Problems With Thai Stepson

[Macclad]

I've been with my Thai wife for nearly 5 years now.She has two Thai sons,aged 11 and 16,from a previous marriage to a Thai man.

I cant fault my wife .She takes good care of me and her sons and keeps the house tidy and clean etc.She's not afraid of hard work and is very kindhearted.

I get on really well with the 11 year old boy.True,he's naughty sometimes but thats to be expected and we have a good laugh together,like a father and son should do.

The problem is the 16 year old.He's not very bright (not that I hold that against him) and isnt interested in school.Last year we found he had been bunking off school a fair bit and he was one of only two boys who failed to attain his grades for that year.We arranged for him to do retakes of the subjects he had failed but that took up almost 3 months of the new school year.

My wife decided that as he had missed 3 months of his current year it would be better if he skipped this curriculum till next year ie. take the subjects a year behind.

His character is not good.Lying and cheating seem to be second nature to him.Now he is not at school till next year his life seems to consist of lazing in bed till at least lunchtime,then going out playing online games in the afternoon and then meeting up with his mates at night smoking and drinking Thai whisky and coming home only when he feels like it.

I am not happy about this.My wife says try to understand him as he is only young.But he is abusive towards her and so lazy when asked to do even the simplest of household chores.Too be honest he doesnt listen to my wife and its only when I speak firmly to him that he will do anything.

Sometimes he doesnt come home or not till the early hours.He's only 16 years old and thats just not on as far as I am concerned.

I found him rooting through my wifes handbag in our bedroom once,maybe looking for money.My wife told me he did this before she met me.

I said why doesnt he get a job whilst hes not at school and make a bit of money but hes not interested.Too much like hard work.

For me,I wouldnt give him any money till he improves,just feed him,but I know my wife will relent and give him some baht every time.

Personally I feel like beating the living shit out of him but what would that achieve other than making me feel better in the short term !

His personality sames to be exactly the same as his fathers,a complete waster,drunkard and womaniser.

Its reaching the stage where I feel this boy is spoiling my life big time.I'd be so happy if he went to live with his grandparents three hours drive away.

But that would be passing the buck.He would just spoil their life.

I've even said to my wife if he doesnt go then I will.Again,unfair on my wife and younger son for they have done nothing wrong.

But,on the other side of the coin,if he doesnt go I am left living with a complete waster for possibly the rest of my life,not fair on me.

So,grateful for any ideas people might have as to how this can be resolved.I should say that,other than for this boy,I would have a great life over here.

I didnt leave stressed out UK for even more stress in Thailand.

Thanks for any help/advice.

[NotNew2You]

Yeah...women with kids are a real downer. I would go near one with a 10-foot pole. You made your bed...now just looks like you'll have to sleep in it. That, or leave the relationship as you will never turn a mother against her son no matter how bad he becomes. Also, a danger the younger son picks up these bad traits from his pee-chai.

[nidhogg]

Thanks for any help/advice.

Sympathize with your position. My 2 cents (for what its worth) is you real problem lies not with the boy, but with his mother. As long as the two of you do not agree a common approach, and she STICKS by it, you are just wasting your time.

Time and time again I see Thai kids ruined by their "doting" parents (or mothers) who let them get away with anything, and then can't understand why they turn out bad.

Work on the mother. If you can't get her on board, you have to pick one of the other options.

[Pushit]

You need professional advice t move forward with this issue, try to locate a counsellor and take both your wife and kids to discuss.

[petitechevre]

many will disagree but at 16, hes old enough to receive a beating imo, he's probably already fought with other kids.. dont see the problem, its for his own good.

but i would really prefer to scare to living shit out of him

i would personaly grab him by the throat pretty hard untill he coculdnt breathe than tell him he has 3 days to get a job of 20hours a week+/ and to fix his nightly shedule to something decent or im sending his sorry ass to a school with dormitory very very very far away or locking him in the house for 1month with only food he doesnt appreciate.

I mean if hes about to become the equivalent of a drunktard tuktuk driver, why not go overboard and dry some drastic on a young adult? you got nothing to lose, if it doesnt work.. we'll he can just stop smooching off his mother and get his own place with his bad buddies.

Keeping him around like that you are just risking the future of the good one.

Again, if someone doesnt agree, dont bother replying. My dad beat the living shit out of me when i was going in that direction and it changed me, took me 2 years to forgive him now im thankfull and ive known many other people who had the same path, they ended up living in the streets, then coming back home and changing totaly to a nice life.

Some people dont learn from hugs and cuddles.

and at 16 you are not a little kid you are at the top of your shape.

[Lancelot]

Buddy, you are between the proverbial "Rock and a hard Place..."

The kid needs some discipline but if you administer it, he'll probably only resent you more. I totally agree about not giving him money and I hope your wife supports you on this.

The kid will probably only respond to firmness. A (rather small) lady that worked in a mental institution told me how she handled patients that became physical. One big guy that loved coffee was going to hit her. She pulled her self up to her full 5'2" heigth, looked him in the eye and said "You like coffee? You hit me and there's no more coffee or you!!!" Try denying him what ever it is he likes when he becomes abusive to your wife.

Again, I wish I had better advice but I don't. You must really love your wife, to tolerate that brat. I don't think I could.

All the best to you!

Lance

PS-Is he interested in mechanics or something practical? Maybe you can get him involved in something like that? But you've probably already done that.

[BigSnake]

Similar problem, thought it would get better as the son got older, didn't happen it was just the opposite. He is now 27 years old married, no kids of his own yet, thank goodness. Life is fine until he comes to visit his mom, which is once or so a year, after a day or so he will drank(get drunk) cause problems. Know this is not much help in your case; just wanted to let you know you are not along when it come to a Thai Stepson. What can we do(??) beat me, other pray for a short visit I don't have a clue. Tough love don't work; mom wimp out because she love her baby so much.

[nidhogg]

i would personaly grab him by the throat pretty hard untill he coculdnt breathe than tell him

Again, if someone doesnt agree, dont bother replying.

I don't agree, but hey, I will reply anyway.

What you propose is called "assault" in many countries, and here in Thailand as well. It is a criminal offense, and potentially carries severe legal penalties.

[Pushit]

i would personaly grab him by the throat pretty hard untill he coculdnt breathe than tell him

Again, if someone doesnt agree, dont bother replying.

I don't agree, but hey, I will reply anyway.

What you propose is called "assault" in many countries, and here in Thailand as well. It is a criminal offense, and potentially carries severe legal penalties.

And you would probably end up with a knife between your ribs or worse when least expected.

[soic]

I know exactly what you're going through. My wife has an older son in the same situation. I came into the family and have loved and treated both sons as my own, she also has adopted her nephew, so we have an adopted number one son. Ages 8, 15 and 21. The all call me Pa Pa... and for me they're my sons. The middle son decided that he wasn't going to go to school everyday, and started the whole stay in the bed and stay out late, and party life style. I told him that he was to go back to school, not argue with his mother, and to help her in the house and the store, everyday. I also told him that I'd make sure that he was trained for whatever vocation he chose. For which, he would receive the privilege to use his motorbike and an allowance. The other alternative was to leave the home and go find work somewhere else. In our family, children go to school, help their mother and get home at a decent hour. He chose not to follow the rules. My wife took his motorbike and threw him out, his grandmother refused to let him stay with her, because she respected our judgement.

He hooked up with a couple of friends and went to go work in Bangkok. He was away for 6 months, then he came home. He asked his mother for forgiveness moved back in and started following the rules. I guess he figured out that our way is a little easier to life with. I can't say it will work in your instance or that our way was the "right" way, but it was our way. We love our kids, but we expect them to be responsible for their actions and they get out of the family the same attention that they put into it.

[ozzydom]

And here is me thinking I am the only ex-pat in Los with this problem, My stepson was bad enough at school but is now 24 yrs old and a total drunk and magnet for trouble.

He turns up on the doorstep every few months and creates so much friction until T/W gives in and gives him the 5k he demands to go back to Bangkok ,but within 2-3 months is back and the arguing,stealing,drunk every day on Lao Kao and going out of his way to be a pain in the arse ,always with the ultimatum "give me 5k and I go'.

Nobody in the village will employ him ,even to plant rice,so we are stuck with it, I have tried the carrot and the stick ,these dont work, I have had him by the throat but then I find that blood is thicker than water when it comes to Thais and their kids ,no matter how bad they are.

It seems that in these situations the farang must assume the position at the bottom of the ladder or walk away which seems to be my only alternative.

[Cuban]

A few facts of life are in order, you are currently the supplier of all things for the child in question and the source of money even if via the mother. There is no motivation for the child to change as the supply is unlimited and without risk of being shut off from money.

I would think 16 is too old to control by 'locking in his room with bread rice and water' and any form or violence can come back to you in many ways that will not benifit you or your 'family'.

Exclusion is a useful tool, when the child in question has gone out, take the rest of the family out for an unplanned meal. get the younger child to help with a minor task, play etc. Maybe 'forget' to include the older child's place setting at the table at meal times. The mother will not like this idea.

There is little that you can do to force a person to change - the first move needs to be from the child - you just need to be ready to respond positively to it, rolling the ball back.

The phrase "..not very bright.." suggests to me that you berate him based on that lack of educational skills, this is probably a wedge that separates you from bonding (yes I guess that is a long way off). Not everyone can be an accountant or design engineer, there also needs to be rice planters and chicken shit sweepers as well. There are probably more of the latter in Thailand than skilled white collar workers.

Your concern (rightly) seems to be for the child's future, and the choice of work that will engage him (...and impact you if he does not stand on his own two feet). I don't know where in Thailand that you are but I would suggest that your life would be easier if you considered in depth the work choices for him that are positive, desirable and possible within your area. I doubt that the school system is geared up for anything beyond farmer or cook.

The lack of a positive older male role model is a killer for much of Thailand's teenage boys. Is there a 'good' man in the family, an uncle with a business? Someone that needs a 'go-for'. Your status is too left-field to be within the child's scope of understanding - you are alien, rich and speak funny. Difficult to relate to. I would guess he gets the piss taken from him because of this - maybe the money, smokes & drinking is his payback to his peer group to buy back his status. Teenagers can be nasty, something the younger one does not yet encounter.

I do not have children, but have spent time with various relatives and taken an interest in what they are likely to be able to do as young adults. The oldest boy I know closely will be a cattleman / part time farmer like his dad. Some of the girls I fear will be drawn to the bars of Pattaya via lower paid other jobs (food or hotel related). The ones I have hope for seem to be drawn toward the forces or police.

For those looking to get a foot hold in 'unskilled' work in the tourist industry being able to speak English is a good start, driving a car/minibus would again be a 'soft' skill that would aid getting a job.

It's clear the child will not suddenly learn Physics and work as a high tech weapon's tech, but maybe the army would 'sort him out'.

You can not live another's life for them - but as father you should be able to use your brain to help him (his mother) understand real life choices that are availible to him where you are.

The task is not an easy one - from my staff's comments (asking about boys work choices) Thai men are can be lazy unless hooked with a job that they enjoy and is seen to pay well. Not an easy task for one without the drive to take advantage of education.

Good luck.

[pumpuiman]

Could you offer a reward for good behavior? The prospect of a motorcycle, computer or other such niceties may push him in the right direction.........then again, he might be a good for nothing prick.

My brother, when having the same sort of problems with his son, sat down with him and negotiated a written contract. He listened to his sons grievances and proposals, discussed his own and they came upon a settlement. The rules were clearly defined. Punishment for infractions increased with the frequency of the offense up to and including being thrown out of the house. Reward was also included in the contract....the rewards negotiated by his son. This was signed by both parties.....after both agreeing to it's content.

It worked wonders.

You need to get your wife on board. Her son is not a little boy....she needs to realize that now.

Good luck

[roygsd]

I've been with my Thai wife for nearly 5 years now.She has two Thai sons,aged 11 and 16,from a previous marriage to a Thai man.

I cant fault my wife .She takes good care of me and her sons and keeps the house tidy and clean etc.She's not afraid of hard work and is very kindhearted.

I get on really well with the 11 year old boy.True,he's naughty sometimes but thats to be expected and we have a good laugh together,like a father and son should do.

The problem is the 16 year old.He's not very bright (not that I hold that against him) and isnt interested in school.Last year we found he had been bunking off school a fair bit and he was one of only two boys who failed to attain his grades for that year.We arranged for him to do retakes of the subjects he had failed but that took up almost 3 months of the new school year.

My wife decided that as he had missed 3 months of his current year it would be better if he skipped this curriculum till next year ie. take the subjects a year behind.

His character is not good.Lying and cheating seem to be second nature to him.Now he is not at school till next year his life seems to consist of lazing in bed till at least lunchtime,then going out playing online games in the afternoon and then meeting up with his mates at night smoking and drinking Thai whisky and coming home only when he feels like it.

I am not happy about this.My wife says try to understand him as he is only young.But he is abusive towards her and so lazy when asked to do even the simplest of household chores.Too be honest he doesnt listen to my wife and its only when I speak firmly to him that he will do anything.

Sometimes he doesnt come home or not till the early hours.He's only 16 years old and thats just not on as far as I am concerned.

I found him rooting through my wifes handbag in our bedroom once,maybe looking for money.My wife told me he did this before she met me.

I said why doesnt he get a job whilst hes not at school and make a bit of money but hes not interested.Too much like hard work.

For me,I wouldnt give him any money till he improves,just feed him,but I know my wife will relent and give him some baht every time.

Personally I feel like beating the living shit out of him but what would that achieve other than making me feel better in the short term !

His personality sames to be exactly the same as his fathers,a complete waster,drunkard and womaniser.

Its reaching the stage where I feel this boy is spoiling my life big time.I'd be so happy if he went to live with his grandparents three hours drive away.

But that would be passing the buck.He would just spoil their life.

I've even said to my wife if he doesnt go then I will.Again,unfair on my wife and younger son for they have done nothing wrong.

But,on the other side of the coin,if he doesnt go I am left living with a complete waster for possibly the rest of my life,not fair on me.

So,grateful for any ideas people might have as to how this can be resolved.I should say that,other than for this boy,I would have a great life over here.

I didnt leave stressed out UK for even more stress in Thailand.

Thanks for any help/advice.

Hi,

Read you post and several of the responses to it, much of the advice seems well meant but from experience ( non Thai) I can assure you that there is much truth in the old saying you can bring a horse to water but can't make it drink ".

Each kid is different from another so what works for one may not necessarily work for another, however as its easier to resolve other peoples problems than our own I suggest you consider stepping back and look at the bigger picture to see what is really going on at home.

I was a shit as a kid and a good hiding did nothing but make me more determined to come out on top ( and I did) , please forget some of the advice to throttle him as this is a sure fire way of allowing him to gain support from other family members.

The kid isnt the problem and you know it, he takes the piss because he knows he can get away with pretty much what he likes and will continue to do so.

How do you get on with the Garandparents? If you support them in some way explain the problem and ask them to back you up if the kid turns to them, if you have to lace your request so that it leaves them with the impression that they might be having to support their daughter and kids if you give up and decide to leave LOS so be it.

THen there is the not insignificant problem of getting the kids mother to work with you rather than against you, not easy but if she wants to undermine your efforts now then maybe you are better off cutting your losses now rather than a year or two down the road which seems pretty much how you see it at present anyway.

Be careful not to paint her or the boy into a corner though, give them both choices and leave the final decision to them.

Explain to the wife that you are unhappy with the situation and changes have to be made, if the boy is to have any real future etc.

Dont know what financial arrangements exist in your house but before speaking to the wife I would be quietly putting my assets out of her reach, just in case things go pear shaped.

When it is safe to do so, tell the wife that you are not prepared to ignore the boy being disrespectful to her or put up with his

abusive and disruptive ways any more, and starting tomorrow morning the boy will have to comply with the new house rules and make it clear that she has to support you in this.

When you have the mother on side, ( or failing that she knows the score!) sit the boy down with the pair of you and ask him why he feels he should be allowed to lie in bed all day rather than go to school and if he says he wants to quit school just tell him he is making a big mistake but if thats what he wants then its no skin off your nose and tell him to write a letter there and then to the school explaining why he will not be returning.

After you have the letter from him I would then tell him that starting tomorrow you will be up at ( whatever time he should be up for school) for breakfast and you will leave the house at the same time and not return to the house until the usual time he got back from school, during that time he must go find job and if he has not found a job within one week then all allowances will cease. I would then tell him that when he has a job he must provide his mother with a sizable chunk of his earnings each month to pay for his keep as there are no passengers in the house whilst you are paying the bills.

Also tell him that if he fails to get out of bed when called he will get a bucket of cold water thrown over him whilst he is in the bed and he will have to bring the bedding don and put them out to dry in the yard, he likely will not belive you but I guarantee that the first time he gets a soaking he will know that he is no longer in control.

(My old man threatened to bash the granny out of me if my older brother didnt get up for work everyday. I warned him but he just ignored me,so I opened the front door and made sure my escape path was clear before launching water and bucket on him as I fled at top speed out and away down the street with my naked 16 ish year old brother breathing fire down my neck as I went! 40+ years he still cannot get over the fact I meant what I said Fortunately I never had to do it again).

If it takes a few soakings so much the better, I would also set a time for him to be home each evening (9 pm is reasonable if he is due at school next day but up to you ) and explain that if he fails to keep to that deadline he must expect to find the door firmly locked and will remain that way unitil next morning.

At the first sign of disrespect for your rules ( which includes being respectful to everyone living in the home) I would take his mobil phone/computer and if he has one a motor bike off him for at least a month, permenantly if need be.

Make it quite clear to the wife that you mean what you say and ther will be big trouble if you find out she is undermining your efforts to put the boy on the straight and narrow.

I certainly cannot guarantee that the above actions will bring about the changes that must be made in order for you to

be at peace in your own home, neither can I guarantee that your wife will not undermine your efforts at every turn.

What I can guarantee you is that after a month (likely less) you will be in no doubt how much or how little resect your wife and kids have for you and then it really is up to you to decide if you want to be the man of the house or simply an inconvienient financial household appliance.

I am sorry if my response seems uncaring, it really isnt meant that way, but after over 20 years of allowing my ex wife to overide my gut instinct on how to deal with one of my step children ( thankfully the other one is quite the opposite) I can assure you that what you will pay ( plenty ) in stress in defining and maintaining the boundaries now will be less than the tip of the iceberg if this situation is allowed to continue for years, until you finally have no choice but to do what you already know needs to be done.

Its a bit like a bad tooth, you have the pain now but it really is up to you to chose if you want to suffer years of pain or go get it pulled once and for all.

Best of luck and dont forget to safeguard your finances before you do anything else

roy gsd

[roygsd]

You need professional advice t move forward with this issue, try to locate a counsellor and take both your wife and kids to discuss.

A counsellor??????? Is that your trade or are you just insane?

Roy gsd

[Cuban]

Talking about this issue with an experianced Thai parent last night, they suggested getting the kid to work on a building site, 100-150 Baht a day and hard work to earn the end of day beers. The 'soft; western ideas of counsellors etc is so way off the mark here.

[mizzi39]

The advice that "roygsd" gave makes a lot of sense. At least you will know where you stand with your family.

I was involved in a similar situation a few years back (in the states) with my live in girlfriends daughter who was 17 years old and out of control. Stealing, drugging, lying, hanging with a bad crowd, defiant to no end, etc. and it really drained me. The problem wasn't so much the "out of control teenager", but her mother who refused to intervene and became more of a codependent out of the "love for her daughter".

No matter what suggestions I gave, I was continuously overruled because "I was not a mother so how could I possibly understand the bond between mom and child", so my happiness and peace of mind took a back seat as well as my ex girlfriends 2 other daughters because this one child absorbed every-ones energy. Our house turned into a circus where peace was almost non existent.

I worked in Psychiatry for 10 years and have seen it all when it comes to defiant, delinquent, children.

In the west we generally expect people to take responsibility for their actions and we try to instill this in children even before they reach adolescence, but there are exceptions (like my ex girlfriend).

Codependent parents do not realize what a disservice they do to their children, and in a way they are just as responsible for their child's actions due to their refusal to set limits.

I don't mean to overgeneralize, but codependency seems to be a national trend here in the LOS. where consequences are almost non existent, and chronic alcoholism, stealing, defiance, is hardly confronted in a positive way, but largely ignored altogether. Many "adult children" never learn how to take personal responsibility for their actions, so they never mature in this respect.

There is no "right" suggestion for you OP. you need to follow your heart on this one and try not to think with to much emotion, but to think logically, so you can discover what makes sense.

Well, with my personal situation, I had finally reached my breaking point. I moved out of the house (my house), put the house up for sale told my ex GF that she had 3 months to find a place (She ultimately moved back with her parents), and started to put my life back together.

Nothing can replace your Peace (piece) of mind, because without it, you virtually stop living. Good luck OP!

Edited August 21, 2008 by mizzi39

[Macclad]

Guys,

Thanks very much for the advice offered.Its much appreciated.

Its very true that I am concerned that the elder boys behaviour will have an adverse effect on the younger one and we will end up with two bad sons.

As for the financial side,the important money is controlled by myself both with my bank account in Thailand and in the UK.....no joint bank accounts !

I have given him a clip around the ear in the past,which improves things for a while,but I dont want to rule by fear and what would happen long term if he is in his twenties and I am nudging sixty and I am no longer physically stronger than him ? I dont want to be on the receiving end of a thumping or maybe even worse !

Anyway,yesterday,I told my wife that I didnt think I could continue living in the house if the eldest son stayed there.I then cleared off for the day on my own.

This threat seems to have galvanised them into action.My wife told him this and said he would have to go either living away with his grandparents or renting a cheap apartment.

He was sad and said he didnt want to live with his grandparents but said he will look for a job as a trainee mechanic and would live in an apartment.

We'll see what happens.I'd be more than happy if he moved out but wouldnt want him turning up like a bad penny at our house every five minutes.

I doubt very much that his character will change for the better,despite what my wife tells me.I admit I feel more relaxed when he is out of the house rather than slobbing about in bed or on the sofa.If he got any less active I think hed sink into a coma !!

[Beacher]

You said, "I've even said to my wife if he doesn't go then I will...unfair on my wife and younger son for they have done nothing wrong."

I certainly agree that the younger son has done nothing wrong, I but totally disagree that your wife is innocent here. By her coddling the boy and refusing to take any part in disciplining him, she is the main obstacle in getting this kid turned around. I assume many people have indicated that you're nearly powerless in this situation. The kid isn't going to listen to you, and using corporal punishment will only set you up for worse problems.

Unless your wife gets on board and agrees to take strong measures to solve this problem, the situation will only get worse, and you'll likely grow to resent and dislike your home life more and more.

[PattayaParent]

Speaking from the experience of a mate of mine who has similar problems but with both lads he put the older boy in the army and the younger one in a disciplinarian boarding school.

[Dave the Dude]

Guys,

Thanks very much for the advice offered.Its much appreciated.

Its very true that I am concerned that the elder boys behaviour will have an adverse effect on the younger one and we will end up with two bad sons.

As for the financial side,the important money is controlled by myself both with my bank account in Thailand and in the UK.....no joint bank accounts !

I have given him a clip around the ear in the past,which improves things for a while,but I dont want to rule by fear and what would happen long term if he is in his twenties and I am nudging sixty and I am no longer physically stronger than him ? I dont want to be on the receiving end of a thumping or maybe even worse !

Anyway,yesterday,I told my wife that I didnt think I could continue living in the house if the eldest son stayed there.I then cleared off for the day on my own.

This threat seems to have galvanised them into action.My wife told him this and said he would have to go either living away with his grandparents or renting a cheap apartment.

He was sad and said he didnt want to live with his grandparents but said he will look for a job as a trainee mechanic and would live in an apartment.

We'll see what happens.I'd be more than happy if he moved out but wouldnt want him turning up like a bad penny at our house every five minutes.

I doubt very much that his character will change for the better,despite what my wife tells me.I admit I feel more relaxed when he is out of the house rather than slobbing about in bed or on the sofa.If he got any less active I think hed sink into a coma !!

Hi Macclad

I am sorry for your very uneasy situation. I have gone thru something simular recently and with the good advice here, things have seemed to be slowly getting better. You will see from my thread running alongside this one (Thief in the Family) that I resisted violence for the family explaining their discrace with the lad. I have, however showed my 'authority ' by explaining the 'no questions asked' actions that I WILL take if any other incidents occur.

Dave

[bina]

i dont understand why people think all thai dote on their kids;

most of the thai men i know are hard workers (ok, drink alot, but bust their balls for their families), and most have told me that they received caning for any misdemeanors, usually by -- mom, not dad.

my husband has a scar from a caning by his dad... and he has often hinted that a good spanking would get my 14 yr old to keep room clean, and all other rules ...they all think the kids here are spoiled brats and dont understand why we treat 15 yr olds as children. if they arent in school, they should be working or helping in the house as far as they all claim . i do know there are layabouts in anon's family but the relatives all have a low tolerance for them, and do the 'tuff love' thing. its hard to lock an open walled wooden shack, but the thai have their own ways to deal and make it clear to the miscreants that they are 'not acceptable in this manner'. not always caning, but there are other ways, like financial help, or using the 'face' thing.

most of these guys tell me that they consider 16 as an adult; and anon has for example, after warning my three (21 in army, 18 almost in army and 14 still at home) a few times about keeping 'stuff' (papers homework, cameras jewellry, whatever) on the dining room table, or laying in the middle of the floor, including army stuff, tossed it all in a box and put the box somehwere out of sight. u never saw a 21 yr old get her act together (she's a commander in the army now but at home acts like a 15 yr old) so fast since if she shows up at the base w/o all her gear, she doesnt just get a slap on the wrist. she gets a possible jail sentence. the 18 yr old nearly didnt fly out to the states (sponsered by my folks) cause he left passport laying around. passport disappeared. he had buy new one, pay a fine,and if it gets lost again, cannot get a new one for five years with that stamped in his passport, and deal with the hassle (thats israeli regs ): cost him a lot of his own money. he now makes sure his stuff is in his room.

anon still considers the 14 yr old a spoiled child but she isnt a brat; his way of rewarding all three for when they 'act adult' is cooking special dinners of things they prefer, lending money out of his salary if needed, and other small ways. (they are from my previous marriage, father lives close by).

counselling? i dont think so. u may have to just put yourself on 'ignore' mode, and dont deal with him at all, like u said, that is often the thai way of dealing with someone they dont like. they put themselves on 'ignore mode' and the person on the 'ignore' list. they give the money if asked, let the person lay around, but dont interact too much more then that. and the person feels it and knows it. and so do all the people around him/her. its a matter of face too. and as thai are social in more ways then we are, they feel it. that's my thai husband's take on it.

bina

israel

[roygsd]

Guys,

Thanks very much for the advice offered.Its much appreciated.

Its very true that I am concerned that the elder boys behaviour will have an adverse effect on the younger one and we will end up with two bad sons.

As for the financial side,the important money is controlled by myself both with my bank account in Thailand and in the UK.....no joint bank accounts !

I have given him a clip around the ear in the past,which improves things for a while,but I dont want to rule by fear and what would happen long term if he is in his twenties and I am nudging sixty and I am no longer physically stronger than him ? I dont want to be on the receiving end of a thumping or maybe even worse !

Anyway,yesterday,I told my wife that I didnt think I could continue living in the house if the eldest son stayed there.I then cleared off for the day on my own.

This threat seems to have galvanised them into action.My wife told him this and said he would have to go either living away with his grandparents or renting a cheap apartment.

He was sad and said he didnt want to live with his grandparents but said he will look for a job as a trainee mechanic and would live in an apartment.

We'll see what happens.I'd be more than happy if he moved out but wouldnt want him turning up like a bad penny at our house every five minutes.

I doubt very much that his character will change for the better,despite what my wife tells me.I admit I feel more relaxed when he is out of the house rather than slobbing about in bed or on the sofa.If he got any less active I think hed sink into a coma !!

Hi,

Easy! Dont push him out of the nest, he is only a kid, a pain in the arse maybe, but a kid all the same, pushing him away is just providing ammunition that for sure will be fired straight back at you and likely from all sides in the future.

The goal is ( I hope?) a happy household and for sure mum may be make soothing noises to you now but underneath she is

resenting your ultimatum, what you need to do now is to make bloody sure the boy stays at home and shows some respect for others.

Dont expect miracle's, but over a few months you might actuallly end up liking this spoilt kid again.

When you have managed to get him to appreciate that he needs to consider others as well as himself and to accept the sense in following the house rules he might just be persuaded to go finish his education which in my view is most important.

If he is allowed to run away from these problems to live with his mates or grandparents the only thing he will be taking with him is resentment of you and if you are not careful with no education to give him a chance in life is is almost certain he is going to be returning to his mothers home for the rest of his life every time he wants some cash or just to air his frustrations at who he will see as responsible for what he views of his sad life to date.

In your position I would see the fact he has suggested he wants to go get some training in mechanics as a golden opportunity to point out that without good school results no employer will entertain him.

In fact I would go as far as to be seen to be actively assisting him to find the career he claims he wants, but I would go to a fairly decent car dealership and ask to see he manager/boss and ask for his help ( some money passing hands will be a good investment I think). Explin that you want to do the right thing by the boy and are desparate to have him return to full time education.

Ask him to agree to give the boy an interview as a trainee and if you can get him to boost the kid up and then have him ask the boy for sight of his qualifications ( which he doesnt possess) at which point have him tell the boy that much as he would like to help him but there are loads of kids out there with the right qualifications who are desparate for the opportuntity to train as a mechanic and get him to say that if he goes back to school and gets decent marks/qualifications he would be delighted to have him comeback for another interview.

Ok, it is devious, but if you can get him to realise that h is just another kid with no prospects if he doesnt get back into school

you will have proved to the whole family and more importantly to yourself, that you were only acting in the boys best interests instead as I am sure is the case ight now, another resntful stepfather.

With respect, you knew when you took this woman on that she and the kids came as a package, you also know he kids biological father is not a "Dad " to the kids, when you took the job no-one ( I hope!) told you it would be easy, so now you have managed to get the wife to realise that this problem needs to be sorted she has ( begrudgingly I suspect) taken the first step to regaining some respect in her own house.

If the kid likes mechanics then try to exploit his interests and perhaps assist him by buying a crock of a car or bike for him to get his hands dirty each night rather than sitting on street corners waiting for the trouble that will almost certainly be heading his way.

By the sound of it he has never had a father to show him the way, his friends likley tease him about his mother having a farang husband and no doubt they are doing what kids do best which is to give it plenty of the " I wouldnt let a farang tell me what to do bulshit " whilst at the same time they may well secretly resent the fact the your kid ( well he is you know!) has material things that they perhaps do not.

Cast you mind back to when you were 16, I dont supose you were any diffent from other kids of that age, finding you feet and gnerally making a prat of yourself, I know I was!

Easing him out of the door may seem to be the easy option right now, but its not the right one for you or the other family members in the long run.

He may never thank you for investing your time and effort in him and you shouldnt expect him to either, thats what being a real dad is about.

Other than being a typical 16 year old pain in the arse from what you have written he isnt out of control like may his age are.

You have his attention now and thats half the battle, sure its going to be a rollercoaster ride at times, but treat this as a training exercise for when the next one starts pushing the boundaries as they all do.

The fact is he needs you, he might not like it but he knows he doesnt have anyone else to pick him up when he stuffs up and to knock him down ( not literally please!) when he gets too head of himself.

Good luck "Dad", and welcome to the club! LOL

Roy gsd

[jimmi]

This is a tough situation. Find a police officer and pay/tip/bribe him to get a hold of this kid after he has been drinking and scare the living <deleted> out of him. You pay the police so this time there is no real leagal problem this time. He needs a good, rude awakening, and so does the mother. I wish you luck!

[think_too_mut]

Indirectly, I see that situation in my Thai family.

My wife's sister, has a boy 18 yrs old now. No father and nobody knows where he is.

The boy is just a waste.

My wife got me (3 years ago) into paying him some electromechanic trade shool (18K baht) but he dropped out. Now, drinking, fighting, chasing girls and no thought what the future brings.

That is where "Thai man no good" comes from.

Then people like him make babies that you (farangs) inherit and have to nurse and get into the trouble as the OP is having.

Not because of my wife's niece that I see once a year, it would not move me if I saw his guts spilled, our evacuation to Japan would clear all those undue problems, and let the fcuks alone to sort themself out.

Being family problems, I don't expect it will ever be clear, but in Japan we would be us and only us.

Some money may flow back, but nothing like moving out of my own home.

To the OP, I believe the boy is done, no remedy. "Thai man no good".

[think_too_mut]

The latest:

The boy is working in a factory, where his mother works.

They catch the same bus to/from work.

He still goes astray but has a daily routine to follow. Not much different from Oz drop-out youngsters.

[philliphn]

The hoock seems to be his interest in Mechanics and getting the qualifications for this trade. Get him an interesting total jumk car to work on. Help him best you can work on the car. Buy some parts. This positive interaction with him may well improve your relationship with him. Move him towards going to a trade school. Support him in this. Even reward the steps to the goal of becoming a trained mechanic.

Edited August 24, 2008 by philliphn

[torrenova]

The wife is the problem, simple. He is a normal layabout good for nothing kid who has had an easy time in recent years because mama hooked the golden farang. She has to sort him out or you have to ship him out, somewhere. If all fails, you'll have to dump her so plan an exit strategy now.

[thaihome]

At 16 it may be too late, but boarding school is very good option. Look into overseas schools. A consultant can help a lot choosing the right school.

TH

[Lancashirelad]

my thoughts:

talk to the lad. (try to get him on a good day, if there is such a thing)

make it clear to him that the present situation is untenable & has to change whether he likes it or not. Ask him if he realises how much unhappiness he is causing both you & his mother.

Give him 3 options:

1.tow the line, have a complete re-think about his whole attitude to family/life/future. Explain that you will not be continuing to support him once he is 17 unless he is in full time educatiion.

2.That he beggar off to Bangkok or wherever & support himself, leaving you in peace.

3. If he chooses neither, that YOU will leave & with you will leave the $$$ supply. And that you leaving will greatly upset & have a major effect on his Mother & brother.

Give him the choice.

That way you don't have to make it.

I also like Pumpuiman's punishment/rewards contract idea and Roygsd provides some good ideas in both his posts.

Speaking from the experience of a mate of mine who has similar problems but with both lads he put the older boy in the army and the younger one in a disciplinarian boarding school.

very wise

Edited September 2, 2008 by Lancashirelad