Financial Crisis

[AlexLah]

Baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!!

You you you

Anyway as our fellow TV member()s is/are asking for linky linky, here's two.

http://dandelionsalad.wordpress.com/2009/0...atherine-harris

http://informationclearinghouse.info/article22087.htm

First one specially for Herr Naam,

[Naam]

First one specially for Herr Naam,

Alex, i very much like the style of this "other" Catherine Harris but i don't know why i should read over and over again what i know already. and what really bothers me is that she didn't mention any broken seal or pointed to some Mayan or Aztec calendar indicating the end of the world or at least pointing to a conspiracy of the FED using fractional banking and creating fiat money out of thin air to please Gordon Brown and bankrupt the United Kingdom.

[AlexLah]

The reason why I mentioned that link specially for you Naam is that I knew you would go through it and as I know you know what you talk about

regarding these financial instruments if there would be some flaw in that story you would certainly copy and paste some snips here and put it under the digital guillotine.

That you have not done that is some evidence that that linky is worth reading for those people that just start to discover all this madness and for those that still not understand or partly. There have been some very interesting posts/links posted during this 30+ pages thread and I thought the links I provided in above post just explain things a bit different but still accurate. Most if not all MSM do not really mention this stuff but instead blame this mess on all those peeps that bought homes they could not afford, which is in part true but not the real reason why Trillions and Trillions of dollars euro's toilet paper is needed to "Kick start"

the economy or that is what they want us to believe.

Now there is some other interesting stuff to be found here: http://cafr1.com/

Requires a bit of time to go through all info and clips, but I think this guy has some good point's.

Edit: As I said earlier, China is going to sell some of it's dollars (Read they go shopping)

http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/bizchina/2009...ent_7485649.htm

Edited February 25, 2009 by AlexLah

[Naam]

The reason why I mentioned that link specially for you Naam is that I knew you would go through it and as I know you know what you talk about regarding these financial instruments if there would be some flaw in that story you would certainly copy and paste some snips here and put it under the digital guillotine.

That you have not done that is some evidence that that linky is worth reading for those people that just start to discover all this madness and for those that still not understand or partly. There have been some very interesting posts/links posted during this 30+ pages thread and I thought the links I provided in above post just explain things a bit different but still accurate.

Alex, there is no doubt about that Ms. Harris -not the floridian bitch Catherine Harris )- has indeed done a good job with her explanation.

[AlexLah]

Ok, thanks Naam.

Now for that last link that CAFR I have found something that explains it a bit better and shorter, it has nothing to do with derivatives stuff but will hopefully get you (Us all here I mean) interested. If you realise the enormous scam of this, well look for yourself and let me know what you think.

As I said this monster is so big that when you mention this all and other stuff people think your a nutter so hopefully if eaten bit by bit people finaly start waking up that the world they think they are living in is a fantasy world.

Enjoy!

[Naam]

except for funny ones i hardly ever watch youtube clips Alex. and i definitely don't watch youtube for information purposes. simple reason: there are a number of professionals who do nothing but faking clips. an excellent example is the variety of available clips concerning the terror attack on sept 11, 2001. although i knew about the fakes i could hardly believe my eyes when a documentary on Deutsche Welle TV demonstrated what all can be done in this respect.

[flying]

Have not really looked at it yet as I am on vacation & only have a laptop....( I hate lap tops )

Anyway looks well put together.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/meltdown/

Edited February 26, 2009 by flying

[samuibeachcomber]

Have not really looked at it yet as I am on vacation & only have a laptop....( I hate lap tops )

Anyway looks well put together.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/meltdown/

as an aside why do you hate laptops/I ask cos was thinking of getting one(already have a home PC.

[flying]

Have not really looked at it yet as I am on vacation & only have a laptop....( I hate lap tops )

Anyway looks well put together.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/meltdown/

as an aside why do you hate laptops/I ask cos was thinking of getting one(already have a home PC.

You know.....Of course they serve their purpose when traveling etc.

But even now just typing this I have bumped the cap locks 2x

I am not a giant .... but man this keyboard seems tiny when your use to a full sized one.

Don't even get me started about these finger driven mouse deals

Now I am in a condo so I am using a small USB mouse that is better than none.

Lastly years ago I was a sys admin & was always amazed at the price versus what you get hardware wise.

The full size desktop is just such a better value if..........you dont need to travel.

So I have both....but only use this laptop when traveling which i less & less these days.

Edited February 26, 2009 by flying

[flying]

Awhile back I posted a link about New Hamshire & Montana now it looks like more have followed.

Texas is up to bat now

http://www.capitol.state.tx.us/BillLookup/...&Bill=HCR50

http://www.capitol.state.tx.us/tlodocs/81R...ml/HC00050I.htm

Also it looks like the same has basically passed in Oklahoma

http://www.tenthamendmentcenter.com/2009/0...re-in/#more-222

Things have a feeling of change here & I do not think it was the one the new President was talking about in his campaign

WHEREAS, The Tenth Amendment defines the total scope of

federal power as being that specifically granted by the

Constitution of the United States and no more; and

WHEREAS, The scope of power defined by the Tenth Amendment

means that the federal government was created by the states

specifically to be an agent of the states; and

WHEREAS, Today, in 2009, the states are demonstrably treated

as agents of the federal government; and

WHEREAS, Many federal laws are directly in violation of the

Tenth Amendment to the Constitution of the United States;

[Naam]

But even now just typing this I have bumped the cap locks 2x

I am not a giant .... but man this keyboard seems tiny when your use to a full sized one.

Don't even get me started about these finger driven mouse deals

Now I am in a condo so I am using a small USB mouse that is better than none.

since years i use something like this when i am travelling with my laptop:

[AlexLah]

Made in China, Taiwan?

[midas]

No matter how we interpret the economic data released everyday- one thing which

is more shocking than anything is stories like the one below.

There have always been bad elements in all societies but there doesn't seem to be

any end in sight to the attitude of these kinds of people today. This seems to represent

a total breakdown in morals and integrity. We can never have bright future without

a huge change in attitude and WHEN is this going to happen?.

Bear in mind the incident which led to this investigation of these very recent events

started after a senior executive made what he probably regarded as a totally

innocent remark at the party - but not realising a friend of an investigative journalist overheard the remark

which was passed on and started this whole story .

What was that remark - it was " screw the taxpayer " .

There is no hope for a meaningful recovery because I don't feel there's much hope for

a civilized society if this is the way people are still thinking today. Who can we trust ?

Bailout Bank Blows Millions Partying in L.A.

Northern Trust flew hundreds of clients and employees to L.A. and put many of them up at some of the fanciest and priciest hotels in the city. We're told more than a hundred people were put up at the Beverly Wilshire in Bev Hills, and another hundred stayed at the Loews Santa Monica Beach Hotel. Still more stayed at the Ritz Carlton in Marina Del Rey and others at Casa Del Mar in Santa Monica.

Now how's this for outrage? Northern Trust laid off 450 workers in December, 4% of its workforce.

And here's what's absolutely amazing: The United States Government flat out gave Northern Trust the $1.6 billion in bailout money, and the bank didn't even request it!

http://www.tmz.com/2009/02/24/northern-trust-bank-bailout/20

Edited February 26, 2009 by midas

[samuibeachcomber]

midas all the banks/financial institutions are doing the same thing in the USA and UK,and why would n't they?they were not made to account for any of it.the walls will come crumbling down,only a matter of time.

Edited February 26, 2009 by samuibeachcomber

[midas]

midas all the banks/financial institutions are doing the same thing in the USA and UK,and why would n't they?they were not made to account for any of it.the walls will come crumbling down,only a matter of time.

But this is no different to theft. Then we may as well all go home and barricade

ourselves in because if society is implying that just because no one is made to account for it

they can assume they can get away with it -then all our moral values have just gone out the door.

No amount of tax payers money is going to solve this problem because that is not

the real problem - it is our own attitude to other people and society- Bernard Madoff,

Alan Stanford ad the executive at Northern Trust essentially said the same thing

-fukc my lifelong friends and fukc society -I don't care about them ?

So if we can get away with it we can take anything from anyone-God help society

[BEENTHEREDONETHAT]

midas all the banks/financial institutions are doing the same thing in the USA and UK,and why would n't they?they were not made to account for any of it.the walls will come crumbling down,only a matter of time.

But this is no different to theft. Then we may as well all go home and barricade

ourselves in because if society is implying that just because no one is made to account for it

they can assume they can get away with it -then all our moral values have just gone out the door.

No amount of tax payers money is going to solve this problem because that is not

the real problem - it is our own attitude to other people and society- Bernard Madoff,

Alan Stanford ad the executive at Northern Trust essentially said the same thing

-fukc my lifelong friends and fukc society -I don't care about them ?

So if we can get away with it we can take anything from anyone-God help society

Makes Thailand look mighty good in comparison. Could rage on about all the politicians, bankers and wall street thief's, but I don't think it would make any difference to anyone. They will be sure to have enough tucked away to weather the storm. And the fact that they caused it does not concern them one bit.

[samuibeachcomber]

midas all the banks/financial institutions are doing the same thing in the USA and UK,and why would n't they?they were not made to account for any of it.the walls will come crumbling down,only a matter of time.

But this is no different to theft. Then we may as well all go home and barricade

ourselves in because if society is implying that just because no one is made to account for it

they can assume they can get away with it -then all our moral values have just gone out the door.

No amount of tax payers money is going to solve this problem because that is not

the real problem - it is our own attitude to other people and society- Bernard Madoff,

Alan Stanford ad the executive at Northern Trust essentially said the same thing

-fukc my lifelong friends and fukc society -I don't care about them ?

So if we can get away with it we can take anything from anyone-God help society

exactly,its what we've all been saying on this thread for a long time now.there are no morals any longer,but what has really shaken both govts.is the level of distrust now towards elected politicians,i think the amount of outrage and anger,especially expressed on channels like FOX has taken them by surprise.they've been getting away with lying to the public for over 20 years,and now the truth is out.thats why it will be so difficult to restart the economy again,there is no trust anymore.

[samuibeachcomber]

this excess of spending the bailout money on good times will only be stopped when either the govt.stops handing out tax payer money or if someone has the balls to prosecute them for stealing.but then members of the same family will rarely against one of their own.

[Groongthep]

And here's what's absolutely amazing: The United States Government flat out gave Northern Trust the $1.6 billion in bailout money, and the bank didn't even request it!

http://www.tmz.com/2009/02/24/northern-trust-bank-bailout/20

Yes, they gave stimulus money to a number of institutions that didn't request it. Since some banks like Northern Trust and others are not loaning out any of their own money and the US government is not in the consumer banking business (they guarantee some loans like VA and Student loans but these are administered through private banks) they are lending private institutions money at little or no interest so that they can then lend it out to people to buy homes, cars and start small businesses. That's the whole idea behind the stimulus package; kick-starting the credit markets in order to get the economy moving again.

I agree that it sounds crazy to try to fix the banking crisis which was caused by making bad loans in the first place by injecting even more money into the system that started it, but if no one can get a loan to buy a car or home then those sectors will collapse causing even more unemployment and a domino effect throughout the economy. What other solution is there? If nothing is done then another 1930's style depression is very possible.

The outrage comes when those institutions that went broke because of bad business practices give their top executives huge bonuses after the taxpayer has given them "bailout" money. President Obama himself has expressed anger at this. In his speech yesterday he mentioned that there will be new regulations written that will attempt to make sure that the money is spent and loaned wisely. There are some banks, credit unions, pension funds etc. that are respectable and solvent but who are still getting stimulus money with the expectation that they will make loans to consumers with it.

Edited February 26, 2009 by Groongthep

[gregb]

If nothing is done then another 1930's style depression is very possible.

A depression similar to the 1930's is about the best that can be hoped for right now. All this bail out money is just amplifying the mistakes. The strategy that has been selected is going to make things far worse than the 1930's. The US has elected to commit suicide because they are afraid of the pain associated with losing an arm. True, they will escape those effects, but the results are going to be far worse. Pray that the situation is only as bad as the 1930's.

[AlexLah]

It is hilarious, do those people not understand you can't pay off your debt by going deeper into debt.

Or maybe they do, and the ones in control get their money easy by the payment of interest on this debt?

The last YT cllip link I posted is about an English guy that beat the system. He is now a "Freeman"

He has his own bizz, does not pay ANY tax neither parking fines, penalty for not wearing a seatbelt whilst driving, can smoke pot and there is nothing they can do against it. Sure sometimes they take him in but have to let him go everytime. They once took his car as he refused to pay council tax but had to give it back, ha ha ha! Please go and see his presentation and you will find out something that could change your life for the better. There are no conspiracy theories, just plain facts. Here the website: http://www.tpuc.org/

Last night I looked at some YT clips that covered some sessions of the EU parliament regarding the Lisbon treaty and the denial of peoples vote against it, France, Holland, and Ireland. It is absolutely stunning to see how they want to push this stuff through and how some people are fighting against it.

It is all a big set-up in order to prepare for the next step in slavery, because that is what we are, slaves to a corrupt corporation.

[midas]

And here's what's absolutely amazing: The United States Government flat out gave Northern Trust the $1.6 billion in bailout money, and the bank didn't even request it!

http://www.tmz.com/2009/02/24/northern-trust-bank-bailout/20

The outrage comes when those institutions that went broke because of bad business practices give their top executives huge bonuses after the taxpayer has given them "bailout" money. President Obama himself has expressed anger at this. In his speech yesterday he mentioned that there will be new regulations written that will attempt to make sure that the money is spent and loaned wisely. There are some banks, credit unions, pension funds etc. that are respectable and solvent but who are still getting stimulus money with the expectation that they will make loans to consumers with it.

This is nothing to do with outrage against institutions that went broke who then

give their top executives huge bonuses.

This is the outrage from these scoundrels at Northern Trust receiving money

only to be used in a specific way and then wasting it irresponsibly in this way. This at a time

when they had just laid off 450 workers so anyone with any amount of

morality would have understood the need to show austerity.

Instead , their attitude was " screw the taxpayer " which other words

the friend of the journalist overheard. Maybe a 1930's style depression is

what we need to clear the decks and start again because at the moment this is

like a modern Wild West with everyone dressed in suits and ties robbing each other.

[12DrinkMore]

I am fed up with this guy Blanchflower. He has lived in the USA for many years and should be removed from the MPC, but I think he has resigned anyway, so thank god for that.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/economi...anchflower.html

Professor Blanchflower also questioned whether the benchmark CPI index was the right tool for the MPC to measure inflation, because it does not take house prices into account.

It is blatantly obvious that when the Labour party changed from using the RPI to the CPI it was a big mistake. And not for the dam_n reason that this <deleted> Blanchflower suggests

He suggested that including house prices could have helped the MPC to justify rate cuts sooner, amid growing evidence that the economy is facing the worst downturn for many decades.

The reason would have been that the MPC would have to have RAISED the rates to PREVENT the bubble in the first place.

But who was the Chancellor who took out the house prices from the equation? Yes, it was that monosighted git from Scotland, Gordon <deleted> Brown, who has now sent us all down the pan.

I am now seriously considering abandoning all prudence and thinking that I should simply take all my money far out of the reach of these bastards and bring it to Thailand, where, in the last decade, I have met so many people who are happy to have me here without trying to destroy what I have, and squander it all in booze and women until there is fukc all left. Then I will head back to the UK and claim all my benefits and support and fukc the next generation in the same way that Brown and his lot are doing.

At least it will help Thailand and its population, who have given me so much in comparison to Brown, who has destroyed so much.

Is there anything wrong with this plan?

Edited February 26, 2009 by 12DrinkMore

[ArranP]

I am fed up with this guy Blanchflower. He has lived in the USA for many years and should be removed from the MPC, but I think he has resigned anyway, so thank god for that.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/economi...anchflower.html

Professor Blanchflower also questioned whether the benchmark CPI index was the right tool for the MPC to measure inflation, because it does not take house prices into account.

It is blatantly obvious that when the Labour party changed from using the RPI to the CPI it was a big mistake. And not for the dam_n reason that this <deleted> Blanchflower suggests

He suggested that including house prices could have helped the MPC to justify rate cuts sooner, amid growing evidence that the economy is facing the worst downturn for many decades.

The reason would have been that the MPC would have to have RAISED the rates to PREVENT the bubble in the first place.

But who was the Chancellor who took out the house prices from the equation? Yes, it was that monosighted git from Scotland, Gordon <deleted> Brown, who has now sent us all down the pan.

I am now seriously considering abandoning all prudence and thinking that I should simply take all my money far out of the reach of these bastards and bring it to Thailand, where, in the last decade, I have met so many people who are happy to have me here without trying to destroy what I have, and squander it all in booze and women until there is fukc all left. Then I will head back to the UK and claim all my benefits and support and fukc the next generation in the same way that Brown and his lot are doing.

Is there anything wrong with this plan?

I would probably wait a while, as the £ is likely to strengthen against the baht. Best of luck with the rest of it.

[Chaimai]

I am now seriously considering abandoning all prudence and thinking that I should simply take all my money far out of the reach of these bastards and bring it to Thailand, where, in the last decade, I have met so many people who are happy to have me here without trying to destroy what I have, and squander it all in booze and women until there is fukc all left.

Is there anything wrong with this plan?

Perfectly sound plan. Can I come and help you execute it

[henryalleman]

looks more like a construction site on fire with a lot of standers by.If its not please tell me what was going on am interested.

200,000 demonstrators against the Poll Tax. 5,000 were injured and Thatcher was kicked out a few months later.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poll_Tax_Riots

Whilst the Poll Tax was regarded as the undoing of Thatcher I think she had run her course by then, and the economy was in a parlous state - can you imagine what it would be like now if interest rates were 15% !

As an aside, I would wager that you would take take Thatcher at her worst to Brown at his best ?

Should take in mind that Tatcher was a firm believer of a total free unregulated market, economical and financially, and that it was followed by her American admirer Reagan. I still remember her furious attacks on the EU committee that she almost accused to be commies because they want to have an regulated economy. her furious attacks against a minimum salary in the UK, Her furious attacks against an social Europe who protect the consumers and employees.

And what is the result of that free unregulated free market so much liked by Maggie and Ronny, that they established in both countries? I think we all know it.... a worldwide financial collapse.

I think in history books Tatcherism and Reaganism will be F words.

[flying]

since years i use something like this when i am travelling with my laptop:

Very nice idea!

I saw one in a magazine & thought so too.

[CPH]

looks more like a construction site on fire with a lot of standers by.If its not please tell me what was going on am interested.

200,000 demonstrators against the Poll Tax. 5,000 were injured and Thatcher was kicked out a few months later.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poll_Tax_Riots

Whilst the Poll Tax was regarded as the undoing of Thatcher I think she had run her course by then, and the economy was in a parlous state - can you imagine what it would be like now if interest rates were 15% !

As an aside, I would wager that you would take take Thatcher at her worst to Brown at his best ?

Should take in mind that Tatcher was a firm believer of a total free unregulated market, economical and financially, and that it was followed by her American admirer Reagan. I still remember her furious attacks on the EU committee that she almost accused to be commies because they want to have an regulated economy. her furious attacks against a minimum salary in the UK, Her furious attacks against an social Europe who protect the consumers and employees.

And what is the result of that free unregulated free market so much liked by Maggie and Ronny, that they established in both countries? I think we all know it.... a worldwide financial collapse.

I think in history books Tatcherism and Reaganism will be F words.

Sorry to say it but it was not only Reagan and Thatcher who destroyed the economy.

The removal of the Glass Steagal act in the end of 1999 was unfortunately done by a united congress and signed by Clinton. This law had separated banking, insurance, stock trading etc since the thirties when it was enacted to avoid another depression. Then Bush removed the ceiling over the leverage the banks could use, (i think in 2002), and then after a few years we have another depression. This was actually predicted by a few members of congress in 1999 when the Glass Steagal act was removed. By the way removing the ceiling over the leverage was lobbied heavily at that time by Paulsen, who later had to clean up some of the mess.

[lannarebirth]

looks more like a construction site on fire with a lot of standers by.If its not please tell me what was going on am interested.

200,000 demonstrators against the Poll Tax. 5,000 were injured and Thatcher was kicked out a few months later.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poll_Tax_Riots

Whilst the Poll Tax was regarded as the undoing of Thatcher I think she had run her course by then, and the economy was in a parlous state - can you imagine what it would be like now if interest rates were 15% !

As an aside, I would wager that you would take take Thatcher at her worst to Brown at his best ?

Should take in mind that Tatcher was a firm believer of a total free unregulated market, economical and financially, and that it was followed by her American admirer Reagan. I still remember her furious attacks on the EU committee that she almost accused to be commies because they want to have an regulated economy. her furious attacks against a minimum salary in the UK, Her furious attacks against an social Europe who protect the consumers and employees.

And what is the result of that free unregulated free market so much liked by Maggie and Ronny, that they established in both countries? I think we all know it.... a worldwide financial collapse.

I think in history books Tatcherism and Reaganism will be F words.

Sorry to say it but it was not only Reagan and Thatcher who destroyed the economy.

The removal of the Glass Steagal act in the end of 1999 was unfortunately done by a united congress and signed by Clinton. This law had separated banking, insurance, stock trading etc since the thirties when it was enacted to avoid another depression. Then Bush removed the ceiling over the leverage the banks could use, (i think in 2002), and then after a few years we have another depression. This was actually predicted by a few members of congress in 1999 when the Glass Steagal act was removed. By the way removing the ceiling over the leverage was lobbied heavily at that time by Paulsen, who later had to clean up some of the mess.

Most financial atrocities in the US can be traced back to the beginnings of Goldman Sachs Group running the financial wing of the US government. this particular legislative abomination was pushed by the arch criminal Rubin under the Clinton administration. Rather than being shot in the public square, he has been made "economic advisor emeritus" and his then underlings now hold all important positions in Treasury. It's "change you can believe in", Not.

Edited February 27, 2009 by lannarebirth

[CPH]

looks more like a construction site on fire with a lot of standers by.If its not please tell me what was going on am interested.

200,000 demonstrators against the Poll Tax. 5,000 were injured and Thatcher was kicked out a few months later.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poll_Tax_Riots

Whilst the Poll Tax was regarded as the undoing of Thatcher I think she had run her course by then, and the economy was in a parlous state - can you imagine what it would be like now if interest rates were 15% !

As an aside, I would wager that you would take take Thatcher at her worst to Brown at his best ?

Should take in mind that Tatcher was a firm believer of a total free unregulated market, economical and financially, and that it was followed by her American admirer Reagan. I still remember her furious attacks on the EU committee that she almost accused to be commies because they want to have an regulated economy. her furious attacks against a minimum salary in the UK, Her furious attacks against an social Europe who protect the consumers and employees.

And what is the result of that free unregulated free market so much liked by Maggie and Ronny, that they established in both countries? I think we all know it.... a worldwide financial collapse.

I think in history books Tatcherism and Reaganism will be F words.

Sorry to say it but it was not only Reagan and Thatcher who destroyed the economy.

The removal of the Glass Steagal act in the end of 1999 was unfortunately done by a united congress and signed by Clinton. This law had separated banking, insurance, stock trading etc since the thirties when it was enacted to avoid another depression. Then Bush removed the ceiling over the leverage the banks could use, (i think in 2002), and then after a few years we have another depression. This was actually predicted by a few members of congress in 1999 when the Glass Steagal act was removed. By the way removing the ceiling over the leverage was lobbied heavily at that time by Paulsen, who later had to clean up some of the mess.

Most financial atrocities in the US can be traced back to the beginnings of Goldman Sachs Group running the financial wing of the US government. this particular legislative abomination was pushed by the arch criminal Rubin under the Clinton administration. Rather than being shot in the public square, he has been made "economic advisor emeritus" and his then underlings now hold all important positions in Treasury. It's "change you can believe in", Not.

You are perfectly right. We can only hope that Goldman Sacks is the next to fall and then it could be split up into a number of smaller companies to reduce their power.