New Government

[samgrowth]

I see Abhisit the phoney's nephew is also a toff at Eton.

What a fantastic message that sends out...

Wonder if he will get a vote,...at least he will be able to learn all about the ignorant and uneducated rural thai poor.

As I have often mentioned it's almost impossible to underestimate the chippy class sensitivity of the English lower middle classes.As though being an Etonian was some sort of crime.

If I'm not mistaken Abhisit's nephew won a King's Scholarship a couple of years ago to Eton from his Bangkok school, a fantastic achievement since it is a highly demanding and rigorous exam.I would have thought all those who have Thailand's interests at heart should be very proud of him.

Ex Thaksin spokman / ex-Foreign Minister also won a King's Scholarship to study law in Oxford. Should we be proud of Noppadon Pattama too?

You betray your ignorance.King's Scholars at Eton are named after the founder, Henry VI of England.The name has nothing to do with Thailand's system of King's Scholarships.

Indeed, two separate scholarships.

Sorry, I did not know that there is more than 1 king scholarship. However, Thai king is praised as the king of kings during the last major celebration in Thailand where many kings attended. Long live the king(s). Please accept my apologies.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Have you read the charges he's facing, the details of the 6 cases waiting to proceed if the fugitive returns?

SJ can probably find them for you if you ask him nicely, very minor are not the right words.

Yes I have, all drummed up by the military and their masters. And I don't need anything from SJ thankyouverymuch and stopped reading/responding to his posts as they seem only meant to be inflammatory.

[Plus]

All the cases were extensively discussed long before the coup, the junta didn't discover or made up anything new.

The feeling is "finally someone can do something about it".

[hammered]

There is another interesting article up on his blog by Michael Connors. Always worth a read imho and often contradictory with other analysis

http://sovereignmyth.blogspot.com/

[sriracha john]

Have you read the charges he's facing, the details of the 6 cases waiting to proceed if the fugitive returns?

SJ can probably find them for you if you ask him nicely, very minor are not the right words.

Yes I have, all drummed up by the military and their masters. And I don't need anything from SJ thankyouverymuch and stopped reading/responding to his posts as they seem only meant to be inflammatory.

at least you acknowledge you erroneously referred to them as "minor charges"...

[Koo82]

Why does this government pay too much attention to Khun Thaksin? Don't they have better things to do? When Khun Thaksin was the PM, he did not hunt for the previous PM like this.

[plachon]

Why does this government pay too much attention to Khun Thaksin? Don't they have better things to do? When Khun Thaksin was the PM, he did not hunt for the previous PM like this.

Such profound insight..................

[Jai Dee]

Chalit says Thaksin should come clean

A former senior member of the 2006 military junta said yesterday that fugitive former premier Thaksin Shinawatra should stop fighting and confess his wrongs and the public would soon forgive him.

ACM Chalit Pukphasuk, former Air Force commander, said in a radio interview that the current Democrat Party-led government was not the goal of the junta but a natural consequence of political development.

Chalit served as caretaker chairman of the Council for National Security, which staged the coup in September 2006 that ousted Thaksin. He took over as CNS chairman from former Army chief General Sonthi Boonyaratglin, who led the power seizure.

More than two years after the coup, Chalit defended the putsch as necessary to prevent chaos and insisted it had not been self-serving. Telling Thaksin to stop fighting and confess, he conceded that it was natural to fight to defend oneself.

Asked about what he thought was Thaksin's view on the monarchy, Chalit said he did not know Thaksin's mind but added: "Nothing stays a secret."

Chalit also defended the junta from the allegation that it had influenced judges to punish Thaksin, saying it was impossible to force judges to come to a certain verdict.

"Am I gratified [by the Supreme Court's ruling against Thaksin]? I say no. It's up to [Thaksin]. If he chooses to confess and admit his wrongs, he's right, and he may beg for mercy."

Many national leaders have been ousted by coups in the past 70 to 80 years. They may have good and bad qualities, but Thais forgive them; it won't take that long."

Asked if the political divide would worsen, he said that too was up to one man, Thaksin.

Chalit defended the anti-Thaksin People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) protesters, who shut down two Bangkok airports and caused much economic damage, as "civilised protesters" who were "educated" and "well off". He said it was impossible to hire PAD protesters for Bt500 a day and no one had the money to do so.

Source: The Nation - 11 January 2009

[Ricardo]

Why does this government pay too much attention to Khun Thaksin? Don't they have better things to do? When Khun Thaksin was the PM, he did not hunt for the previous PM like this.

You might equally ask, why did the previous two governments also pay too much attention to him, flying to visit him or phoning him for his views on every decision ?

Some might say, because he is a very wise & very rich man, who cares only for his country and its people, putting them ahead of his own personal interests. Others might suspect that there are other reasons.

[ballpoint]

Why does this government pay too much attention to Khun Thaksin? Don't they have better things to do? When Khun Thaksin was the PM, he did not hunt for the previous PM like this.

Is this a joke? This government is paying far less attention to Thaksin than the previous one that couldn't do a thing without his approval. You also conveniently forget that when Thaksin was PM the previous incumbent wasn't a convicted criminal. Any government in the world would be being negligent if it didn't pay some attention to a high profile cockroach that ran to a rock to hide under when its past finally caught up with it.

[Plus]

Since hiring PR firms in 2006 Thaksin has paid $920,000 a year to Barbour Griffith, $300,000 to Edelman Public Relations and $80,000 to Baker Botts.

The government SHOULD pay attention to people who spend so much for smearing Thailand's reputation in international media.

[hammered]

Since hiring PR firms in 2006 Thaksin has paid $920,000 a year to Barbour Griffith, $300,000 to Edelman Public Relations and $80,000 to Baker Botts.

The government SHOULD pay attention to people who spend so much for smearing Thailand's reputation in international media.

Or they should certainly make sure the public know about it. After all politics is a dirty game

[hammered]

Why does this government pay too much attention to Khun Thaksin? Don't they have better things to do? When Khun Thaksin was the PM, he did not hunt for the previous PM like this.

Is this a joke? This government is paying far less attention to Thaksin than the previous one that couldn't do a thing without his approval. You also conveniently forget that when Thaksin was PM the previous incumbent wasn't a convicted criminal. Any government in the world would be being negligent if it didn't pay some attention to a high profile cockroach that ran to a rock to hide under when its past finally caught up with it.

Indeed the Samak and Somchai governments spent so much time fixating on the desires of the master that they diodnt even bother to do any governing of the country. Right now there are huge backlogs on decisions that should have been made ages ago and in some cases legislation that was mandated to have been made by deadlines now passed. These proxy government sahve a left a very nasty muddle in government business that rarely gets mentioned as it is overshadowed by Mr Huge ego, the red (all grannies are legitimate targets and lets drag old men from their car and murder them) boot boys (shame considering the PAD loons now seem to have gone home), national division and unfortunately and an econimic tsunami.

[Samuian]

Since hiring PR firms in 2006 Thaksin has paid $920,000 a year to Barbour Griffith, $300,000 to Edelman Public Relations and $80,000 to Baker Botts.

The government SHOULD pay attention to people who spend so much for smearing Thailand's reputation in international media.

Or they should certainly make sure the public know about it. After all politics is a dirty game

I couldn't find any proof of that, but had the dam_n gut feeling all the time!

Articles in the media, which had the stench of Taxsinomics.

It's his way and YES the government should assign a media body to just deal with his

defamation onslaught, so far I see no problem with the internet censorship as long as it isn't abused by some conservative powers.

Shows a lot of his true nature and cheap character!

[Plus]

It was in the news last week, with Prommin issuing blank denials.

Hiring these companies was on a news radar in 2007, it was covered on Thaivisa, too.

I don't know if Democrats want to pursue with their accusations, they are rather soft on issues like these, Thaksin would have been all over the TV drilling the message in millions of heads five times a day, like he did with IMF repayment, for example.

Here we have several posters who'd laugh off any suggestion of Thaksin manipulating foreign media, like WSJ or the Economist.

Thaksin paid over a million a year for it, however, and still continues to do so.

Oh, and the numbers I lifted of the interview with Democrat spokesman I read in the paper Nation, couldn't find it online yet, the search, however returned this almost forgotten story:

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/search/rea...newsid=30049579

Edited January 11, 2009 by Plus

[hammered]

It was in the news last week, with Prommin issuing blank denials.

Hiring these companies was on a news radar in 2007, it was covered on Thaivisa, too.

I don't know if Democrats want to pursue with their accusations, they are rather soft on issues like these, Thaksin would have been all over the TV drilling the message in millions of heads five times a day, like he did with IMF repayment, for example.

Here we have several posters who'd laugh off any suggestion of Thaksin manipulating foreign media, like WSJ or the Economist.

Thaksin paid over a million a year for it, however, and still continues to do so.

Prommin is making a reappearance after a while of quiet. The red movement are it seems interested in reactivating comrade Prommin to try and offset the problems caused it by the defection of Newin who was not exactly uninvolved in the initial rise of the UDD. Prommin's involvement could result in a change of red tactics and a movement towards a more single goal. A study of his past and particularly his younger days will reveal the tactics more favored of him. He also had some links to some quite interesting people in Asia.

The reds right now seem to be in three broad groups:

Newin reds who have split from the red movement and who see their aims can best be taken forward in the short term at least by the current new arrangement.

Intellectual and leftist reds who may well start to distance from Peau Thai (as well as all other politcal parties). They have a goals beyond and somewhat different from the third group below although oddly enough they may share some with the group above! This group is mostly seen in Bangkok and on "tours".

Thaksin supporter reds raised by faction and local leaders and who have little ideological goal beyond returning Thaksin. These are the ones most likely to resort to violence right now and tend to be the local provincial groups. They are usually only seen in Bangkok for big events.

There is also some speculation on Khwanchai's Udon boys doing a deal with Newin. He refused to show for the last gathering in BKK being too busy partying.

The Thaksin supporter and Newin groups are bigger than the intellectual leftist group, which is why until now but maybe for longer or maybe not the intellectual group tries to stay allied with the Thaksin supporters and earlier the Newinites.

All imho

[younghusband]

Here we have several posters who'd laugh off any suggestion of Thaksin manipulating foreign media, like WSJ or the Economist.

And will continue to do so until there is evidence the charge is other than paranoia fuelled fantasy.

[Steve2UK]

Since hiring PR firms in 2006 Thaksin has paid $920,000 a year to Barbour Griffith, $300,000 to Edelman Public Relations and $80,000 to Baker Botts.

The government SHOULD pay attention to people who spend so much for smearing Thailand's reputation in international media.

I'm sure ( ) that you're not setting out to imply those figures were being paid every year - let alone are still being paid. After all, it's rather an old, whiskery story now.........

As shown in the US government's Lobbying Reports ( http://disclosures.house.gov/ld/LDSearch.aspx - search by Client Name "Thaksin Shinawatra") filed by the lobbying companies Baker Botts & BBG, their contracts with Thaksin finished in June 2007 & June 2008 respectively - in the latter case after the fees had been less than $5,000 in the first half of 2008. Being lobbying companies, they are targeting branches and agencies of the US government - maybe Thaksin was after US asylum, maybe just help for his case in Thailand. Granted that might include questioning the fairness of the courts as he did much later, for example, but it doesn't seem to fit the timing of the contracts and certainly isn't proven.

The contract with Edelman PR was reported as having been cancelled in May 2007 ( http://nationmultimedia.com/2007/05/07/hea...es_30033567.php ).

Other than claims made by Democrat Party executive board member Korbsak Sabhavasu on ASTV (claims which he was also making way back in 2007 - http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2007/04/30...al_30033014.php ) or claims made by Democrat Party spokesperson Dr. Buranat Samutrak ( http://www.2bangkok.com/09/Thaksin-foreign...sts.shtml#baker ) - is there actually any real objective evidence that the purpose of the lobbying and PR contracts was "smearing Thailand's reputation in international media"?

PS: I see you re-posted - so my opening sentence is less applicable now. Your further post makes the following necessary:

In light of the above facts, will you produce any real objective evidence of any of: ".........Thaksin manipulating foreign media, like WSJ or the Economist. Thaksin paid over a million a year for it, however, and still continues to do so".

[my bold emphasis]

Without some supporting facts as evidence, it's merely your opinion.......... and you're welcome to it.

[Plus]

"Buranut Samuttaruk, chief Democrat spokesman, said Thaksin had engaged four firms - namely Bell Pottinger North, Baker Botts, Edelman Public Relations and lobby-marketing firm Barbour Griffith and Rogers - since 2006.

So far, only the contract with Barbour Griffith and Rogers has been terminated, Buranut said.

These firms were hired to pose questions about the legitimacy of the Thai national assembly and

the recent policy statement delivered by Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva at the Foreign Ministry, he said."

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/search/rea...newsid=30092516

That was just a few days before the interview I got the numbers from.

From the 2bangkok article you liniked:

[As far as we can tell from the US online disclosure information, there are no current Thaksin lobbyist in the US.

Edelman at one time worked for Thaksin and, among other things, specializes in creating fake lobbying organizations as part of its PR efforts. Edelman created the short-lived USA for Innovation to lobby against the coup government.

BGR Company apparently worked for Thaksin in 2007.

Bell Pottinger Group apparently worked for Thaksin in 2008.

Baker Botts worked for Thaksin in 2007.]

From the paper Nation:

Buranaj Smutharaks, chief spokesman for the ruling Democrat party:

"We're waiting for the US Office of Public Records to disclose the latest information on the business activities of lobbying firms over the past year. However, public relation firms are not covered by such disclosure", he said.

>>

Yeah, "paranoia fuelled fantasy".

[Steve2UK]

"Buranut Samuttaruk, chief Democrat spokesman, said Thaksin had engaged four firms - namely Bell Pottinger North, Baker Botts, Edelman Public Relations and lobby-marketing firm Barbour Griffith and Rogers - since 2006.

So far, only the contract with Barbour Griffith and Rogers has been terminated, Buranut said.

[my bold emphasis above]

Bell Pottinger North - terminated June 2008

( http://www.how-do.co.uk/north-west-media-n...a-200806112782/ )

Edelman PR - terminated May 2007

( http://nationmultimedia.com/2007/05/07/hea...es_30033567.php )

Baker Botts, LLP - terminated by 30 June 2007

( http://disclosures.house.gov/ld/LDSearch.aspx - search by Client Name "Thaksin Shinawatra" )

to find

( http://disclosures.house.gov/ld/pdfform.aspx?id=200059128 )

"Buranut said".......... Well, Khun Buranut may want to check the facts available at the links above and then let's see if he still wants to repeat what he said. Seems like his boss isn't so sure......... I understand Matichon Weekly has Abhisit saying "Khun Buranat must take responsibility for his own words. He didn't consult me first about the disclosure of this information". (p10 of January 9-15 edition). Smart guy, Khun Abhisit - really I mean it.

Meanwhile, Khun Buranut is "waiting for the US Office of Public Records to disclose the latest information on the business activities of lobbying firms over the past year".

Sure, let's all wait - and see what facts there are when that information appears. He's also saying that even that information won't disclose PR firms' activity. One good thing about this - it shows he may understand the distinction between US lobbying firms (targeting US government branches/agencies) versus PR firms (targeting the media and opinion formers generally).

So, ummmm.......... where in any of this are the facts or evidence to substantiate Khun Buranut's and your current claims right now ?

PS - in my previous post, I inadvertently typed "BBG" instead of "BGR" for "Barbour Griffith & Rogers". Sloppy of me.

PPS - I haven't mentioned "paranoia fuelled fantasy" or is that meant for younghusband? Sloppy of you.

[baht&sold]

"Puea Thai Party to sue if Thaksin police rank is stripped"

(Article link)

[baht&sold]

Steve, some missing current PR references:

"Sam Moon has lived in and worked across Asia for the past 23 years working for The Economist, Dow Jones and his own company in partnership with BusinessWeek. Mr. Moon first met Dr. Thaksin Shinawatra 16 years ago and has remained in contact with him over the years"

"Having seen Dr. Thaksin work with media, handle challenges and “work” a crowded room, Mr. Moon feels Dr. Thaksin is one of only a handful of a new generation of Asian leaders who could become a “Clinton from Asia”. Dr. Thaksin’s leadership ability, vision, charm and media savvy puts him in a league all to his own. Having the advantage of seeing most leaders up close and personal (and behind the scenes), Mr. Moon feels he is in a unique position to make this comparison"

'Building a better Future' (LINK)

And:

"The man who has been helping ousted prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra with his latest gimmicks is not an unfamiliar face at all. Sam Moon, a member of the board of advisers to Thaksin's Building a Better Future Foundation, was in Bangkok three years ago to attend the "Asia Leadership Forum" organised by Thailand Elite and Thaksin's AIS"

Article Link

Edited January 11, 2009 by baht&sold

[hammered]

Well getting back on the subject of new government they are a lot more secure today. It seems they won 20 of the 29 seats ansd even one of the opposition MPs elected was supported by friends of Newin and can be expected to vote with the government. PT have a lot of issues to deal with today and hopefully yhte government can now work full time on its policies.

[Plus]

I'm sure Boranut and Kobsak can use google just as well as you, Steve. I'm also sure they have other sources of information.

Just because you can't google it doesn't mean they made the story up. They talked about very recent jobs, btw, they specifically mentioned Thaksin's reaction to Abhisit's PMship.

[Plus]

He is undoubtedly a smart fellow but greed took the better of him. I don't know if he's smart enough to realise that himself, and he doesn't like to listen to anyone else.

He is just no wise enough for all his money.

[Journalist]

Here we have several posters who'd laugh off any suggestion of Thaksin manipulating foreign media, like WSJ or the Economist.

And will continue to do so until there is evidence the charge is other than paranoia fuelled fantasy.

I don't have any doubt at all he is trying to steer foreign media to tell his side of the story.

There is nothing remarkable whatsoever about hiring PR flaks to massage your image, (or having an in-house corporate communications team - which Thaksin now seems to have hired).

Every company I talk to has this function, and they all would like to have quote checks, a review of text pre-publication etc etc. On the occasions I write negative stories about them, they are the ones who go bonkers.

[baht&sold]

Here we have several posters who'd laugh off any suggestion of Thaksin manipulating foreign media, like WSJ or the Economist.

And will continue to do so until there is evidence the charge is other than paranoia fuelled fantasy.

I don't have any doubt at all he is trying to steer foreign media to tell his side of the story.

There is nothing remarkable whatsoever about hiring PR flaks to massage your image, (or having an in-house corporate communications team - which Thaksin now seems to have hired).

Every company I talk to has this function, and they all would like to have quote checks, a review of text pre-publication etc etc. On the occasions I write negative stories about them, they are the ones who go bonkers.

You raise a fair point actually J - every fortune 500 Company (and many others) hire PR firms, or have in-house corp comms teams, that's to be expected.

However, when a convict on the run is permitted to hire a PR guy with long documented associations/partnerships with major respected western/UK media Co's, reasonable people have a right to question when suddenly much of that news becomes suspect and devolves to 'talking points' and innuendo 'masquerading' as news...

Beyond this, 'The Economist' in particular missing a global economic crisis was quite telling... perhaps they should focus more on facts, solid journalistic presentations of both sides and less 'shaping' of opinion.... Sad state of affairs in world media these days. For example, recall fully 5 months after the tragic Tsunami and there's a gaggle of reporters reporting from where a lot of debris was bull-dozed and saying: "As you can see behind me here, utter destruction remains in Phuket".... (preceded by playing the 'eye-catching' wave crashing scene as an in-take, over and over and over)

[Journalist]

^I would think that to secure an interview with Thaksin, one would have to agree to run the text past Sam Moon.

Some publications refuse to do that as policy - that may be why he doesn't appear a lot in the big publications in Q&A form, but I see he does do columns, which I imagine to some extent are ghosted.

Would I concede quote checks and rewrites as a condition of getting an interview with Thaksin? Yes; I have to admit I would make that concession: mindful of the diluting impact of that on the answers originally quoted.

Its always far better to be 'on the record' - the copy is more punchy. but even eloquent people find it hard to speak on the record. Its not easy - as George W Bush has found out.

[Plus]

When Thaksin first hired these companies he was a "legitimately elected" PM fighting a military coup, his image had a lot of potential.

Now it's all over for him, international media can't help him very much, his last war cry was for "people power" in early December, he needed a positive spin on that in case it came through but now it's truly over, whether he pays for it or not.

[Plus]

I would think that to secure an interview with Thaksin, one would have to agree to run the text past Sam Moon.

After his conviction the only interview he got was on some internet blog. No more CNN or Al Jazeera, not interested. I bet if he orders some articles published it's about his legacy and ideology rather than his personal story.