Farang Murdered In Chiang Mai

[eggomaniac]

At the scene, police found a six-inch knife and a broken jar, which could have been used in the killing.

----------------

Sounds like a simple case of matching fingerprints, from the Citroen as well; not chasing Shans into the hills. Too bad the police and British newspapers would paint a horrific murder and robbery with crime as pertaining to a Peoples' rituals and customs!? sheeshh

I wonder if the Shan could sue some of the newspapers, at least demand a retraction and an apology.

Why pay to live in a 'gated community' if there are no restrictions on letting known criminals freely come and go?

[ETC]

The tribal ritual story, I think should be taken with a pinch of salt and didn't see it mentioned in the Thai article.

Has anyone honestly heard of Shan smashing lights after robberies to avoid capture.

I suppose simple robbery would be too boring for reporters.

There was another case a few weeks back (only in Thai press) of a Thai woman down in Sanpatong who was robbed, murdered and then they tried to burn the body. She was a money lender and some local youths knew what time of day she held cash at home. It was a group of local youths and just plain murder for cash. This could be much the same.

A sad story indeed and I totally agree that the Shan ritual story should be taken with a pinch of salt.

It sounds like an attempt to deflect the blame already, without any substance.

When I read sad things, like this, I'm reminded of earlier training in my life. "People Lie"! "Believe the Science"!

[warmwater7]

According to the material cited in the Sun, the killer got away in a stolen car, and possibly took a safe (from drag marks seen). If anyone was aware that the victim had valuables in his house, that could certainly have been a big risk for him. I hope they catch the RIGHT criminal, and I hope other foreigners in CM and other parts of Thailand will learn from this story and be careful. There are reasons that many of the richer Thais live in guarded, walled estates with broken glass bottles lining the walls.

Very sad news. Well put about the walls et.

As we have all learned, it takes at least a few years to learn (and have a healthy respect for) the nuances of Thai behavior.

The same thing happens in Mexico like clockwork,however there, one may simply get a knife for being at the wrong place at the wrong time.

In the LOS it seems somehow,if one gets a knife , well one may have somehow ( in violation of some potentially tricky cultural navigation ) earned it, knowingly, or in the case of new arrivals,unknowingly.

Prayers and regards to the gentleman and his family.

the attacker have earned some very nasty karma.

[dinthailand]

At the scene, police found a six-inch knife and a broken jar, which could have been used in the killing.

----------------

Sounds like a simple case of matching fingerprints, from the Citroen as well; not chasing Shans into the hills. Too bad the police and British newspapers would paint a horrific murder and robbery with crime as pertaining to a Peoples' rituals and customs!? sheeshh

I wonder if the Shan could sue some of the newspapers, at least demand a retraction and an apology.

Why pay to live in a 'gated community' if there are no restrictions on letting known criminals freely come and go?

matching fingerprints, asking for retractions and apologies. that is not a thai or eastern concept. thais will avoid this as they see it as maintaining further conflict. they will mae bphen rai and want to move on and close this case.

the thai police will put their own spin on what happned as they did in the kirsty jones case which was reviewed by shropshire police

people will be arrested (3 have already) pictures in newspapers then all will be forgotten. sad and wrong but this is the feudal east.

[Loaded]

Something for the police to consider is that the body was found by the mae bahn. Most mae bahns in Chiang Mai are Tai Yai (Shan). There are conflicting reports that the body was dead for 4 days, 2 days, his car driven by 2 suspects 2 days before etc. Unless the murder happened late the night before it was found, it's unlikely the mae bahn wouldn't have found it before. Is she the only witness? What about her relationship to the two shan guys who lived at the back of the house and haven't been seen since?

[judewil]

You know you can always change the channel if you don't like what's on.

The point is - you and those like you with your attitude - that people are well aware that they can change the channel, but maybe some people know how to live without an attitude like yours, and are trying to shake some sense into you and tell you to get a life.

[PeaceBlondie]

Loaded, I am puzzled about the mention of the 73-year old housekeeper. The first thing David asked me when I visited, was the name of a housekeeper, but he did not want to pay standard wages. I never saw a female in that home in about 7 visits.

peekint, who speaks passable pasa Thai and was at the crime scene with investigating police, has posted how professionally they carried out their duties.

Also, the hill tribes of the men I met at David's home did not include Tai Yai or Shan, as far as I could tell.

[connel707]

Well i guess if you want to throw police off your trail in Chiang Mai smash a light and instantly they think its these tribes...

I don't like stereotyping but it seems the Thai police always know exactly what's going on. Ask them about any crime and they will have an answer ready - even if they just discovered the body.

That's probably because in the vast majority of cases it's actually been the cops who did the killing in the first place and had a prepared reason. Their reasons often never make sensce to anyone with half a brain, but you see they think that everyone has lower intellegence than them, and, being in Thailand that is also often true.

I spoke to a Thai policeman friend of mine, he has told me the police now suspect it was suicide..!!! RIP whatever

[invex]

To all of you;

Be careful; after all, Thailand ranks 2th or 3rd in the world for murders, with a gun as weapon ! !

In Thailand, every day, an average of 10 people were killed ! ! Statistics for 2008.

To David:

R.I.P.

[john b good]

Well i guess if you want to throw police off your trail in Chiang Mai smash a light and instantly they think its these tribes...

I don't like stereotyping but it seems the Thai police always know exactly what's going on. Ask them about any crime and they will have an answer ready - even if they just discovered the body.

That's probably because in the vast majority of cases it's actually been the cops who did the killing in the first place and had a prepared reason. Their reasons often never make sensce to anyone with half a brain, but you see they think that everyone has lower intellegence than them, and, being in Thailand that is also often true.

I spoke to a Thai policeman friend of mine, he has told me the police now suspect it was suicide..!!! RIP whatever

If this event was not so serious that "the police now suspect it was suicide" has got to take the biscuit.

One can never ever be assured of a proper investigation (and conclusion) in this county if a falang is the victim.

[Paagai]

Before the thread is closed, could someone please post a photo of Mr. Crisp?

r.i.p

I wasn't going to post this, but if we must have a picture of David let's at least have a more flattering and respectful one.

[sriracha john]

Before the thread is closed, could someone please post a photo of Mr. Crisp? I'd do it myself, but I've not found any at all in all of the news reports and for completeness of the thread I think it would appropriate.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/uploads/mont...73570_thumb.jpg

Thank you.

Edited January 24, 2009 by sriracha john

[Ulysses G.]

I know him!

[travelingmike]

so it doesn't sound like a pure-bred Thai, but one of those cross-bred impure Burmese/Thai. Is it possible that it was committed by a basic Thai person, and not some savage ritual drum-beating dance around the fire dirty filthy border people. It seems that everything to do with a border is less than up to standard to the Thai. Sawasdibpiimaijeen

Some people have taken offense to the above, I believe not a bigot. Just stating facts. Thai persons are very prejudice toward the border people describe above and this is how they describe them and it is easy to place blame on them when it was probably just a pure-bred thai , whatever that is. I am married to one of those issarn people that the pure thai -whatever that is again, looks down on. The only pure thai is probably a chinese because they make the rules and label the rest. There was a movie in america called "a day without a mexican", could you imagine "a day without issarn or hill tribe people ", this place would fall apart.

[WaiWai]

Don't forget that it is by no means impossible that a foreigner/s was/were somehow involved in this story. We simply don't know.

I, too, have wondered about possible complicity of the "housekeeper"/people living at the house, and possibly also the guards, as well as a number of conflicting elements in the reports. The recent party could, of course, have provided surveillance opportunities to a number of people.

It certainly does appear that this ought not be an extremely difficult case to solve. It is therefore very hard to think that justice may not be served (though the report from the person who was interviewed at the scene of the crime may be cause for us to be a little more hopeful). None of our amateur detective work is going to change the course of events to follow, though.

While I'd love to hear otherwise, I really don't see any way we can help serve the interests of justice, other than by keeping this story alive -- respectfully, and with strict attention to facts (as "Mary Jane" and relatives of other victims are doing, painful as it must be). The story has appeared in a number of overseas newspapers, with varying degrees of sensationalism.

[Jingthing]

The deceased Mr. Crisp is no longer here to DEFEND HIMSELF. Some RESPECT, please. Again I request all slanderous implications be DELETED. Thank you.

Edited January 24, 2009 by sbk

[dinthailand]

The deceased Mr. Crisp is no longer here to DEFEND HIMSELF. Some RESPECT, please. Again I request all slanderous implications be DELETED. Thank you.

Seconded. Ive have written to the mods asking they ban certain individuls permanently. Let's make TV a decent forum

[sbk]

And so they have, next person to bring unwarranted and uncalled for implications will find their account suspended. This is not an appropriate thread for such discussions.

[Paagai]

I'd originally written this post in response to a now deleted comment from Gravelrash. As the offensive comemnts are now gone I've edited the post to remove my reply. However, the last sentence I wrote I beleive offers some good advice:

If you have information about Farangs abusing children, rather than pontificate it about it on this forum, do something positive and REPORT IT. Click This Link for an easy way to do so.

Edited January 24, 2009 by Paagai

[Paagai]

Don't forget that it is by no means impossible that a foreigner/s was/were somehow involved in this story. We simply don't know.

I, too, have wondered about possible complicity of the "housekeeper"/people living at the house, and possibly also the guards, as well as a number of conflicting elements in the reports. The recent party could, of course, have provided surveillance opportunities to a number of people.

It certainly does appear that this ought not be an extremely difficult case to solve. It is therefore very hard to think that justice may not be served (though the report from the person who was interviewed at the scene of the crime may be cause for us to be a little more hopeful). None of our amateur detective work is going to change the course of events to follow, though.

While I'd love to hear otherwise, I really don't see any way we can help serve the interests of justice, other than by keeping this story alive -- respectfully, and with strict attention to facts (as "Mary Jane" and relatives of other victims are doing, painful as it must be). The story has appeared in a number of overseas newspapers, with varying degrees of sensationalism.

I think concerns about the activities of the BIB maybe misplaced. I'm pleased to report they've been quite active knocking on doors in the Shan community in Chang Peuk, and know what they are looking for. Please give them chance to do their job; it may take a while if the suspect has gone to ground.

[Priceless]

To all of you;

Be careful; after all, Thailand ranks 2th or 3rd in the world for murders, with a gun as weapon ! !

In Thailand, every day, an average of 10 people were killed ! ! Statistics for 2008.

To David:

R.I.P.

Firstly, my condolences to all the victim's family and friends.

Secondly, this crime did not involve any guns. As far as Thailand's ranking in murders over all, it is (according to this website: http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_mur_...ders-per-capita ) # 14 in the world. Still far to high, but let's stay somewhere in the neighbourhood of facts. I would be interested in the source for your statement, as I very much doubt that there are any (reliable) statistics for 2008 published anywhere.

/ Priceless

[Rasseru]

I know him!

dam_n, so did I, and now I half wish I had not looked at this thread. He and I were in a Thai language class together at the YMCA last year. He was a very nice man.

Edited January 24, 2009 by Rasseru

[sassienie]

I have read that per year in Thailand Westerners are being murdered here by the hundreds.

Thailand is still one of the safest countries in the world to live for foreigners and most of the murders are committed against gang members, criminals and those that become involved with undesirables, including Thai girlfriends/wives.

Providing ex-pats here keep their heads down, do not get involved in criminal activities and try to stay clear of undesirables, than Thailand can still be a utopia for most of us.

[imaneggspurt]

I just don't understand what kind of gated community it is. There is a quardian, right? He was on duty and saw the poor man's car driven by a Thai boy plus another Thai inside. And what? He couldn't stop the car and ask why there were taking it and where the owner was? What is actually the guardian's responsibility? For what he is there, at the gate, - to watch and that's all? It seems nobody cares of anything in this country. All they want is just farangs' money. As one Thai man said to me:"Oooh, Thai people need money..." As if nobody else does, only them...

You're right - in a perfect world the guard would have at least attempted to foil the guy's getaway. However, I've rarely seen a security guard care about who's coming in and out. Occasionally, one will ask questions, but usually they just wave you on through.

And why dont they have cctv on the gates, it costs peanuts now,

[dinthailand]

I just don't understand what kind of gated community it is. There is a quardian, right? He was on duty and saw the poor man's car driven by a Thai boy plus another Thai inside. And what? He couldn't stop the car and ask why there were taking it and where the owner was? What is actually the guardian's responsibility? For what he is there, at the gate, - to watch and that's all? It seems nobody cares of anything in this country. All they want is just farangs' money. As one Thai man said to me:"Oooh, Thai people need money..." As if nobody else does, only them...

You're right - in a perfect world the guard would have at least attempted to foil the guy's getaway. However, I've rarely seen a security guard care about who's coming in and out. Occasionally, one will ask questions, but usually they just wave you on through.

And why dont they have cctv on the gates, it costs peanuts now,

because the police would have to review the film and it would show a guard waving someone through. what can the embarassed policeman and guard then do. everyone is losing face. not a western concept but this would understand

[Considered Opinion]

I have read that per year in Thailand Westerners are being murdered here by the hundreds.

Utter rubbish.

[Jimjim]

Stories like this just make me sad...

[dinthailand]

I have read that per year in Thailand Westerners are being murdered here by the hundreds.

Utter rubbish.

"utter rubbish" seems a strange remark from someone whose name is " considered opinion"

check the american, australian, and uk embassies for their figures; then give us the benefit of your considered opinion

[sbk]

Lets not get into a debate about how many murders there are in Thailand in this thread please. Thanks.

[sbk]

And lets not make unfounded allegations as well, post have yet again been deleted. Show some respect for the man's friends and family please