Farangs With Guns!

[stroll]

this  guy  obviously  doesnt  live  in  the  real  world......ive  got  no  doubts  he  lives  in  a  condo  in  Bangkok  with  security  on  the  front  door.....some  of  us  dont  .

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That's why he urges you to consider more effective and less risky ways to protect yourselves!

[siamruby]

Thanks Thaiflyer, I am fine. Won't get into any more arguement now as it s pointless really.

Yes,Stroll. They were trying to use less risky way in the UK by the police as they were never armed. But now since the 9/11 and the increasingly amount of armed drug dealers you now see armed police everywhere all over Uk, especially London.

[Pudgimelon]

Well,Pudg. It s very well trying to insult my brother and my country just to annoy me.   I can see you are one of these superior farangs who think we Thais can not think for ourself and we do need some expert like you to come and teach the Thai police force how to handle guns.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

My brother is chief of police in my hometown (as well as assistant fire chief, it's a small town), and my uncle has been on the force for 30 years (he's a captain in a major metro police force).

Both have degrees in criminal science, and both have HUNTING rifles. Neither one would be stupid enough to keep loaded guns in a house where children live and neither one is delusional enough to believe they'd NEED to use a gun in their own house.

What does that prove?

NOTHING!

That's my point. You can go on and on and on and on and on and on and on about how nifty your big brother is and what a keen guy he is and that STILL does not contradict a single thing I said.

And don't pull that "insulting Thailand" crap. It doesn't wash here.

You want act all holier than thou and pretend like the Thai police force is above reproach, that's your opinion. But those very same newspapers you want me to look at are also filled with stories of police corruption and misdeeds (or is torturing confessions out of people with electrical wires to their gonads standard operating procedure here?). So my comments on the professionalism of the Thai police force still stand.

And in case you need me to draw a map for you, just because I say the Thai police force lacks credibility, doesn't mean I'm insulting Thailand or acting all superior. It just means I'm making an ACCURATE assessment of the credibility of that profession in this country. Any insult you see in that is self-perceived.

as you won't see all those insignificant news of rape, robbery, contact killing, assualt etc. all with guns. I suggest you go wonder around Thailand a bit to see if you can protect yourself without gun.

I wonder around Thailand all the time. I've been in every kind of situation from high to low and I've NEVER felt I needed a gun.

Quit being such a baby. Life is a risk. If you're afraid to walk out your front door, then don't. But don't delude yourself into thinking that a gun is going to help protect you out there in the big scary world. It won't.

the citizen that will be willing to be disarmed. So all the criminals will be only one who have guns?   the choice is Pudg....either you and the criminals got guns or you got no guns and they still got their guns.

Again with this idiot crap.

Would you PLEASE stop quoting NRA publicity material and THINK FOR YOURSELF!!

The police do a pretty good job of removing guns from the streets AFTER they've been used in a crime.

Additionally, once a gun is used in a crime, it can be tracked, and so any felon caught with that gun can be tied to past crimes by it (in other words, a criminal would have to be a complete IDIOT to carry around EVIDENCE that could be used against him). So most guns are used in a crime once, and then disposed off.

So if the criminals do not have a source of "clean" guns, they cannot get new guns to commit new crimes.

Duh!!

So if you take the guns out of the homes, the criminals will have no place to steal their guns!!!

Are you just being obstinate or are you ignoring this key fact because it refutes everything you're saying?

Have guns only for sports? just to kill some defenceless animal just for fun? no not for me thanks.

Oh, so in your book, guns are just fine for shooting people, but heaven forbid somebody might use one to knock off Bambi. Bleh...

Humans are mammals, correct? Humans are omnivores, correct? Humans have about 2 million years of genetic, environmental, and social experience as HUNTERS, correct? Humans are part of the ecosystem, correct?

You eat chickens, cows, pigs, and fish, correct? (or if not, then you at least eat poor defenseless soy beans).

The SPORT I was refering to was something like skeet shooting and target practice (and the biathalon), NOT deer hunting. I don't consider deer hunting to be a sport. It is simply a natural and vital role humans have to play in the ecosystem of rural America. And if you disagree with me, that's because you've never seen starving deer strip the bark off trees during the winter because someone let the herd get over-populated. But I'm sure Bambi will appreciate your "kindness" when he's dying from hoof-n-mouth disease.

[siamruby]

Ok you win as it is getting rather childish Got more to do in life rather than take notice of some verbal abuse from a virtual enermy guess you are used to that anyway as I notice you do that with everyone here.

[jackr]

Oh, so in your book, guns are just fine for shooting people, but heaven forbid somebody might use one to knock off Bambi.  Bleh...

Fair doos to you, Pudg', you know how to get your point across...but with this quote (above), I'd sure prefer Bambi to some of the foul, miscrient, waste of space human-types that tread this planet.

[easymoney]

Whew!

I have always tried to stay clear of the issue simply because of the passions on both sides of the issue. This is mostly a US , Canadian and Aussie thing in the passion side.

To me to address the opening author of this thread I woiuld protect my family at any cost. However if you don't need to live there don't. As principle goes so far especially if you are over 50. Disengage. I had to in 98 in Kanchanaburi which I addressed on another thread.

That said I have read on here such really outlandish stats concerning guns. I know our English on here gave up thier rights long ago to have firearms. I say only to that look at the continuing surge of weapon related crimes comitted in your UK.

In an ideal world there would be none , Right! Wrong some AH would have them.

There are a couple of well documented cases in the US about citizens protecting themselves. 1. The Sullivan Act in Ythe State of New York. The residents in New York City were so clambered by organized crime that in 1908 they armed themselves and crime dropped by 90 %. The cirminals were outraged as their profits drop dramatictly. The criminals bought off State reps and Judges so to pass the Sullivan Act that decent abiding citizens could not only carry weapons but could not own them. We saw what happened.

In 1980's crime by armed thugs was blatant in Florida. Many tourist mainly English and Germans were being killed. The state inacted the concealed hand gun law and murders again dropped dramatically.

The reason for these actions are that most but not all criminals are really cowards so they really can't take a chance of being hurt themselves

I spent my early years as an officer in the US Army in combat. I later was restored to my actual comissioned role as an MP officer but served in CID til leaving the service. I trained many police forces in many countries in Swat ops to include some metro forces and US Goverment anti terrioist units.

That said taking a human life is a sin or if you like dispicable act a human can do. I don't like the idea of a looney or under trained person having a gun. I don't have a loaded unsecured gun in my house but I do have them and would not hesitate to use them. I do have security that can withstand 6 to 7 minutes of of concentrated effort so I can prepare myself.

on another thread a gentleman said how about an ambush, Well any well planned and carried out op might secede. However I watch my mirrors and never ever take same routes, just old discipline and training

Another issue put forth here is that most criminal steal guns, boderdash most are bought illegally. In the same logic as some on here a gun is taken and used once BS it is reused many times and is by the novice criminal. The professional never would as if caught he goes down for more than one crime

It is is illegal in Thailand to own a gun by a farlang . It doesn't matter if you are PR or not. I can and do and hope I never have to again use. If you have a wife maybe you are in the south where you need but remember that Thais are lets say easily roused to high passion as are many farangs. Think.

Sorry for such a disjointed message, but felt should be said

[maitembot]

In 1980's crime by armed thugs was blatant in Florida. Many tourist mainly English and Germans were being killed. The state inacted the concealed hand gun law and murders again dropped dramatically.

The reason for these actions are that most but not all criminals are really cowards so they really can't take a chance of being hurt themselves

Reality Check: http://www.youdebate.com/DEBATES/gun_right_to_carry.HTM

When Black and Nagin compared crime rate trends two to three years after RTC laws were enacted with rates two to three years prior to enactment, they found no clear pattern in the results indicating that RTC laws reduced violent crime. In some states violent crime decreased after these laws were enacted, while in other states RTC laws were followed by increases in violent crime. When state RTC laws were examined separately, the laws had no consistent effect on any category of crime. In states which did experience reductions in violent crime, one cannot confidently attribute the reductions to RTC laws. For example, Oregon's RTC law was associated with lower violent crime, but the legislation which eased restrictions on concealed gun carrying also extended waiting periods and strengthened background checks for handgun purchases. The reduction in crime could be just as easily attributable to the new restrictions on handgun purchases as to the eased restrictions on carrying permits. As discussed above, there are several factors that could just as easily explain the declines in Florida's homicides during the early 1990's that Lott and Mustard attribute to the delayed effects of the 1987 RTC law. The Johns Hopkins Center for Gun Policy and Research

[easymoney]

In 1980's crime by armed thugs was blatant in Florida. Many tourist mainly English and Germans were being killed. The state inacted the concealed hand gun law and murders again dropped dramatically.

The reason for these actions are that most but not all criminals are really cowards so they really can't take a chance of being hurt themselves

Reality Check: http://www.youdebate.com/DEBATES/gun_right_to_carry.HTM

When Black and Nagin compared crime rate trends two to three years after RTC laws were enacted with rates two to three years prior to enactment, they found no clear pattern in the results indicating that RTC laws reduced violent crime. In some states violent crime decreased after these laws were enacted, while in other states RTC laws were followed by increases in violent crime. When state RTC laws were examined separately, the laws had no consistent effect on any category of crime. In states which did experience reductions in violent crime, one cannot confidently attribute the reductions to RTC laws. For example, Oregon's RTC law was associated with lower violent crime, but the legislation which eased restrictions on concealed gun carrying also extended waiting periods and strengthened background checks for handgun purchases. The reduction in crime could be just as easily attributable to the new restrictions on handgun purchases as to the eased restrictions on carrying permits. As discussed above, there are several factors that could just as easily explain the declines in Florida's homicides during the early 1990's that Lott and Mustard attribute to the delayed effects of the 1987 RTC law. The Johns Hopkins Center for Gun Policy and Research

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Sir, Please give national accredited stats. The one you just sited is a canned opinion

[Heng]

Let me clue you in on something:

IF HE GOT SHOT THROUGH THE DOOR, THEN A GUN IN HIS HAND WOULD HAVE DONE NOTHING TO PROTECT HIM!!!!!

The other cop on the scene, and others soon to be on the scene, were probably glad that they weren't just armed only with high quality replicas or even really good batons.

The same for anyone else, after seeing a criminal shoot a friend or family member through the door.

[penzman]

My mate has an electric current running around the wall of his house 20000 volts, when it rain its cracks and sparkles, maybe i'll get one.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Who needs a BBQ with one of those

[Pudgimelon]

In states which did experience reductions in violent crime, one cannot confidently attribute the reductions to RTC laws....The reduction in crime could be just as easily attributable to the new restrictions on handgun purchases as to the eased restrictions on carrying permits.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yes, this is quite true. People who site RTC laws as the reason for a localized reduction in violent crime are usually guilty of sloppy science and sloppy math.

There are dozens (if not hundreds) of factors which affect crime rates, and unless they are all looked at, a simple one-to-one comparison between crime rates and gun laws is fundamentally flawed.

For example, the local trend might be part of a larger national trend, and therefore the local gun law might have nothing to do with the reduction. The ECONOMY has a much, much bigger impact on crime rates than ANY gun law, so if the ecomony happens to improve (which it did throughout the 90's), then that would reduce violent crime rates more than any local gun law.

Additionally, as you mentioned, changes in gun laws are often associated with changes in police policies and tactics. There may be more community outreach, police bike patrols, or neighborhood watch programs implemented along with the new gun law and all of these things have an impact on crime rates too.

Looking at a one-to-one comparison between gun laws and crime rates is simplistic and misleading.

[meadish_sweetball]

In states which did experience reductions in violent crime, one cannot confidently attribute the reductions to RTC laws....The reduction in crime could be just as easily attributable to the new restrictions on handgun purchases as to the eased restrictions on carrying permits.

Yes, this is quite true. People who site RTC laws as the reason for a localized reduction in violent crime are usually guilty of sloppy science and sloppy math.

There are dozens (if not hundreds) of factors which affect crime rates, and unless they are all looked at, a simple one-to-one comparison between crime rates and gun laws is fundamentally flawed.

For example, the local trend might be part of a larger national trend, and therefore the local gun law might have nothing to do with the reduction. The ECONOMY has a much, much bigger impact on crime rates than ANY gun law, so if the ecomony happens to improve (which it did throughout the 90's), then that would reduce violent crime rates more than any local gun law.

Additionally, as you mentioned, changes in gun laws are often associated with changes in police policies and tactics. There may be more community outreach, police bike patrols, or neighborhood watch programs implemented along with the new gun law and all of these things have an impact on crime rates too.

Looking at a one-to-one comparison between gun laws and crime rates is simplistic and misleading.

Nobody knows how many factors are actually involved. Statistics can be manipulated to the extreme to prove a point.

If our statistical models were really advanced, we would be able to predict the fluctuations of the economy and the impact of this or that law on society. The truth is, we can't. At present, science provides some extra guidance at best. People's behaviour is too complex to squeeze inside a mathematical model.

[Covertjay]

6/10 gun deaths are a domestic dispute........... and you know how jelious they are...................

Instead of the somtam mortar you may get a hollow point......but it's your constitutional right to be retarded PILGRIM.

[toastwars]

Anybody know the ruling on Farangs owning handguns indoors? Big bollocking and possible deportation and/or prison sentence, or nothing too heavy?...I suspect the former.

Reason I ask...say, for instance, I was living in Pattani with my family and was worried about the recent goings-on in the region and therefore decided to purchase a handgun in the unlikely, but possible, event that Muslim radicals wanted to injur, or kidnap, my family. What would happen if I shot one of them, dead? Nothing, due to self-defence because he was on our, sorry, wife's property up to no good, or life in prison because I killed a Thai national, which wouldn't have happened if I wasn't there in the first place attitude?

Just a thought for a peaceful Sunday afternoon...

jackr

Get some help for that paranoid delusional streak that you are displaying,you maniac. Please don't move to bangkok I like to sleep at night, and there are enough lunatics with shooters around without having another move in

[Pudgimelon]

The reason for these actions are that most but not all criminals are really cowards so they really can't take a chance of being hurt themselves

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

If this is the case, then a replica gun would serve exactly the same purpose as a real gun.

In most crimes, the victim is threatened by an UNARMED assailant. And since--as you assert--most criminals are cowards--then simply threatening them with a weapon is all that is necessary (actually firing the weapon is NOT necessary in MOST cases).

"But what about armed bad guys? etc... blah, blah, blah", you say.

Yeah, yeah, all you macho Clint Eastwood-wannabes are going to be saying, "I'd rather have a REAL .357 Magnum than some wussy replica if I'm going to be facing down some bad guy with a real gun."

Please..........

Try to be realistic guys. The odds of you facing an armed assailant are small. The odds of you getting the drop on an armed assailant are remote. And the odds of you whipping out your piece and winning a firefight with an armed assailant are astronomically remote.

Face it. In a typical crime-encounter, the bad guy is going to be unarmed or armed with a knife or club. If you whip out a replica, he's going to piss himself and run. And you'll be just as safe as you would have been with a real gun. Likewise, in a home break-in, the odds of you being home are SMALL compared with the odds of you being away. So in the RARE cases where you encounter a burglar in your home, again, a replica would serve the exact same purpose as a real gun.

That is, IF your purpose is to protect yourself by threatening the bad guy.

It appears though, that some of you do not see that as your purpose. You see a gun as a way to PUNISH the bad guy, and THAT is why you think a replica is insufficient.

Also, in the EXTREMELY RARE cases where you are the target of an assassination or kidnapping attempt, then it is highly unlikely that the bad guys would wait for you to arm yourself before jumping you. In which case, you're kidding yourself if you think a gun is going to help you.

But again, we can debate hypothetical situations until we are blue-in-the-face. The simple fact is that guns make lousy self-defense tools. You can dream up "what-if" scenarios and quote scaremongering stories all you want, you still can't change the facts.

People who think guns are good for self-defense are either woefully misinformed or CHOOSE to be a bunch of paranoid nervous-nellies.

When I lived in Florida, my next door neighbors were actual crack dealers (quite common thing in South Florida), and yet they never bothered me, never harrassed me, never threatened me, and never tried to break into my house. And I never felt the need for a gun and I never felt unsafe.

Why?

Because I had a nice big German Shepard. She was gentle as a lamb, but fortunately the drug dealers never figured that out. It was quite amusing to see them actually scramble off their porch every time I brought her out for a walk. They were absolutely terrified of my dog, heheh.

I lived in one of the roughest neighborhoods in South Florida (murders at 7-11 on a monthly basis, drug raids in all the schools, etc...). In fact, many of the people in my neighborhood ended up on that TV shop "Cops" (Broward County was a favorite stop on that TV show because it was such a s--thole). I've been on the business end of a 9mm pistol before (see, when you're sleeping, it's a bit harder to hear a person sneak in and press it up against your temple, which is what happened to me). So I have direct and personal knowledge of how USELESS a gun would have been in a "home-invasion" situation.

Now a dog isn't fool-proof. When I was up north once, a mugger approached me from behind while I was walking my dog through Chinatown and he hit me with a lead pipe in the back of the head and then again in the chin. Opened me up pretty good too (needed 20+ stitches). My dog did nothing (like I said, she was gentle as a lamb), and I'm glad she didn't because otherwise he might have hit her with the pipe too.

Fortunately, the guy was stoned out of his mind (he'd have to be to attack someone on a busy street walking a dog). So it wasn't much of a problem to take away the pipe and beat him senseless with it. Funny thing is, I actually got on "Real Stories of the Highway Patrol" for that one. Heheh, my mom flipped out when she saw me sitting on the curb with blood gushing out of my face .

I'm just bringing these stories up to contradict all those who say I've lived a sheltered life and don't know what it's like out in the "real world". I spent two years backpacking and travelling around the United States, paying my way with dishwashing jobs, warehouse jobs, and farm work. I've lived in some of the dirtiest, meanest neighborhoods in some of the most violent cities in America. I've never carried a gun and I've never NEEDED a gun.

That's not saying I haven't been in some very hairy situations, but what I am saying is that I don't go around WORRYING about bad situations. Someone carrying a gun around is someone who is WAITING for a bad situation to happen (in other words, looking for trouble). You believe a bad situation is inevitable, and therefore you think a gun is necessary. I believe a bad situation can be avoided most of the time, and when it can't, I believe that adding mayhem to the mix (a gun) isn't any more likely to get me out of that situation alive.

[Pudgimelon]

People's behaviour is too complex to squeeze inside a mathematical model.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

So what you're saying is that you agree with me, right?

Because if people's behavior is too complex to fit into a mathematical model, then those guys who are making a one-to-one comparison (that's a MATHEMATICAL comparison, by the way) between RTC laws and crime rates are using fundamentally flawed reasoning, correct?

They are trying to simplify a complex set of variables into a direct cause-and-effect relationship, which YOU are saying can't be done. Therefore, you agree that people who quote crime statistics as justification for RTC laws are wrong to do so.

[toastwars]

Thanks Thaiflyer, I am fine. Won't get into any more arguement now as it s pointless really. 

Yes,Stroll. They were trying to use less risky way in the UK by the police as they were never armed. But now since the 9/11 and the increasingly amount of armed drug dealers you now see armed police everywhere all over Uk, especially London.

No you don't, in certain sensitive areas, airports etc yes there are some armed police, they are all members of tactical firearms units,police in the uk are not trained in firearms use as a standard part of their training, and the use of firearms is increadably low in the UK. There was a period in London during the 80's when a bombing campain by the IRA was underway ( BTW thanks to all you patriotic Americans for funding the IRA for all those years while they bombed our cities. Glad to see you saw the error of your ways when it came home to roost, shame it wasn't sooner) when the number of armed patrolls was increased, when this threat was over you didn't see them any more, most armed responce units are in cars on patrol and ready to react to any call requiring them. i think there was somewhere in the region of ten murders involving firearms last year in the UK, compared to thousands in the USA, figures speak for themselves, And why don't Canadians spend all day gunning down their fellow countrymen?

[toastwars]

Then he told us that he carries his gun with him around the HOUSE at all time. When he sits on the sofa watching TV the gun is alway alongside him.

Can you say, "Paranoia?"

Well, I call it "experiences" Who are you or me to argue with a Thai who had experiences dealing with THAI crimes, THAI criminals, THAI criminal investigations and psychology of THAI criminals for 40 years? I use the word Thai in capital because that what we are talking about.. Thai criminals. Who are you? an expert in FARANG criminology? or are you a 20 something farang who has never experienced Thai crime in your life?

I once asked my brother why he carried gun all the time even when he was off duty. The answer " I may be off duty but the criminals are not and they carry their guns all the time if I don't carry my gun I might not be so lucky"

One of his "paranoia" experience is his young colleague, fresh from the cadet school,23yr old just started working only a few weeks. They went together to investigate some disturbance in a house. He did something that an experienced Thai police officer would have never done.....walked up to the front door unarmed and relaxed. He knocked and called the man out to talk to him standing right at the front door. Next minute he was shot dead, the guy inside shot him through the door as soon as he heard a police. Yes you tell my brother he is paranoia.

Anyway you have your own opinion and as a Thai I have mine so may be where you are from the crime rate is low,no one kill anyone and so on. Lucky you who live in such a world.

Maybe I know your brother, is he the cop who comes to my local bar, gets blind drunk with the gun stuck down the front of his pants? I really enjoy his visits

[siam]

Thanks Thaiflyer, I am fine. Won't get into any more arguement now as it s pointless really. 

Yes,Stroll. They were trying to use less risky way in the UK by the police as they were never armed. But now since the 9/11 and the increasingly amount of armed drug dealers you now see armed police everywhere all over Uk, especially London.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No you don't, in certain sensitive areas, airports etc yes there are some armed police, they are all members of tactical firearms units,police in the uk are not trained in firearms use as a standard part of their training, and the use of firearms is increadably low in the UK. There was a period in London during the 80's when a bombing campain by the IRA was underway ( BTW thanks to all you patriotic Americans for funding the IRA for all those years while they bombed our cities. Glad to see you saw the error of your ways when it came home to roost, shame it wasn't sooner) when the number of armed patrolls was increased, when this threat was over you didn't see them any more, most armed responce units are in cars on patrol and ready to react to any call requiring them. i think there was somewhere in the region of ten murders involving firearms last year in the UK, compared to thousands in the USA, figures speak for themselves, And why don't Canadians spend all day gunning down their fellow countrymen?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Probably the Canadians don't have the same genetic mix up,That make the Sceptics so crazy,Why do they think they are so better than everyone else?

I have a gun at home,Can be loaded in about 3 secs ready to fire,

I also use it quite often,The kids know never to go near the gun case let alone the Slugs for it,

I have taught the kids never to aim guns at anyone loaded or not,As they might take their eyes out,one day,Well that's their Fathers fault,For buying and not teaching them.Bloody BB's

Yes the Yanks have a lot to answer for but as you say they funded the IRA,I believe of Karma,and it always hurts more when it is on your own doorstep and it comes back to haunt you,

Pudgi so this gun theft,I suppose the Yardies and alike get their automatic weapons from Joe public?Or is that not included in your statistics,

If your cards are marked you are gonna get it,That's for sure,But i would rather have a gun,When i live out in the sticks in Gentle old LOS,I don't want to be easy pickings as Rich Farang lives on their own in the middle of Chaing Mai provence,

Thais know the law they're on your property after 12,Looking for trouble be prepared to meet your maker.

[toastwars]

Thanks Thaiflyer, I am fine. Won't get into any more arguement now as it s pointless really. 

Yes,Stroll. They were trying to use less risky way in the UK by the police as they were never armed. But now since the 9/11 and the increasingly amount of armed drug dealers you now see armed police everywhere all over Uk, especially London.

No you don't, in certain sensitive areas, airports etc yes there are some armed police, they are all members of tactical firearms units,police in the uk are not trained in firearms use as a standard part of their training, and the use of firearms is increadably low in the UK. There was a period in London during the 80's when a bombing campain by the IRA was underway ( BTW thanks to all you patriotic Americans for funding the IRA for all those years while they bombed our cities. Glad to see you saw the error of your ways when it came home to roost, shame it wasn't sooner) when the number of armed patrolls was increased, when this threat was over you didn't see them any more, most armed responce units are in cars on patrol and ready to react to any call requiring them. i think there was somewhere in the region of ten murders involving firearms last year in the UK, compared to thousands in the USA, figures speak for themselves, And why don't Canadians spend all day gunning down their fellow countrymen?

Probably the Canadians don't have the same genetic mix up,That make the Sceptics so crazy,Why do they think they are so better than everyone else?

I have a gun at home,Can be loaded in about 3 secs ready to fire,

I also use it quite often,The kids know never to go near the gun case let alone the Slugs for it,

I have taught the kids never to aim guns at anyone loaded or not,As they might take their eyes out,one day,Well that's their Fathers fault,For buying and not teaching them.Bloody BB's

Yes the Yanks have a lot to answer for but as you say they funded the IRA,I believe of Karma,and it always hurts more when it is on your own doorstep and it comes back to haunt you,

Pudgi so this gun theft,I suppose the Yardies and alike get their automatic weapons from Joe public?Or is that not included in your statistics,

If your cards are marked you are gonna get it,That's for sure,But i would rather have a gun,When i live out in the sticks in Gentle old LOS,I don't want to be easy pickings as Rich Farang lives on their own in the middle of Chaing Mai provence,

Thais know the law they're on your property after 12,Looking for trouble be prepared to meet your maker.

maniac

[jackr]

Anybody know the ruling on Farangs owning handguns indoors? Big bollocking and possible deportation and/or prison sentence, or nothing too heavy?...I suspect the former.

Reason I ask...say, for instance, I was living in Pattani with my family and was worried about the recent goings-on in the region and therefore decided to purchase a handgun in the unlikely, but possible, event that Muslim radicals wanted to injur, or kidnap, my family. What would happen if I shot one of them, dead? Nothing, due to self-defence because he was on our, sorry, wife's property up to no good, or life in prison because I killed a Thai national, which wouldn't have happened if I wasn't there in the first place attitude?

Just a thought for a peaceful Sunday afternoon...

jackr

Get some help for that paranoid delusional streak that you are displaying,you maniac. Please don't move to bangkok I like to sleep at night, and there are enough lunatics with shooters around without having another move in

Sounds like you're the paranoid one pal! How am I being a maniac by wanting to look after my family with a weapon under lock and key? Don't worry, I won't be in Bangkok waving my piece about if that's what you're getting at, one day is enough there. The original post was an inquiry as to whether or not a farang can have a gun; a topic related to Thailand. I'll probably never get a weapon but thought the post was apt with the recent goings-on. BTW, don't move up to Chiang Mai, there's no odd balls living up here and we certainly don't want one moving in.

[Ajarn]

Anybody know the ruling on Farangs owning handguns indoors? Big bollocking and possible deportation and/or prison sentence, or nothing too heavy?...I suspect the former.

Reason I ask...say, for instance, I was living in Pattani with my family and was worried about the recent goings-on in the region and therefore decided to purchase a handgun in the unlikely, but possible, event that Muslim radicals wanted to injur, or kidnap, my family. What would happen if I shot one of them, dead? Nothing, due to self-defence because he was on our, sorry, wife's property up to no good, or life in prison because I killed a Thai national, which wouldn't have happened if I wasn't there in the first place attitude?

Just a thought for a peaceful Sunday afternoon...

jackr

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Get some help for that paranoid delusional streak that you are displaying,you maniac. Please don't move to bangkok I like to sleep at night, and there are enough lunatics with shooters around without having another move in

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Sounds like you're the paranoid one pal! How am I being a maniac by wanting to look after my family with a weapon under lock and key? Don't worry, I won't be in Bangkok waving my piece about if that's what you're getting at, one day is enough there. The original post was an inquiry as to whether or not a farang can have a gun; a topic related to Thailand. I'll probably never get a weapon but thought the post was apt with the recent goings-on. BTW, don't move up to Chiang Mai, there's no odd balls living up here and we certainly don't want one moving in.

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No oddballs in Chiang Mai? Jack let me take you on a tour sometime. My sense is there are mostly oddballs here. And I include myself, proudly!

And, me thinks maybe you, too, Jack

To me, 'oddballs' are fine...Like Free Thinkers, perhaps. Now, if your're talking about a**h*les and idiots, that's a different story, but there are plenty of those here too....

[siamruby]

No oddballs in Chiang Mai? Jack let me take you on a tour sometime. My sense is there are mostly oddballs here. And I include myself, proudly!

And, me thinks maybe you, too, Jack

To me, 'oddballs' are fine...Like Free Thinkers, perhaps. Now, if your're talking about a**h*les and idiots, that's a different story, but there are plenty of those here too....

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Totally agree Ajarn, May I join your club too when I move up there?

[pal78]

Interesting, to know peoples' views on gun ownership. I was at my in-laws house about a year ago, and a guy on a motorbike drove by slowly looking into the houses along the street. We noticed that he made a second pass, and he looked like he was planning on robbing someone. We observed him quietly waiting to see what he would do, and suddenly we heard the folks next door get hysterical. My wife said they were shouting "GET THE GUN, GET THE GUN".

Up to that point I was not worried for the safety of anyone in the neighborhood at all. It was unlikely that the little guy on the motorbike would try to rob a house full of people, and if he tried to steel from any houses near my in-laws place we could have called the cops, and the worst that could happen is that he'd make off with some money, or gold or whatever. Nobodies life was threatened.

But now that I knew that the neighbor had a gun, and was scrambling to get it ready my attitude was entirely different. I was scared. My thoughts went from observing the suspect and attempting to note as much information as possible that might be used to catch him, to thoughts of how best to protect my wife and me from a possible stray bullet.

People with guns scare me more than robbers. Armed police scare me!

But peoples filthy dogs scare the crap outta me too.

Anyway, I've been involved in this argument this people many times, and eventually I've learned that people who want guns (for whatever reason) will not listen to any reasonable argument that they are faced with. But I have to be honest and admit that I don't listen to their arguments either, because I believe that it's safer to run away than fight, better to hand over your money than pull a gun, and better to have to buy a new DVD player than to shoot someone (regardless of their moral or social background).

The original poster's reason for having a gun was protection, not from robbers, but from the unrest in the south. What causes unrest? Let's just say that more guns won't solve the problem, and if you're not welcomed somewhere i would suggest that it's wiser to leave than to try and fight for your safety. If you came into my house and offended me somehow... but you didn't understand how... and I was like "get out of my house or I'll beat the crap outta you", I think you'd probably leave, regardless of if I was right or wrong, or if it was a fair reason or not. Because it's my house, not yours. If you feel for any reason that the people in the south don't like you being there... why do you stay? It's not your country.

I'm not saying if you don't like it get outta there... I'm saying if they don't like you, and don't like you to the point that you feel they might kill you or a family member... i don't think it's worth staying there. The scenery would have to be &lt;deleted&gt; nice.

[Ajarn]

I'm not saying if you don't like it get outta there... I'm saying if they don't like you, and don't like you to the point that you feel they might kill you or a family member... i don't think it's worth staying there

That was a main factor in my leaving my birthplace, and it would be the likely reason for my leaving Thailand.... It's the peace of mind aspect that's most important. For me, a gun just doesn't give that peace of mind... My priority is making sure they don't even get close to the confrontational stage....

I feel I've taken some basic security precautions, and based on my history of experiences here, I don't feel very vulnerable at all regarding my personal safety. And I've a shitzu puppy watchin' my back now, too.

[jackr]

Anyway, I've been involved in this argument this people many times, and eventually I've learned that people who want guns (for whatever reason) will not listen to any reasonable argument that they are faced with. But I have to be honest and admit that I don't listen to their arguments either, because I believe that it's safer to run away than fight, better to hand over your money than pull a gun, and better to have to buy a new DVD player than to shoot someone (regardless of their moral or social background).

...what a hypocrite. You say that gun owners don't listen to an argument against gun ownership yet you refuse to listen to what they have to say.

The last bit's the best....what if they don't want your dvd but your daughter or wife, for instance? Moving away ain't going to help much because there are bad people the world over, buddy.

[jackr]

Anybody know the ruling on Farangs owning handguns indoors? Big bollocking and possible deportation and/or prison sentence, or nothing too heavy?...I suspect the former.

Reason I ask...say, for instance, I was living in Pattani with my family and was worried about the recent goings-on in the region and therefore decided to purchase a handgun in the unlikely, but possible, event that Muslim radicals wanted to injur, or kidnap, my family. What would happen if I shot one of them, dead? Nothing, due to self-defence because he was on our, sorry, wife's property up to no good, or life in prison because I killed a Thai national, which wouldn't have happened if I wasn't there in the first place attitude?

Just a thought for a peaceful Sunday afternoon...

jackr

Get some help for that paranoid delusional streak that you are displaying,you maniac. Please don't move to bangkok I like to sleep at night, and there are enough lunatics with shooters around without having another move in

Sounds like you're the paranoid one pal! How am I being a maniac by wanting to look after my family with a weapon under lock and key? Don't worry, I won't be in Bangkok waving my piece about if that's what you're getting at, one day is enough there. The original post was an inquiry as to whether or not a farang can have a gun; a topic related to Thailand. I'll probably never get a weapon but thought the post was apt with the recent goings-on. BTW, don't move up to Chiang Mai, there's no odd balls living up here and we certainly don't want one moving in.

No oddballs in Chiang Mai? Jack let me take you on a tour sometime. My sense is there are mostly oddballs here. And I include myself, proudly!

And, me thinks maybe you, too, Jack

To me, 'oddballs' are fine...Like Free Thinkers, perhaps. Now, if your're talking about a**h*les and idiots, that's a different story, but there are plenty of those here too....

...yeah, I know there are really, Ajarn. You ever seen the old farang wondering around with the bottle of chang all day? Not you is it? Just wanted that toastwar guy to maybe feel he was the only oddball in the world. Bit of a strange one that.

Maybe I'll take you up on that tour and a beer sometime.

[Pudgimelon]

....what if....

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What if...

What if...

What if....

What if....

WHAT IF....!

What is it with all the "what ifs"??

You respond to reasonable, rational opinions and FACTS with outrageously hypothetical "what if" scenarios.

What if they poison your dogs?

What if they want to rape your wife, daughter and goldfish?

What if the communists/muslims/boogiemen invade?

What if the government is evil and power-mad? (hint: it already is, and you ain't doing so bad, eh?)

What if the bad guys have all the guns and the liberals force me to wear a skirt?

etc.... etc... etc.... ad nauseum....

Good grief man. Please step out of your paranoid delusions for a minute and take a look around. The world isn't THAT bad off. Sure, life has some risk involved in living it, but that doesn't mean you have to be scared and afraid ALL the time.

When was the last time someone tried to poison your dogs, steal your DVD, rape your family and assassinate YOU on your doorstep??

Seriously. When!??!?!

Last week? Last month? Last year?

These "what if" scenarios you keep bringing up are exceedingly RARE. Yes, they happen to thousands of people every day, that is true, but there are BILLIONS of people on this planet, so the odds that they will happen to YOU are REMOTE.

I understand that you may not be that bright in math, so this may be a difficult thing for you to grasp completely, but try to imagine "bad things" as some sort of "bad lottery". What are the odds of you winning a lottery (any lottery)? Slim, right?

So would you go around spending money every day like you were going to win the lottery tomorrow? No, because that would be stupid. You don't PLAN to win the lottery (a good lottery with lots of money). You might HOPE to win the lottery, but nobody is stupid enough to live their life as if winning the lottery is INEVITABLE.

And yet that's what you are doing (only in reverse). You are living your life as if the bad lottery is inevitable. You are walking around scared and afraid every day, because you really believe that the would is filled with "bad people" lurking around, just waiting for the chance to do you harm.

And so you feel that a gun is "necessary", because you believe that it is inevitable that you will eventually win the "bad lottery" and become a victim of a violent crime.

You refuse to listen to reason, and you refuse to think about this topic rationally, because to do that, it would require you to let go of your fear. And that's difficult for you to do, because at the core of your being, you are a very scared little boy.

Even when it's explicitly spelled out to you that a gun is not the cure-all security blanket you think it is (in most of the "what if" scenarios you and other have mentioned, a gun would be of questionable assistance, and might actually cause more harm than good), you STILL refuse to let go to this notion that "a gun = self defense".

IT DOESN'T!

Why do you cling to that false belief with such tenacity?

I guess fear is a powerful thing, and some people just chose to let it dominate their lives. Sad, really.

Look, simply put, if you can't think of a better rebuttal than "what if", you're really grasping at straws. It's time to give up and admit that you may need to reconsider your reasons for gun-ownership. If you're not hunting or sport-shooting, the "necessity" of a gun in your home is questionable. You don't NEED a Ferrari today simply because tomorrow you MIGHT win the lottery. Likewise, you don't NEED a gun today simply because tomorrow you MIGHT become a statistic.

As the saying goes, "S--t happens".

[Ajarn]

Sounds like you're the paranoid one pal! How am I being a maniac by wanting to look after my family with a weapon under lock and key? Don't worry, I won't be in Bangkok waving my piece about if that's what you're getting at, one day is enough there. The original post was an inquiry as to whether or not a farang can have a gun; a topic related to Thailand. I'll probably never get a weapon but thought the post was apt with the recent goings-on. BTW, don't move up to Chiang Mai, there's no odd balls living up here and we certainly don't want one moving in.

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No oddballs in Chiang Mai? Jack let me take you on a tour sometime. My sense is there are mostly oddballs here. And I include myself, proudly!

And, me thinks maybe you, too, Jack

To me, 'oddballs' are fine...Like Free Thinkers, perhaps. Now, if your're talking about a**h*les and idiots, that's a different story, but there are plenty of those here too....

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...yeah, I know there are really, Ajarn. You ever seen the old farang wondering around with the bottle of chang all day? Not you is it? Just wanted that toastwar guy to maybe feel he was the only oddball in the world. Bit of a strange one that.

Maybe I'll take you up on that tour and a beer sometime.

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No, that's not me, Jack. I don't drink.... I'm the old farang wondering around with a paintball gun. You're welcome to play... :

Most of the stranger types here are fairly harmless, like the guy you described- and there's the Pickle King,

Some others are more nefarious, even dangerous, like the recent immigrant who calls himself a photog...

[RamdomChances]

....what if....

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What if....

WHAT IF....!

What is it with all the "what ifs"??

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Good point...... but what if one night a team of highly trained ninja assasins intent on cutting me up into little pieces and raping my wife and cows, use a rubber mat get over my electric fence, poison my hunger crazed man eating tigers, uses a boat to get over the crocodile infested moat, disable the automatic laser cannons and kill the teams of ex-navy seals that randomly patrol the house.

Would'nt a gun be useful then