Got (almost) Robbed

[sangfroid]

"If I have to give money to everyone that has an angry face and asks for money, I will have nothing left"

George Burns was held up at gunpoint, "Your money or your life", demanded the guy.

"C'mon, C'mon hurry up"

"I'm thinking about it" , said George.

A Scotsman was mugged by a thug in Glasgow. "Give me your money or I'll belt you up" says the thug. The Scotsman thinks for a few seconds and says "I'm scared half to death, here's half my money!!

[johna]

Thai Rath

Rayong

Police in Rayong are searching for a mugger who uses pepper spray on his victims.

The first victim of this new type of attack was a foreign resident identified as Kriswillems.

Police found Kris late at night on a lonely stretch of highway incapacitated by pepper spray. In recounting his horrific ordeal Kris said he had bought the Pepper Spray after being bitten by a dog, and when stopped by the mugger he pulled the canister out of his pocket and pointed it at his attacker saying “go ahead dude make my day”

“I was counting down from 10 before I sprayed him but he leaned forward took the can out of my hand and laughed at me as he sprayed me in the face” said the distraught victim.

Kris was robbed of 40 Baht and a fake Rolex watch.

Kris whom admitted illegal possession of the pepper spray was fined 10.000 Baht by the Police.

[Hawkup2000]

Amongst other things, you might like to consider any of the the following items:

---

Flapper

---

I did a google image search on flapper and learned that it was a popular dress among women in the 1920's. I think women run the same risk of being robbed, so I would rule out the dress-like-lady-scheme.

Or do you mean those those hand flappers that PAD grannies used in Suvarnabhumi to make the police scared?

EDIT: Saw that you meant Slapper.

Edited February 8, 2009 by Hawkup2000

[justanothercybertosser]

Loads of crap advice here that might make out of bad situation a life threatening one, very little good advice.

Forget pepper spray, or any of those weapons. In Thailand one always has to assume that an attacker has a gun (easy to get and cheap - 100 Baht for a pen gun, 1500 Baht for a single shot 38, 2500 Baht up for a revolver), and more often than not there will be multiple attackers anyhow.

Don't become a target - avoid deserted areas, and don't live in them.

[Hawkup2000]

Yes, not so many good advices. First, don't use weapons or fight if you're not skilled. And if you resort to violence be very aware that it could led to a even more dangerous situation. The main rule: never look away.

It might sound crazy but I have a pair of panties with a "kangaroo pouch" with zipper. Good for keeping large cash and credit cards when traveling. One time I had my passport in them and were stopped by the police in Asoke. They gave me some funny looks when I reached for my passport and handed it to them. But hey, better safe than sorry.

If you want some entertainment on the subject: search for "Bas Rutten Street defense" on youtube.

Edited February 8, 2009 by Hawkup2000

[ozgirlinbkk]

Hi,

I was told by my former karate instructor in Australia - a state champion and also a burly 6'3" - that it is always best to give any mugger what they want - you can always replace money, credit cards, watches, but not your life. If that doesn't work, a swift kick in the nuts and then run like hel_l. Last resort, stand and fight, but only when you truly believe your life is at risk. Using weapons yourself only escalates the risk of getting injured or having them pulled from your grip and used against you.

[neverdie]

Hi,

I was told by my former karate instructor in Australia - a state champion and also a burly 6'3" - that it is always best to give any mugger what they want - you can always replace money, credit cards, watches, but not your life. If that doesn't work, a swift kick in the nuts and then run like hel_l. Last resort, stand and fight, but only when you truly believe your life is at risk. Using weapons yourself only escalates the risk of getting injured or having them pulled from your grip and used against you.

Thats Great advice ozgirl.

Other people strut around the planet ready to challenge anyone they come upon, but a very wise old man once told me, "No matter how good you are, theres always somebody better." Even the wise 6'3 black belt Karate instructor knows this.

[Arkady]

Is the German Canon spray available in Thailand? I have seen various other types of pepper spray on sale in the pet shop attached to my local animal hospital. They might be useful to carry on a bike against dogs but they were all in quite large cans, not very convenient for use on a bike. I have ridden a bike a lot upcountry and never felt threatened by people but have been attacked several times by evil dogs. Once had to dismount and protect myself with the bike. Then managed to pick up some large stones to hurl at the brute just as the owner came out of his house in time to watch a mean farang attacking his defenceless Rover. Greatest danger is falling off the bike and then being bitten while on the ground. Pepper spray could probably help.

Riding a bike in deserted areas in Bkk is probably not a good idea. I would also not advise resisting attempts at robbery as many people have got knifed or shot in Thailand for doing that. When biking upcountry I only take a few hundred baht for food, water or emergencies, a mobile phone and a plastic watch just in case. Mugging is not that common in Bkk in crowded areas. Avoid walking in quiet places at night. Lock car doors in Bkk, especially women. My gf has had unsavory looking men trying to open her car door in Bkk but luckily she always locks them. Also be warned, especially women again, of the tricks of cars or motorcyclists deliberately bumping into your car at night in a quiet area to force you out to look at damage to his vehicle and then mugging or kidnapping the victim for rape and/or forcing them to drain their account from an ATM machine. In case of a small scrape like that, best to drive off as quickly as possible. If it's a genuine case and they take your number, you or she can explain to the cops, if necessary, and the penalty for leaving the scene of a minor scrape is not going to be astronomical.

[Guts]

Do you have tips how you can protect yourself without violating the law and without making the situation more dangerous?

Where can I buy these things?

Getting away safely out of the situation would be a priority, but maybe you will be not that fortunate to do that one day....

Learn some self-defence techniques and practice the moves regularly. I bet there are classes for this in Thailand.

You also might want to search on "Yawara Stick" and "Yawara Stick Techniques". Almost any small rod shaped object can be used as a yawara stick and is legal to carry.

Keys can also be used in self-defense. For example, if you have three keys on your key chain, make a fist and put the keys in between the fingers so the points stick out.

Use weapons only when there is no safe way to escape.

Be safe!

- Guts

[Dakhar]

When I'm at the in-laws I frequently carry at least a couple of the above

Jeez!! and I thought my inlaws were bad...

Simon

I like that cannon idea for the MIL

[Zombienation]

To the OP...

Whilst what you experienced was traumatic and scary, you dealt with it well imho. You kept your cool and avoided injury or significant loss.

Don't take the law into your own hands, it always goes wrong.

Don't worry about what happened, most people are the victim of a crime at some point. It might not happen to you again. You were unlucky and encountered an opportunist. This could happen to anyone, anywhere at any time.

Enjoy your life and be safe. I think you did well.

Cheers

[Zombienation]

To the OP...

Whilst what you experienced was traumatic and scary, you dealt with it well imho. You kept your cool and avoided injury or significant loss.

Don't take the law into your own hands, it always goes wrong.

Don't worry about what happened, most people are the victim of a crime at some point. It might not happen to you again. You were unlucky and encountered an opportunist. This could happen to anyone, anywhere at any time.

Enjoy your life and be safe. I think you did well.

Cheers

[FairwayJack]

The decoy wallet is a good idea. I keep a 200 baht in it for our boys in the tight brown shirts. Only problem was my (former) mechanic found it, stole the 200 and put the wallet back in the glove box...Ha !!

[ClaytonSeymour]

Is the German Canon spray available in Thailand?

I've bought them in Patpong, Nana, Patong & at a market stall in Buriram City; they are also readily available in most (all?) beach resorts. So in answer to your question; most definitely yes.

[alantheembalmer]

i recently bought a bike and have been enjoying riding around town and getting lost, discovering new places etc. its a great way to see a city.

i have been lucky that i havent been bit by a dog or robbed. but i will take more caution now thanks to your warnings here.

i had been thinking about how to defend against a dog attack- a friend said he'd spit water at them from his camel pack, that and ringing his bell seems to freak out the dog.

i was imagining the baton might be good if it you could whip it out in time, tho dogs are quick..

and i had been riding in some dark dodgey areas alone, i had this perception that bangkok was such a 'safe' city.

thanks again for both warnings.

Many years ago, I cycled around the World, and dogs were a bit of a problem, especially in India and the USA. The one thing you do not do is try to outrun them, as they like nothing more than a good chase. The most effective method I adopted was to come to a grinding halt, stare them straight in the eye and then bare my teeth. This invariably did the trick. Sorry about being a bit, well a lot, off topic.

[qualtrough]

Do you have tips how you can protect yourself without violating the law and without making the situation more dangerous?

Without making it more dangerous?:

Give them what they want and then get the <deleted> out of there. You where lucky tonight as there are plenty out there with a gun/knife AND whom are willing to use it.

Is it really worth the risk for 2000 baht?

If I have to give money to everyone that has an angry face and asks for money, I will have nothing left. I don't give money until I really see a weapon. I didn't see a weapon.

My wife has a business, she sells clothes for monks, Buddha statues, joss sticks and other similar things. In the shop the are only 2 small girls working. They regularly get visits from ugly looking guys with angry faces asking for money. One of them wraps a cloth around his knuckles as if he wants to fight. Many poor people use intimidation techniques to extort money from shopkeepers (especially when the shopkeepers are girls). We can not give money every time. I live on a Thai budget.

I am sorry you are having trouble, but I think you are either living in the wrong part of Thailand or inadvertently projecting some kind of aura that attracts trouble. I have lived here for over 17 years since first arriving in 1980, and have visited areas all over the country, not to mention Bangkok and vicinity. I truthfully cannot remember anyone coming up to me with an angry face and demanding money, not once. Now, sure, that could happen, I am not saying Thailand is a paradise or that there is no crime, but if you and your wife are regularly confronted by angry people seeking to rob you or worse you are doing something wrong.

[ClaytonSeymour]

I am sorry you are having trouble, but I think you are either living in the wrong part of Thailand or inadvertently projecting some kind of aura that attracts trouble. I have lived here for over 17 years since first arriving in 1980, and have visited areas all over the country, not to mention Bangkok and vicinity. I truthfully cannot remember anyone coming up to me with an angry face and demanding money, not once. Now, sure, that could happen, I am not saying Thailand is a paradise or that there is no crime, but if you and your wife are regularly confronted by angry people seeking to rob you or worse you are doing something wrong.

Times are changing. A couple of month ago, I commented in the Isaan Forum that there appeared to be a growing number of beggars & homeless in Buriram City; this can easily escalate into crime. Don't be so sure that you are immune to this. People should take whatever steps they deem necessary to protect themselves, their property & their loved ones.

[John_Rambo]

The OP needs to learn to stand up for himself.

I would have kicked the guys head in.

[SNGLIFE]

It's NOT the same Thailand as 10 years ago and it will get a LOT worse as more factories close and jobs are lost. Try to fight a Thai and you will be mobbed by bystanders. I've seen it happen more than a few times.

[flying]

Sorry to hear about this.

But I agree with a poster above that you may be projecting something too.

I mean you said for yourself at the start you had a feeling so only took small cash & a card.

What seems odd to me is after you have this feeling you go cycling in a deserted area?

Almost hard to believe.

All that aside I do not agree with most posts here.

I do agree with not looking away as someone said. You did not say but it seems like you never looked at him?

Can you describe him? Did you see a gun?

Other than that if he said something about a gun I would be looking at it.

If he is counting down about pulling it & killing you would be on him before he reached zero.

You said a deserted area...Well then it is deserted for him too.

Your not getting mobbed by bystanders.

It is easier to get yourself out of a police station than a morgue. If you are not willing to

do what you need to do you should not be putting yourself in those situations.

Be willing to fight for your life it is the only one

you have.

[ForrestGump]

(I accidentally posted this reply in the wrong thread, sorry for that)

It's been said many times but needs to be repeated: If you don't know very, very well how to defend yourself, meaning that you are very familiar with fighting, with being beaten, taking a serious hit or using weapons with high skill - then don't. Starting a fight or pulling out a weapon will most likely get you into a whole lot more trouble and put you in a very dangerous position. It takes a lot of skill to disarm or fight with an attacker, especially if that someone does not have much to lose and has been in numerous confrontations before. Risking your life is not worth your wallet, watch, bike or whatever. In the sad event that it happens, just give it to them, show no threat and be humble about it. We lose things all the time in life. Losing items and money to a robbery is nothing. Losing your life is everything. It is not right to let an attacker get away with it, but there is no shame in knowing your limits. I have been attacked many times and been in numerous fights in my life, trained martial arts and I do know how to defend myself. Still in the event of a robbery - especially here in Thailand - I would just give them what they want and not make a fuzz about it.

The only exception I would say, is in the event of a man sexually assaulting/attacking a woman. This is a different scenario where the attacker is mostly not that tough, mostly only confident because of his perceived upper hand as being a male. A very violent response with pepper spray or a weapon to such an attacker can be very successful, and many times also life saving as the attacker will otherwise only get more violent at the presence of only normal resistance. Remember that sexual assault/rape is not about sex for the attacker, it's an act of power and control. A very powerful, loud and violent response can therefore be very effective. However, if the attacker has a gun, I would not suggest this approach as a gun is easily discharged almost regardless of harm done to the attacker. These suggestions are from experience. I used to work as a prison guard many years ago, where I was in daily contact with many sexual predators.

[GungaDin]

(I accidentally posted this reply in the wrong thread, sorry for that)

It's been said many times but needs to be repeated: If you don't know very, very well how to defend yourself, meaning that you are very etc. etc

Good post, it made me rethink my situation.

[flying]

I always wonder what makes a victim assume all is well once they give up the goods?

[ForrestGump]

I always wonder what makes a victim assume all is well once they give up the goods?

Most robbers are primarily after the goods. Threats and violence are means to getting the goods and once they get it, getting away with it becomes the next priority. But of course you are also right - attackers that are primarily out to hurt you can ask for money or belongings to provoke a response that will (to them) justify an attack.

[flying]

I always wonder what makes a victim assume all is well once they give up the goods?

Most robbers are primarily after the goods. Threats and violence are means to getting the goods and once they get it, getting away with it becomes the next priority. But of course you are also right - attackers that are primarily out to hurt you can ask for money or belongings to provoke a response that will (to them) justify an attack.

Then there are those that are just going to take & take till you have nothing left including your life. I am not willing to bet against it.

I am willing to do what ever it takes...That is just me

[simon43]

As can be seen from the picture that was posted, that Leather Billy is definitely a faggoty thing...

For sure the manner in which you behave can have an effect on whether or not you are a likely mugging victim.

Acting like a wimp, looking furtively over your shoulder at every dark corner etc would seem (in my mind) to make you a likely target for attack.

And stomping down the street with bulging muscles shouting 'dare you to try mother f*ckers!!' could also lead to problems.

You need to take the middle ground. Walk/cycle with an air of confidence. Be alert, be aware of your surroundings. Look around you, look ahead.

If you are stopped or a threatening situation starts to arise, use your skills to defuse the situation. Talk confidently, make a joke, ask the potential attacker questions and keep moving all the time towards a safer area.

You do speak Thai don't you? If you are living here (not a tourist), then speaking the language, cracking a joke in Thai can really help to resolve a sitation.

Use your brain, not your brawn.

As an example, many know that I work as a volunteer police officer in Patong. I'm 5 feet 7 inches tall, 70kg. (I do have self-defence training).

On several occasions I have had to deal with aggressive tourists (Russians, Brits, Aussies etc) who are twice my size and half my age, looking for a fight. I know that the back-up support from the Thai police can be woefully inadequate. I have no desire to be kicked to a pulp by these guys!

So I have to use my brain to defuse the situation, not what little brawn I possess. By confident, calm but firm speech, and calm but alert body stance etc, I am able to defuse a potentially dangerous situation. I have never had to threaten to use any sort of defensive weapon, such as a pepper spray.

I think one of the best forms of defence can be calm and intelligent speech, in a language that the aggressor understands.

Simon

[GungaDin]

^^^ ^^^ 70 kgs !

Where do you go if there's a stiff breeze blowing?

[ClaytonSeymour]

As can be seen from the picture that was posted, that Leather Billy is definitely a faggoty thing...

For sure the manner in which you behave can have an effect on whether or not you are a likely mugging victim.

Acting like a wimp, looking furtively over your shoulder at every dark corner etc would seem (in my mind) to make you a likely target for attack.

And stomping down the street with bulging muscles shouting 'dare you to try mother f*ckers!!' could also lead to problems.

You need to take the middle ground. Walk/cycle with an air of confidence. Be alert, be aware of your surroundings. Look around you, look ahead.

If you are stopped or a threatening situation starts to arise, use your skills to defuse the situation. Talk confidently, make a joke, ask the potential attacker questions and keep moving all the time towards a safer area.

You do speak Thai don't you? If you are living here (not a tourist), then speaking the language, cracking a joke in Thai can really help to resolve a sitation.

Use your brain, not your brawn.

As an example, many know that I work as a volunteer police officer in Patong. I'm 5 feet 7 inches tall, 70kg. (I do have self-defence training).

On several occasions I have had to deal with aggressive tourists (Russians, Brits, Aussies etc) who are twice my size and half my age, looking for a fight. I know that the back-up support from the Thai police can be woefully inadequate. I have no desire to be kicked to a pulp by these guys!

So I have to use my brain to defuse the situation, not what little brawn I possess. By confident, calm but firm speech, and calm but alert body stance etc, I am able to defuse a potentially dangerous situation. I have never had to threaten to use any sort of defensive weapon, such as a pepper spray.

I think one of the best forms of defence can be calm and intelligent speech, in a language that the aggressor understands.

Simon

I'm sorry Simon but I'll have to disagree; defusing the situation with a drunken tourist & dealing with a criminal who's intent on stealing your belongings are a totally different thing.

I wouldn't, nor would I advise anyone to threaten with a pepper spray; if you feel the situation warrants it; use it whilst you still have the element of surprise. One of the very early lessons I learnt on fighting was to get your own punch in first; same applies with weapons; if you feel the situation warrants it then use it; waiting for your assailants reaction might be too late.

What surprises me here are the comments surrounding weapons training; I would have thought that many expats have a fair bit of time on their hands, so why not actually use it constructively & acquire some weapon training? Reasonable ability to protect yourself, your property & your loved ones ought to be a responsible choice; not an afterthought.

[simon43]

Hi Clayton, you and me seem to come from different camps. In all my 49 years I have never (ever) been the subject of a physical attack.. I have been in many different environments and encountered all manner of 'dubious' people who clearly had some ill-intent. I have always used my brain to safelt extract myself from the situation, primarily because I have no brawn :)

In the UK I legally owned rifles, shotguns and disguised weapons. In my volunteer work I am required to carry pepper spray and nightstick. I hopefully never have to use them, (but will use them as a last resort).

I stand by my comment that if you have brains, use them instead of your brawn.

Simon

PS - Gungadin, some 'farang' are naturally slim and handsome and weigh 70kg. It's a pity that I only meet that last criteria....

Edited February 9, 2009 by simon43

[HorseDoctor]

Is the pepper spray legal in Thailand? I would love to get hold of some of that (I frequently have a dog problem walking home at night, never had a people problem).

I The Phuket Gazette in Issues and Answers column has the police saying "...ANY weapons., pepper spray included are illegal. "

" Just trust the police " is the advice.

( This is not online or I would add the link ..)

You can use vinegar on dogs , it is humane as it will deter them but not blind them permanently , spray it at their nose