Thai Ministry Of Foreign Affairs - Statutory Marriage Licence

[bargwaan]

Before I can marry a Thai national in Thailand me and my girlfriend must go to the Thai Ministry of Foreign Affairs (Don Mueng, Bangkok) and apply for the statutory marriage licence. I understand that when doing this that I cannot marry in Thailand until I have first been in the country for 3 days, can anyone confirm:-

i) whether this is meant to be 3 working days or does this include Sat/Sun? does the ministry normally pay that much attention to this?

ii) also will the Thai Ministry of Foreign Affairs be able to issue us with a marriage licence if we go there before the 3 days have passed so we can use at an Amphur a day later (i.e. does the licence have a valid from date?)?

The problem for me is that I only have so many days in Thailand before I have to leave again and we want to change the name on my Thai girfriend's Thai ID card when we marry so this means we have to travel to her local Amphur to do this. These sort of issues are not easy to determine until you go there and do it however I might need to book flights etc upfront so information from anyone would be appreciated, I would like to prevent any surprises when I get there.

regards

Karl

Edited October 1, 2008 by bargwaan

[Thanyaburi Mac]

Before I can marry a Thai national in Thailand me and my girlfriend must go to the Thai Ministry of Foreign Affairs (Don Mueng, Bangkok) and apply for the statutory marriage licence. I understand that when doing this that I cannot marry in Thailand until I have first been in the country for 3 days, can anyone confirm:-

i) whether this is meant to be 3 working days or does this include Sat/Sun? does the ministry normally pay that much attention to this?

ii) also will the Thai Ministry of Foreign Affairs be able to issue us with a marriage licence if we go there before the 3 days have passed so we can use at an Amphur a day later (i.e. does the licence have a valid from date?)?

The problem for me is that I only have so many days in Thailand before I have to leave again and we want to change the name on my Thai girfriend's Thai ID card when we marry so this means we have to travel to her local Amphur to do this. These sort of issues are not easy to determine until you go there and do it however I might need to book flights etc upfront so information from anyone would be appreciated, I would like to prevent any surprises when I get there.

regards

Karl

Karl

I've never heard of that 3-day deal. You don't say what country you're coming from or a national of, altho that probably doesn't make much difference. FYI, there's no "marriage licence" (sic) (hmmm, must be Brit, rather than "license") in Thailand, altho there's some other paperwork involved.

FYI II, see below for info from U.S. Embassy which should be much the same for other countries.

Mac

http://bangkok.usembassy.gov/service/marriage.html

A legal marriage in Thailand consists of both parties registering their marriage in person with the local Thai Amphur (Civil Registry Office). The United States does recognize the validity of such a marriage. For American citizens marrying either Thai citizens or another American citizen, the procedure is the same. For Americans marrying a third-country national, their prospective spouse must also follow a similar procedure with their own embassy.

Procedure

1. Complete an affidavit at the American Embassy. The affidavit form, available upon request, includes all of the information required by relevant Thai law. The form must be completed and notarized at the Embassy. To make an appointment for a notarial, please click here. You may download a copy of the form here.

2. Have the notarized affidavit translated. Click here for a list of translators in the Bangkok area.

3. Take the affidavit and translation to:

Legalization Division

Department of Consular Affairs

Ministry of Foreign Affairs

3rd Floor, 123 Chaeng Wattana Road

Tung Song Hong, Laksi District, Bangkok

Tel:(02) 575-1057-8, Fax:(02) 575-1054

4. Take the affidavit and supporting documents to a local Amphur and register yourselves as married. The Amphur will also require the following documents:

Your American passport

If one party is Thai, the Thai citizen's identification card

If either party is under the age of twenty, written permission from the parents (with Thai translation);

If either you or your fiance have been previously married the Amphur will want to see proof that prior marriages have been terminated; either divorce or death certificates. These documents, if available, should be translated into Thai prior to presentation at the Amphur.

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

[thaihome]

Note that from the steps listed above, the Ministry of Foreign Affairs does not issue the marriage certificate, they only legalize the translation of the free to marry affidavit. The marriage certificate is issued by any amphur. You can get the marriage certificate and get your new wife’s ID card changed at the same time.

I have heard of the 3 days in country rule, but have never heard of it being a problem.

If you are seriously pressed for time, it might worth a few thousand baht to hire an agent to smooth the process.

TH

Edited October 2, 2008 by thaihome

[richm7]

A correction to the previous post first.....

You DO NOT have to get any divorce decrees translated nor do you have to present them at the Amphur. YOU DO have to get a Affirmation of Freedom to Marry from your embassy, which will involve having any decrees available to show them, but no translation, obviously. The freedom to Marry letter is signed by an Embassy official; not sure about the US Embassy but the Brit Embassy does not notarize it nor do Chaeng Wattana (Thai Consular department) require them to. You DO need to get the letter translated and you DO need the Chaeng Wattana notarized version of it with you at the Amphur. Make sure you use a reputable translation service because if it's wrong, they won't accept it.

As for the three days, by the time you have got your Affirmation (overnight) and pissed about in line at Chaeng Wattana, it will take at least three days, trust me!! One word of warning; don't waste money on one of these service companies. They charge a lot of money for things you can easily do yourself and they can't do things any faster either.

[ubonjoe]

Most translation offices will also take the document you get at your consulate to the Ministry of Forign Affairs for a small additional fee. They will also send the document to you by EMS for the cost of the EMS postage of course. This will save some time that you could use to do the travaling for the next step if you have it sent to your intendeds registered residence.

It is best to do the marriage resgistration at the Amphur where your intended is registered. It will save a lot of time and hassle. She will need her ID and house registration book.

She can do the ID card there also,

Hope this helps.

Edit: If your wife is from a village and her family knows the village headman it would be usefull to take them along for the registration. They will know most everybody at the reigistration office and can smooth things out a bit.

Good luck.

PS In case you don't already know it EMS is express mail service. Very dependeble service here and next day to most addresses.

Edited October 2, 2008 by ubonjoe

[thaihome]

A correction to the previous post first.....

You DO NOT have to get any divorce decrees translated nor do you have to present them at the Amphur. YOU DO have to get a Affirmation of Freedom to Marry from your embassy, which will involve having any decrees available to show them, but no translation, obviously. The freedom to Marry letter is signed by an Embassy official; not sure about the US Embassy but the Brit Embassy does not notarize it nor do Chaeng Wattana (Thai Consular department) require them to. You DO need to get the letter translated and you DO need the Chaeng Wattana notarized version of it with you at the Amphur. Make sure you use a reputable translation service because if it's wrong, they won't accept it.

As for the three days, by the time you have got your Affirmation (overnight) and pissed about in line at Chaeng Wattana, it will take at least three days, trust me!! One word of warning; don't waste money on one of these service companies. They charge a lot of money for things you can easily do yourself and they can't do things any faster either.

The US Embassy does not require a copy of the divorce as they do not certify anything. They notarize your statement that you are free to marry. In my case (some 8 years ago) the amphur actually looked at the translated divorce decree. One thing you learn about Thai government agencies, it is best to have too much paperwork as they are very likely to go thorough what you give them and try to think of something else. They often take as a personal defeat if you have everything the first time and they don't get the chance to ask for something else.

I certainly agree that can take 3 days ito get all this done and for me, 4k baht is well worth not having to go to the MFA myself, they also paved the way at the amphur so we jumped ahead of the other 3 couples (all Thai) in line to register marriage. Just depends on what you think your time is worth.

TH

[richm7]

A correction to the previous post first.....

You DO NOT have to get any divorce decrees translated nor do you have to present them at the Amphur. YOU DO have to get a Affirmation of Freedom to Marry from your embassy, which will involve having any decrees available to show them, but no translation, obviously. The freedom to Marry letter is signed by an Embassy official; not sure about the US Embassy but the Brit Embassy does not notarize it nor do Chaeng Wattana (Thai Consular department) require them to. You DO need to get the letter translated and you DO need the Chaeng Wattana notarized version of it with you at the Amphur. Make sure you use a reputable translation service because if it's wrong, they won't accept it.

As for the three days, by the time you have got your Affirmation (overnight) and pissed about in line at Chaeng Wattana, it will take at least three days, trust me!! One word of warning; don't waste money on one of these service companies. They charge a lot of money for things you can easily do yourself and they can't do things any faster either.

The US Embassy does not require a copy of the divorce as they do not certify anything. They notarize your statement that you are free to marry. In my case (some 8 years ago) the amphur actually looked at the translated divorce decree. One thing you learn about Thai government agencies, it is best to have too much paperwork as they are very likely to go thorough what you give them and try to think of something else. They often take as a personal defeat if you have everything the first time and they don't get the chance to ask for something else.

I certainly agree that can take 3 days ito get all this done and for me, 4k baht is well worth not having to go to the MFA myself, they also paved the way at the amphur so we jumped ahead of the other 3 couples (all Thai) in line to register marriage. Just depends on what you think your time is worth.

TH

Yes TH it looks like things have changed. I agree that the Embassy effectively "endorses" your affirmation of freedom to marry and funny you should make the comment about the US divorce decree because the Brits wanted to see my UK decree but couldn't care less about my American decree (no idea why). I can confirm that Chaeng Wattana no longer needs a translated divorce decree nor does the Amphur. A also agree that you can never have too much documentation in Thailand but getting a decree translated then certified at Chaeng Wattana is costly and time consuming if you do not need it (which I didn't at Bangrak).

Your experience is a few years ago and mine is a few months ago, but this is Thailand and tomorrow is a new day, so who knows for sure! Just be jai yen yen and ready for anything!

[thaihome]

The US Embassy does not "endorse" the affirmation in any way. You fill out a form they give you and sign it. Then their notary public stamps it. They are not saying in any way that your statement is true, only that you have signed it. The girl that was doing the notary public at the Embassy last year had some mistaken belief that she had to ask if the statement is true or not, but that is first time I have ever had any notary public ask that question. Of course her question was meaningless since if you lied on the form would you admit it to her? There is no oath or affirmation asked or given that the statement are true nor does the notary stamp say anywhere they are true, only that the named person is the one that signed. I have learned not question her though, she could be very unpleasant and is very quick to ask you to leave. Wonder if she is still there?

Fortunately, Thailand does not have an equivalent process, so they do indeed think this is some sort of cortication. This is the same as the income certification for the retirement visa. All you do is sign a statement and get it notarized, the embassy does no verification at all, but it seems sufficient for immigration.

TH

[ubonjoe]

Great about 2 or 3 useful posts and a discussion about devorce papers. Probably got the OP so confused he doesn't know what to do. Info from US consulate was good plus it has link to translators.

I have never taken any of my translated paperwork to Chaeng Wattana I just paid the translator a small fee to handle that. Thats SOP for most translators.

We don't know where the poster is from or if he has ever been devorced or not. Whether he needs them or not will be what his consulate will want. I understand some do. But he will not need a translation for the Amphur as long as he has the document from his consulate.

Forget the agent route its only needed if you want to get married in Bangkok and the wife to be is not registered in Bangkok.

[bargwaan]

Thanks for everyones replies (TH, MAC etc), this has been very useful.

I only have a week in Thailand so basically my plan is this starting on Tuesday:-

1. Tuesday go Embassy and submit Affirmation, needs to be done by about 3:30pm;

2. Wednesday go Embassy at 9am and collect Affirmation or signed affidavit then get it translated into Thai before going to Thai MFA (not sure which place is quickest to get it translated a place near Embassy or outside the MFA), all needs to be done by about 2:30pm, note this is on assumption that MFA don't care that this is 3rd working day in the country;

3. Thursday go Amphur in home town, get marriage certificate and Thai ID card for wife changed with new name;

4. Friday go passport office in Bangkok apply for new passport for wife with new name then go to a translator and submit the marriage documents for translation.

Following week my wife will submit translated papers with application doc and fee to the Embassy.

What do you think, is this possible?

Karl

[ubonjoe]

Thanks for everyones replies (TH, MAC etc), this has been very useful.

I only have a week in Thailand so basically my plan is this starting on Tuesday:-

1. Tuesday go Embassy and submit Affirmation, needs to be done by about 3:30pm;

2. Wednesday go Embassy at 9am and collect Affirmation or signed affidavit then get it translated into Thai before going to Thai MFA (not sure which place is quickest to get it translated a place near Embassy or outside the MFA), all needs to be done by about 2:30pm, note this is on assumption that MFA don't care that this is 3rd working day in the country;

3. Thursday go Amphur in home town, get marriage certificate and Thai ID card for wife changed with new name;

4. Friday go passport office in Bangkok apply for new passport for wife with new name then go to a translator and submit the marriage documents for translation.

Following week my wife will submit translated papers with application doc and fee to the Embassy.

What do you think, is this possible?

Karl

1. Have you confirmed your embassy/consulate takes that long. Mine took about an hour. Maybe they could hurry it up if you tell them about your lack of time.

2. Which translator probably doesn't matter to much (not one that approaches you near the consulate). I think it would be faster and less hastle to have translator handle MFA. They have special contacts that can shorten wait. Forget the three day thing.

3.Depends on how far you have to travel. Include changing her house registration book (Also include that in translated documents). May not get a new ID then but she will have the receipt for doing it.

4. All the remainder depends upon all the rest happening according to schedule.

Good Luck

Edited October 5, 2008 by ubonjoe

[mgjackson69]

One thing you learn about Thai government agencies, it is best to have too much paperwork as they are very likely to go thorough what you give them and try to think of something else. They often take as a personal defeat if you have everything the first time and they don't get the chance to ask for something else.

If you learn nothing else from reading these forums (fora?), remember the above statement.

This applies to dealing with almost any Thai governmental agency, for anything. Except police...the only paper they want to see has "100" or "1000" and a portrait of the King on it.

Take everything you can think of and more.

Bring two copies of everything, plus the originals.

Do not make a big show of being prepared...it is ok to appear a bit disorganized, even if you are not.

Do not offer any document unless/until it is requested.

Bring exact change for whatever fees you will be paying.

Have some small change along, for going "next door" to photocopy something.

Smile, be polite, jai yen yen...but, there is no reason to kowtow.