Where Is Gold Going In This Market

[flying]

so u r telling me it is no longer possible to buy a gold necklace in a gold shop in MBK on a non-weekday? that is quite hard to imagine. those are the busiest 2 days of the week for shoppers. many will blow their salary by monday morning.

The rule is for bullion not jewelry

BANGKOK, 28 August 2011 (NNT)- Gold shops have suspended bar trade at weekends as a way to protect themselves from risks resulting from global price volatility.

Actually it is not uncommon & in the USA larger firms do not Buy on the weekends

They will of course sell.

http://www.apmex.com/Trading%20Hours/Default.aspx

Edited August 29, 2011 by flying

[midas]

Actually it is not uncommon & in the USA larger firms do not Buy on the weekends

They will of course sell.

http://www.apmex.com/Trading%20Hours/Default.aspx

flying does it concern you that there seems to be a growing chorus crying

" it's a bubble "? Such as this article from yesterday although when I read it

I kept thinking in that case where are people going to put the money?

In this article the writer argues that it's better to hold cash.

http://www.businessinsider.com/the-collapse-of-the-commodities-bubble-2011-8

I was also just also just watching the financial news from Australia

and they were also showing a the graph regarding the interrelationship of

goldmining shares and bullion and claiming it was also bubble.

Edited August 29, 2011 by midas

[Kwasaki]

perhaps we could dupe Mrs Naam by telling her we are not after Faber's gold but want to check out the services of some whorehouses in Chiang Mai?

Hey there Naam,

My Mrs today said that Prime Minister Yingluck announced she is going to put the gold down to 17,000 bht per bht gold because it is too high, I said she is in cloud cuckoo land, your take please.

[12DrinkMore]

Actually it is not uncommon & in the USA larger firms do not Buy on the weekends

They will of course sell.

http://www.apmex.com...rs/Default.aspx

flying does it concern you that there seems to be a growing chorus crying

" it's a bubble "? Such as this article from yesterday although when I read it

I kept thinking in that case where are people going to put the money?

In this article the writer argues that it's better to hold cash.

http://www.businessi...s-bubble-2011-8

I was also just also just watching the financial news from Australia

and they were also showing a the graph regarding the interrelationship of

goldmining shares and bullion and claiming it was also bubble.

From the article

We stand on the verge of a precipice. The effects of the first real liquidity crunch for decades will be profound. We are going to see prices fall across the board, but far fewer will be able to afford goods or assets at those lower prices than can currently afford them at today's lofty levels. The social effects of this will be enormous, and will spread to many more countries. The collapse of our credit pyramid will be the driving factor and it will sweep all before it like a hurricane for at least the next several years. Beware.

Beware, the Ides of March, eh?

Sounds far worse than my worst rant.

Well, I'm off to invest in a warehouse of beer, as I can't drink my gold. That'll sort out my liquidity problem for sure.

Just have to be careful I don't stumble over the precipice of the empty bottle pyramid.

[flying]

flying does it concern you that there seems to be a growing chorus crying

" it's a bubble "?

Not really because the various anal-ist have been calling gold a bubble for

years now. As always I will continue to use my eye & ears to see & hear what is

actually occurring...Not what the various cheerleaders claim.

My original reasons for going into gold remain intact. If those reasons start to show

actually signs of repair then I would start to at least regain my initial investment.

(Which has tripled since 2008) But we have seen no lasting repair to the many broken systems.

That the markets trade on silly news of course will have its daily effect. But long term what has

been repaired? What has gotten worse?

Due to the corrupt paper gold markets I do expect volatility & said well over a year ago that I fully expect to see days

where gold will rise or drop more than $100 a day. I am physical only so do not trade in & out for short swings. Premiums & availability

would not make that a profitable or intelligent trade. But I do swap metal for metal & will again

if the gold/silver ratio returns to above 60/1

Not that I am a chartists but

Looking at a 5 yr chart it may be a little toppy but nothing extreme

Looking at a 30 day it does look like it has a strong spot at $1750

Again not a chartist but if it were to break below that then I might be a little concerned

But again it would have to be accompanied by a real reasons greater than paper gold being manipulated

via COMEX option expiration & CME margin hikes.

Edited August 29, 2011 by flying

[PCA]

flying does it concern you that there seems to be a growing chorus crying

" it's a bubble "?

Not really because the various anal-ist have been calling gold a bubble for

years now. As always I will continue to use my eye & ears to see & hear what is

actually occurring...Not what the various cheerleaders claim.

My original reasons for going into gold remain intact. If those reasons start to show

actually signs of repair then I would start to at least regain my initial investment.

(Which has tripled since 2008) But we have seen no lasting repair to the many broken systems.

That the markets trade on silly news of course will have its daily effect. But long term what has

been repaired? What has gotten worse?

Due to the corrupt paper gold markets I do expect volatility & said well over a year ago that I fully expect to see days

where gold will rise or drop more than $100 a day. I am physical only so do not trade in & out for short swings. Premiums & availability

would not make that a profitable or intelligent trade. But I do swap metal for metal & will again

if the gold/silver ratio returns to above 60/1

Not that I am a chartists but

Looking at a 5 yr chart it may be a little toppy but nothing extreme

Looking at a 30 day it does look like it has a strong spot at $1750

Again not a chartist but if it were to break below that then I might be a little concerned

But again it would have to be accompanied by a real reasons greater than paper gold being manipulated

via COMEX option expiration & CME margin hikes.

good approach for now flying, buying dangerous and selling short deadly. Holding if in is the best current recipy. But sorry to tell the but it's a bubble nevertheless. A bubble which can go another 50% from here as easy as burst next week.

[Naam]

perhaps we could dupe Mrs Naam by telling her we are not after Faber's gold but want to check out the services of some whorehouses in Chiang Mai?

Hey there Naam,

My Mrs today said that Prime Minister Yingluck announced she is going to put the gold down to 17,000 bht per bht gold because it is too high, I said she is in cloud cuckoo land, your take please.

i can't judge PM Yingluck but from what i heard she is not that stupid.

[manarak]

perhaps we could dupe Mrs Naam by telling her we are not after Faber's gold but want to check out the services of some whorehouses in Chiang Mai?

Hey there Naam,

My Mrs today said that Prime Minister Yingluck announced she is going to put the gold down to 17,000 bht per bht gold because it is too high, I said she is in cloud cuckoo land, your take please.

i can't judge PM Yingluck but from what i heard she is not that stupid.

The PM can't move gold, but she can move the baht.

Sounds like a signal to buy baht.

[churchill]

Actually it is not uncommon & in the USA larger firms do not Buy on the weekends

They will of course sell.

http://www.apmex.com/Trading%20Hours/Default.aspx

flying does it concern you that there seems to be a growing chorus crying

" it's a bubble "? Such as this article from yesterday although when I read it

I kept thinking in that case where are people going to put the money?

In this article the writer argues that it's better to hold cash.

http://www.businessinsider.com/the-collapse-of-the-commodities-bubble-2011-8

I was also just also just watching the financial news from Australia

and they were also showing a the graph regarding the interrelationship of

goldmining shares and bullion and claiming it was also bubble.

see also ..

Is Gold a Bubble? 14 Charts, the Facts and the Data Suggest Not

http://www.goldcore.com/goldcore_blog/gold-bubble-14-charts-facts-and-data-suggest-not

[LivinLOS]

so u r telling me it is no longer possible to buy a gold necklace in a gold shop in MBK on a non-weekday? that is quite hard to imagine. those are the busiest 2 days of the week for shoppers. many will blow their salary by monday morning.

The Thai retailers announcement was only in relation to bullion bars .999 fine etc.. Which has pretty tight margin stock..

The 22 carat jewelry they will still sell.

[ExpatJ]

so u r telling me it is no longer possible to buy a gold necklace in a gold shop in MBK on a non-weekday? that is quite hard to imagine. those are the busiest 2 days of the week for shoppers. many will blow their salary by monday morning.

The Thai retailers announcement was only in relation to bullion bars .999 fine etc.. Which has pretty tight margin stock..

The 22 carat jewelry they will still sell.

Its not the selling that the shops are worried about- that's a pure red herring/BS. The point of restricting the trade due to 'high volatility' is they want to have the option to not buy back their gold should there suddenly be a big drop in price and a rush of sellers. In my mind the risk of holding Thai gold just increased significantly and if you are holding gold hoping to sell in the near future i would switch now to another countries physical or invest in paper gold.

Edited August 30, 2011 by ExpatJ

[flying]

In my mind the risk of holding Thai gold just increased significantly and if you are holding gold hoping to sell in the near future i would switch now to another countries physical or invest in paper gold.

Paper is paper. If folks are worried about plunges they may as well stay in cash (paper)

The COMEX is under no obligation to deliver physical gold to anyone who holds paper claims/contracts.

They reserve the right to settle in cash. Also you cannot get rid of paper gold when the market is closed either.

As for Bullion

No shops in USA (those that can buy more than a few ounces) buy bullion during weekend (off market) hours.

They buy 7am-5pm Mon-Fri only

I think Thailand has just caught up now to standard bullion operating procedures due to the increased buying there.

Edited August 30, 2011 by flying

[ExpatJ]

In my mind the risk of holding Thai gold just increased significantly and if you are holding gold hoping to sell in the near future i would switch now to another countries physical or invest in paper gold.

Paper is paper. If folks are worried about plunges they may as well stay in cash (paper)

The COMEX is under no obligation to deliver physical gold to anyone who holds paper claims/contracts.

They reserve the right to settle in cash. Also you cannot get rid of paper gold when the market is closed either.

As for Bullion

No shops in USA (those that can buy more than a few ounces) buy bullion during weekend (off market) hours.

They buy 7am-5pm Mon-Fri only

I think Thailand has just caught up now to standard bullion operating procedures due to the increased buying there.

"No shops in USA (those that can buy more than a few ounces) buy bullion during weekend (off market) hours"

This is wrong, you can buy gold bars at the weekend (i wansn't sure so i googled it and found a number of sellers trading 7 days a week).

"Also you cannot get rid of paper gold when the market is closed either."

The point is that you don't have to worry that the paper traders suddenly announce that they are not trading on a weekday due to volatility. The fact that thai gold shops just announced they will stop trading weekends because of volatility does indicate that the chances of them using this as an excuse to halt trading during a big price drop in a weekday has increased in a significantly big way.

Edited August 30, 2011 by ExpatJ

[farang000999]

Just buy thai gold .965 imho or at least buy enough of it so that you can trade it on the weekends to make yourself less worrisome. really, there is no reason to buy .999 in Thailand as i said before. personally i think it's better to just buy CEF or PHYS and then you get substantially more liquidity than you would with any form of physical.

[midas]

so u r telling me it is no longer possible to buy a gold necklace in a gold shop in MBK on a non-weekday? that is quite hard to imagine. those are the busiest 2 days of the week for shoppers. many will blow their salary by monday morning.

The Thai retailers announcement was only in relation to bullion bars .999 fine etc.. Which has pretty tight margin stock..

The 22 carat jewelry they will still sell.

Its not the selling that the shops are worried about- that's a pure red herring/BS. The point of restricting the trade due to 'high volatility' is they want to have the option to not buy back their gold should there suddenly be a big drop in price and a rush of sellers. In my mind the risk of holding Thai gold just increased significantly and if you are holding gold hoping to sell in the near future i would switch now to another countries physical or invest in paper gold.

I guess everyone has a different perspective as to what represents the worst risk

" Marc Faber: Don’t Store Your Gold In The United States "

[LivinLOS]

so u r telling me it is no longer possible to buy a gold necklace in a gold shop in MBK on a non-weekday? that is quite hard to imagine. those are the busiest 2 days of the week for shoppers. many will blow their salary by monday morning.

The Thai retailers announcement was only in relation to bullion bars .999 fine etc.. Which has pretty tight margin stock..

The 22 carat jewelry they will still sell.

Its not the selling that the shops are worried about- that's a pure red herring/BS. The point of restricting the trade due to 'high volatility' is they want to have the option to not buy back their gold should there suddenly be a big drop in price and a rush of sellers. In my mind the risk of holding Thai gold just increased significantly and if you are holding gold hoping to sell in the near future i would switch now to another countries physical or invest in paper gold.

Not sure I see the difference.. if they sell bars and the price rises suddenly they are just as out of pocket as if they buy bars and the price falls. Long / short makes not much difference.. They dont want to be caught with their pants down and its not simple to hedge.

We are working on an operation right now, to interface gold grammes from our online storage accounts, with a VISA credit card in real time, much like a multi currency transaction.. Its non trivial and our biggest hurdle is the lack of a functional weekend market. Forex pricing exists constantly but gold pricing markets dont. We are trying to operate a workaround and think we will be the first in the world to achieve this (before the Utah depository) and offer a true 'gold card' visa.

[flying]

In my mind the risk of holding Thai gold just increased significantly and if you are holding gold hoping to sell in the near future i would switch now to another countries physical or invest in paper gold.

Paper is paper. If folks are worried about plunges they may as well stay in cash (paper)

The COMEX is under no obligation to deliver physical gold to anyone who holds paper claims/contracts.

They reserve the right to settle in cash. Also you cannot get rid of paper gold when the market is closed either.

As for Bullion

No shops in USA (those that can buy more than a few ounces) buy bullion during weekend (off market) hours.

They buy 7am-5pm Mon-Fri only

I think Thailand has just caught up now to standard bullion operating procedures due to the increased buying there.

"No shops in USA (those that can buy more than a few ounces) buy bullion during weekend (off market) hours"

This is wrong, you can buy gold bars at the weekend (i wansn't sure so i googled it and found a number of sellers trading 7 days a week).

"Also you cannot get rid of paper gold when the market is closed either."

The point is that you don't have to worry that the paper traders suddenly announce that they are not trading on a weekday due to volatility. The fact that thai gold shops just announced they will stop trading weekends because of volatility does indicate that the chances of them using this as an excuse to halt trading during a big price drop in a weekday has increased in a significantly big way.

No your confusing what I said.

If you re-read my post it said no decent shop buys large quantities during off hours.

Yes you a customer can buy anytime you want 24 hours a day here in the USA

http://www.apmex.com/Trading%20Hours/Default.aspx

As for paper as I said they do not trade during off hours either.

You can put in a sell or buy to be executed at open but the same will apply if there is a gap down at open.

By the time your order is filled.....your price may be well below your sell target.

But really I think your being a little extreme regarding the new rule in Thailand.

It is basically the same everywhere in the world. Of course Thailand will continue to sell bullion on the weekends during

off market hours. They have a 50/50 chance price will gap up or down same as anyone.

They would not refuse a sale not knowing if Monday morning the markets may open lower.

But they limit their risk by not buying from you during off market hours.

As for anyone stopping trading during open market hours.....

It happens in the free worlds too. There are switches on all major exchanges.

If volatility is such they are tripped & trading halted.

Look back at the not too long ago flash crash in the USA. Many trades executed during it were not honored.

Although at that instance the switches did not trip properly.

But yes look at all the major exchanges Russia,Japan,Hong Kong etc. They all have the switches in place. If volatility reaches a point in a certain short period of time the switch is tripped & trading halted.

Basically I agree for those who want in-out-in-out paper is the way.

Not my way but the way of many

Physical is real I hold it I own it. It is nobody's liability but mine.

I would not trade paper any more than I would look for love in the streets of Pattaya Both places are totally corrupted.

Edited August 30, 2011 by flying

[midas]

good grief! I think someone must have injected Alan Greenspan with some kind of truth serum

" Former Federal Reserve boss Alan Greenspan (left) made headlines this week when he said gold is indeed a currency and noted that the euro was falling apart, contradicting top officials on both sides of the Atlantic.

But Greenspan’s comments on gold — widely accepted among economists — fly in the face of recent statements made by current Fed chief Ben Bernanke. In mid-July, Congressman Ron Paul (R-Texas), the chairman of the House Subcommittee on Monetary Policy, asked Bernanke whether he thought gold is money."

good on you Alan

http://thenewamerican.com/economy/markets-mainmenu-45/8742-greenspan-gold-is-a-currency-euro-breaking-down

Edited August 30, 2011 by midas

[midas]

Analysis: Record prices spawn new wave of China gold bugs

" Record gold prices, rather than denting China's enthusiasm for bullion, have emboldened investors to plough more money into gold bars and riskier bullion-based derivatives."

" The attitude of Chinese consumers -- expected to soon overtake Indians as the world's top buyers of gold -- will be an important influence on longer-term trends. That demand may also help smooth out temporary drops in prices"

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/08/29/us-china-gold-demand-idUSTRE77S15X20110829

[flying]

good grief! I think someone must have injected Alan Greenspan with some kind of truth serum

Remember back in 1966 it was Greenspan who once wrote

"Deficit spending is simply a scheme for the 'hidden' confiscation of wealth. Gold stands in the way of this insidious process. It stands as a protector of property rights."

Alan Greenspan

[midas]

good grief! I think someone must have injected Alan Greenspan with some kind of truth serum

Remember back in 1966 it was Greenspan who once wrote

"Deficit spending is simply a scheme for the 'hidden' confiscation of wealth. Gold stands in the way of this insidious process. It stands as a protector of property rights."

Alan Greenspan

actually when you look back on his career he wasn't such a bad guy.and he even admitted when he was wrong.

The only thing I criticise him for was his refusal to consider introducing regulation for derivatives trading immediately

after the fall of Lehman Bros which made him look like he was in bed with the other banksters.

[flying]

actually when you look back on his career he wasn't such a bad guy.and he even admitted when he was wrong.

The only thing I criticise him for was his refusal to consider introducing regulation for derivatives trading immediately

after the fall of Lehman Bros which made him look like he was in bed with the other banksters.

In Ron Paul's book End the FED ...He has a chapter titled "Conversations with Greenspan"

Very Interesting

The thing I remember most about Greenspan was during the tech bubble. It seemed like he was adjusting rates daily.

Of course he was not but it is what I remember thinking at the time.

[churchill]

Gerald Celente - I’m Now 100% In Gold, Roubini is Wrong

'You know I used to be in Swiss Francs (along with gold), I am not in Swiss Francs anymore. I got in (Swiss Francs) about a year and a half ago and did very well, but I’ve transferred everything I own into gold, I’m now totally invested in gold.”

Did I hear that before ?

http://kingworldnews.com/kingworldnews/KWN_DailyWeb/Entries/2011/8/30_Gerald_Celente_-_Im_Now_100_In_Gold%2C_Roubini_is_Wrong.html

[midas]

Gerald Celente - I’m Now 100% In Gold, Roubini is Wrong

'You know I used to be in Swiss Francs (along with gold), I am not in Swiss Francs anymore. I got in (Swiss Francs) about a year and a half ago and did very well, but I’ve transferred everything I own into gold, I’m now totally invested in gold.”

Did I hear that before ?

http://kingworldnews.com/kingworldnews/KWN_DailyWeb/Entries/2011/8/30_Gerald_Celente_-_Im_Now_100_In_Gold%2C_Roubini_is_Wrong.html

from this article ..." Yeah India was buying gold back then, but not like they are buying it now. "

Gold Sales in India May Increase 25% During Festival Season, Jeweler Says

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-08-30/gold-sales-may-rise-25-during-indian-festival-season-help-extend-rally.html

[12DrinkMore]

And to counteract all that

http://www.bloomberg...of-the-day.html

Gold's 'Absurd' Price Makes Stocks Look

I suppose he must have missed the boat.....

Investors can get a 130 percent return by investing in Dow stocks over the next two decades even if earnings rise by 2 percent under a deflationary scenario, Wadle said. To match this performance, gold prices would need to rise to $4,400 an ounce and the total value of bullion must surge to $27.6 trillion based on current and future supply, he said.

"This is absurd because it would represent two times the U.S.'s current gross domestic product and more than twice the current value of all U.S. equities," he said. "The gold price is an absurdity waiting to correct."

Why do I feel more confident in holding gold than chucking the lot onto the DOW, where I would have to confidence that the US is not going to suffer the Japanese disease?

And with the Bernank possibly about to pull more "unconventional tools" out of his toolbox, who knows what is going to happen next?

[edgarfriendly]

perhaps we could dupe Mrs Naam by telling her we are not after Faber's gold but want to check out the services of some whorehouses in Chiang Mai?

Hey there Naam,

My Mrs today said that Prime Minister Yingluck announced she is going to put the gold down to 17,000 bht per bht gold because it is too high, I said she is in cloud cuckoo land, your take please.

i can't judge PM Yingluck but from what i heard she is not that stupid.

The PM can't move gold, but she can move the baht.

Sounds like a signal to buy baht.

Explain please, how can she move the baht?

and if i sell gold for baht, would i then be able to buy back the gold i sell at 26000 for 17000?

ef

e2a - even reading that back it seems absurd to even ask. is it even possible let alone plausible?

Edited August 31, 2011 by edgarfriendly

[Naam]

Explain please, how can she move the baht?

PM Yingluck has moved the Baht already. THB weakened after the announcement of minimum wage increase.

[flying]

e2a - even reading that back it seems absurd to even ask. is it even possible let alone plausible?

which one? You asked 2

[edgarfriendly]

well, both i suppose.

specifically the abilty to 'change the price' of gold to 17k at a whim.

i cant see how it would be possible for anyone to do that.

actually i was aiming the question. at manarak, but appreciate any decent input.

the more i think about it, the more i want to know what made manarak think that and what he expects to be the method used.

IF its deemed plausible.

im trying to look at a wider perspective than maybe im used to.

and as i have noticed, empty words/promises CAN have huge real life effects.

ef

[churchill]

Given Gartman's trading record - Expect a decline from here !

Today "Economist Dennis Gartman Is Buying Gold in Euros, British Pounds ~ Bloomberg Wire'

last week from http://ftalphaville.ft.com/blog/2011/08/24/661521/kiss-of-death-for-gold/

In the bubble camp, Nouriel Roubini compared the gold price to the Nasdaq bubble on Tuesday. In “le pop” land, meanwhile, Dennis Gartman (CNBC pundit, fund manager and author of the Gartman Letter) openly declared — to the dismay of many goldbugs — that it was quite clear that a top had been reached and that he regretted not having exited at least 150 per cent of his long position (that would be shorting right? – Ed):

'We shall be told that central banks are buying gold and that that shall offer support and we acknowledge that fact and say “So what?” We will be told that gold is not a commodity but is instead a currency, and we’ll acknowledge that that is the thesis we have ourselves pushed and promoted, but again, “So what?” Once a top is made no sum of bullish news can dissuade the new trend from asserting itself. The public is caught heavily long; funds… large funds… sophisticated funds… funds that should know better… are caught heavily long and are now in a very difficult position, for their long positions in equities are deteriorating and their gold positions are now about to do the same.'