Does Your Thai Partner Want To Live In Isaan?

[Ollie]

I think open minded Thais become immersed in their host countries culture and become more empowered here. They then find it difficult to tolerate all the crap around status, losing face etc. they see when they return to Thailand. Women are perhaps not given the same opportunities to develop in Thailand. These are not my views but my wife and her friends.

Very much the views of my wife and her small circle of Thai friends here in the UK, although we will be moving to LOS in due course - the definition of that is a minor bone of contention between us. She wants to stay at least another 5 years! That horrifies me as I can retire in 3.

[MJP]

From what I've heard, Thai women usually seem to want to move to and live in Western countries, so I've always wondered how the wives/gfs of farangs living in Isaan feel about remaining there. Are some of them bitter about having to stay? Maybe the reality is that many go to a Western country for a few months then realize they like Thailand better? I ask because my gf and I have visa problems that probably won't allow her to ever come to the U.S. (she was born male gender but changed before i met her) and U.S. immigration doesn't recognize "same-sex" marriage for purposes of the fiance visas (F1&3). She always talks about how she wants to 'live in ameri-gah' and it breaks my heart, I'm hoping I could comfort her by saying most sao lao want to come back to pathet isaan anyway....

Tried this the other year.

Took 6 months to get a family visitor visa. Came over and 3 weeks and 3 days later back on an aeroplane home. No chance. Hated it.

Now tells everyone what a miserable place the UK is and wonders why people want to go there.

[Roadman]

i wonder if the reason why a lot of the above posters wifes do not want to settle in the west is that they would will miss there thai husband / boyfriend !!!!!!!!!!!! haha this post has got to be deleted! you just watch!

Pathetic contribution to an otherwise interesting topic. Use of English is poor also.

Good arguments either way. We intend to re-locate from Thailand to the UK when our daughter reaches 11, primarily for her schooling. Hopefully will return at a later date for my retirement. Best laid plans though can go awry.

Londoedan,

We had lived in Thailand for about 10 years and left just before they devalued the Baht back in the 90s. Sorry can't recall exact dates. Our intention was to just come for a year for my daughter to learn English. We had a good life in Thailand and both of us had romantic notions of returning. Trouble with having a plan is that life gets in the way. In many ways we've both enjoyed our time in Ireland. My wife has worked here as a translator, drives her own car, is studying massage and does lots of things she would never do in Thailand.

I think open minded Thais become immersed in their host countries culture and become more empowered here. They then find it difficult to tolerate all the crap around status, losing face etc. they see when they return to Thailand. Women are perhaps not given the same opportunities to develop in Thailand. These are not my views but my wife and her friends.

Bitter Irish guy,

Joe

Same same here in NZ.

My Isaan wife came here for the intent of us doing a short stint but that has changed her mind with time as she sees how good she has it compared to Thailand. And that is common among our thai community friends. Other values she has here apart from what Paddythai has correctly identified are not only for the individual woman but her family. Most here including ourselves have other thai family here now taking the opportunities that they would never be able to obtain in Isaan both in education, employment and bussiness. For some they have more family committment here now than in Thailand.

The close contact with those back in Isaan still remains with time spent back there each year and financial assistant given - and for most of these women that is their own money they are sending home and buying their air fares with and not having to wait or beg for in Thailand - empowerment that they could never dream of in Thailand.

The real advantage for my wife with a serious illness is the free high quality health care she needs 2 monthly. ฿30 health care may be great for simple illness but you still have to pay the big ฿฿฿ for specialists in Thailand - she gets access to those same specialists here for nothing.

Looking at Thai women here in general I would say that those who get involved within the thai community are more likely to be the ones that stay and commit long term as that base is there for the thai "family interdependance" that they initially need and can develop western style independence from. I now see a few thai women that have been here now 4 or 5 years going through the next stage of their lives as they divorce what they thought were desirable falang husbands. What does not surprise me is that they do not chose to go back to Isaan but are keen to start afresh here.

I have learnt with time that you will never get Isaan out of an Isaan woman (and I would never want her to lose that) but that Isaan woman can get out of Isaan in spite of the view otherwise.

Edit for spelling.

Edited November 1, 2008 by Roadman

[tommyj4]

My wife stayed in the U.K for 6 months...that was the visa we applied for just to see how it was.......after being here a few years and going back, I hated it...although my wife enjoyed it & she was welcomed by everyone, it still isnt the same as being here and we returned here for good. She dosnt want to live in Issan even though most of her family are there as she knows work/education etc opportunities are not as good as BKK/Phuket/Samui etc......so although she liked the U.K she prefers it here...

[Svenn]

Looking at Thai women here in general I would say that those who get involved within the thai community are more likely to be the ones that stay and commit long term as that base is there for the thai "family interdependance" that they initially need and can develop western style independence from. I now see a few thai women that have been here now 4 or 5 years going through the next stage of their lives as they divorce what they thought were desirable falang husbands. What does not surprise me is that they do not chose to go back to Isaan but are keen to start afresh here.

hmm, i hope divorcing and being independent isn't naturally the "next stage" of a woman's development! Though some thai women get bad farangs, I don't think we should view more independent ones as 'more advanced' than the others.

I'm still trying to understand the viewpoint of the wives of the posters who remained outside thailand- what exactly do you mean by more "empowered"? maybe i'm just a thick-headed male, but its hard for me to understand what they can do in the west that they can't in isaan. maybe your contrasting affluent urban life with rural village life as opposed to the West vs thailand? u guys have to understand, i'm trying to make the most light out of this as possible, playing devil's advocate, since it's likely my gf can never come to the west.

Edited November 1, 2008 by Svenn

[Ollie]

I'm still trying to understand the viewpoint of the wives of the posters who remained outside thailand- what exactly do you mean by more "empowered"? maybe i'm just a thick-headed male, but its hard for me to understand what they can do in the west that they can't in isaan. maybe your contrasting affluent urban life with rural village life as opposed to the West vs thailand? u guys have to understand, i'm trying to make the most light out of this as possible, playing devil's advocate, since it's likely my gf can never come to the west.

How about getting your wife to ask that question? There are many forums for Thai females scattered across the world and it's a common viewpoint.

[jay-uk]

There are two types of Isaan girl seen here in the UK which may help the opening poster with a decision to move or stay. In UK you see Thai ladies who have immersed themselves into the culture of UK and find that the respect given by employers and opportunities to work open up possibilities to earn sums of money which would not otherwise be achiveable back in LOS. We have two Thai friends who studied here and learned to work within schools or nursing positions and proud that they have not had to get a masters degree to get there. Then you have a larger number of Thais who appear not to want to better their eductation but still like the idea of earning money to send back home so they do what they can in terms of employment cleaning or factory work. The latter still earns reasonable money as factory work with overtime pays to one friend £300/week net (16,800 baht @ todays rate). I read some government statistics somewhere that upto 50% of Thai arrivals return within first year but likelyhood of them returning significantly diminishes after that as years pass by. Some arrive here and their partners expect them to adapt to a life in a council house so even Thais are not stupid that life on the dole is not much better than back home so they leave but for most they enjoy life and would not want to leave. Something to do with once they have had a taste of what they can earn they know any return to Thailand means a life of just getting by day-to-day unless they return with a wealthy farang of course who has the funds to last the duration. There is good and bad to be found in both countries. I love the feeling of holidays in Thailand and Isaan's people's attitude to life is to be admired but when the holiday is over it is a place which does not support people to get on financially so most do not get the chances we get in the west unless born into a wealthy Bangkok family. The numbers of Thais entering and staying in the UK is growing faster than the return rate so I guess that speaks volumes.

Edited November 2, 2008 by jay-uk

[zaphodbeeblebrox]

My fiance is from Chiang Rai. She has lived in the U.S. and Hong Kong for short periods with prior boyfriends. I think she would like to live in the U.S. (her best friend recently got married and moved to Texas).

The thing is that I moved to Thailand with the plan to live here the rest of my years. I could take her to my home town (L.A.), where we could settle near Thai Town and she would be quite comfortable. But, I hate L.A. The only place in the U.S. I would consider living is Hawaii, but after 15 years in the Aloha state, I gave that up.

My fiance has bought a good-sized piece of land in Isaan, and moved her mom and dad, brothers and sisters up there. I might move up there when I reach retirement age and become a farmer (ala "Green Acres").

So, my fiance is stuck with me, wherever I decide to live. Right now, that's Rayong. In the future, it could be Bangkok or Chiang Mai. She's not from Isaan, so she doesn't want to move there now, but I think she really digs my Green Acres thing. She does make a good Zsa Zsa Gabor.

Regards,

Oliver Wendell Holmes, Esq.

[bina]

She always talks about how she wants to 'live in ameri-gah' and it breaks my heart, I'm hoping I could comfort her by saying most sao lao want to come back to pathet isaan anyway....

sven i think the point is really moot. i dont think that a transgendered girl can get a female identity card in thailand, therefore on her passport she will be male but u might want to pm to bambina since she managed to get a visa for going to university overseas (in holland so maybe a different story); she is transgendered (post op) and a doctor of veterinary medicine doing a stint in holland i think...

so dreaming of going or being disappointed isnt even in the books... it has nothing to do with wanting or liking being overseas... most likely she will not ever be able to do that. and getting a visa for fiancee will only happen if same sex (as far as being written on the identity card as male and not female) marriages are considered legal for visa purposes.

however, there are others with similar problems, such as men with partners from the hill tribes w/o id cards, passports, or citizenship in thailand or laos or burma...and they have it worse cause some are stuck only in certain changwat, or cant work legally in thailand.

its like trying to say to a child that wearing glasses has benefits that those that dont wear them dont have. i wear glasses, hated it as a child, parents tried that story with me... basically it took me a while to understand that i have to wear glasses (cant wear contacts doesnt matter why) and thats that. accept that as fact and move on to other things.

like building your life in issaan as best as possible. make friends. go to college in issaan area. or go metropolitan and go to the big city. its not worth beating around the bush to try to make the grass on the other side less green. it always will be greener. your girlfriend has to realize that. she made a very big and brave decision . well, maybe two. one to change, and one to tell u (re: your last thread). so now number three decision is : no can do, so will make best of what there is here and now.

my two sheckels worth

bina

israel

Edited November 2, 2008 by bina

[PaddyThai]

My wife has recently started studying Thai massage here in Ireland. She was telling me today how the Thai massage parlour where she goes to practice has a turnover of about 43,000 bht per day. Add to that the fact they work less hours than say Bkk. The staff get very generous tips. They have option of working 5 day weeks. Rent nice apartments. None of the staff are particularly good looking imho but they get invited on dates regularly and 2 of them are in relationships.

These are new Thai people my wife has met and they too are in no hurry to retrun to Thailand. I guess even if they did get homesick it might be foolish to leave this kind of income to go back to an impoverished village.

My wife is now set on opening a massage business in Canada. While canada, I'm sure, is very nice I am not keen on the idea of learing about a new country. I've laready spent about 10 years in Thailand.

[khunandy]

When I first met my wife 5 years ago her dream was to go to either Switzerland or Australia (don't ask me). After we married we settled in Perth, Australia for a year or so and although she enjoyed it and got a job, money and a bit more independence I could see her developing a few western habits that I didn't like.

We came back to Thailand and I saw that old spark in her eyes again while happily bashing som tam to death and sitting back on the grass mat surrounded by life long friends.

We go to Aussie a couple of times a year now for a few weeks , mainly to see family and we enjoy it very much but I really don't want to return full time and either does my wife.

[Dave the Dude]

When I first met my wife 5 years ago her dream was to go to either Switzerland or Australia (don't ask me). After we married we settled in Perth, Australia for a year or so and although she enjoyed it and got a job, money and a bit more independence I could see her developing a few western habits that I didn't like.

We came back to Thailand and I saw that old spark in her eyes again while happily bashing som tam to death and sitting back on the grass mat surrounded by life long friends.

We go to Aussie a couple of times a year now for a few weeks , mainly to see family and we enjoy it very much but I really don't want to return full time and either does my wife.

Hi Andy

Nice story. I am glad it worked out good for you all.

Dave

[samuibeachcomber]

khunandy,what did you mean by"i could see her developing a few western habits i did n't like",interesting,care to elaborate pleasr.

[richm7]

This mirrors our previous post and the thoughts of my wife & I. As much as I love the thought of moving there in my old age with my wife there are so many other factors to consider in future. The economy is driving interest rates down not up around the world, house prices are sliding fast, pension funds are suffering and currencies are weakening against the baht. This all affects the viability longer term for Thailand as it becomes more expensive to travel or live there when compared against other countries. I can't believe for one minute that the people already retired there living on offshore savings are not sweating at the moment with the current economic climate. All said and done the real reason I could never stay in Thailand well into my old age would be health care. After seeing my son become sick in UK it made me appreciate how important your health is. Most take chances living out in Thailand without cover only to return back to the west when their health runs into more serious problems. We know a couple of people who have had no choice but to return to Uk with heart problems as they could not afford treatment locally. No matter what cover you have the Thais will always find a way out of paying if you do not use a reputable company. Even if you can get cover initially most insurers will not cover you into your late 70's anyhow so how long can anybody really stay there unless you throw caution to the wind. Let's face it how many 80/90 year old farangs do you see walking around, I've not seen many in Thailand. I've seen people in the 50's, 60, and a few in there 70's but older than that they are not to be seen much. You can only draw public pensions now when you are over 65 in UK so unless you plan to retire early off your own savings then most would have difficulty funding a move to LOS. However, I still dream of spending more time there in future but sadly feel those chances are fast slipping for the masses who have not already made the move before times go bad.

It's easy to come up with numerous reasons not to settle in Thailand, especially if you are not keen to do so, as it would appear you are not. If you wanted to come, I'm sure you would not find it that difficult. Health care is important, and insurance IS available for life, even if you turn 100. The cover I have is not age related, you remain at the same age for premium purposes as you were when you started. I drink every week with a farang well into his 80's (he's as fit as a fiddle) How many golden oldies do you drink with in the UK? Most people that age in the UK, are huddled around the fire wondering how they are going to pay all the bills, and no doubt just waiting to die. If you own your own home in the UK, then even with diminishing prices, with the average value around £200,000, that would give you 11 million baht, more than enough for a great life, and with the state and any other pensions to come at a later date, assuming you are currently under 65.

But turning to the thread subject, my wife realises that life overall here in Thailand, despite it's many problems, is far better than it would be in the UK or Europe in general, with its exhorbitant prices, and has no wish to leave, other than for a short holiday.

IMO this is not totally true of everyone's circumstances and if you are single with no pre-existing health issues then yes you are probably insured well and easy. However, BUPA Thailand quoted me 30,000+ baht per month cover for my family if we were living in LOS. On your assumption that a choice few may own the whole of their homes without mortgage and can retire with £200K in the bank generating @ 5% per annum interest then they would enjoy upto £833 (45,000baht)/month less the 30,000 for inssurance leaves only 15k baht to exist. Sorry but even if I was fortuante enough to have 200K in the bank then that would still not be enough to insure my family and live comfortably over in Thailand. There are members of my wife's family who use local Thai insurers but one has already had her fingers burnt with them not paying out on a claim so only reputable companies could be used I feel and they usually are costly. Everyone's different with different circumstances. I love Thailand too but would find it difficult to retire there fiancially with two children that need educating properly and if all my budget was set aside for insurance then how would we find it possible to pay tuition fees at a decent local school in future. It is OK for the single guy or couple who have kids that have already grown up but for younger children and famillies there is more to consider than having enough money each day to sit at your local watering hole.

30k baht a month! I'm an old fart and my BUPA is only 50k a year, so for a family of four that's (worst case) 200k a year or less than 20k a month; frankly, I'd expect it to be less for younger people. I'd double check with BUPA if I were you. That sounds wrong unless they think there are eight of you!

[Doggsy]

initially my wife got very homesick but i think that was due to not really knowing any thai people in the uk. Then we made some friends but they lived over an hour away and due to working different days it was difficult to go and see them. However we have now moved back to teh area my family live in and have made friends with a number of thais that my wife can see on a daily basis. If she is not going out for breakfast with my dad she is round at her mate's house eating home cooked spicy thai food. She seems much happier this year with this support network that we ahve around us.

Equally we make a trip to the thai supermarket at least once a month and have now found one online that delivers so we never run out of the essentials. The biggest hurdle to overcome was trying to find a cheaper alternative to papaya as in england they are very expensive. It has been found that swedes taste similar in the salad and at 78p for 3 i dont mind if they eat it 5 times a day!!

I am a little worried though about how she will adapt back in Thailand. Being in england has been an eye opener for her as she realises now how hard people have to work for their money and watns her sister to come across, in winter, and earn some of her own money. We plan on moving back to thailand in about 20 mths and although this is something that she wants now I am a little worried about how she will blend back in. I worry abotu this because since I moved back from thailand to england I have generally hated it and I am doing everything I can to move back to thailand but with a secure financial future for us both.

[spok]

Fortunely my wife doesn't come from Issan although we are up here at the moment.

It seems to be very difficult to get my wife to want to come to Britain.

I think its the fear factor Thai's seem to be frightened of everything.

I am not that fond of Thailand although it does have good points.

I am planning to go back to the UK next year and I do want my wife to come over, even for a holiday.

I think she is planning to go back down South after I leave.

Will she come over I really don't know I did get her a visa but she didn't use it.

Looking at Doggsy's post that made a lot of sense.

[samuibeachcomber]

Fortunely my wife doesn't come from Issan although we are up here at the moment.

It seems to be very difficult to get my wife to want to come to Britain.

I think its the fear factor Thai's seem to be frightened of everything.

I am not that fond of Thailand although it does have good points.

I am planning to go back to the UK next year and I do want my wife to come over, even for a holiday.

I think she is planning to go back down South after I leave.

Will she come over I really don't know I did get her a visa but she didn't use it.

Looking at Doggsy's post that made a lot of sense.

each to their own,why not try to get her to go for holiday when you go back then there is no pressure on her to stay.Then with luck she may like it and want to return.

[samuibeachcomber]

reading the majority of these posts it would seem that once thai girls go to the west,get a network of thai's,work/study then they are more reluctant to return to LOS,and many of the husbands of these girls are rueing the day they took their better half home cos they now want to return to LOS and their g/f dont.

The other reason i can think of for not taking wife/gf back home is that they will become a westernised female with all the baggage that goes with it(for western men),and after all is n,t that the reason we all left home to come to thailand to find/be with a lovely asian lady that is n't corrupted with western values.I think,however,once a girl has left Isaan its hard for her to go back,living in places like chang mai,phuket,Samui,etc they can earn more money and there's more to do too.

The only ladies that want to return to Isaan are the gold diggers bringing back their newly acquired farang to buy them land/house so they can show off their newl wealth..............ok i know there are exceptions,this is just my general overview.

[Dave the Dude]

The only ladies that want to return to Isaan are the gold diggers bringing back their newly acquired farang to buy them land/house so they can show off their newl wealth..............ok i know there are exceptions,this is just my general overview.

Hi Samuibeachcomber(Isaan resident,I think not)

I think a lot what you say makes sense, I do take exception to the above. Yes there are a percentage of dishonest 'gold digger' types without doubt and I suppose thier 'Hamsum Teeraks' are screwed so quickly that maybe people/expats living in Isaan don't hear about it. I have met many good expat guys around Isaan who have wonderful wives and I am not sure if I can honestly say I have met many ferangs who look like he will be this weeks 'Pattaya Condo Jumper'.

I am not disagreeing with you, only reminding the ThaVisa reader that good stories do happen with Isaan ladies but are often unreported.

Dave

Edited November 10, 2008 by Dave the Dude

[samuibeachcomber]

yes i know dave,it was a generalisation and i agree there are man happy Isaan/farang couples.Last year i stayed with such a couple in Si Sa Ket.My g/f who is with me on Samui is from Chaiyaphum and i have stayed at her home many times,no offence meant.

[Dave the Dude]

yes i know dave,it was a generalisation and i agree there are man happy Isaan/farang couples.Last year i stayed with such a couple in Si Sa Ket.My g/f who is with me on Samui is from Chaiyaphum and i have stayed at her home many times,no offence meant.

None taken

There are far too many 'doom and gloom' merchants here (myself included) and every once in a while its nice to remember some people are having a gr8 life in LOS.

Dave

Edit for:- crap Granma & hand/eye control

Edited November 10, 2008 by Dave the Dude

[Gary A]

My wife and I lived in my Jomtien condo for about a year before we moved into her house upcountry. I think I was more burned out from living in the farang ghetto than she was. I am content up here. I have a large workshop, a tractor and land to play with my toys. My workshop is fairly well equipped and I can build or repair nearly anything. I really missed having animals, a garden and my tinker shop while living in a condo. It's a much healthier life style out here in the boonies.

[MJP]

My wife and I lived in my Jomtien condo for about a year before we moved into her house upcountry. I think I was more burned out from living in the farang ghetto than she was. I am content up here. I have a large workshop, a tractor and land to play with my toys. My workshop is fairly well equipped and I can build or repair nearly anything. I really missed having animals, a garden and my tinker shop while living in a condo. It's a much healthier life style out here in the boonies.

Love the boonies. Nothing like it. Finally found home.

[samuibeachcomber]

My wife and I lived in my Jomtien condo for about a year before we moved into her house upcountry. I think I was more burned out from living in the farang ghetto than she was. I am content up here. I have a large workshop, a tractor and land to play with my toys. My workshop is fairly well equipped and I can build or repair nearly anything. I really missed having animals, a garden and my tinker shop while living in a condo. It's a much healthier life style out here in the boonies.

yes i know what you mean.I used to live in Pattaya in a small condo and it drove me mad,i could n't get away from people and traffic.After the initial euphoria of the night life wore off i could n't wait to get out.Plus there were/are so many seedy and down and out farang there too.Anyway ended up on Samui and am renting a nice house on 3 acres of land near the beach,very peaceful,but have the night life nearby if wanted.All is good and happy.cheers.

[khunandy]

khunandy,what did you mean by"i could see her developing a few western habits i did n't like",interesting,care to elaborate pleasr.

I had to really think about this for a few days. It really was a mixture of so much time shopping (window and purchases) and just slipping into a routine lifestyle. I guess I am being unfair saying "western habits" but where we live in Thailand is fairly remote and shopping is an adventure not a boredom breaker.

On reflection the group of Thai friends my wife made through working in a local Thai restaurant was cause for concern as well. It was a very competative circle of Thai women in regard to what their worth was and how much gold they had...plenty of invites to the casino etc.

One battleax openly boasted she had two "farang" husbands, both working on remote minesites but I havent a clue how she juggled that.

We are happier with the quieter lifestyle in our house in Thailand where my wifes family is.

PS. I am writing this from my house in Perth after signing a rent agreement with a tennant this morning..I guess my visits here will be reduced again:)

[blueandbrown]

From what I've heard, Thai women usually seem to want to move to and live in Western countries, so I've always wondered how the wives/gfs of farangs living in Isaan feel about remaining there. Are some of them bitter about having to stay? Maybe the reality is that many go to a Western country for a few months then realize they like Thailand better? I ask because my gf and I have visa problems that probably won't allow her to ever come to the U.S. (she was born male gender but changed before i met her) and U.S. immigration doesn't recognize "same-sex" marriage for purposes of the fiance visas (F1&3). She always talks about how she wants to 'live in ameri-gah' and it breaks my heart, I'm hoping I could comfort her by saying most sao lao want to come back to pathet isaan anyway....

Hi dave you say you built a little shop do you now live off the proceeds?? My thai wife and I want to move back soon but want ideas for future but i am only normal working guy here in the uk so would only have about 70k to do everything with (house car etc)