Where Is Gold Going In This Market

[flying]

Me thinks India got a good deal at 1045/oz

IMF Sells Gold to Central Bank of India, Netting $6.7 Billion

Nov. 3 (Bloomberg) -- The International Monetary Fund said it is selling 200 metric tons of gold to the Reserve Bank of India for about $6.7 billion, its first sale of the precious metal in nine years.

The sale accounts for almost half the 403.3 tons that the Washington-based lender in September agreed to sell as part of a plan to shore up its finances and lend at reduced rates to low- income countries.

“This transaction is an important step toward achieving the objectives of the IMF’s limited gold sales program, which are to help put the fund’s finances on a sound long-term footing and enable us to step up much-needed concession lending to the poorest countries,” IMF Managing Director Dominique Strauss- Kahn said in an e-mailed statement yesterday.

The transaction, which involved daily sales from Oct. 19-30 at market prices, is in the process of being settled, the IMF said in the statement. The average price in the transaction with India was about $1,045 an ounce, an IMF official said on a conference call with reporters.

The lender has said it is ready to sell directly to central banks and later make transactions on the open market if necessary. The IMF official declined to say whether other central banks have expressed interest in purchases.

The 403.3 tons the IMF board agreed to sell amount to one- eight of its stockpile. Gold prices reached a record of $1,072 an ounce on Oct. 14 and have gained 45 percent from a year ago.

Gold futures for December delivery jumped $13.60, or 1.3 percent, to $1,054 an ounce on the New York Mercantile Exchange’s Comex division yesterday, the highest closing price for a most-active contract since Oct. 23.

Low-Income Countries

Proceeds from the sales and other IMF resources as well as individual contributors would help pay for discounted interest rates on loans to low-income countries, the IMF said in July. It plans to grant as much as $17 billion in extra loans to poor nations through 2014.

The IMF, which helped shore up economies from Pakistan to Iceland over the past year, has sold gold on several occasions in the past. The last transaction was authorized in December 1999 and took place off-market between then and April 2000.

[Naam]

The International Monetary Fund said it is selling 200 metric tons of gold to the Reserve Bank of India for about $6.7 billion, its first sale of the precious metal in nine years.

hmmm... conclusion: IMF = fools, indian central bankers = clever?

[flying]

The International Monetary Fund said it is selling 200 metric tons of gold to the Reserve Bank of India for about $6.7 billion, its first sale of the precious metal in nine years.

hmmm... conclusion: IMF = fools, indian central bankers = clever?

Well the Indians may be clever since....

the objectives of the IMF’s limited gold sales program, which are to help put the fund’s finances on a sound long-term footing and enable us to step up much-needed concession lending to the poorest countries,

Now India is 6.7B poorer & maybe qualify to get their money back & now have gold too

[sokal]

The International Monetary Fund said it is selling 200 metric tons of gold to the Reserve Bank of India for about $6.7 billion, its first sale of the precious metal in nine years.

hmmm... conclusion: IMF = fools, indian central bankers = clever?

Yeah, because now the IMF has no real money.

The IMF gold sales I am guess where a price suppression scheme and as Flying pointed out, the scheme seems to be going over like a lead balloon.

Edited November 3, 2009 by sokal

[lannarebirth]

Good article.

Even though I could pay cash, I am thinking about borrowing 40 grand to buy some bullion. I see limited downside at this point. I could even handle a temporary slide down to 800.

If I was looking to buy I think this is a nice pullback to do so in both Gold & Silver.

Could launch. Good Luck.

[flying]

Good article.

Even though I could pay cash, I am thinking about borrowing 40 grand to buy some bullion. I see limited downside at this point. I could even handle a temporary slide down to 800.

If I was looking to buy I think this is a nice pullback to do so in both Gold & Silver.

Could launch. Good Luck.

Thank LB Sure looks strong.

It seems like it coiled & sprung again

Jumped again today even with the $$ rising.

I said a month or so ago that I wouldn't be surprised to see gold outpace

other currencies in Nov.

[flying]

Without even looking at a chart it seems gold has set a real pattern since last Oct.

Seems like we set new highs then it pulls back to 20-40 range of previous hundred

Meaning it was 735 range last Oct

breaks thru to 860+ pulls back to 820-840 coils

Breaks thru to 960+ pulls back to 920-930 coils

Breaks thru to 1060 pulls back to 1020-140 coils

What is next? Breaks thru to? 1160? Will we see a break thru & pull back to 1120 range 3rd week of Nov?

I would not be at all surprised given what I have seen this past year.

[flying]

Me thinks India got a good deal at 1045/oz

IMF Sells Gold to Central Bank of India, Netting $6.7 Billion

Nov. 3 (Bloomberg) -- The International Monetary Fund said it is selling 200 metric tons of gold to the Reserve Bank of India for about $6.7 billion, its first sale of the precious metal in nine years.

The transaction, which involved daily sales from Oct. 19-30 at market prices, is in the process of being settled, the IMF said in the statement. The average price in the transaction with India was about $1,045 an ounce, an IMF official said on a conference call with reporters.

Given that India bought roughly... 6,430,000 ounces yesterday at avg 1045/oz

They made a sh!t load of money in one day didn't they?

Based on a 40 rise..... $257,200,000 & they have not even taken delivery yet.

Not a bad days work

Actually I think the Bloomberg article may be wrong.

Does the IMF sell in metric Tons? I thought so but Bloomberg is calculated in US Tons?

Just curious but does anyone know?

Edited November 4, 2009 by flying

[sokal]

Me thinks India got a good deal at 1045/oz

IMF Sells Gold to Central Bank of India, Netting $6.7 Billion

Nov. 3 (Bloomberg) -- The International Monetary Fund said it is selling 200 metric tons of gold to the Reserve Bank of India for about $6.7 billion, its first sale of the precious metal in nine years.

The transaction, which involved daily sales from Oct. 19-30 at market prices, is in the process of being settled, the IMF said in the statement. The average price in the transaction with India was about $1,045 an ounce, an IMF official said on a conference call with reporters.

Given that India bought roughly... 6,430,000 ounces yesterday at avg 1045/oz

They made a sh!t load of money in one day didn't they?

Based on a 40 rise..... $257,200,000 & they have not even taken delivery yet.

Not a bad days work

Actually I think the Bloomberg article may be wrong.

Does the IMF sell in metric Tons? I thought so but Bloomberg is calculated in US Tons?

Just curious but does anyone know?

I wonder how they went about selling that gold ? Surly every central bank on earth was interested in it. They probably had a top secret auction at the BIS.

[flying]

Interesting update on India's purchase

Gold Over $1,090 and Climbing

I was surprised to find that India paid for their 6.7B in gold in SDR's

It poses the question.......

Did India want to hold the dollars or did the IMF not want dollars?

Edited November 4, 2009 by flying

[flying]

for the record: if USD remains at present levels vs. other major currencies (JP¥, €UR, AUD, CAD) and gold crosses $1,100/ounce i will buy that worthless metal which has no intrinsic value at all like a madman.

Get your Euros ready We are at the door & knocking $1097

Edited November 4, 2009 by flying

[Naam]

for the record: if USD remains at present levels vs. other major currencies (JP¥, €UR, AUD, CAD) and gold crosses $1,100/ounce i will buy that worthless metal which has no intrinsic value at all like a madman.

Get your Euros ready We are at the door & knocking $1097

did the USD hold steady? yes/no [delete not applicable]

[Naam]

Interesting update on India's purchase

Gold Over $1,090 and Climbing

I was surprised to find that India paid for their 6.7B in gold in SDR's

It poses the question.......

Did India want to hold the dollars or did the IMF not want dollars?

wrong question. the correct questions [and answers] are:

-what is India's source of the SDRs which are used to pay for the gold?

-can the Reserve Bank of India print SDRs? yes/no

-can SDRs be bought at vegetable markets in Delhi or fish markets in Mumbai? yes/no

-is it correct that SDRs can only be acquired from the IMF against payment of the appropriate currency amounts? yes/no

-does India have to use 44% US-Dollars to pay for the gold? yes/no

[flying]

wrong question. the correct questions [and answers] are:

-what is India's source of the SDRs which are used to pay for the gold?

-can the Reserve Bank of India print SDRs? yes/no

-can SDRs be bought at vegetable markets in Delhi or fish markets in Mumbai? yes/no

-is it correct that SDRs can only be acquired from the IMF against payment of the appropriate currency amounts? yes/no

-does India have to use 44% US-Dollars to pay for the gold? yes/no

So I see your in the IMF did not want dollars camp

Cant blame them can we

[flying]

did the USD hold steady? yes/no [delete not applicable]

Never in its history

[Naam]

did the USD hold steady? yes/no [delete not applicable]

Never in its history

diversions not allowed, history irrelevant!

QUOTE (Naam @ 2009-08-0117:37:44) for the record: if USD remains at present levels vs. other major currencies (JP¥, €UR, AUD, CAD)...

[sokal]

Interesting update on India's purchase

Gold Over $1,090 and Climbing

I was surprised to find that India paid for their 6.7B in gold in SDR's

It poses the question.......

Did India want to hold the dollars or did the IMF not want dollars?

wrong question. the correct questions [and answers] are:

-what is India's source of the SDRs which are used to pay for the gold?

-can the Reserve Bank of India print SDRs? yes/no

-can SDRs be bought at vegetable markets in Delhi or fish markets in Mumbai? yes/no

-is it correct that SDRs can only be acquired from the IMF against payment of the appropriate currency amounts? yes/no

-does India have to use 44% US-Dollars to pay for the gold? yes/no

What is your point ?

India dumped fiat for gold. Not much else to be said.

[sokal]

for the record: if USD remains at present levels vs. other major currencies (JP¥, €UR, AUD, CAD) and gold crosses $1,100/ounce i will buy that worthless metal which has no intrinsic value at all like a madman.

Get your Euros ready We are at the door & knocking $1097

Its funny how CaptainARK wont go near the gold thread.

[lannarebirth]

Interesting update on India's purchase

Gold Over $1,090 and Climbing

I was surprised to find that India paid for their 6.7B in gold in SDR's

It poses the question.......

Did India want to hold the dollars or did the IMF not want dollars?

wrong question. the correct questions [and answers] are:

-what is India's source of the SDRs which are used to pay for the gold?

-can the Reserve Bank of India print SDRs? yes/no

-can SDRs be bought at vegetable markets in Delhi or fish markets in Mumbai? yes/no

-is it correct that SDRs can only be acquired from the IMF against payment of the appropriate currency amounts? yes/no

-does India have to use 44% US-Dollars to pay for the gold? yes/no

What is your point ?

India dumped fiat for gold. Not much else to be said.

I think the point is that the IMF dumped Gold in lieu of coming up with real cash.

[flying]

I think the point is that the IMF dumped Gold in lieu of coming up with real cash.

Well yes they wanted currency as stated in their reason....

The IMF sale accounts for almost half the 403.3 tons that the Washington-based lender in September agreed to sell as part of a plan to shore up its finances and lend at reduced rates to low-income countries. Asian nations, which have amassed stockpiles of foreign currency reserves since the 1998 financial crisis, have shown increased interest in diversifying out of U.S. assets as the dollar loses value against other currencies.

Since the sale took place in SDR's it is still a bit confusing to me.

The reason in bold above does not make that much sense to me in the IMF's case.

What is the percentages of each currency in a SDR? The USD make up the largest portion of it...no?

It seems it would have made much more sense to hold the gold.

Obviously India thought so & made a hefty profit in the one day since they bought it.

Still one has to wonder ......But at the end of the day if their job is loaning to low income countries they need a medium of exchange & it has no bearing in the bigger scheme of things anymore than the red cross selling badges to raise funds to help disaster victims.

But it did show once & for all that the often touted threat to sell gold is not a negative for golds price in the free held gold market

From a newsletter I get ............

For nearly two decades, every time the manipulators in the Fed, US Treasury, & bullion banks wanted to drive down gold, they would drag out that old dead duck (the threat of IMF gold sales) and shake it in the market's face. Oh, my, that would send the market shivering, at least, those naïve folks who had not already witnessed the duck two dozen times. So comes the time that the IMF finally really, really, decides to sell gold, 403.3 tonnes (12.966 million oz). Does gold strangle? Hardly. Decision was made 18 September, but the long-threatened gold never hit the market. Rather, the Reserve Bank of India gobbled up 200 tonnes (6.421 Moz) from 19 - 30 October at an average price of $1,041.96. And the gold market? Did the mighty IMF garrotte the gold market with its big-bad sales? Hardly. Gold ROSE $30.90 on the IMF sales news to close at an all time Come high of $1,084.30! Viola! The dead duck has exploded, leaving only flecks & gobs of carrion all over the IMF.

Edited November 5, 2009 by flying

[flying]

Its funny how CaptainARK wont go near the gold thread.

The Captain/Harmonica got banned

I noticed right after he went off the other night on some long post

about posting trades. He was tearing into one member in particular.

Who knows why but it was a odd post as usual

Edited November 5, 2009 by flying

[lannarebirth]

Its funny how CaptainARK wont go near the gold thread.

The Captain/Harmonica got banned

I noticed right after he went off the other night on some long post

about posting trades. He was tearing into one member in particular.

Who knows why but it was a odd post as usual

Ignore my last post, I'm not sure what I was talking about.

As far as posting trades is concerned it just doesn't work. Not even on an actual securities trading forum, which this isn't even close to being. Almost nobody trades what I trade or for the same reasons I trade it. What could they possibly get from me posting a trade I'm in for 5 minutes, and didn't know a minute before i got in that i would. Should I tell them afterwards? I don't think so. It's an exercise in futility.

[Abrak]

Its funny how CaptainARK wont go near the gold thread.

The Captain/Harmonica got banned

How sad. He made very bold predictions which were right off the money.

Personally I would ban Sokal for calling Keynes an ass. He has 233 publications on Amazon. I have a 48 page booklet simply of his bibliography. He is generally recognized as the greatest economist of the 20th century - outscoring the number 2 by 3x in a recent poll and was nominated by Time magazine as one of the 100 greatest thinkers of the 20th century. Even so called Austrian sympathizers like Faber recommend more books by him than any other author. I doubt Sokal has read a 10th of his work, in fact I know very few people who have.

[sokal]

Interesting update on India's purchase

Gold Over $1,090 and Climbing

I was surprised to find that India paid for their 6.7B in gold in SDR's

It poses the question.......

Did India want to hold the dollars or did the IMF not want dollars?

wrong question. the correct questions [and answers] are:

-what is India's source of the SDRs which are used to pay for the gold?

-can the Reserve Bank of India print SDRs? yes/no

-can SDRs be bought at vegetable markets in Delhi or fish markets in Mumbai? yes/no

-is it correct that SDRs can only be acquired from the IMF against payment of the appropriate currency amounts? yes/no

-does India have to use 44% US-Dollars to pay for the gold? yes/no

What is your point ?

India dumped fiat for gold. Not much else to be said.

I think the point is that the IMF dumped Gold in lieu of coming up with real cash.

Why would they do that ? The IMF can print SDRs by getting the Fed to do currency swaps with the SDR central banks. They can print as much fiat money as they want. That would be like the Saudis selling oil in exchange for sand.

[flying]

As far as posting trades is concerned it just doesn't work. Not even on an actual securities trading forum, which this isn't even close to being. Almost nobody trades what I trade or for the same reasons I trade it. What could they possibly get from me posting a trade I'm in for 5 minutes, and didn't know a minute before i got in that i would. Should I tell them afterwards? I don't think so. It's an exercise in futility.

All true & yes even when I did trade, none stated trades on any board. Perhaps mentioned stocks or possibilities of course. Especially on the day trade groups.

Then again that was the tech bubble & many were pumping so they could dump.

That aside having seen the post I mentioned it was IMO just a big power trip.

Having been wrong so often I think he was trying to show others could not post successful trades in some crazy allotted time frame he deemed the rules

As if a person busy in the markets had the time or inclination to do such flag waving

[sokal]

Its funny how CaptainARK wont go near the gold thread.

The Captain/Harmonica got banned

How sad. He made very bold predictions which were right off the money.

Personally I would ban Sokal for calling Keynes an ass. He has 233 publications on Amazon. I have a 48 page booklet simply of his bibliography. He is generally recognized as the greatest economist of the 20th century - outscoring the number 2 by 3x in a recent poll and was nominated by Time magazine as one of the 100 greatest thinkers of the 20th century. Even so called Austrian sympathizers like Faber recommend more books by him than any other author. I doubt Sokal has read a 10th of his work, in fact I know very few people who have.

"Ben Keynes Bernanke is an economic criminal and a destroyer of wealth"- Marc Faber

[Abrak]

Why would they do that ? The IMF can print SDRs by getting the Fed to do currency swaps with the SDR central banks. They can print as much fiat money as they want. That would be like the Saudis selling oil in exchange for sand.

I truely dont understand SDRs. Remember in 2008 there was only some US$30bn in existence. I gather they are a general basket of currencies but that the Yuan and the Indian Rupee are excluded. I also believe that the IMF was effectively allowed to print SDRs to distribute to second and third world countries which is a bit odd because they have all the forex reserves - the printing being to the tune of US$300bn earlier this year. Now obviously this is a nonsense, so the truth is rather different. Can someone explain?

[flying]

I truely dont understand SDRs. Remember in 2008 there was only some US$30bn in existence. I gather they are a general basket of currencies but that the Yuan and the Indian Rupee are excluded. I also believe that the IMF was effectively allowed to print SDRs to distribute to second and third world countries which is a bit odd because they have all the forex reserves - the printing being to the tune of US$300bn earlier this year. Now obviously this is a nonsense, so the truth is rather different. Can someone explain?

All you they want you to know & more here & on the Data tab

http://www.imf.org/external/np/tre/sdr/sdrbasket.htm

http://www.imf.org/external/np/exr/facts/quotas.htm

Edited November 5, 2009 by flying

[Abrak]

"Ben Keynes Bernanke is an economic criminal and a destroyer of wealth"- Marc Faber

First I was pointing out that Marc Faber actually recommends reading Keynes above all other economists. I have no idea where that quotation comes from but it really is hard to see Bernanke as a rabid Keynesian (Krugman perhaps).

Keynes said such things as....

"the best way to destroy the capitalist system [is] to debauch the currency." 1919

Very much a Bernanke solution.

And he is totally committed to reponsible fiscal policy and states so monthly. This is because he does not believe in a concept which Keynes called the 'liquidity trap' (1936 General Theory) whereby monetary policy is rendered useless at ZIRP.

Anyway strange comment from Faber but then he did think we would all be dead by swine flu by now.

At least now I know the underpinning of why you think Keynes is an ass.

[Abrak]

All you they want you to know & more here & on the Data tab

http://www.imf.org/external/np/tre/sdr/sdrbasket.htm

http://www.imf.org/external/np/exr/facts/quotas.htm

So Flying I read it but didnt totally understand it.

As I see it I would be wrong in saying that the IMF can print SDRs. What they do is take a quota of second and third world currencies and in return either give them SDRs or access to SDRs. In other words it is a fancy way of operating the same old economy. SDRs are made up of mostly dollars and sterling but in stead of having US$ and sterling reserves (Ok there is yen and euro too) you now have a fancy new package called an SDR. It all still amounts to 2nd and 3rd world countries paying for 1st world deficits.