Gen. Anupong suggests House dissolution

[Bkkboet]

It is Anupong who should be kicked out for disobeying a direct order. The idiot was quick enough to try and start trouble with Cambodia but he is absolutely useless in the south and is a backer of the PAD, so what use is he to Thailand?

I don't normally waste my time getting involved in these discussions of the uninformed, but this one demands a response:

- Anupong did not 'start to trouble' with Cambodia, the present government did by ILLEGALY signing a treaty that gave control of a temple to Cambodia after it had been a non issue

for decades.

- It is not Anupong who sets policy, that is the responsibility of the government. Unfortunately they have been in power for almost a year and have done nothing.In fact they have done nothing for the country (including the poor people of Isaan who they perport to represent) for a whole year, instead focusing solely on pursuing their own interests and that of a convicted criminal on the run.

[h90]

If Somchai would do his part to avoid bloodshed, by resigning and dissolving parliament, then I think PAD would honor their pledge and stop the protest. What I hope would follow is an election campaign in which PAD does not run as a political party, but instead allies with the Democrat party and its candidate for PM, Abhisit. If the Democrats can manage to put forth a platform that offers something to the poor folks in the north and NE, they might just be able to win the next election.

Why should the government bend over and pull their pants down? Whether you like it or not they were democratically elected and recognized by the international community.

Doing such a thing would send a very bad message to the peoples of this country, and would basically mean that anyone using terrorist tactics to obtain what they want will work.

They are not democratic elected as confirmed by the EC. Somewhere middle December the PPP will be dissolved for vote buying. That is the reason why they want to change the constitution.

so they are NOT democratic elected.

In many other countries governments dissolve house for much less.

[animatic]

There are TWO coups in the offing

A Executive coup to replace the cabinet and call new elections,

This just prior to the Judiciary invalidating their right to act ion ANY fashion.

They dissolution clock is ticking like Captain Hooks Crocodille pursuer...2.5 weeks maybe

OR, a coup of the JUDICIAL system, by the Cabinet and PPP,

TO get off the hook for their OWN malign actions.

Trying to give themselves free reign to do as they please.

I don't think Somchai has the balls to stand up to wife and B in L.

But trying to take out Gen. Anupong is the best way to shoot his own foot.

Loyal to king and country, this Gen., more than a cabinet he doesn't

respect for the space they take up, and the hot air they expel.

Like PAD or not, their aim clearly was to make this dual decsion come to pass,

sooner than later, and even if they have to die trying.

Edited November 26, 2008 by animatic

[h90]

somchai should sack the army general immediately and put someone in place that can do the job. ie. remove the 'protesters' from the airport.

This move would create exactly what is feverishly tried to be avoided at all cost!

Go on.... Tianmen Square fan?

So you think the only way to remove protesters is to shoot them????

Bring in a general with some balls, tear gas (american made please) , water cannons , clear exit paths , get them back on the freeway and tear gas them back home until they are crying for their mommy.

or let somchai sign the papers for dissolve house--problem fixed

[mc2]

So there are a few options to resolve the immediate crisis

1. Somchai decides to disolve parliment

2. Dems MP resign and force house disolution

3. Somchai resigns

4. Army disperses PAD with tear gas

5. Coup

number 4 seems the only option that respects the democratic process.

[frodo]

Like it or not, but PAD is the only force that can stand up to Thaksin, everyone else in this country bent over already, even if they don't admit it.

you forgot about the judges that convicted him.

Unfortunately, the judges in 2001 did bend over for Thaksin. Had they not dropped their drawers for Thaksin, we wouldn't be experiencing what we are today.

[permanent_disorder]

Like it or not, but PAD is the only force that can stand up to Thaksin, everyone else in this country bent over already, even if they don't admit it.

you forgot about the judges that convicted him.

yes, that would be a process according to the LAW. democratic, legal and civil.

but that is not what the PAD and their egomaniac leaders are up to. they think of themself above the law. they are even not afraid to commit murder and bring the country to even bigger problems. stubborn cretins and violent criminals with a totalitaristic semi fascist regime as goal. that what they call "new politics".

[JoeInSurin]

If Somchai would do his part to avoid bloodshed, by resigning and dissolving parliament, then I think PAD would honor their pledge and stop the protest. What I hope would follow is an election campaign in which PAD does not run as a political party, but instead allies with the Democrat party and its candidate for PM, Abhisit. If the Democrats can manage to put forth a platform that offers something to the poor folks in the north and NE, they might just be able to win the next election.

Why should the government bend over and pull their pants down? Whether you like it or not they were democratically elected and recognized by the international community.

Doing such a thing would send a very bad message to the peoples of this country, and would basically mean that anyone using terrorist tactics to obtain what they want will work.

They are not democratic elected as confirmed by the EC. Somewhere middle December the PPP will be dissolved for vote buying. That is the reason why they want to change the constitution.

so they are NOT democratic elected.

In many other countries governments dissolve house for much less.

In many other countries governments or courts dissolve house and not mobs. It is the courts job not vigilanties.

Edited November 26, 2008 by JoeInSurin

[MyphuketLife]

Like it or not, but PAD is the only force that can stand up to Thaksin, everyone else in this country bent over already, even if they don't admit it.

you forgot about the judges that convicted him.

exactly, all the PRO_PAD say only the PAD can / will stand up to Thaksin, and government corruption, but they fail to remember that it is the JUDGES and the COURT SYSTEM not the PAD that is issuing jail sentences... I am not pro-yellow shirt or pro-red shirt, but after the stunts the yellow shirts have pulled these last few months, I am ANTI yellow shirt policies.... I hope when all is settled that the GOOD JUDGES AND COURT SYSTEM deal with the yellow shirt leaders just as they dealt with Thaksin ....

[Chang_paarp]

somchai should sack the army general immediately and put someone in place that can do the job. ie. remove the 'protesters' from the airport.

As the army folk keep on trying to infer. The army's job is to defend the country from outside attack, it is the job of the police to enforce the laws internally. Get the police to do their job.

It would have been better to find a professional law enforcement officer that understands how to do more than collect brown paper bags to do their job. If they did this some 4 or so months ago this farce would not have developed. Unfortunately these creatures are as common to dodos in the Thai police force.

The army folk have learned from their last adventure in governing that they need to leave it to others for the moment.

The constant harking to the army to do something is not going to work ......... yet. They may decide to step in later but first let the alternatives show their colours.

[JoeInSurin]

somchai should sack the army general immediately and put someone in place that can do the job. ie. remove the 'protesters' from the airport.

This move would create exactly what is feverishly tried to be avoided at all cost!

Go on.... Tianmen Square fan?

So you think the only way to remove protesters is to shoot them????

Bring in a general with some balls, tear gas (american made please) , water cannons , clear exit paths , get them back on the freeway and tear gas them back home until they are crying for their mommy.

or let somchai sign the papers for dissolve house--problem fixed

Why would he let a mob make him dissolve the house. That is as bad as the shipping companies paying off the pirates.

[jdinasia]

If Somchai would do his part to avoid bloodshed, by resigning and dissolving parliament, then I think PAD would honor their pledge and stop the protest. What I hope would follow is an election campaign in which PAD does not run as a political party, but instead allies with the Democrat party and its candidate for PM, Abhisit. If the Democrats can manage to put forth a platform that offers something to the poor folks in the north and NE, they might just be able to win the next election.

The PAD does not want to offer anything to the poor folks. They want to keep the poor under-educated with nothing, that is how they get their 100 baht a day labor to get as rich as they are. The PAD hate the PPP because they are helping the poor and are a threat to their exploitation of cheap labor. The PAD I know have passed college no matter what grades they had as long as they were paying the tuition. They also have got many jobs from knowing people and not on their qualifications. There is no way some should be in the positions they are in. This is just as corrupt as vote buying but being to their advantage it is OK with them. With the poor people being the majority they have come into power and are a threat to their exploitation. They say they are too dumb to vote. If you exploit the masses and keep them under-educated they will be victim to vote buying and can come into power in a democratic society. Untill the elite offer people an equal opportunity for education and employment this is what they will get. This will never happen as the elite might have to actually pass college and qualify for their jobs.

Please inform us about which PAD people you are referring to when you say the underlined phrases above!

Then please explain how that does not apply to some of Thaksin's family and most of the TRT/PPP faction?

[animatic]

So there are a few options to resolve the immediate crisis

1. Somchai decides to disolve parliment

2. Dems MP resign and force house disolution

3. Somchai resigns

4. Army disperses PAD with tear gas

5. Coup

number 4 seems the only option that respects the democratic process.

Actually all but #5 respect the democratic process.

[Los78]

PAD are holding the country for ransom. They dont care one second about their fellow Thais. The army has no right to tell the government what to do. They are not in charge.

[Bangyai]

Please see this new topic about Gen. Anupong's call for the dissolution of parliament:

www.thaivisa.com/forum/Gen-Anupong-suggests-House-dissolu-t225219.html

--

Maestro

And that has /what/ to do with the airport topic?

I assume it's now okay again to have a wider debate about the situation?

If a topic is only about the airport or travel situation then there does exist a spanking Suvarnabhumi sub-forum on this site.

It's obvious isn't it?

If the Government dissolves, Premier resigns, no reason for PAD to continue protests and occupations.... simple!

i guess Winnie the Kwai pointing out, in an ironic manner, some previous attempt to delete anything what is may strong reletated to the PAD or the current political situation but didn't describe what current going on at the airport building. the have been a lot of post deleted in the Airport topic with the reason "Off Topic". not easy to define what is "off topic" and i have the feeling sometimes it is used as a lame excuse.

and i guess Winnie maybe got his own posts deleted as well, with the "off topic" reason given. but now Winnie spots an other such "off topic" post and expressed his confusion about it.

It's obvious isn't it? simple TVforum mechanics.

And not for the first time.

[fidelio]

So there are a few options to resolve the immediate crisis

1. Somchai decides to disolve parliment

2. Dems MP resign and force house disolution

3. Somchai resigns

4. Army disperses PAD with tear gas

5. Coup

number 4 seems the only option that respects the democratic process.

Actually all but #5 respect the democratic process.

To anyone with even an ounce of political education , democracy and military coups are irreconciable antagonisms .

You don't get it do you ?

[animatic]

Like it or not, but PAD is the only force that can stand up to Thaksin, everyone else in this country bent over already, even if they don't admit it.

you forgot about the judges that convicted him.

exactly, all the PRO_PAD say only the PAD can / will stand up to Thaksin, and government corruption, but they fail to remember that it is the JUDGES and the COURT SYSTEM not the PAD that is issuing jail sentences... I am not pro-yellow shirt or pro-red shirt, but after the stunts the yellow shirts have pulled these last few months, I am ANTI yellow shirt policies.... I hope when all is settled that the GOOD JUDGES AND COURT SYSTEM deal with the yellow shirt leaders just as they dealt with Thaksin ....

This forgets that the PPP and cabinet were doing their best to re-write the charter to STOP the courts.

Coup of the judiciary in effect. Retroactive law making to excuse their OWN mis-deeds.

An no, no else one WAS putting the breaks on them in time.

[jdinasia]

exactly, all the PRO_PAD say only the PAD can / will stand up to Thaksin, and government corruption, but they fail to remember that it is the JUDGES and the COURT SYSTEM not the PAD that is issuing jail sentences... I am not pro-yellow shirt or pro-red shirt, but after the stunts the yellow shirts have pulled these last few months, I am ANTI yellow shirt policies.... I hope when all is settled that the GOOD JUDGES AND COURT SYSTEM deal with the yellow shirt leaders just as they dealt with Thaksin ....

Ahhhh but there's the kicker... Thaksin has been convicted, but is he in jail? TRT has been banned from politics but they are all still interfering in politics. The current regime tried to illegally change the constitution as recently as yesterday (which the PAD prevented). Thaksin ripped apart the checks and balances that democracy needs to survive and his cronies are still trying to do so.

I would like to see the guy that fired the gun yesterday be brought in front of courts! I would also like to see the people that have been bombing the PAD be brought on charges!

I am not sure about what stunts that you are referring to that the PAD has pulled but I think they certainly should pay any and all damages to Gov't House etc when this is over (and the airport, etc etc) I think that action should be taken against the leaders of the PAD where the courts deem it prudent/lawful to do so!

Let's face it the courts just pissed Thaksin off and made him more resolute to force his way back into power through any means he can, attempting to bribe judges, throwing illegal money into elections, and more!

[hammered]

What is wrong with an election? It seems like a reasonable suggestion when a society face big problems. I also thought the PPP and UDD werer into this kind of stuff

[HamSabai]

So there are a few options to resolve the immediate crisis

1. Somchai decides to disolve parliment

2. Dems MP resign and force house disolution

3. Somchai resigns

4. Army disperses PAD with tear gas

5. Coup

number 4 seems the only option that respects the democratic process.

Actually all but #5 respect the democratic process.

You!!! saying that!!! What a joke...I hope it was ironic coming from you but I'm afraid not

Do you think what is happening right know, like lets see mmhhhhh... seizing Thailand's main international airport is part of "respecting the democratic process"

If the answer is yes, you are perfectly in line with PAD's strange concept of democracy.

[Bangyai]

[Yes, I was rather put out that my, I thought, considered post on the whole situation was deleted with the 'off topic's' some pages on, whilst there were many many other hysterical posts, having nothing at all to do with the airport closure, being allowed to remain.

Join the club

[JoeInSurin]

If Somchai would do his part to avoid bloodshed, by resigning and dissolving parliament, then I think PAD would honor their pledge and stop the protest. What I hope would follow is an election campaign in which PAD does not run as a political party, but instead allies with the Democrat party and its candidate for PM, Abhisit. If the Democrats can manage to put forth a platform that offers something to the poor folks in the north and NE, they might just be able to win the next election.

The PAD does not want to offer anything to the poor folks. They want to keep the poor under-educated with nothing, that is how they get their 100 baht a day labor to get as rich as they are. The PAD hate the PPP because they are helping the poor and are a threat to their exploitation of cheap labor. The PAD I know have passed college no matter what grades they had as long as they were paying the tuition. They also have got many jobs from knowing people and not on their qualifications. There is no way some should be in the positions they are in. This is just as corrupt as vote buying but being to their advantage it is OK with them. With the poor people being the majority they have come into power and are a threat to their exploitation. They say they are too dumb to vote. If you exploit the masses and keep them under-educated they will be victim to vote buying and can come into power in a democratic society. Untill the elite offer people an equal opportunity for education and employment this is what they will get. This will never happen as the elite might have to actually pass college and qualify for their jobs.

Please inform us about which PAD people you are referring to when you say the underlined phrases above!

Then please explain how that does not apply to some of Thaksin's family and most of the TRT/PPP faction?

I will agree that it would apply to both but at least PPP will give them 30 baht health care and small loans for their farms. They are trying to give back to the hard working people that help them. To PAD this is outrageous. Do you think there is a fair difference between the rich and poor? PAD acts like they are getting the raw end of the deal. It is the country of every Thai rich and poor. It should serve all of the population. Why do you hate the poor people that go about their lives without complaining and side with people that have it all and bitch about some poor farmer getting 30 baht health care and a small loan for their farm?? I would never get my kicks from talking down to those more unfortunate than me.

[Crushdepth]

It is Anupong who should be kicked out for disobeying a direct order. The idiot was quick enough to try and start trouble with Cambodia but he is absolutely useless in the south and is a backer of the PAD, so what use is he to Thailand?

You're wrong. Anupong (and all the armed forces) ultimately answer to the Head of State, and that is *not* the Prime Minister as many people assume. The Head of State clearly said 'no violence' at the beginning of all this, and the armed forces have held that line faithfully.

[jdinasia]

Joe --- you may not know it but the 30 baht health scheme was not a Thaksin thing and the village loan scheme has created more debt and is causing far more issues than it has helped with!

[mc2]

Joe --- you may not know it but the 30 baht health scheme was not a Thaksin thing and the village loan scheme has created more debt and is causing far more issues than it has helped with!

[grandpops]

If Somchai would do his part to avoid bloodshed, by resigning and dissolving parliament, then I think PAD would honor their pledge and stop the protest. What I hope would follow is an election campaign in which PAD does not run as a political party, but instead allies with the Democrat party and its candidate for PM, Abhisit. If the Democrats can manage to put forth a platform that offers something to the poor folks in the north and NE, they might just be able to win the next election.

The PAD does not want to offer anything to the poor folks. They want to keep the poor under-educated with nothing, that is how they get their 100 baht a day labor to get as rich as they are. The PAD hate the PPP because they are helping the poor and are a threat to their exploitation of cheap labor. The PAD I know have passed college no matter what grades they had as long as they were paying the tuition. They also have got many jobs from knowing people and not on their qualifications. There is no way some should be in the positions they are in. This is just as corrupt as vote buying but being to their advantage it is OK with them. With the poor people being the majority they have come into power and are a threat to their exploitation. They say they are too dumb to vote. If you exploit the masses and keep them under-educated they will be victim to vote buying and can come into power in a democratic society. Untill the elite offer people an equal opportunity for education and employment this is what they will get. This will never happen as the elite might have to actually pass college and qualify for their jobs.

Please inform us about which PAD people you are referring to when you say the underlined phrases above!

Then please explain how that does not apply to some of Thaksin's family and most of the TRT/PPP faction?

I'll wait with you. And whilst we are on the subject, we were asking questions of you earlier that you ran away from.

Remember page three

So off the old high horse and on with the questioning about whether the good General should make the PAD stand for election or bugger off.

Or what policies should they adopt and who in particular should be involved.

Me, Cougar 52, FatherF et all are waiting. Thats page three and a couple on page four Post listed below infact. you are all so keen to snipe and kneejerk respond. Why not answer a few important questions in an adult way.

48, 55, 57, 63, 70, and the hilarious 84 by Father F who tried to pin you and SrirachaPAD as well to no avail.

**flame removed***

Up to you as we Thais say

[animatic]

So there are a few options to resolve the immediate crisis

1. Somchai decides to disolve parliment

2. Dems MP resign and force house disolution

3. Somchai resigns

4. Army disperses PAD with tear gas

5. Coup

number 4 seems the only option that respects the democratic process.

Actually all but #5 respect the democratic process.

You!!! saying that!!! What a joke...I hope it was ironic coming from you but I'm afraid not

Do you think what is happening right know, like lets see mmhhhhh... seizing Thailand's main international airport is part of "respecting the democratic process"

If the answer is yes, you are perfectly in line with PAD's strange concept of democracy.

No irony at all.

1# It is democratic for the PM to decide to dissolve parliment for ANY reason.

#2 The Dems can resign in mass if they choose, it's correct procedure. Nothing undemocratic about it.

#3 Somchai can resign for any reason he chooses.

In this case for ending the mess letting the people decide etc...

In any case it is STILL a democratic process, no matter the external issues.

There is no gun at his head. There ARE big issues, but he still has the legal authority to resign.

#4 Yes they can clear them out with teargas.

But it will be quite nasty, and much face will be lost in the process.

And THAT could kill NEXT years tourist season.

And likely the carnage likely will ALSO make the government fall a few days later.

Same effect, but with world wide viewership and disgust.

#5 A coup is undemocratic, no question.

So what are you whining about?

It has nothing to do with external factors to be democratic decisions or not.

He has ignored Generals telling him to resigning before,

remember mid October... wasn't THAT long ago.

He has ignored the NCCC telling him he should resign too.

In 2 weeks or so the JUDICIARY will also tell him to resign permanently.

Will he be democratic to ignore them too?

Edited November 26, 2008 by animatic

[jdinasia]

Ummm I was with the partner for dinner.

Again you are calling names then trying to call other people on sniping. You have pushed for a violent end to the situation at the airport etc etc. Grandpops if you care to ask me a question then ask it without the bile and rhetoric.

[brahmburgers]

methinks grandpops posteth too much.

Let us be calm. The pieces are moving on a vast board

yes, I need a jam sandwich, then I'll get back to the revolution.

SO WHY QUESTION AGAIN IS WHAT IS IT THAT THEY ARE PROTESTING, WHAT DO THEY WANT.????

cAN YOU ANSWER THAT FOR ME? JD??

I don't have all the answers, but PAD, even with their faults, are staging non-violent, effective, sustained and well-attended protests in order to (among other things) try to rid Thailand from the scourge of Thaksin. A man who paid his way to power on the back of promises he knew he couldn't keep. a lot more disparaging things could be said about Thaksin and his brood, but you've heard so much already.

note: In Byzantine, hundreds of years ago, there were riots between the green shirts and the blue shirts.

I'm still appreciative that the red shirts haven't had direct confrontations recently with the yellows. Is it because the reds are restrained or because they can't muster enough folks to counter the yellows?

It's also mucho appreciarlo that the police and military haven't responded heavy-handedly. bravo!

[Bangyai]

Cougar I am sure that when the government resigns that the PAD will vacate the airport.

Just so everyone understands my previous post. The General and the community suggested dissolution of Parliament, PM to resign, and new elections, PART 2 WAS THAT PAD TO STOP THE PROTESTS IMMEDIATELY.

And in less than 5 minutes, PAD announced from Government House that they disagree with the suggestion and do not intend to stop.

SO WHY QUESTION AGAIN IS WHAT IS IT THAT THEY ARE PROTESTING, WHAT DO THEY WANT.????

cAN YOU ANSWER THAT FOR ME? JD??

In the interests of humanity ( some people holding their breaths can't wait any longer ) what Sondhi and chums want,

what they really really want......is

However, we are assured that they are not going to get it.......hopefully