Another Snake Id Question

[hanuman1]

Hi

Could anyone tell me what snake this is? We found it last night in our garden with an unusual looking frog (large, dark green, but with a large bright orange blotch covering nearly its entire back) in its (the snake's) mouth. The wife said the snake was poisonous on account of the shape of the tail (!?) and since we have a toddler who frequents the area where we think the snake was living, it was soon battered to death.

Sad to lose the snake, but at least the frog got its life back, sustaining only a broken leg. Was surprised to see the frog still alive if the snake was poisonous, but it limped off pretty quickly so I don't know if it succumbed to any poison later on.

It's about 2 feet long but doesn't look fully grown to me. Thanks for any opinions.

Hanuman1

[neverdie]

Its got both a head & markings similar to a Malayan Pit Viper - Calloselasma rhodostoma Thai: (ngu gap pha).

If it is one of them, they have a strong poison....can be deadly.

Having said that its strange colouring also looks like a Kanburi Pit Viper Cryptelytrops [Trimeresurus] kanburiensis Thai: .

which are less lethal, maybe only make you sick. Do you live near Kanchanaburi??

Edited January 8, 2009 by neverdie

[hanuman1]

Thanks so much Neverdie. I think

Now I'm getting nervous about it. Do you know anything about the likelyhood of other members of its family being in the immediate vicinity? Is there anything we can do to discourage others of its kind coming near our home?

There is an area where we put all cuttings and dead leaves - like a compost heap - next to the house. Will it help to get rid of that? Any other info on this snake's lifestyle would be most welcome. I'll take a look around the web too.

Thanks again.

Hanuman1

P.S. 'm not in Kanchanaburi. We are in Chiang Mai. By the way, the head may be out of shape due to the beating it got.

Edited January 8, 2009 by hanuman1

[neverdie]

LOL Point taken about the head beating.

You are talking to the bloke who came home the other nite to find a King Cobra in the kitchen.....not sure how it got in the house, i often leave the front door open to let the breeze thru, so it must have slithered in, most likely under my nose.

As for you. Snakes are on the move because it is starting to heat up, some of them have been in a short hybernation & many in CM probably still are. They come out and they are on the move looking for a quick and easy feed.

Important for you is to understand the snakes food chain....that will determine where they like to go....they do NOT feed on human (thankfully). Snakes like to eat frogs, small lizards & things like that. Frogs like to be near water, because water is where the mosquitos are...frogs eat mosquitos. I'm trying to be simple about it because normally the simplest explanation is the best one. Having said that, if you yard has lots of rubbish like building supplies, tin sheets , old car bodies etc, snakes love that sort of thing & they may make a home in a compost heap (pile of grass like you describe). They love garden sheds, tiny nooks and crannies, places where they can hide and feel safe, have the chance to grab the odd feed and most importantly where they can keep warm.

Anyway don't freak out, remember that most people get bitten by the snake by accident, either by accidently treading on one OR whilst trying to kill the snake. Most snakes will try to rack off as you approach them because they are more scared of us than we are of them....they normally taste the air as you approach & try to make a get away. Having said that they can become aggressive if startled, cornered or when protecting their young & at breeding time (just like humans).

Sadly, more snakes are killed by humans than humans by snakes. I also killed my kitchen snake because I couldnt get him out of the kitchen and he didnt want to share the space (either did i).

Don't freat it too much, keep ur yard clear of debris & overgrown gardens wont help....BUT don't be surprised because people with clear open yards can often come out the back to find a snake snoozing on that nice warm concrete surface near the BBQ. If your out & about in the garden or bushwalking & stuff, be heavy footed, the vibrations will send most snakes scattering.

Anyway, I am certainly no expert & the other day there was a snake handler on thai visa....i cant remember his/her name but they may be able to give you better advice than me.

Edited January 8, 2009 by neverdie

[gnoof]

Looks more like a harmless Kukri Snake to me. And definitely not a Malayan Pit Viper Calloselasma rhodostoma.

Edited January 8, 2009 by gnoof

[hanuman1]

Thanks for that gnoof.

That is definitely very similar to what we saw.

You've taken a load off my mind!

Edited January 8, 2009 by hanuman1

[Geekfreaklover]

Yes, I think it is a Banded kukri Snake Oligodon fasciolatus. Harmless.

[Rimmer]

Agree it looks like some sort of viper but kinda the wrong colors.

Attached my home made snake hook which can extend to about two meters. Just pick them up in the middle and flick them over the wall. Easy!!

[Rimmer]

Looks more like a harmless Kukri Snake to me. And definitely not a Malayan Pit Viper Calloselasma rhodostoma.

Yes I'll go with that as well, now I found one in my book.

[sbk]

Agree it looks like some sort of viper but kinda the wrong colors.

Attached my home made snake hook which can extend to about two meters. Just pick them up in the middle and flick them over the wall. Easy!!

I'd hate to live on the other side of your wall, Rimmer

[neverdie]

Looks more like a harmless Kukri Snake to me. And definitely not a Malayan Pit Viper Calloselasma rhodostoma.

Agree it looks like some sort of viper but kinda the wrong colors.

Attached my home made snake hook which can extend to about two meters. Just pick them up in the middle and flick them over the wall. Easy!!

Gnoof,

I agree totally, its a Kukri snake....never even seen one before....theres actually a few non venomous snakes I didnt have. Very difficult with the colour for me on screen, my eyes is like that, markings are similar to the viper BUT MUCH Closer to the Kukri snake . I've got an old book here that hasnt even got one in it....might explain why i didnt see it.

Rimmer that snake hook is great, don't know how i missed the Kukri snake, colour matches much better.

hanuman1, this might explain why your frog was able to waddle off, seemingly unaffected (because it was). Sorry about the misinformation, all the same rules still apply, irregardless of whether or not the snake is a harmless or dangerous one.

Edited January 8, 2009 by neverdie

[hanuman1]

No problem, neverdie. I'm pretty relieved.

I don't know why all the locals who've seen it say it is poisonous and some are saying 'viper'. You'd think they'd have a fairly good understanding of the various beasts that turn up from time to time on their patch, but on the other hand the photographic evidence of it bring a Kukri is very strong.

I'm going for the photographic evidence, although flying in the face of local knowledge can often be costly in various ways.

Cheers to all

Hanuman1

[Gary A]

I'm always surprised how little Thais know about snakes. ALL of them are venomous. Most Thais kill any snake they see. Fortunately my wife is an exception. She gets upset when the neighbors kill any snake. We have a King Cobra in the neighborhood and so far he has been fast enough to get away. That and since he is big, they are afraid of him.

[gnoof]

hanuman1, you are welcome.

Snakes usually run away when they encountered human unless they are provoked.

neverdie, A Photographic Guide to Snakes and Other Reptiles of Thailand, Peninsular Malaysia and Singapore is a great book.

Gary A, not only in Thailand. Here in Malaysia also have the same problem. In fact I think this happen throughout the world.

[Remix4]

i used to live on a rubber plantation in Indonesia where king cobras around the house was a regular occurrence.

We basically used sulphur to help prevent snakes entering the houses - pour a ring of sulphur powder around doors etc.

I guess it worked!!!

[neverdie]

hanuman1, you are welcome.

Snakes usually run away when they encountered human unless they are provoked.

neverdie, A Photographic Guide to Snakes and Other Reptiles of Thailand, Peninsular Malaysia and Singapore is a great book.

Gary A, not only in Thailand. Here in Malaysia also have the same problem. In fact I think this happen throughout the world.

i used to live on a rubber plantation in Indonesia where king cobras around the house was a regular occurrence.

We basically used sulphur to help prevent snakes entering the houses - pour a ring of sulphur powder around doors etc.

I guess it worked!!!

thanks gnoof, i will look for a new book....this one is a bit ordinary...it was a hand me down from my father...the website is also good but i easily missed a whole cateogry of snakes.

remix, i never heard of the sulphur trick before....very interesting. thanks to both of you.

[Yahooka]

I'm always surprised how little Thais know about snakes. ALL of them are venomous. Most Thais kill any snake they see. Fortunately my wife is an exception. She gets upset when the neighbors kill any snake. We have a King Cobra in the neighborhood and so far he has been fast enough to get away. That and since he is big, they are afraid of him.

Yes,and the sad thing is that this lack of knowlegde is passed on to many farangs !! The most classic story I`ve been told by a number of farangs up in Issan is about the King Cobra :" If you destroy the King Cobras eggs in the nest ,it doesn`t matter where in Thailand you go after that...the King Cobra will remember your scent and come after you " !!

This is stories told to them by their Thai family/friends and which they sadly believe and tell other farangs with a straight face !!

[pongosnodgrass]

1. How do you get close enough to a Cobra to kill it? I would run a mile if I saw one.

2.

Attached my home made snake hook which can extend to about two meters. Just pick them up in the middle and flick them over the wall. Easy!!

Rimmer - you could start a business selling those things to freaked-out farangs! Unless you're willing to share how you made it.

I've seen a few of those kukri snakes near our cottage in Pattaya. One was having great trouble eating a bat, the other made a short meal of a lizard and then disappeared into a tree.

Edited January 22, 2009 by pongosnodgrass