Thaksin And Potjaman Divorce In Hong Kong

[mc2]

The timing of the announcement of the 'divorce' was a disgrace, trying to draw attention away from the royal cremation.

More likely done to take attention away from him by announcing when the media is covering something more newsworthy.

Normally it would make front page news but now it gets pushed back to something like second or 3rd page .

You lot would probably attack him if the color of his shoelaces didn't match.

I don't know what nationality you are, but I come from a culture where satire is an art. There have been hundreds of satirists and critics of politicians since Roman times.

England had "That Was the Week That Was", Monty Python and the wonderful series "Yes Prime Minister", while America has Saturday Night Live and other great shows of similar ilk.

Thailand doesn't really have this type of freedom so well developed at the moment and since Thailand is a relatively free country, there will always be people ready to satirize (attack if you will) politicians and other high profile public figures.

What you seem to miss is that Thaksin has created his own monster and now is finding that he is on the receiving end of people's animosity, and he doesn't like it, neither do you.

Until he fades away into the sunset, with his ill gotten millions, (if he's lucky enough to survive long enough to obtain them), .he will be subject to ongoing personal criticism and satire.

The ability to withstand this is related to the maturity and self confidence of the 'victim'. Thaksin, being a bully enjoys it when he is winning, but he's a terrible loser.

All British Prime ministers have been satirized as well as most American presidents. It goes with the territory. In most cases there was something about the person that was the subject of satire. And Thaksin is no different.

I hope posters on T.V. will continue to satirize, berate, tease, cajole and generally get on his case. He deserves it.

And I am glad you have the freedom to post on here too.

Yes,

And , there is a fine line between satire and cheap shots . I appreciate good satire , however I've noticed that a great many attempts on the news clipping forum have fallen so short of the mark , they can only be described as 'cheap shots'.

mai pen rai.

Edited November 17, 2008 by mc2

[amarka]

hi...

yes this is amazing.

thailand is split down the middle about 50/50 for and against thaksin, so there will be no easy resolution - no matter what the courts decide...

this is a politial problem and can only be solved by political means,

all the stupid commens from the farang thaksin haters are just pouring petrol on the fire and will achieve nothing but hate and contempt. what do you want to achieve? a civil war? thailand split into 2 nations?

this is a thai problem and a very serious one indeed... the problem is not even close to being resolved and in the meantime thailand suffers...thaksin has an agenda and he is far from finished - and what does that mean for thailand, only more problems i am afraid.

i dont know what the solution is, but i do know hate talk and stupid comments will not solve any problem.

amarka

Foreigners who post their points of view on a forum dedicated to foreigners living in Thailand will cause Thailand to split into two and achieve a civil war? Yes, it's a Thai problem. No, people posting their views is just that. Even if anyone here had the solution, it wouldn't matter anyway.

no the comments will have no affect at all........... but its the style - or lack of it and the unnecessary sadistic tones to the remarks....

if the foreigners making these comments are really dedicated to living in thailand, then they should remember that they are guests in thailand and whilst making comments is everyone’s right, they should use a little bit more judgment and respect and keep the pub talk in the pub.

amarka

[geriatrickid]

"to a New National Unity Color : Orange"

i think that is an excellent idea to help get people moving towards unity.

Disagree with your assessment. Looks like a fiendish Dutch plot. Before you know it, they'll be forcing people to put mayonnaise on their chips, sing loud naughty songs while drinking beer and sharing pickled haring breath on the streets. What's next? Dutch manners and the holding of doors for people? No. Cannot have this.

[Foggy Bottom]

if the foreigners making these comments are really dedicated to living in thailand, then they should remember that they are guests in thailand and whilst making comments is everyone’s right, they should use a little bit more judgment and respect and keep the pub talk in the pub.

amarka

Think you need a reality check there amarka - considering the context of the thread has turned to debating free speech in Thailand, what you are advocating is en-mass censorship and gagging of a portion of the resident population who in general are far more highly educated and globally aware than their hosts. By suppressing the voices of the resident "guests" you are also suppressing the opportunity for Thais to learn from those they are so envious of at so many different levels.

You also need to revisit the dictionary regarding the definition of guests (and how their treatment defines the difference between guests and mere visitors). Guests are invited, welcomed, and taken care of. Visitors may be invited and welcomed (not always) but are otherwise left to their own devices - much like I would suggest, the vast majority of expats on this forum. Thailand is fantastic at inviting, welcoming, and entertaining guests while they are cash-rich, know-nothing, only-interested-in-sanook, tourists, or while they are cash-injecting, job-creating, company forming, investors. Once they become know-too-much, think-too-much, earn-too-much, too-valuable-to-their local-Thai-economy, successful expats, then they are less welcome and indigenous jealousies and prejudices emerge, and the "guests should know their place" line you spouted gets trotted out.

In other words, Thailand wants you as long as you play dumb, throw money around like water at Songkran, and do not attempt to understand what happens around you. For educated cognitive westerners, that last point is near impossible, just as it is nigh impossible for them to remain silent when witnessing injustice, nepotism, corruption, and an obvious failing of duty. If Thailand wants to invite guests into the country, then the least courtesy Thailand could offer is to learn to understand the culture and nature of those guests - do you invite a lion to play with your children without first knowing if the lion has fed recently?

Note that in the above I referred to Thailand, not to Thai people. Generally, away from the elevated-beyond-their-ability hi-so's and policy makers, the Thai people are very warm and welcoming, but strictured by laws and national prejudice thumped out constantly by the vested interests who control the kingdom's purse strings. If you doubt that, consider the very simple example of property ownership - countries like the UK welcome foreigners and allow them to buy LAND and property anywhere in that kingdom, for any purpose, whereas Thailand allows what?

Perversely, in 2001, one of Thaksin's earliest attempts at legislation was to gain permission for foreigners to own land within Thailand. He got shouted down by the xenophobic traditionalists and old guard, and from that attempt came the law regarding the 30+30 year renewable land leases, and eased ability for foreign funded companies to buy land via the BOI system - why do you think the junta (post 2006) tried to amend and squeeze those concessions out of the foreign business act? Who exactly do YOU think pulls the strings in legislation forming today? When that legislation involves Khon Farang, it isn't Thaksin, nor is it any of the sitting cabinet.

---------------------------------------

Who was it (above) proposed merging the yellow shirts and the red shirts to create orange shirts of national unity?

I guess they skipped the first page of the thread, where it was discussed whether or not Thai hi-so's displayed Buddhist qualities, and I guess the proposer forgot that a large number of Thais also wear orange on a daily basis? Whilst those have the supposed ability to bring national harmony and peace, remember it was a monk who schemed for the replacement of King Taksin with General Chakri, and you should not remember recent saffron-led attempts at national harmony measures - occupying Government House in a call for the total banning of alcohol and tobacco - I guess the learned ones did not study early 20th Century American history (and the facilitating legislation for the rise of organised crime)? Ah - forgot, that doesn't apply here as organised crime governs the country already. Eh?

Gaz

Edit - corrected 1st line of last paragraph to "first page" instead of "first post", and inserted a few commas further up

Edited November 17, 2008 by Gaz Chiangmai

[animatic]

The timing of the announcement of the 'divorce' was a disgrace, trying to draw attention away from the royal cremation.

More likely done to take attention away from him by announcing when the media is covering something more newsworthy.

Normally it would make front page news but now it gets pushed back to something like second or 3rd page .

You lot would probably attack him if the color of his shoelaces didn't match.

I don't know what nationality you are, but I come from a culture where satire is an art. There have been hundreds of satirists and critics of politicians since Roman times.

England had "That Was the Week That Was", Monty Python and the wonderful series "Yes Prime Minister", while America has Saturday Night Live and other great shows of similar ilk.

Thailand doesn't really have this type of freedom so well developed at the moment and since Thailand is a relatively free country, there will always be people ready to satirize (attack if you will) politicians and other high profile public figures.

What you seem to miss is that Thaksin has created his own monster and now is finding that he is on the receiving end of people's animosity, and he doesn't like it, neither do you.

Until he fades away into the sunset, with his ill gotten millions, (if he's lucky enough to survive long enough to obtain them), .he will be subject to ongoing personal criticism and satire.

The ability to withstand this is related to the maturity and self confidence of the 'victim'. Thaksin, being a bully enjoys it when he is winning, but he's a terrible loser.

All British Prime ministers have been satirized as well as most American presidents. It goes with the territory. In most cases there was something about the person that was the subject of satire. And Thaksin is no different.

I hope posters on T.V. will continue to satirize, berate, tease, cajole and generally get on his case. He deserves it.

And I am glad you have the freedom to post on here too.

Yes,

And , there is a fine line between satire and cheap shots . I appreciate good satire , however I've noticed that a great many attempts on the news clipping forum have fallen so short of the mark , they can only be described as 'cheap shots'.

mai pen rai.

My satirical slant goes back to Tom Lehrer and Flanders and Swan.

Some of the best satire PULLS NO PUNCHES especially with polititicans as target.

I just got 2 Mock the Week DVD's in the post

and a have the complete Yes Minister and Yes PM series too.

I even know the Goon Show... "Lurgie! "

And I am not even a Brit!

The French have 'Les Guinols' which scewers ALL pols to the Nth degree.

Like portraying Chirac as a wannabe DeGaule, crossed with The Mask..

He goes in to a frenzied spin and stops and say "Puople!"

While his wife Bernadette huddles with an 'giant purse', her trademark.

It shows the American government as being run by a Giant Corporation where

EVERY person in it from president to janitor, has the same head ; Sly Stallon.

A cheap shot is usually the BEST on for this stuff:

fair play!

There's good monks and not so good monks.

I was leaning to a slightly different shade of orange.

But we DO have a base of existing orangness to build on!

Edited November 17, 2008 by animatic

[animatic]

"to a New National Unity Color : Orange"

i think that is an excellent idea to help get people moving towards unity.

Disagree with your assessment. Looks like a fiendish Dutch plot. Before you know it, they'll be forcing people to put mayonnaise on their chips, sing loud naughty songs while drinking beer and sharing pickled haring breath on the streets. What's next? Dutch manners and the holding of doors for people? No. Cannot have this.

Dutch plot...

I don't even paint with Dutch boy!

My mom was from Pennsylvania,

but we weren't even Pennsylvania Dutch!

[sriracha john]

And dinner included the usual suspects.

The group included Yaowapa Wongsawat, his younger sister and wife of Prime Minister Somchai Wongsawat, her close aide Yongyuth Tiyapairat and former Thai Rak Thai executive Newin Chidchob. Veera Musikhapong and Chatuporn Promphan, hosts of the Kwam Jing Wan Nee (Truth Today), were also seen in Hong Kong yesterday.

Like we don't know he CONTROLS the government executive from a far.

A planning session for more PR attacks no doubt.

Apparently the Public Health Minister was there also so we can add a current Cabinet Member to this dinner party with a convicted criminal fugitive that also included a Member of Parliament and the First Lady.

Interesting that as a Police Captain, Chalerm seemingly did nothing to secure the apprehension of a wanted man...choosing instead to have a fancy dinner with him.

Perhaps he felt it improper for a Police Captain to intervene with a Police Lieutenant-Colonel.

Edited November 17, 2008 by sriracha john

[Bagwan]

If Thaksin was a member of this forum , most of you lot would be banned for flaming by now.

If Thaksin was a member of this forum, many of the members wouldn't be. I, for one, am pretty selective about the company I keep.

Rather than giving a hoot about being banned, I'd be worrying about being sued for billions of baht.

[RigPig]

I know many people will probably not agree with me, but I don't think Thaksin has been such an evil man. I don't believe that Thaksin was any more corrupt than many other Thai 'officials', or indeed many other government officials of other countries.

I think Thaksin was probably the most advanced, proactive and forward thinking PM Thailand ever had. I argue that removing him from his post was a politically motivated act.

I'm not saying I'm a fan of the PPP and its current leadership. I'm just saying that I think Thaksin was the best leader at that time.

Thailand's 'Elite' has made a profound mistake by ousting Thaksin in the way it did in the 2006 coup: It has created a very angry man with many followers. Now this 'angry man' has become a powerful, invisible enemy with many resources to his disposal.

Now Thaksin can address thousands of followers by phone and stir up even more turmoil within the country.

I think now the best policy for Thai politics may be just to not talk about Thaksin any more. After some time people may just forget him. But I'm afraid that this will probably not happen that way…

I see your point and it is valid (IMHO). In these tumultuous Thai times it seems to have been easy to forget/forgive the fact that the army staged an illegal (by most democratic standards at least) coup. No one was punished or held accountable, the perpetrator even ran for office.

All the cries of what is right or wrong (PAD, PPP or Thaksin), the reality is an elected (corrupt or not, vote buying or whatever) government was over thrown by an Army that was supposed to take its instructions from the elected government. Whether you think Thaksin was corrupt (and I personally am sure he was) broke the law, or whatever, isn't it up to the (Thai) people to decide? I am sure he isn't the first corrupt polititian (in Thailand or not), and I am sure he will not be the last. Democracy is about the people deciding and if they make the wrong decision for the wrong reasons it is about learning by your mistakes as life is.

I work in a lot of third world countries (I am in the middle of the Sahara dessert now) and believe me this one is actually getting there, be it in there own time and way.

Hmm what would happen in the States if the KKK decide that Obamas election was bought (heaven knows he threw enough money at it even if it was in a different way) he was able to spend far more than

Mc Cain if I remember right. What constitutes vote buying? Promises that are never adhered to? Media and man power? Promises to already wealthy National and multinational corperations? Maybe they should stage a coup and have the generals run the show for a couple of years and then just let them walk away and even run for government after changing the constitution. Hmm not going to happen without another civil war at least. Oh thats right, the Americans had a civil war and so did the British before they got it right (if it is right). Growing pains.....

At least not too many people have been hurt yet and despite everything else Thailand needs to grow in its own way and at its own pace.

Ther may be a lot of niaeve Thais and uneducated Thais but most of them cannot be considered stupid and everyone learns eventually, one way or another.

IMHO

But I cant vote so it doesn't matter anyway

[RigPig]

if the foreigners making these comments are really dedicated to living in thailand, then they should remember that they are guests in thailand and whilst making comments is everyone's right, they should use a little bit more judgment and respect and keep the pub talk in the pub.

amarka

Think you need a reality check there amarka - considering the context of the thread has turned to debating free speech in Thailand, what you are advocating is en-mass censorship and gagging of a portion of the resident population who in general are far more highly educated and globally aware than their hosts. By suppressing the voices of the resident "guests" you are also suppressing the opportunity for Thais to learn from those they are so envious of at so many different levels.

You also need to revisit the dictionary regarding the definition of guests (and how their treatment defines the difference between guests and mere visitors). Guests are invited, welcomed, and taken care of. Visitors may be invited and welcomed (not always) but are otherwise left to their own devices - much like I would suggest, the vast majority of expats on this forum. Thailand is fantastic at inviting, welcoming, and entertaining guests while they are cash-rich, know-nothing, only-interested-in-sanook, tourists, or while they are cash-injecting, job-creating, company forming, investors. Once they become know-too-much, think-too-much, earn-too-much, too-valuable-to-their local-Thai-economy, successful expats, then they are less welcome and indigenous jealousies and prejudices emerge, and the "guests should know their place" line you spouted gets trotted out.

In other words, Thailand wants you as long as you play dumb, throw money around like water at Songkran, and do not attempt to understand what happens around you. For educated cognitive westerners, that last point is near impossible, just as it is nigh impossible for them to remain silent when witnessing injustice, nepotism, corruption, and an obvious failing of duty. If Thailand wants to invite guests into the country, then the least courtesy Thailand could offer is to learn to understand the culture and nature of those guests - do you invite a lion to play with your children without first knowing if the lion has fed recently?

Note that in the above I referred to Thailand, not to Thai people. Generally, away from the elevated-beyond-their-ability hi-so's and policy makers, the Thai people are very warm and welcoming, but strictured by laws and national prejudice thumped out constantly by the vested interests who control the kingdom's purse strings. If you doubt that, consider the very simple example of property ownership - countries like the UK welcome foreigners and allow them to buy LAND and property anywhere in that kingdom, for any purpose, whereas Thailand allows what?

Perversely, in 2001, one of Thaksin's earliest attempts at legislation was to gain permission for foreigners to own land within Thailand. He got shouted down by the xenophobic traditionalists and old guard, and from that attempt came the law regarding the 30+30 year renewable land leases, and eased ability for foreign funded companies to buy land via the BOI system - why do you think the junta (post 2006) tried to amend and squeeze those concessions out of the foreign business act? Who exactly do YOU think pulls the strings in legislation forming today? When that legislation involves Khon Farang, it isn't Thaksin, nor is it any of the sitting cabinet.

---------------------------------------

Who was it (above) proposed merging the yellow shirts and the red shirts to create orange shirts of national unity?

I guess they skipped the first page of the thread, where it was discussed whether or not Thai hi-so's displayed Buddhist qualities, and I guess the proposer forgot that a large number of Thais also wear orange on a daily basis? Whilst those have the supposed ability to bring national harmony and peace, remember it was a monk who schemed for the replacement of King Taksin with General Chakri, and you should not remember recent saffron-led attempts at national harmony measures - occupying Government House in a call for the total banning of alcohol and tobacco - I guess the learned ones did not study early 20th Century American history (and the facilitating legislation for the rise of organised crime)? Ah - forgot, that doesn't apply here as organised crime governs the country already. Eh?

Gaz

Edit - corrected 1st line of last paragraph to "first page" instead of "first post", and inserted a few commas further up

All I can say to this is WOW!!!

Havent read a better post for a long time

[sriracha john]

Thaksin looking for a home from Dubai

Ousted PM Thaksin is staying in Dubai as he seeks a new home after his British visa was revoked earlier this month, an aide said Monday, AFP news agency reported. Thaksin has been living in exile since August to avoid jail sentences. Since Britain cancelled Thaksin's visa on Nov 7, he has travelled to several cities around the world including Beijing and Hong Kong - where he divorced his wife in a surprise move late last week. "He is in Dubai, I don't know how long he will be there," Jatuporn Prompan, a key leader for a Thaksin supporters group, told AFP in Bangkok. The couple fled to Britain in August after Khunying Potjaman and her brother were sentenced to three years in jail for tax evasion.

Continued here:

http://www.bangkokpost.com/breaking_news/b...s.php?id=132104

[sriracha john]

Thaksin looking for a home from Dubai

Ousted PM Thaksin is staying in Dubai as he seeks a new home

Enjoy the lushness of Dubai, Thakky... its scenery is practically a carbon copy of Thailand...

[mc2]

Thaksin looking for a home from Dubai

Ousted PM Thaksin is staying in Dubai as he seeks a new home

Enjoy the lushness of Dubai, Thakky... its scenery is practically a carbon copy of Thailand...

The windscreen on his monster rolls royce has probably been fixed by now.

[Tony Clifton]

I haven't read the entire thread because of the slowness of my internet connection but I can only guess that this divorce was set up for financial and/or legal purposes only.

[bruceboy]

I am guessing the same thing.

[mc2]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...?hpid=sec-world

Thailand's Ex-Premier Divorces Wife; Both Facing Jail Time

By Tim Johnston

Washington Post Foreign Service

Monday, November 17, 2008; Page A13

BANGKOK, Nov. 16 -- Thaksin Shinawatra, Thailand's controversial former prime minister, has divorced his wife Potjaman after 32 years of marriage.

The divorce comes at a time when Thaksin, who became a billionaire in the telecommunications industry, and his wife are effectively stateless.

They both face jail sentences if they return to Thailand -- he on charges of breaching conflict-of-interest laws and she for tax evasion. Thaksin has said the charges and convictions are politically motivated.

Britain, where the two have spent most of their time since he lost his office in a military coup in 2006, recently revoked their visas, citing their criminal convictions. Thaksin's current whereabouts are unclear, although the divorce was finalized in the Thai consulate in Hong Kong last week.

There has been speculation in the Thai media that the divorce was a charade motivated by financial considerations -- that because many of their seized assets are in Potjaman's name, they would have greater access now that they are divorced. A spokesman denied this was the case.

ad_icon

"This divorce will not affect their status in any of the court cases they face," said Pongthep Thepkanchana, a former justice minister and now Thaksin's spokesman.

Thaksin won two elections, in 2001 and 2005, before he was removed from office. But he and his political successors remain popular among the country's rural poor, and when the military called elections at the end of last year, his allies were returned to power.

Thaksin's opponents remain virulently opposed to him and his political heirs. They have taken over buildings that normally house the prime minister's offices as part of a campaign that has paralyzed the country's political process. They say their protest will not end until the current government, led by Thaksin's brother-in-law, Somchai Wongsawat, resigns.

[Kerryd]

There seems to be some speculation that by divorcing her husband, Potjaman would be able to apply for a visa to enter the UK on her own.

Seems odd, considering Thaksin's visa was cancelled because of his criminal conviction, and she too is a convicted criminal. Why on earth would the UK suddenly decide to overlook her conviction and issue her a visa ?

And let us not say it would be on compassionate grounds because of her children. Her children, in addition to being fabulously wealthy, are all (young) adults. It's not like they are pre-teens or even in their early teenage years.

Not to mention that a story earlier on in this thread said her kids had all returned to Thailand any ways.

As someone else mentioned, the UK denied a visa to Martha Stewart, who actually did go to prison and do her time. Why grant a visa to someone that everyone knows is still on the run ?

[brahmburgers]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...?hpid=sec-world

Thailand's Ex-Premier Divorces Wife; Both Facing Jail Time

By Tim Johnston

Washington Post Foreign Service

Monday, November 17, 2008; Page A13

BANGKOK, Nov. 16 -- Thaksin Shinawatra, Thailand's controversial former prime minister, has divorced his wife Potjaman after 32 years of marriage.

The divorce comes at a time when Thaksin, who became a billionaire in the telecommunications industry, and his wife are effectively stateless.

They both face jail sentences if they return to Thailand -- he on charges of breaching conflict-of-interest laws and she for tax evasion. Thaksin has said the charges and convictions are politically motivated.

Britain, where the two have spent most of their time since he lost his office in a military coup in 2006, recently revoked their visas, citing their criminal convictions. Thaksin's current whereabouts are unclear, although the divorce was finalized in the Thai consulate in Hong Kong last week.

There has been speculation in the Thai media that the divorce was a charade motivated by financial considerations -- that because many of their seized assets are in Potjaman's name, they would have greater access now that they are divorced. A spokesman denied this was the case.

ad_icon

"This divorce will not affect their status in any of the court cases they face," said Pongthep Thepkanchana, a former justice minister and now Thaksin's spokesman.

Thaksin won two elections, in 2001 and 2005, before he was removed from office. But he and his political successors remain popular among the country's rural poor, and when the military called elections at the end of last year, his allies were returned to power.

Thaksin's opponents remain virulently opposed to him and his political heirs. They have taken over buildings that normally house the prime minister's offices as part of a campaign that has paralyzed the country's political process. They say their protest will not end until the current government, led by Thaksin's brother-in-law, Somchai Wongsawat, resigns.

Pardon me for being subjective (I grew up in D.C.), but the Washington Post's article is like a breath of fresh air - in terms of reporting the news. They report the news as they observe it - without innuendo, or too much speculation, or personal opinions. In contrast, many other news agencies, Thai bureaus in particular are rife with personal spins on news reports. It's not uncommon to have front page articles (in Thai newspapers) - thinly disguised as news - be just ranting opinions of some 'expert' or another.

[animatic]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...?hpid=sec-world

Thailand's Ex-Premier Divorces Wife; Both Facing Jail Time

By Tim Johnston

Washington Post Foreign Service

Monday, November 17, 2008; Page A13

BANGKOK, Nov. 16 -- Thaksin Shinawatra, Thailand's controversial former prime minister, has divorced his wife Potjaman after 32 years of marriage.

The divorce comes at a time when Thaksin, who became a billionaire in the telecommunications industry, and his wife are effectively stateless.

They both face jail sentences if they return to Thailand -- he on charges of breaching conflict-of-interest laws and she for tax evasion. Thaksin has said the charges and convictions are politically motivated.

Britain, where the two have spent most of their time since he lost his office in a military coup in 2006, recently revoked their visas, citing their criminal convictions. Thaksin's current whereabouts are unclear, although the divorce was finalized in the Thai consulate in Hong Kong last week.

There has been speculation in the Thai media that the divorce was a charade motivated by financial considerations -- that because many of their seized assets are in Potjaman's name, they would have greater access now that they are divorced. A spokesman denied this was the case.

ad_icon

"This divorce will not affect their status in any of the court cases they face," said Pongthep Thepkanchana, a former justice minister and now Thaksin's spokesman.

Thaksin won two elections, in 2001 and 2005, before he was removed from office. But he and his political successors remain popular among the country's rural poor, and when the military called elections at the end of last year, his allies were returned to power.

Thaksin's opponents remain virulently opposed to him and his political heirs. They have taken over buildings that normally house the prime minister's offices as part of a campaign that has paralyzed the country's political process. They say their protest will not end until the current government, led by Thaksin's brother-in-law, Somchai Wongsawat, resigns.

Pardon me for being subjective (I grew up in D.C.), but the Washington Post's article is like a breath of fresh air - in terms of reporting the news. They report the news as they observe it - without innuendo, or too much speculation, or personal opinions. In contrast, many other news agencies, Thai bureaus in particular are rife with personal spins on news reports. It's not uncommon to have front page articles (in Thai newspapers) - thinly disguised as news - be just ranting opinions of some 'expert' or another.

Yes a pretty even handed report.

Looks like Dr. T.s PR company got ignored on this one.

[CuttySark]

Thaksin looking for a home from Dubai

Ousted PM Thaksin is staying in Dubai as he seeks a new home

Enjoy the lushness of Dubai, Thakky... its scenery is practically a carbon copy of Thailand...

The windscreen on his monster rolls royce has probably been fixed by now.

He can now buy up the whole Thailand up, in "The World" project in Dubai. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_World_(archipelago)

[sonnyJ]

Say, woe to the downpressors. They will eat the bread of sorrow. As it has been, so it is, so it will be. And these are not the last words.

[amarka]

if the foreigners making these comments are really dedicated to living in thailand, then they should remember that they are guests in thailand and whilst making comments is everyone’s right, they should use a little bit more judgment and respect and keep the pub talk in the pub.

amarka

Think you need a reality check there amarka - considering the context of the thread has turned to debating free speech in Thailand, what you are advocating is en-mass censorship and gagging of a portion of the resident population who in general are far more highly educated and globally aware than their hosts. By suppressing the voices of the resident "guests" you are also suppressing the opportunity for Thais to learn from those they are so envious of at so many different levels.

You also need to revisit the dictionary regarding the definition of guests (and how their treatment defines the difference between guests and mere visitors). Guests are invited, welcomed, and taken care of. Visitors may be invited and welcomed (not always) but are otherwise left to their own devices - much like I would suggest, the vast majority of expats on this forum. Thailand is fantastic at inviting, welcoming, and entertaining guests while they are cash-rich, know-nothing, only-interested-in-sanook, tourists, or while they are cash-injecting, job-creating, company forming, investors. Once they become know-too-much, think-too-much, earn-too-much, too-valuable-to-their local-Thai-economy, successful expats, then they are less welcome and indigenous jealousies and prejudices emerge, and the "guests should know their place" line you spouted gets trotted out.

In other words, Thailand wants you as long as you play dumb, throw money around like water at Songkran, and do not attempt to understand what happens around you. For educated cognitive westerners, that last point is near impossible, just as it is nigh impossible for them to remain silent when witnessing injustice, nepotism, corruption, and an obvious failing of duty. If Thailand wants to invite guests into the country, then the least courtesy Thailand could offer is to learn to understand the culture and nature of those guests - do you invite a lion to play with your children without first knowing if the lion has fed recently?

Note that in the above I referred to Thailand, not to Thai people. Generally, away from the elevated-beyond-their-ability hi-so's and policy makers, the Thai people are very warm and welcoming, but strictured by laws and national prejudice thumped out constantly by the vested interests who control the kingdom's purse strings. If you doubt that, consider the very simple example of property ownership - countries like the UK welcome foreigners and allow them to buy LAND and property anywhere in that kingdom, for any purpose, whereas Thailand allows what?

Perversely, in 2001, one of Thaksin's earliest attempts at legislation was to gain permission for foreigners to own land within Thailand. He got shouted down by the xenophobic traditionalists and old guard, and from that attempt came the law regarding the 30+30 year renewable land leases, and eased ability for foreign funded companies to buy land via the BOI system - why do you think the junta (post 2006) tried to amend and squeeze those concessions out of the foreign business act? Who exactly do YOU think pulls the strings in legislation forming today? When that legislation involves Khon Farang, it isn't Thaksin, nor is it any of the sitting cabinet.

---------------------------------------

Who was it (above) proposed merging the yellow shirts and the red shirts to create orange shirts of national unity?

I guess they skipped the first page of the thread, where it was discussed whether or not Thai hi-so's displayed Buddhist qualities, and I guess the proposer forgot that a large number of Thais also wear orange on a daily basis? Whilst those have the supposed ability to bring national harmony and peace, remember it was a monk who schemed for the replacement of King Taksin with General Chakri, and you should not remember recent saffron-led attempts at national harmony measures - occupying Government House in a call for the total banning of alcohol and tobacco - I guess the learned ones did not study early 20th Century American history (and the facilitating legislation for the rise of organised crime)? Ah - forgot, that doesn't apply here as organised crime governs the country already. Eh?

Gaz

Edit - corrected 1st line of last paragraph to "first page" instead of "first post", and inserted a few commas further up

hi Gaz....

what i said was "and whilst making comments is everyone’s right, they should use a little bit more judgment and respect and keep the pub talk in the pub"

i never said foreigners never had the right to speak - in any country - and i am not advocating censorship or gagging...

i am saying try and keep it a bit more honorable and not so much cheap trash - thats all..

amarka

[brahmburgers]

Say, woe to the downpressors. They will eat the bread of sorrow. As it has been, so it is, so it will be. And these are not the last words.

wow, is that a quote from the old testament from that archaic cult known as Christianity? That's a different spin for Thai visa.

[ohobangkok]

Thaksin and Potjaman divorce in Hong Kong

Former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra is reported to have divorced his wife Khunying Potjaman, in a move that has shocked many of the couple's friends and colleagues.

Thaksin told People Power party (PPP) MPs at a dinner in Hong Kong last night that his 32-year marriage had ended.

"We divorced in order to make everybody feel comfortable," a PPP MP, who was at the dinner, quoted Thaksin as saying.

The divorce was sealed at 11.00am yesterday at the Thai consulate in Hong Kong, the source said.

Thaksin's announcement shocked everyone at the table which became suddenly silent, said the MP, who declined to be named. Khunying Potjaman was not at the dinner, he added.

A high-ranking government source confirmed the couple had signed the divorce papers at the Thai consulate in Hong Kong.

The divorce took place less than a month after the Supreme Court sentenced Thaksin to two years in jail and acquitted Khunying Potjaman over conflict of interest charges in the Ratchadiphisek land deal case.

The prison sentence is alleged to have prompted the UK to cancel entry visas for Thaksin and his wife.

A political observer said the divorce could be legally motivated to protect the couple's assets, which are mostly held in the name of Khunying Potjaman.

The National Anti-Corruption Commission revealed last year that Thaksin officially declared assets worth 614.39 million baht when he took office, while Khunying Potjaman had 8.48 billion baht.

Thaksin and Khunying Potjaman married in 1976 and have three children.

The family often appeared in public together, even after Thaksin was ousted in a coup and went into self-exile in London before his and Khunying Potjaman's visas were revoked.

During his controversial phone-in speech to supporters at Rajamangala stadium on Nov 1, Thaksin lamented that his family had been torn apart after the Sept 19 coup.

Thaksin reportedly flew to Dubai last night after the dinner with the PPP MPs, who went to Hong Kong to meet Thaksin, who arrived from Beijing on Tuesday.

The group included Yaowapa Wongsawat, his younger sister and wife of Prime Minister Somchai Wongsawat, her close aide Yongyuth Tiyapairat and former Thai Rak Thai executive Newin Chidchob. Veera Musikhapong and Chatuporn Promphan, hosts of the Kwam Jing Wan Nee (Truth Today), were also seen in Hong Kong yesterday.

A PPP source said the former prime minister chose Dubai because the UAE has no extradition treaty with Thailand.

The source said Thaksin told his associates he would use "all means" to fight his political enemies, whom he blamed for his political downfall and the two-year jail sentence imposed by the Supreme Court's Criminal Division for Holders of Political Positions.

Thaksin blamed a group of "privileged elites" including retired army generals, said the source.

Bangkok Post 2008-11-15

Do you think Lydia involve in this matter?

Lydia is a pop singer.

She once said she loves the Shinawatra family in the first issue od Dailyxpress ( dailyxpress.net )

[Tony Clifton]

Lydia = disposable peasant.

[animatic]

Lydia = disposable peasant.

One of hundreds available to any POWERFUL man here.

Kow tow till your panties fall off, then make merit monday..

[WAERTH]

Huh I am not even rich, nor powerfull, nor handsum and not young. But I already have more Lydias then I can handle wanting to study English in my room.

I never knew you needed to be powerfull for that .....

[animatic]

Powerfull gets yout popstars.

So ego gratification is value added.

[sriracha john]

Thailand Consul Denies Ex-PM Thaksin in Dubai

DUBAI - Thailand’s Consul General Pasan Therapak has denied any 
knowledge of the presence of ousted Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra in the UAE and categorically declared there was nothing here to link the 
country to him.

He told Khaleej Times that the billionaire businessman-turned politician, is known to have shown interest in east Asia but not in the UAE or Dubai in particular. “For this, I cannot confirm that he is in Dubai or that he has plans to live in the UAE for good,” he said.

Before Thaksin was elected to the highest government position in Thailand, he was already a billionaire with so many business interests, the biggest bulk of which was on telecommunications, Consul General Therapak said.

"His family is still very rich and is in the business. But, what is known to all is that he is travelling around the world after UK’s cancellation of his visa this month."

Earlier, AFP reported that the former Thai Prime Minister, who was toppled in a coup in 2006, is in Dubai.

"He is in Dubai, I don’t know how long he will be there," Jatuporn Prompan, a key leader for a Thaksin supporters group told AFP in Bangkok.

AFP also cited links to the UAE to the selling of Premier League Club Manchester City to Abu Dhabi United Group for Development and Investment in September.

He was allegedly forced to give up his stake after having $2.2 billion of his assets frozen as a result of corruption and fraud charges in Thailand.

He has been living in exile since 
August in the UK to avoid jail sentences at home. Since UK cancelled Thaksin’s visa on November 7, he has been travelling to several cities around the world, including Beijing and Hong Kong.

In Hong Kong, he was reported to have divorced his wife last week. Pojaman was married to him for 32 years. But, family and intelligence sources claimed on Sunday that the decision was for financial and legal reasons.

The couple fled to the UK in August after Pojaman and her brother were sentenced to three years in jail for tax evasion.

Thaksin, however, insisted that the charges against him and his family are politically motivated.

Khaleej Times (Dubai, UAE) / 2008-11-18

[sriracha john]

Thailand Consul Denies Ex-PM Thaksin in Dubai

DUBAI - Thailand’s Consul General Pasan Therapak has denied any 
knowledge of the presence of ousted Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra in the UAE and categorically declared there was nothing here to link the 
country to him.

Where's Waldo???

Before Thaksin was elected to the highest government position in Thailand, he was already a billionaire with so many business interests, the biggest bulk of which was on telecommunications, Consul General Therapak said.

The missing key to reality being whilst he might have been a billionaire in Baht going in, he came out a Billionaire in Pound Sterling... (back in the time when the Pound was worth a lot more)...

"His family is still very rich and is in the business. But, what is known to all is that he is travelling around the world after UK’s cancellation of his visa this month."

Earlier, AFP reported that the former Thai Prime Minister, who was toppled in a coup in 2006, is in Dubai.

"He is in Dubai, I don’t know how long he will be there," Jatuporn Prompan, a key leader for a Thaksin supporters group told AFP in Bangkok.

AFP also cited links to the UAE to the selling of Premier League Club Manchester City to Abu Dhabi United Group for Development and Investment in September.

In Hong Kong, he was reported to have divorced his wife last week.

ah well.... hide-and-go-seek continues...