Most Secure Perimeter Wall For House

[RY12]

Have there been any studies to show what are the best angles for the spikes on top of perimeter walls to prevent people from climbing over with a ladder? The fact that I see numerous variations in Thailand tends to make me think no one has done a study- some of the spikes lean in, others out, some are vertical with angeled offshoots, etc... which design is the most difficult for burglars?

The Japanese Embassy in Bangkok has a pretty viscious looking wall- a downward-slanting spike, a curved one, and then a tall vertical one behind them... but still, couldn't the burglar just drap a heavy cloth over it, attach a sheet of wood to the end of the ladder so it balances on the spikes, and just climb over?

[longball53098]

I think you answered your own question!

Short of wiring the fence to 440volts or having electronic surveillance anyone can get over a fence if they really want in and not be seen or heard.

[GuestHouse]

Short of wiring the fence to 440volts or having electronic surveillance anyone can get over a fence if they really want in and not be seen or heard.

And if the householder has gone to the trouble of building a wall that is high enough, the house breaker can take his time knowing that his activities are screaned from neighbours and passers by.

[Gary A]

If a thief wants in, he will get in. No wall will stop him. We put a two meter high wall around our two rai property. The main purpose was to keep the dog in and kids and chickens out. Once in a while I see kids sitting on top of the wall especially if I am using my tractor. They want to see what I am doing.

[kamalabob2]

Value for the Money and Great Peace of Mind.

I firmly believe that a professionally installed, legal and proven Electric Fence is a "Game Changer" as far as security is concerned. Beauty is in the "eye of the beholder". In my opinion what a perimeter wall should do is deter ANY thief from coming onto your property. I priced stainless steel fence toppings, rolling spikes, Painted Steel spikes and even looked at razor wire. In the end it was NO CONTEST. The cards are stacked totally in favor of an electric fence. The "fear" of Thai people, even the Police who do the "sign several times in a log book" patrol seem to respect the fence. The cost per linear meter INSTALLED by a polite, competent three man professional staff from Bangkok was FAR LOWER than stainless steel spikes. In my opinion any drug addict can throw a blanket or car floor mat over a typical security fence and lean a stolen ladder against your wall. Impossible with the electric fence we have since it is also wired to a very loud alarm. The controller unit is very quiet and made in Brazil with a long life back up battery. We have good air flow on the property as the existing concrete block fence did not have to be built as high as many in the community. It is the Thai Visa Forum that first alerted me to WASP Security in Bangkok. I had done google searches and had looked and priced another Thailand based electric fence company with a "great" photo of the owner of that firm with a current political fugitive. Mike the owner of WASP security was the BEST sub contractor I worked on with this home building project. He personally came with his installation crew chief two weeks prior to the installation and checked everything in person. He had metal fence posts powder coated to the color my wife wanted. We have had ZERO false alarms. My wife was mopping the spirit house platform tile with an aluminum map handle and she can verify the shock is quite sharp if you touch the electric wire. I've attached photos so you can decide for yourself if the Electric Fence is noticeable. The warning signs are in Thai and English. My electric bill did not jump as a result of this fence.

[MaximumSecurity]

Kamala Bob has the right idea. Electric barriers are one of the best intruder preventions available. I didn't see it mentioned but it should have a sector sensor alarm which goes off in the house (and the security company if there is a monitored alarm system) if any of the wires are touched and/or cut. That way you know immediately from which direction the threat is coming.

If you don't like the look of electric, go with a prolific, thorny vine which can be enhanced with razor wire in the middle. You won't see the wire after a few months but anyone trying to climb over the vines will know it's there. Remember that a three meter wall can easily be breached by someone jumping or climbing from the top of a pick up truck.

Don't forget to couple any of those options with motion sensor lights at night and cameras connected to a recording device. This way you have a permanent record of everyone who approaches your property especially on a regular basis. These are also an excellent deterrent because the last thing criminals want is to be seen. And for heavens sake, make sure you have a real lock on the gate and that you lock it at all times! You would be amazed at how many homes have walls and gates but no locks.

[0Mix1up]

problem with so much security

it advertises there is something valuable to steal

[longball53098]

Value for the Money and Great Peace of Mind.

I firmly believe that a professionally installed, legal and proven Electric Fence is a "Game Changer" as far as security is concerned. Beauty is in the "eye of the beholder". In my opinion what a perimeter wall should do is deter ANY thief from coming onto your property. I priced stainless steel fence toppings, rolling spikes, Painted Steel spikes and even looked at razor wire. In the end it was NO CONTEST. The cards are stacked totally in favor of an electric fence. The "fear" of Thai people, even the Police who do the "sign several times in a log book" patrol seem to respect the fence. The cost per linear meter INSTALLED by a polite, competent three man professional staff from Bangkok was FAR LOWER than stainless steel spikes. In my opinion any drug addict can throw a blanket or car floor mat over a typical security fence and lean a stolen ladder against your wall. Impossible with the electric fence we have since it is also wired to a very loud alarm. The controller unit is very quiet and made in Brazil with a long life back up battery. We have good air flow on the property as the existing concrete block fence did not have to be built as high as many in the community. It is the Thai Visa Forum that first alerted me to WASP Security in Bangkok. I had done google searches and had looked and priced another Thailand based electric fence company with a "great" photo of the owner of that firm with a current political fugitive. Mike the owner of WASP security was the BEST sub contractor I worked on with this home building project. He personally came with his installation crew chief two weeks prior to the installation and checked everything in person. He had metal fence posts powder coated to the color my wife wanted. We have had ZERO false alarms. My wife was mopping the spirit house platform tile with an aluminum map handle and she can verify the shock is quite sharp if you touch the electric wire. I've attached photos so you can decide for yourself if the Electric Fence is noticeable. The warning signs are in Thai and English. My electric bill did not jump as a result of this fence.

I would be interested in this product.

Where are you located kamala? Near Rayong? How about the company?

[RY12]

In the end it was NO CONTEST. The cards are stacked totally in favor of an electric fence. The "fear" of Thai people, even the Police who do the "sign several times in a log book" patrol seem to respect the fence. The cost per linear meter INSTALLED by a polite, competent three man professional staff from Bangkok was FAR LOWER than stainless steel spikes. In my opinion any drug addict can throw a blanket or car floor mat over a typical security fence and lean a stolen ladder against your wall. Impossible with the electric fence we have since it is also wired to a very loud alarm.

Wait, does the object that touches the wire have to be grounded, or will every cockroach, rat, bird, or falling leaf that touches the wires set off the alarm? Also, if the house is left alone while we're away, is it common experience that a loud alarm would do any good? i.e. are the neighbors really going to wake up and call the police? maybe they'd have to if the alarm didn't shut off after the burglar stopped touching it. which begs another question, if someone accidently touches it at 3 am, will someone have a key into your property to turn the alarm off?

But it is a good idea and sounds better than stainless steel spikes. Only way over it is to have two trampolines on either side I guess?

[longball53098]

I would say if you go away there most likely would be a way to shut off the audible alarm if you choose or at the least put a switch on the line to the noisemaker. As we say "up to you" or if you have neighbors that you trust they can look after it also.

Most alarms that trigger a noisemaker will automatically shut off after a timed period and start again if the offending zone is still tripped or trips again.

I don't see the alarm nosiemaker as big concern

[Kudos]

Hi all this is my first post, have noticed a few threads re security and thought i would add my bit... .... anyone looking at perimeter security should look at the NEXTAR Fiber Optic Perimeter Detection System - 100% reliable, no power required, connects to an alarm panel for siren and or strobe activation or sends a GSM message to the owners mobile or a central monitoring centre.

[alantheembalmer]

I don't know anything about vicious tropical bushes, (but I expect that there is someone on ThaiVisa that does), but they are always worth considering. In England I planted a firethorn bush around my property, and that certainly detered the riff raff from trying to get onto my land. It is also a lovely looking bush, is maintainance free, (apart from a trim), and gets me over any health and safety issues. Finally, a large bush is very difficult to put a ladder against and then climb. It is definitly worth further investigation.

[Cuban]

A natural bush planted within a latice of barbed wire is a good deterent.

The issue of having security promoting 'interest' in what you have to steal does not really make a farang house stand out here - simply driving your car around alerts robbers looking for targets that you are there.

Get dogs.

Put about a metre width or more of gravel around the edge of your ground, the noise during the still of night alerts the dogs to someone getting in. But I acknowledge other threads about dog poisioning etc.

[longball53098]

Have there been any studies to show what are the best angles for the spikes on top of perimeter walls to prevent people from climbing over with a ladder? The fact that I see numerous variations in Thailand tends to make me think no one has done a study- some of the spikes lean in, others out, some are vertical with angeled offshoots, etc... which design is the most difficult for burglars?

The Japanese Embassy in Bangkok has a pretty viscious looking wall- a downward-slanting spike, a curved one, and then a tall vertical one behind them... but still, couldn't the burglar just drap a heavy cloth over it, attach a sheet of wood to the end of the ladder so it balances on the spikes, and just climb over?

Your post got eveyone talking about fence and wall security but I think no one has really addressed your query of the angles of the spikes.

I never looked at a stufy about this or searched for one. For me if I were building a wall and thinking about the spikes for added protection I think I would add the spikes in a pointed out direction and maybe two or three rows at different angles.

[meandwi]

This plant is very dangerous, "Agave marginata" hundreds of hard sharp spikes! Available in most nurseries very cheap. Will grow to two meters. I'd also plant bougainvilla behind it for further protection.

meandwi

Edited August 22, 2008 by meandwi

[BEENTHEREDONETHAT]

I'm curious, where do you guys live? I just looked out the window and can see abou 20 houses. Not a single one has a fence high enough to deter much more than a dog or a cow. No security bars or security screens.

Why all the security concerns?

[Yamantaka]

I'm curious, where do you guys live? I just looked out the window and can see abou 20 houses. Not a single one has a fence high enough to deter much more than a dog or a cow. No security bars or security screens.

Why all the security concerns?

Edited August 23, 2008 by Yamantaka

[MaximumSecurity]

I'm curious, where do you guys live? I just looked out the window and can see abou 20 houses. Not a single one has a fence high enough to deter much more than a dog or a cow. No security bars or security screens.

Why all the security concerns?

This is the same problem everywhere in the world. Most people prefer to think "It will never happen to me". So they continue spending lots of money on infinity pools and expensive kitchens but little or nothing on their security.

Thailand is following the same trends in crime as most developing countries, maybe at a faster rate because of the large number of high end homes and condos being built. This is what advertises to criminals the amount of "booty" that is available. As Willie Sutton said when they asked him why he robbed banks, "Because that's where the money is."

Thinking that criminals are stupid is the first major mistake. They read the same glossy magazines and see the same home prices. So they know where to go. Those who buy expensive homes are the ones that most need to protect themselves with real security not "looks like security", because the house or development or condo building screams, "ROB ME!!!!".

The second major mistake is feeling secure with only one element of a total protection package. As an example, take a monitored alarm system with sensors on all windows and doors. Every home should have one but this is the last obstacle for the criminals. Think what it means when the alarm goes off: The bad guys are in your house! Now what steps have you taken to protect your family in the time it will take the security company to call you, ask for your duress code word, call the police, and then for the police to arrive?

Think medieval walled town. There was an outer wall, an inner wall, the castle and then the castle keep. Modern security should be configured in the same manner providing deterrence, prevention, containment and protection from outer wall to an interior room that will keep you safe.

[GuestHouse]

There's plenty of free good advice on the internet on home security - This from the UK' s Met'.

A point to note is that the vast majority of the prevention methods are about the occupant's own behaviour - Not about spending money on alarms.

The Met's advice in the link above starts with the mind of the thief and then addresses what you can do to prevent a would be thief a) conssidering your house as a target and getting in to your house.

This first part should not be overlooked - It is no point having an alarm sytem and electric fence if you provide ample oportunities for thieves to get into your house.

--

What I find surprising here, well not surprising actually, is that no mention is made of what is perhaps the most effective means of preventing house breakings in Thailand - Get frienldy with your neighbours and set up a neighbourhood watch.

Neighbourhood watches do exist in Thailand (informal and formal) and believe me, Thais are far more aware of the risks of house breaking than most foreigners - Your Thai neighbours will not only have their eyes open and ears to the ground, but they also have all the back-up knowledge of who belongs in the area, who has been a problem before.

Our Neighbourhood watch in Narklua frequently spotted and alerted everyone in the area of 'scouting' or outher suspicious activity - That no burglar alarm can pick up. A warning went around and vigilance went up.

In the seven years we lived in the neighbourhood there was not one single break-in at any of the houses in the moo baarn.

Work with your neighbours to find a solution that works - rather than acting alone and relying on technology to solve a problem that you can solve easily with the help of people who are also concerned about the same issues as yourself.

[kamalabob2]

Good questions and comments from posters such as RY12. I did a bit of research PRIOR to purchasing this particular electric fence. It is my understanding that for anything electric to work a current has to flow from the positive to the negative side of the circuit. For an electric fence the ground, literally and figuratively, is the negative.

This is a diagram of a simple AGRICULTURAL fence.

http://www.afence.com/ElectricFenceJPG/warnin7.jpg

For a FALSE alarm to be triggered cockroaches, rats, birds or falling leaves would have to touch both ALTERNATE wires of the fence or the live wire and the ground. As the wires of our electric fence are usually 100mm apart this is unlikely although geckos who climb up an insulator and touch the live wire and a post will get fried and may trigger the alarm. They have just been fried at our home and they make a little crackling noise until we turn off the fence to safely remove the creature. This has "KFG" only happened once a month. No false alarms yet.

Unlucky large flying beetles have been known to land in the wrong place. Similarly some cheap PIR sensors used for a conventional burglar alarms have been known to be triggered by large spiders.

We do NOT live near any relatives. Many "Farang houses" are located near relatives. If I lived near "family" I might consider giving them a "remote" key which looks similar to a remote car alarm key switch so if thee was a "false alarm" they could reset the alarm. Making friends with neighbors is certainly a valid idea. However we have so much coming and going traffic it would be difficult at this time to see who is a "good visitor" and who is a "unwelcome intruder".

I understand that Electric security fences generate alarms if the fence is tampered with and the alarm can be configured for a short or long duration by the home owner. Some energizers will reset after a cause of the alarm has been removed and other models need to be reset manually. I was told that in all but the most "sophisticated" (very expensive) energizers an alarm will not be generated if someone simply touches the fence. The shock experienced when they touch it will convince them they are in the wrong place. My belief is that unless your property is extremely remote the simple presence of an electric security fence will physiologically convince "bad man" to look for a softer target. The signs that various vendors would attach to your electric fence I believe a major deterrent to crime on your property. I am of the opinion that if you are building a perimeter wall or already have an existing perimeter wall, prior to spending serious money on building security bars, fence top metal bars, professional CCTV you should at least price electric fencing from vendors in Thailand.

No one system is the only answer, but at the end of the day (and house budget) you have to consider what will really protect your family. Of the three "Farang houses" in our little Issan town that I am aware were broken into they were all modest 2000 to 2500 baht a month rentals where perhaps the Gold Jewelry and mobile phone of the Thai woman were targets. In all three cases the entry point was a "hidden from view" side door. They were NOT large or stylish homes by any stretch of the imagination.

My mistake with an expensive stainless steel rolling gate was agreeing to vertical fence bars 110mm apart. Just a tad too wide since skinny "soi dogs" had come into our property to perhaps harm our cats.

[chiang mai]

Can't help but feel that some folks have missed the point of living in Thailand - electric fences, <deleted>.

[Gary A]

An electric fence may sound like a good idea but if I were a thief I would drive you absolutely crazy whether I ever robbed you or not. I'd come by with my little insulated handle wire cutters and snip the wire/wires. I assure you that I can cut your wires much more easily than you can repair them. Eventually you would give up because getting up in the middle of the night would wear you out and make you give up on the idea.

[Nomad97]

On the way into our village is a large house with high walls and gate. A couple of months ago a rather large sign (8' by 6') appeared on the gate. Out of curiosity I asked my wife to translate what it was about. Roughly translated it read, "This house has been burgled 7 times in the past 2 years. I am fed up with having to repair broken windows and doors that are left behind after the break-ins. Please do not break in again because there is absolutely nothing left in the house that is worth stealing - it has all been taken already. Thank you!"

[VocalNeal]

An electric fence may sound like a good idea but if I were a thief I would drive you absolutely crazy whether I ever robbed you or not. I'd come by with my little insulated handle wire cutters and snip the wire/wires. I assure you that I can cut your wires much more easily than you can repair them. Eventually you would give up because getting up in the middle of the night would wear you out and make you give up on the idea.

While you are out there wandering around at night why not go to the house with the IR beams on the wall and spray paint the sensor black. And then go to another house and quietly remove one screw from the window bars each night until....

Most theives are opportunists so anything done to disuade them is worthwhile. Bottom line if someone really want in they will get in.

[VocalNeal]

@#*$&! TOT.

Edited August 30, 2008 by VocalNeal

[dave111223]

An electric fence may sound like a good idea but if I were a thief I would drive you absolutely crazy whether I ever robbed you or not. I'd come by with my little insulated handle wire cutters and snip the wire/wires. I assure you that I can cut your wires much more easily than you can repair them. Eventually you would give up because getting up in the middle of the night would wear you out and make you give up on the idea.

Until the home owner gets wise to your snipping and decides to wait in the bushes with a shotgun.

[NotNew2You]

Can't help but feel that some folks have missed the point of living in Thailand - electric fences, <deleted>.

My feelings exactly...like living in San Quentin! Commonsense security precautions yes...paranoia no!

What is it you all have in your houses that you feel all this security is needed? Are you all like Chinese Thai gold-shop keepers and keep all your gold at home in your house or something? Valuable jewels, bearer bonds, the missing Saudi blue-diamond, what pray tell?

Besides a couple TVs, a computer or two, digital camera, and other electronics, that is pretty much all the valuables in my house. If a thief came and cleaned it all out (not likely with the larger TVs and computers (maybe take the notebook and a digital camera) it could all be replaced for under US$ 5000 or so!

Maybe also keep max of B 10k cash in wallet (usually 2-3k). A decent sized floor safe or floor or wall mounted unit would even keep the camera and notebook and any other small valuables safe and costs around US$ 500.

This all seems more practicable than high-tech and expensive security systems.

[thescot]

Can't help but feel that some folks have missed the point of living in Thailand - electric fences, <deleted>.

My feelings exactly...like living in San Quentin! Commonsense security precautions yes...paranoia no!

What is it you all have in your houses that you feel all this security is needed? Are you all like Chinese Thai gold-shop keepers and keep all your gold at home in your house or something? Valuable jewels, bearer bonds, the missing Saudi blue-diamond, what pray tell?

Besides a couple TVs, a computer or two, digital camera, and other electronics, that is pretty much all the valuables in my house. If a thief came and cleaned it all out (not likely with the larger TVs and computers (maybe take the notebook and a digital camera) it could all be replaced for under US$ 5000 or so!

Maybe also keep max of B 10k cash in wallet (usually 2-3k). A decent sized floor safe or floor or wall mounted unit would even keep the camera and notebook and any other small valuables safe and costs around US$ 500.

This all seems more practicable than high-tech and expensive security systems.

Cant believe the last post ......."besides a couple of tv's" what about wife and children .....nuff said

[NotNew2You]

what about wife and children .....nuff said

What...they're going to steal your wife and children? Are you a relative a Bill Gates and fear being kidnapped and held for a computer geek's randsom?

Let go of your paranoia and you will fell better ok

[thescot]

what about wife and children .....nuff said

What...they're going to steal your wife and children? Are you a relative a Bill Gates and fear being kidnapped and held for a computer geek's randsom?

Let go of your paranoia and you will fell better ok

complete idiot .... i guess your only worry then is being charged 10 baht from a baht bus driver