo poles are protected so they do not scratch your window frames (wood, aluminum, PVC, Fiberglass) or push a window out of alignment.

[gdhm]

Thanks again kamalabob2

Will definitely keep in mind you advice re bamboo stick s as yes they are what my builder uses (like most do).

Waiting to here what window supplier my builder is planning to use. My problem is he has quoted and is building to his quality intentions based upon the original Architects plan and gave an excellent price as I am family. He is doing a quality job (proper width and length foundations (has not skimped from the Architects full recommendations - 2 of his workers who have worked for a popular area firm say that that firm uses lesser sized foundations pylons for similar size houses and they are impressed that my wife's Uncle has not cut corners with us. BUT obviously has not assumed expensive bathroom and kitchen fixture's , doors and windows.

He tells me what he planned and I decide to go ahead or decide to pay more the difference between the quote's intentions and what I want extra or better quality.

For example I switched from Thai brick to Qcon (not a cheap improvement of course) but I am sure I will not regret my decision.

Regards

Dave

[malcolminthemiddle]

Bob,

Did you use UPvC windows?

If so, which manufacturer did you use?

Thanks

[Rimmer]

Is it worth getting tinted windows instead of clear glass for a new house

I often hear 15% tinted but does this reflect heat only from direct sun light. What I mean by this question is;

IF the windows are not in direct sunlight are they any better at heat reflection than clear glass.

Is there a best tinting percentage for most private houses taking into account a reasonable balance between heat reflection efficiency, cost and reduced light?

Many thanks

Dave

IMHO it is foolish not to have tinted glass in your new house.

Cuts down direct and indirect sun lite considerably and thus heat in the rooms.

You can see out, no one can see in.

Protects curtains, furniture and carpets from direct sun which would otherwise destroy perfectly good furnishings.

The small extra cost at installation will pay for itself in lower AC bills and longer furnishing life in only a short time.

You can see what tints and shades are available at any window shop, be guided by them they do it all the time.

[kamalabob2]

We hired and are happy with Dr. Temper Window Fabricating Firm. They also made and installed the tempered glass shower doors and will soon install insect screens in our home. We selected a specific grade of Powdered Coated ALUMINUM window frame and Green Tinted Guardian Glass which was then "tempered" at a recognized tempering facility. I might have gone with more Casement style windows as they give more "air flow" than the "single hung" windows, BUT in many locations i realized how the children "run around corners and do not look" while playing on the ground floor veranda. Hence the single hung windows on the ground floor and all tempered glass was a safety issue. Rummer is 100% correct on the virtues of tinted glass.

There are MANY quality window fabricators in Thailand, perhaps most will come to your home. It really means 3 trips for the Window Firm staff if you make a contract with them. We sent accurate window measurements from the architect to three ALUMINUM Frame firms and Three PVC window frame firms. The prices were ALL OVER THE BOARD for the exact same Guardian Green glass in the windows. It is not to say that they all were not excellent window fabricators, it just came down to low cost AND the design of the single hung window for our decision. I might have been perfectly happy with Aluzat, Glassline Thai, Sun Paradise or Duro Products, which all have web sites and have staff or owners who speak English, but at the time Dr. Temper was the selection for us in Buriram. One of the above firms was far more expensive than the other firms in our situation.

In my experience the six firms sent me a detailed price via e-mail based on the measurements and requirements we sent to them. Once we selected Dr. Temper he had four men come and make 100% EXACT measurements of every opening at our home as they had recently finished an installation job in Korat. I paid a 50% deposit prior to any fabricating work.

Six weeks later when we were finally ready the Dr. Temper staff installed and caulked the windows. Every window had a factory number based on EXACT measurements done 6 weeks prior. Then after more house painting and the other work trades staff departed the "hardware" and insect screens are to be installed. In our situation it was crucial to NOT have insect screens installed until after all the painting was completed and dust from other aspects of construction was minimized.

Another Major window glass manufacturer with manufacturing plants in Thailand is Thai Asahi Glass. Both this firm and Guardian have excellent reputations and are distributed to glass wholesalers in most every province in Thailand. The larger fabricators might buy direct from the glass manufacturer and the smaller firms would buy from a Distributor is my understanding.

Word of Warning: The curtain man was left out of the process in that he did not understand that we still had insect screen frames OUTSIDE the window frames to be installed. He did a great job installing curtains, most rooms have "blackout" reflective lining sewn onto the backside of the curtain, but some have separate blackout curtains with two curtain hardware assemblies. SO he had to come back and MOVE many of his

assemblies PRIOR to the insect screens being installed. In doing it again I would have the insect screens installed at the appropriate time and THEN the curtains, but we moved into the home prior to it being 100% finished. Dr. Temper was off doing a major hotel installation and not available to initially come prior to the curtains. In my experience scheduling of building sub-contractors is a "fine art' and perhaps not "an exact science" in Thailand. I have to give the builder credit for the most part as the "step by step" went well considering our location and how many different sub-contractors in the process.

[gdhm]

Hi kamalabob2

Once again great info. I suspect I am in the hands mostly of my builder for choice of window company. The land cost me 1m (wife's now of course by law) and the house 2.7m still mine and Usufruct on land) and I estimate fixtures fittings alarms air-cons will add another 400 -500 k. I am now not in a great position to select and buy real top quality windows. Just try and do my best with what resources I have left. Juggling act.

Sound like you really have invested in major quality (and great planned thinking) as well in your lovely house.

You keep mentioning new items of great interest to me . THIS time blackout lined curtains. I have enquired about this but nobody seemed to think this was much known about in Thailand. One friend even brought a set from the US purchased in Wal-mart, I believe (not very cheap) because eh could not find a supplier.

May I ask whether the level of black out lining was near total and how much cost it seemed to add as this will be very interesting. I live in Khon Kaen to am limited to local suppliers but would be keen to hit at least 3 bedrooms with black (or near levels)

Regards

Dave

[dotcom]

I think you can find black-outs by visiting a good drapery maker. I requested them in my condo & they knew exactly what I wanted. They appear silver in color. Mine just velcro to the existing drapes.

I have thought to price automotive window film to reflect some of the intense heat I get in the mornings in my living room.

[gdhm]

I think you can find black-outs by visiting a good drapery maker. I requested them in my condo & they knew exactly what I wanted. They appear silver in color. Mine just velcro to the existing drapes.

I have thought to price automotive window film to reflect some of the intense heat I get in the mornings in my living room.

Thanks for that dotcom. Knowing the colour is likely to be silver is helpful as the one my friend showed me from the US was indeed jet black.

Silver would seem a good colour to me because if pulled during the day I may hope for it to reflect some of the heat and light that a darker material would not.

(Our different spelling of "colour/color" betrays our origins I suspect ).

May I ask dorcom if the blackout material was expensive?

Regards

Dave

[Naam]

Is it worth getting tinted windows instead of clear glass for a new house

I often hear 15% tinted but does this reflect heat only from direct sun light. What I mean by this question is;

IF the windows are not in direct sunlight are they any better at heat reflection than clear glass.

Is there a best tinting percentage for most private houses taking into account a reasonable balance between heat reflection efficiency, cost and reduced light?

Many thanks

Dave

ordinary tinted glass does not really reflect heat but blocks it slightly. if you really want reflection you have to go with gold coated glass which is available in Thailand (i have used it when building our home). unfortunately i have no idea of price difference as demanded that glass when negotiating the total price. from outside the glass is like a mirror, from inside no blocked view!

i forgot to mention that the glass is tinted too (a very soothing green).

Edited July 9, 2008 by Naam

[dotcom]

The price was incredibly cheap. I Have floor to ceiling windows in my bedroom (sliding glass patio doors). About 3 meters wide x 2.5 M tall. Price was in the neighborhood of 2000 baht. The silver does indeed reflect a lot of heat. Well worth it just for that. Our East facing bedroom is very dark in the mornings.

[gdhm]

The price was incredibly cheap. I Have floor to ceiling windows in my bedroom (sliding glass patio doors). About 3 meters wide x 2.5 M tall. Price was in the neighborhood of 2000 baht. The silver does indeed reflect a lot of heat. Well worth it just for that. Our East facing bedroom is very dark in the mornings.

Thank you dotcom will try to find a curtain maker who deals with the "balck out" backings

Regards

Dave

[gdhm]

Is it worth getting tinted windows instead of clear glass for a new house

I often hear 15% tinted but does this reflect heat only from direct sun light. What I mean by this question is;

IF the windows are not in direct sunlight are they any better at heat reflection than clear glass.

Is there a best tinting percentage for most private houses taking into account a reasonable balance between heat reflection efficiency, cost and reduced light?

Many thanks

Dave

ordinary tinted glass does not really reflect heat but blocks it slightly. if you really want reflection you have to go with gold coated glass which is available in Thailand (i have used it when building our home). unfortunately i have no idea of price difference as demanded that glass when negotiating the total price. from outside the glass is like a mirror, from inside no blocked view!

i forgot to mention that the glass is tinted too (a very soothing green).

Hi Naam.

Your indoor pool looks wonderful. My wife is VERY envious.

At night do the reflective qualities of the windows reverse. Namely, as the indoors is lighter than the outdoors people can look in and the mirror effect is more on the inside looking out.

May I ask you what the percentage drop in light is compared to clear windows in your opinion (or maybe you know from the specs at the time).

If the Windows are gold coated what is the purpose of tinting as well? Sorry for my ignorance.

Thanks

Dave

[Naam]

At night do the reflective qualities of the windows reverse. Namely, as the indoors is lighter than the outdoors people can look in and the mirror effect is more on the inside looking out.

according to my experience (rented property during construction period) the mirror effect at night from inside is not higher than with any tinted glass.

May I ask you what the percentage drop in light is compared to clear windows in your opinion (or maybe you know from the specs at the time).

i don't really know Dave. in our house it must be something like 35%, perhaps even more. anyway, it's a huge big difference whether a window is open or closed, especially on a sunny day.

If the Windows are gold coated what is the purpose of tinting as well? Sorry for my ignorance.

efficiency (reflection and reduced heat transmission) is higher. also i don't think you can get the coated glass without tinting. problems are birds which peck quite often at their mirror image. if i had to do it again i'd select frames with a 45º angle which makes it impossible for a bird to sit on. but overall we are extremely satisfied with the glass. called my contractor concerning the price and was told that the difference between the tinted only and tinted coated glass is less than 20%. bottom line is that the total window price is increased by a fraction only.

ONE CAVEAT THOUGH! the coating is extremely sensitive and scratches are unavoidable when windows are cleaned with hard/sharp objects like razor blades to remove any paint stains.

[gdhm]

At night do the reflective qualities of the windows reverse. Namely, as the indoors is lighter than the outdoors people can look in and the mirror effect is more on the inside looking out.

according to my experience (rented property during construction period) the mirror effect at night from inside is not higher than with any tinted glass.

May I ask you what the percentage drop in light is compared to clear windows in your opinion (or maybe you know from the specs at the time).

i don't really know Dave. in our house it must be something like 35%, perhaps even more. anyway, it's a huge big difference whether a window is open or closed, especially on a sunny day.

If the Windows are gold coated what is the purpose of tinting as well? Sorry for my ignorance.

efficiency (reflection and reduced heat transmission) is higher. also i don't think you can get the coated glass without tinting. problems are birds which peck quite often at their mirror image. if i had to do it again i'd select frames with a 45º angle which makes it impossible for a bird to sit on. but overall we are extremely satisfied with the glass. called my contractor concerning the price and was told that the difference between the tinted only and tinted coated glass is less than 20%. bottom line is that the total window price is increased by a fraction only.

ONE CAVEAT THOUGH! the coating is extremely sensitive and scratches are unavoidable when windows are cleaned with hard/sharp objects like razor blades to remove any paint stains.

Thank you so much Naam and for bothering to ask your contractor - that was very kind of you.

I think 35% light loss will be too great in my house as I "set to task" on my Architect's original plan as he had (IMHO) many too many windows (like a Glass House and probably nearly as hot). His plan was geared to light rooms but in sufficient walls without windows for placement of furniture. The huge Lounge had windows all along 3 sides. Bedrooms had 2 or 3 large windows. I have reduced bedrooms to 1 large window (high level of light not being important but cool bedrooms at night VERY important. All together I knocked out 8 Windows and changed one large glass sliding door to a window.

Because I have eliminated many windows I feel 35% further reduction in natural light would be too much.

Difficult isn't it .

I rightly or wrongly decided more Qcon wall, less windows as even without tinting I assumed Qcon's would more than make up for less windows when it cam to heat prevention as i know roof and windows are number 1 transmitters.

Think I will have to look toward 15% max. I did read about spectrally tinted windows 15% light drop and 85% heat blocked due to the tint coating targeting the heat part of the light spectrum and minimally targeting the light part of the spectrum.

Unfortunately in an earlier Topic nobody responded with any info, availability in Thailand and/or prices (if available here). People in general seem very willing and helpful so I am sure nobody who read my topic knew anything on that very specific topic.

Kind regards Naam and thanks once again

Dave

[Lite Beer]

Dave. We had blackout curtain liners in our bedroom in Samui.

All the curtain making shops had them.

Yes the blackout was 100%, they were silver and they cost around 1,000 Baht a window. (Samui price)

They must have them up here in KK. Ask around any curtain shops.

[WilliamCave]

Is it worth getting tinted windows instead of clear glass for a new house

I often hear 15% tinted but does this reflect heat only from direct sun light. What I mean by this question is;

IF the windows are not in direct sunlight are they any better at heat reflection than clear glass.

Is there a best tinting percentage for most private houses taking into account a reasonable balance between heat reflection efficiency, cost and reduced light?

Many thanks

Dave

ordinary tinted glass does not really reflect heat but blocks it slightly. if you really want reflection you have to go with gold coated glass which is available in Thailand (i have used it when building our home). unfortunately i have no idea of price difference as demanded that glass when negotiating the total price. from outside the glass is like a mirror, from inside no blocked view!

i forgot to mention that the glass is tinted too (a very soothing green).

Hello Naam how much was the cost on your in door pool, thinking of the same, yours looks very nice.

[gdhm]

Dave. We had blackout curtain liners in our bedroom in Samui.

All the curtain making shops had them.

Yes the blackout was 100%, they were silver and they cost around 1,000 Baht a window. (Samui price)

They must have them up here in KK. Ask around any curtain shops.

Terrific Lite Beer, Sounds very promising.

I think maybe my US friend, who resides mostly in the US, did not spend much time investigating availability inKhon Kaen. Maybe others I asked (Thias) did not really understand what I was talking about.

Regards

Dave

[Naam]

Hello Naam how much was the cost on your in door pool, thinking of the same, yours looks very nice.

originally it was not an indoor pool William although roofed and enclosed by the U-shaped house on three sides. as we wanted to have more privacy in our pool area i enclosed the open side with mirror glass, airconditioned the area and added ~150m² to the living area. the additional cost was around 300,000 Baht, 50% for the aluminium glass enclosure and 50% for airconditioning. aircon was expensive because i use the surplus heat from the a/c unit to heat my pool water. just the titanium heatexchanger, separate pump, piping and setup was ~75,000 Baht. a/c unit alone was 75,000 Baht.

for a better explanation here are a few pictures (worth more than a thousand words). first picture my former home in the U.S. without any concerns for privacy because of lake front. pool area is on one side open and only screened. second picture pool area Thailand without enclosure. third picture pool area enclosed.

[Naam]

Because I have eliminated many windows I feel 35% further reduction in natural light would be too much.

Difficult isn't it smile.gif .

it's all a matter of individual priorities. both my wife and me hate bright light and sun. for us a rainy day or heavily clouded skies is a beautiful day. the main reason why we selected Thailand is that the sun hardly ever shines and of course the moderate cool climate

[gdhm]

Because I have eliminated many windows I feel 35% further reduction in natural light would be too much.

Difficult isn't it smile.gif .

it's all a matter of individual priorities. both my wife and me hate bright light and sun. for us a rainy day or heavily clouded skies is a beautiful day. the main reason why we selected Thailand is that the sun hardly ever shines and of course the moderate cool climate

are you saying your judgement and consequential advice is suspect

You are correct of course about individual priorities and preferences.

Now me I like bright light but not dazzling bright and not dim either (eyes don't read as well these days when light is dim or subdued. However, I wish the heat levels were nearer 28C to 30C and certainly the rainy season's heat combined with high humidity is unpleasant but as I said I am very over weight so I suffer more than most would

Dave

[Beardog]

Tinted windows over clear- No brainer.

Got to have tint to keep the heat level down & keep the brightness down. you might consider using a standard tint on non direct sunlit areas & the Ultra reflective glass That Naam has mentioned on areas that get full sun. This way the rest of your house will be cooler & still allow in enough light transmission into the house & the other areas that have too much sun will be cut down to where you would like & you also benefit a bit in air con savings.

I used to have the Platinum Gangsta tint on all my cars in Hawaii(Illegal but i was real good buddies with the chief of police & brought him copious amounts of Game fish caught on my boat .) It was illegal in a car to have full light transmission reduced to no viability in, but the vehicles were a heck of a lot cooler along with keeping out the rays frying your eyes.

On phase 2 of the house we built the windows facing west that get 3 hours sun from 2:30 pm to 5:30 will get the Ultra reflective tint- to keep any excess heat out.

[kamalabob2]

We selected curtains made in Bangkok from KACEE CURTAIN. They have a web site and MANY authorized dealers. At least three local Kacee dealers came to our home when it was under construction with numerous sample catalogs. All three dealers took measurements. Mr. Curtain is another large Curtain Organization in Thailand. There are many different curtain company advertisements in the 80 baht magazines such as "Room" Magazine.

The black out curtains are sewn at the factory on most of our windows. In our case no Velcro. A Grey silver is the color we selected, but they had other "black out" choices. I agree with the above postings about how it might be better than black. Maybe you can print out the web site information on the black out curtains and contact two of the Kacee dealers near your location. In our Master bedroom we had two separate curtains, one is just the black out and other curtain assembly is for the colorful fabric. We can roll UP the black out during the day and receive light through the fabric, but at night with both down it is so dark in the bedroom we can only see the light switches since they have the led on some switches. I have seen the "roll up bamboo" curtains for interiors usage with black out silver sewn onto the backside of the bamboo. Real slick in my opinion if you wanted blackout curtains with a traditional bamboo look.

The blackout curtain "option" was different prices from different dealers of Kacee. The width of the curtain lining was not the same from each dealer. In our situation we also had prices from two large firms that make and sell curtains in Bangkok. We selected a local Kacee dealer from Buriram since he was agreeable to come back for any final adjustments or repairs. One of the curtains came with a small defect and the dealer sent it back and returned with a suitable curtain. Dealing with a dealer who will come back and fix defects was important for us.

Far easier than dragging something over from Wal Mart. It takes some time to properly install a curtain. We think of labor in the Western World as making "custom curtains" out of our price range, but in Thailand "custom" curtains installed are LESS than some Home Pro off the shelf curtains.

I've attached a photo of the Curtain Staff painting some substance on some EXTERIOR bamboo roll up curtains that are used near our Exterior Thai Kitchen. We installed several of these bamboo curtains to cut the afternoon sunight.

The Kacee staff also measured, had made at the same factory and then installed the "silk" headboards for an otherwise plain bed. Similar to the headboards in many Thailand Hotels. Very low in cost and they fit perfect.

[gdhm]

Beardog and Kamalabob2,

Many thanks to both of you

Tinted windows:

I have a wealth of valuable new info and knowledge for when I visit the Window supplier thanks to all the kind respondents

Curtains:

We had some very well made, reasonably priced curtains made up for us by a Local curtain shop in Khon Kaen when we moved into out rental a year ago, so our first port of call will be to them to see if they can accommodate us on price and black out curtains.

I certainly am keen for blackout for my bedroom (AT LEAST).

Kind regards

Dave

[JimmyGreaves]

gdhm to you have images of your build on the Thai Visa site or anywhere else?

Cheers

[gdhm]

quote name='jflundy' date='2008-07-13 11:45:14' post='2084108']

gdhm to you have images of your build on the Thai Visa site or anywhere else?

Cheers

I have a few general ones at various stages (mostly taken with my Mobile camera) but views are not easy as the soi is quite small and house too wide to get fully in focus close up. In between the soi and house we have a wall that stands 3 meters high (road side).

In my opinion the builder made mistake. The land was lower than the road. He said we needs to level it and raise it. I suggested doing so when finished and he said best done first so we raised it about 1 metre+ as he suggested. He then built the foundations on top of th raised land which raised the house by over half a metre more. I told my wife he was crazy as had I known he was going to raise it that much I would have let him build first. Luckily the foundation pylons are wide and very long so they will go deep into the solid land base (and the architect assumed a heavier house with Thai bricks not Qcon which I later decided upon).

Now as I wanted the walls to be 2mtrs high from the inside (due to barbed wire to go on top) I now have walls 3 meters high at the front (road side) and our house is stupidly about 1.4 meters above the road.

Unfortunately I have found that Thais although friendly are a very stubborn people and never seem to accept (or see) other logic other than their own (well not when its builders) evne when the proof is indisputable (well not indisputable in Thailand it seems )

I have tried to upload a few pics. Not a good photographer sorry, and I have edited the Lounge (LAST) photo to remove my family

Hope it worked OK (well seems to have cannot work out the spacing logic sorry)

Best wishes Dave

Edited July 13, 2008 by gdhm

[KKK]

My house has tinted windows and is most definately cooler than my neighbours (untinted) house.

Drawback is that it is darker. Advantage during daytime when its lighter outside than in, nobody outside can look inside. Drawback at night when the house lights are on seeing into the house from outside is very easy. So lots of pluses as well as minuses. Personally I think next time I'd not go tinted but double glaze and have larger eaves.