The Purpose Of Life

[Neeranam]

I was just wondering about the Buddhist's view on the purpose of life. I know HH The Dalai Lama said it was to help others or at least not to hurt them. I've herad most Buddhists say it is to end suffering then end rebirth. I'm confused - if the purpose of birth is to end rebirth, isn't this contadictory?

Like most questions I have on Buddhism, I'm probably hearing the wrong language. Birth and re-bith probably mean something differnet in Dhamma language???

[camerata]

There is no purpose of life other than the one we create for ourselves. Mine is to reduce suffering in this life and maybe get a glimpse of nibbana. Thinking about rebirth is largely a distraction.

If we think there is some purpose of life other than one we create ourselves, it implies an external creator who has some purpose for us, and then we quickly get back to the god delusion.

That's my take on it, anyway.

[Neeranam]

There is no purpose of life other than the one we create for ourselves. Mine is to reduce suffering in this life and maybe get a glimpse of nibbana. Thinking about rebirth is largely a distraction.

If we think there is some purpose of life other than one we create ourselves, it implies an external creator who has some purpose for us, and then we quickly get back to the god delusion.

That's my take on it, anyway.

That's a pretty bold statement.

[jumnien]

There is no purpose of life other than the one we create for ourselves. Mine is to reduce suffering in this life and maybe get a glimpse of nibbana. Thinking about rebirth is largely a distraction.

If we think there is some purpose of life other than one we create ourselves, it implies an external creator who has some purpose for us, and then we quickly get back to the god delusion.

That's my take on it, anyway.

That's a pretty bold statement.

A wise buddhist monk when presented with some spiritual teachings which included the word "God" said there was nothing in the teachings that seemed to contradict buddhist teachings. He suggested that if you just substituted the word "good" for the word "God" a buddhist would have no problem with it. Such an attitude does not come easy to resentful atheists, however.

[Brucenkhamen]

I was just wondering about the Buddhist's view on the purpose of life. I know HH The Dalai Lama said it was to help others or at least not to hurt them. I've herad most Buddhists say it is to end suffering then end rebirth. I'm confused - if the purpose of birth is to end rebirth, isn't this contadictory?

Like most questions I have on Buddhism, I'm probably hearing the wrong language. Birth and re-bith probably mean something differnet in Dhamma language???

Life is it's own purpose, the purpose of life is to live, it's that simple.

Beyond that we can add our own goals aspirations and ideals, which may be good things, but these are things we've added to life not the purpose of life, and they do tend to detract from the direct experience of life.

That's what I think anyway.

[rockyysdt]

There is no purpose of life other than the one we create for ourselves. Mine is to reduce suffering in this life and maybe get a glimpse of nibbana. Thinking about rebirth is largely a distraction.

If we think there is some purpose of life other than one we create ourselves, it implies an external creator who has some purpose for us, and then we quickly get back to the god delusion.

That's my take on it, anyway.

Hi Camerata.

Why limit your goal to a glimpse?

This life could turn out to be your big one.

Whlie there is breath there is possibility.

Edited August 19, 2008 by rockyysdt

[camerata]

That's a pretty bold statement.

Not really. Purpose implies intent. If the purpose of my life does not arise from my own intent, whose intent does it come from? The only reasonable answer seems to be some kind of god.

We can say things like "Nature's purpose for us is to survive," but that doesn't make a lot of sense to me since Nature doesn't have any intent. Saying things like "the purpose of our birth is to..." is already hinting at some intelligent agent that caused us to be born for a specific reason. IMO, the whole idea of being born for a reason is just another product of the ego. A Buddhist knows that we were born as a result of cause and effect, and that's all there is to it. Assigning a purpose to life is up to us.

[camerata]

Why limit your goal to a glimpse?

This life could turn out to be your big one.

Whlie there is breathe there is possibility.

Well, I'm just being realistic. I don't think there is much chance of attaining nibbana unless one is prepared to spend half a lifetime in the monkhood. Ajahn Chah said if you've spent 20 years accumulating defilements, it may well take another 20 years to get rid of them.

[jumnien]

That's a pretty bold statement.

Not really. Purpose implies intent. If the purpose of my life does not arise from my own intent, whose intent does it come from? The only reasonable answer seems to be some kind of god.

We can say things like "Nature's purpose for us is to survive," but that doesn't make a lot of sense to me since Nature doesn't have any intent. Saying things like "the purpose of our birth is to..." is already hinting at some intelligent agent that caused us to be born for a specific reason. IMO, the whole idea of being born for a reason is just another product of the ego. A Buddhist knows that we were born as a result of cause and effect, and that's all there is to it. Assigning a purpose to life is up to us.

The Dalai Lama said the purpose of life is to be happy, basically a reiteration of every other spiritual path. Nihilism says it's all just cause and effect for no purpose.

[rockyysdt]

Life is it's own purpose, the purpose of life is to live, it's that simple.

That's what I think anyway.

Hi Bruce.

Didn't the Buddha talk about the purpose of life?

A regular theme about life in my mind is that most people seem to waste theirs.

The wastage to me appears to be in time as this is very limited.

They appear to do this through over indulgence, laziness, sloth, torpor, inaction, compulsion, addiction etc.

If one of lifes purposes is not to waste it, then living life practicing acute self awareness in order to overcome these afflictions could be a way of discovering your lifes purpose.

Failing to do this may leave you on your death bed feeling overwhelmingly unfulfilled.

[camerata]

The Dalai Lama said the purpose of life is to be happy, basically a reiteration of every other spiritual path. Nihilism says it's all just cause and effect for no purpose.

As I said above, the purpose I've assigned to my life is to reduce suffering, i.e. to be happy. That isn't nihilism.

[rockyysdt]

There is no purpose of life other than the one we create for ourselves. Mine is to reduce suffering in this life and maybe get a glimpse of nibbana. Thinking about rebirth is largely a distraction.

If we think there is some purpose of life other than one we create ourselves, it implies an external creator who has some purpose for us, and then we quickly get back to the god delusion.

That's my take on it, anyway.

I know Buddhism is often quoted as being an atheistic religion, but that doesn't mean God does not exist.

Our problem is defining God.

If you visualise the Christian God depicted throughout the middle ages it's easy to come to your conclusion.

If you visualise God as infinity with infinite posibilities and nibbana is reunification with infinity, or as is often quoted, self realisation that we always were part of infinity, appearing as a finite manifestation, then God is back in the picture.

Anything short of that would seem to relegate Buddhism as a sort of hobby.

Edited August 19, 2008 by rockyysdt

[jumnien]

The Dalai Lama said the purpose of life is to be happy, basically a reiteration of every other spiritual path. Nihilism says it's all just cause and effect for no purpose.

As I said above, the purpose I've assigned to my life is to reduce suffering, i.e. to be happy. That isn't nihilism.

Who is the "I" who you feel is assigning the purpose and who is the owner of the "my" who owns a life, grasshopper!

[camerata]

If one of lifes purposes is not to waste it, then living life practicing acute self awareness in order to overcome these afflictions could be a way of discovering your lifes purpose.

Failing to do this may leave you on your death bed feeling overwhelmingly unfulfilled.

For me, this is a key point of the teachings. If we waste our lives, for sure we are going to regret it and suffer as we approach death. If we don't want to suffer in that particular way, we should be aware of the present moment as much as possible throughout our lives - no replaying the past and no fantasizing about the future. In other words, less thinking. This seems to me to be a strategy for living life rather than a purpose, though.

[rockyysdt]

Who is the "I" who you feel is assigning the purpose and who is the owner of the "my" who owns a life, grasshopper!

Judging by what I've been learning over a period, it appears that we're all very much grounded by our egos.

It seems to me that the only way out is not to analyse things logically but to silence the mind and to expose oneself to the power within.

I'm afraid that guidance could be a way of predetermining what you will find.

[jumnien]

Who is the "I" who you feel is assigning the purpose and who is the owner of the "my" who owns a life, grasshopper!

Judging by what I've been learning over a period, it appears that we're all very much grounded by our egos.

It seems to me that the only way out is not to analyse things logically but to silence the mind and to expose oneself to the power within.

I'm afraid that guidance could be a way of predetermining what you will find.

Going it alone in spiritual matters is dangerous and often delusionary. Follow the path and the people who have been on it before you. It's easy!

[camerata]

Who is the "I" who you feel is assigning the purpose and who is the owner of the "my" who owns a life, grasshopper!

Everyone has an ego until they attain nibbana. But none of this explains how anyone can have an externally created purpose in life without some entity having created it. If people want to believe there is a purpose to life other than what they choose themselves, that's up to them and it's fine by me.

[rockyysdt]

Going it alone in spiritual matters is dangerous and often delusionary. Follow the path and the people who have been on it before you. It's easy!

I supose it's a fine line between becoming delusional or being brainwashed.

Judging by my experience of human character, I'd sat good teachers would be in the minority.

Having said that I need to do something.

I'm suffering more now than I ever have, and I can't see any respite.

I think I must have been a particularly evil person in my last incarnation.

Edited August 19, 2008 by rockyysdt

[Naam]

The Dalai Lama said the purpose of life is to be happy, basically a reiteration of every other spiritual path. Nihilism says it's all just cause and effect for no purpose.

As I said above, the purpose I've assigned to my life is to reduce suffering, i.e. to be happy. That isn't nihilism.

isn't that something quite normal for a human being?

[jumnien]

Who is the "I" who you feel is assigning the purpose and who is the owner of the "my" who owns a life, grasshopper!

Everyone has an ego until they attain nibbana. But none of this explains how anyone can have an externally created purpose in life without some entity having created it. If people want to believe there is a purpose to life other than what they choose themselves, that's up to them and it's fine by me.

You are using logic to dissect something far beyond your logical ability as a human. Don't trouble yourself with the "entity" argument or you'll end up like Richard Dawkins without the cash.

[rockyysdt]

The Dalai Lama said the purpose of life is to be happy, basically a reiteration of every other spiritual path. Nihilism says it's all just cause and effect for no purpose.

As I said above, the purpose I've assigned to my life is to reduce suffering, i.e. to be happy. That isn't nihilism.

isn't that something quite normal for a human being?

Hi Naam.

I think the key in this forum is how one goes about reducing suffering.

Example: Heavy beer drinkers think happiness is to drink lots of beer. Unfortunately, instead bringing happiness they end up suffering.

[Naam]

The Dalai Lama said the purpose of life is to be happy, basically a reiteration of every other spiritual path. Nihilism says it's all just cause and effect for no purpose.

As I said above, the purpose I've assigned to my life is to reduce suffering, i.e. to be happy. That isn't nihilism.

isn't that something quite normal for a human being?

Hi Naam.

I think the key in this forum is how one goes about reducing suffering. Example: Heavy beer drinkers think happiness is to drink lots of beer. Unfortunately, instead bringing happiness they end up suffering.

i think that's quite a long shot Rocky. in my opinion reducing suffering means that suffering did or does exist, not only temporarily but rather permanently. that's what i gather from Camerata's posting.

i am not claiming that i never suffered in my life. losing (as in my case) an only child causes quite some suffering. but i don't see any remedy by using my faith and belief (i am not a Buddhist) to reduce that suffering.

[camerata]

isn't that something quite normal for a human being?

Sure, and the Buddha recognized this when he formulated the Four Noble Truths. He had the human condition all figured out: We all experience suffering and we'd all like less of it. The Noble Eightfold Path is his strategy for achieving that.

I think that when the Dalai Lama, Ajahn Chah, et al say "The purpose of life is to be happy" or "The purpose of life is to attain nibbana" they are phrasing the answer like that because the question was phrased like that. But what they are really saying is that through cause and effect we are all here and all suffering, but the Buddha has shown us a way out.

IMO, wondering about the purpose of life leads to proliferation, discursive thought and... suffering. We should be living life, and living it in a particular way.

[camerata]

i am not claiming that i never suffered in my life. losing (as in my case) an only child causes quite some suffering. but i don't see any remedy by using my faith and belief (i am not a Buddhist) to reduce that suffering.

When you look into it deeply, Naam, it's not about faith, it's about training the mind to see things differently. Specifically, it's about letting go.

[camerata]

Judging by my experience of human character, I'd sat good teachers would be in the minority.

Having said that I need to do something.

If you find it difficult to trust teachers, I think the best strategy is to go straight to the heart of the Buddha's teaching - parts of the suttas, the vinaya and other bits of the Pali Canon. Then bear in mind that the Buddha's main message to his serious followers (i.e. the monks) was to attain nibbana in this life. You can then set aside anything that isn't related to that goal, whether its in the scriptures or coming from a teacher. That way you're not totally going it alone, which is kind of dangerous.

[sabaijai]

There is no purpose of life other than the one we create for ourselves. Mine is to reduce suffering in this life and maybe get a glimpse of nibbana. Thinking about rebirth is largely a distraction.

If we think there is some purpose of life other than one we create ourselves, it implies an external creator who has some purpose for us, and then we quickly get back to the god delusion.

That's my take on it, anyway.

I know Buddhism is often quoted as being an atheistic religion, but that doesn't mean God does not exist.

Our problem is defining God.

If you visualise the Christian God depicted throughout the middle ages it's easy to come to your conclusion.

If you visualise God as infinity with infinite posibilities and nibbana is reunification with infinity, or as is often quoted, self realisation that we always were part of infinity, appearing as a finite manifestation, then God is back in the picture.

Anything short of that would seem to relegate Buddhism as a sort of hobby.

Except that that is not how nibbana is defined ('reunification with infinity'). There's a previous thread on Nirvana: is it Heaven (or God)?.

Also Buddhism doesn't say god/God doesn't exist, only that any and all such entities are impermanent, unsubstantial and subject to suffering.

Nothing in the Tipitaka mentions any sort of deity somehow identified with nibbana or, for that matter, with infinity.

[jumnien]

There is no purpose of life other than the one we create for ourselves. Mine is to reduce suffering in this life and maybe get a glimpse of nibbana. Thinking about rebirth is largely a distraction.

If we think there is some purpose of life other than one we create ourselves, it implies an external creator who has some purpose for us, and then we quickly get back to the god delusion.

That's my take on it, anyway.

I know Buddhism is often quoted as being an atheistic religion, but that doesn't mean God does not exist.

Our problem is defining God.

If you visualise the Christian God depicted throughout the middle ages it's easy to come to your conclusion.

If you visualise God as infinity with infinite posibilities and nibbana is reunification with infinity, or as is often quoted, self realisation that we always were part of infinity, appearing as a finite manifestation, then God is back in the picture.

Anything short of that would seem to relegate Buddhism as a sort of hobby.

Except that that is not how nibbana is defined ('reunification with infinity').

Also Buddhism doesn't say god/God doesn't exist, only that any and all such entities are impermanent, unsubstantial and subject to suffering.

Nothing in the Tipitaka mentions any sort of deity somehow identified with nibbana or, for that matter, with infinity.

I've never thought of God as an entity, but as a quality, such as perfection or compassion.

[sabaijai]

There is no purpose of life other than the one we create for ourselves. Mine is to reduce suffering in this life and maybe get a glimpse of nibbana. Thinking about rebirth is largely a distraction.

If we think there is some purpose of life other than one we create ourselves, it implies an external creator who has some purpose for us, and then we quickly get back to the god delusion.

That's my take on it, anyway.

I know Buddhism is often quoted as being an atheistic religion, but that doesn't mean God does not exist.

Our problem is defining God.

If you visualise the Christian God depicted throughout the middle ages it's easy to come to your conclusion.

If you visualise God as infinity with infinite posibilities and nibbana is reunification with infinity, or as is often quoted, self realisation that we always were part of infinity, appearing as a finite manifestation, then God is back in the picture.

Anything short of that would seem to relegate Buddhism as a sort of hobby.

Except that that is not how nibbana is defined ('reunification with infinity').

Also Buddhism doesn't say god/God doesn't exist, only that any and all such entities are impermanent, unsubstantial and subject to suffering.

Nothing in the Tipitaka mentions any sort of deity somehow identified with nibbana or, for that matter, with infinity.

I've never thought of God as an entity, but as a quality, such as perfection or compassion.

Can't find such a notion in the Bible or the Tipitaka, but good for you you can start your own religion

[Brucenkhamen]

Didn't the Buddha talk about the purpose of life?

Not that I'm aware of.

A regular theme about life in my mind is that most people seem to waste theirs.

The wastage to me appears to be in time as this is very limited.

They appear to do this through over indulgence, laziness, sloth, torpor, inaction, compulsion, addiction etc.

If one of lifes purposes is not to waste it, then living life practicing acute self awareness in order to overcome these afflictions could be a way of discovering your lifes purpose.

Failing to do this may leave you on your death bed feeling overwhelmingly unfulfilled.

It's a good thing not to waste ones life, it's a good goal to have and I have this goal myself, I hope to achieve something with my life but this is a seperate thing from the reason for "life" existing in the first place.

But saying the purpose of life is not to waste it is like saying the purpose of Cars is not to waste petrol, it's a good goal to have and I have this goal myself but I didn't buy my car so I can waste less petrol.

[Naam]

i am not claiming that i never suffered in my life. losing (as in my case) an only child causes quite some suffering. but i don't see any remedy by using my faith and belief (i am not a Buddhist) to reduce that suffering.

When you look into it deeply, Naam, it's not about faith, it's about training the mind to see things differently. Specifically, it's about letting go.

i am trying hard Camerata. since three years. but it's easier said than done. received kind advice from a handful of fellow TV-members who found quite some peace of mind by embracing Buddhism. did some "studying" and admired the wealth of wisdom embedded in the teachings of Buddha. but gave up after some months. reason: as a former scientist and engineer who worked and still works with hard facts i just could not cope.