Getting Engaged

[BIG SPUDS]

Getting Engaged in Los in FEB. But will be getting married in england sometime this year (visa permmitting), so my GF can stay with me until i have cleared up my debts and have money to be able to live in thailand.

GF says for getting engaged i buy her a necklace and not a ring.

How much would i be expected to pay not to be looked on as cheap?

I dont have to worry about the dowry yet because we plan to get married again in thailand for her family in the next year or two. (pay the dowry, tradditional costume etc) Her family are fine with this and we will talk dowry when the time comes, but for getting married in the UK none is needed. So i want to know what am i expected to do in the way way of thai custom.

GF says she does not want a party, but when i go back to her family we will take a lot of food and drink for a little bit of a get together. is that it?

Any advice on thai customs?

[britmaveric]

Why would you pay a dowry? (granted custom has it- the family is supposed to give it back to you, but never the less don't personally see the need for it these days)

Necklace- depends on the weight - just hope its not 10BHT weight or you will be paying a nice tidy sum.

[daveh]

Getting Engaged in Los in FEB. But will be getting married in england sometime this year (visa permmitting), so my GF can stay with me until i have cleared up my debts and have money to be able to live in thailand.

GF says for getting engaged i buy her a necklace and not a ring.

How much would i be expected to pay not to be looked on as cheap?

I dont have to worry about the dowry yet because we plan to get married again in thailand for her family in the next year or two. (pay the dowry, tradditional costume etc) Her family are fine with this and we will talk dowry when the time comes, but for getting married in the UK none is needed. So i want to know what am i expected to do in the way way of thai custom.

GF says she does not want a party, but when i go back to her family we will take a lot of food and drink for a little bit of a get together. is that it?

Any advice on thai customs?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I had the mun (engagement) ceremony on July 15th. I gave her an engagement ring and no other gold, that was done at the wedding. It was kind of a rushed ceremony as I was heading to the airport that day.

Before the ceremony, I went to ask her mother for permission to marry her daughter. You would normally bring your mother to speak for you, but I brought my apartment manager to act as my voice. She's known me for a while and could speak for me. (There is a Thai phrase for the person that acts on your behalf when asking to marry a woman's daughter, but I've forgotten it). My fiancée's mother doesn't speak English, so this was a requirement.

At this meeting, we agreed on the dowry and the amount of gold at the wedding. Her mother didn't want me to buy an engagement ring and to have mun. But, I told her it was my custom to get engaged before marriage and I wanted to buy her a ring. So we agreed to do this on the day I was to leave Thailand.

Normally, as with everything Thai, they like to consult the monks to find the best day to have the ceremony, but in our case that really wasn't an option. I don't believe in all the superstition, so I really didn't care. In the morning of the 15th, my then girlfriend's family came to my apartment manager's apartment for the ceremony.

Before the ceremony, my girlfriend and I went to make an offering at the little budhist stand outside the apartment building. Then we all went to my manager's apartment and sat around to wait for 9:09am. A cloth was laid out on the floor with a little plate to hold the ring. Some words were spoken, and at 9:09am, I placed the ring on her finger. She waied me and it was done. But the man should not wai the girl back.

Months later, I returned for our budhist wedding ceremony. That was alot of fun, but too much went on for me to type it all here now.

[BIG SPUDS]

Cheers mate,

I too told my GF it was English custom for a ring but she said she wanted a necklace (thai custom or not?) up to her!!!! She has not said anything about a ceremony or anything like that, she said i buy the gold, and basically thats all she wants, no big party, or ceremony. She wants to have a few drinks and meal with her mates in pattaya, then when we go to her home same again but with all the family. She has told her parents we are getting engaged and they are really happy. She told her parents when we have a thai wedding we will sort out the dowry and with this they are fine too. I Think they all just want to meet me as i have had chance yet, last visit to thailand caught tonsilitis and did not go to far from hotel, we were supposed to fly back to her home then. I'll take them all out for a meal or something, GF reckons theres about 18 or so of them in total (aunties uncles cousins brothers sisters etc, ) should be fun. And apparently her mom and 98% of her village have never seen a Farang before.

I just wanted to know really is there a rough minimium acceptable amount i should spend on gold as to not look like "Cheap Charlie", GF is fine with it as she knows money saved on gold will give us more money for us together in the UK (when she finally gets here). But i dont want her family or friends to think less of me for not paying much for gold. Do you kind of get my drift?

[Khutan]

My advice - 1 Baht for your fiancee and 1/2 a baht for mum. thats 1.5 Baht @ 8000 a baht ( gold here is weighed in Baht = about 15grams of 96.5% gold) so about 12,000 - 15,000 Thai Baht or somewhere around 160- 180 Englosh Pounds.

Why the 1/2 baht for mum - just looks nice and its respectful.

Of course, I got away with buying mum a box of Chan beer. But, that was different.

[britmaveric]

My advice - 1 Baht for your fiancee and 1/2 a baht for mum. thats 1.5 Baht @ 8000 a baht ( gold here is weighed in Baht = about 15grams of 96.5% gold) so about 12,000 - 15,000 Thai Baht or somewhere around 160- 180 Englosh Pounds.

Why the 1/2 baht for mum - just looks nice and its respectful.

Of course, I got away with buying mum a box of Chan beer.  But, that was different.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well that might be a bit cheap- I'd go for at least 1THB for his mum and perhaps 3-4THB for his wife 2 be. Anything more and you'll be light on the pocket and they will look like Mr T.

Edited January 5, 2005 by britmaveric

[ray23]

Why would you pay a dowry? (granted custom has it- the family is supposed to give it back to you, but never the less don't personally see the need for it these days)

Necklace- depends on the weight - just hope its not 10BHT weight or you will be paying a nice tidy sum. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Has anyone ever gotten the dowery given back to them, thats one I haven't seen.

[ajarnski]

Why would you pay a dowry? (granted custom has it- the family is supposed to give it back to you, but never the less don't personally see the need for it these days)

Necklace- depends on the weight - just hope its not 10BHT weight or you will be paying a nice tidy sum. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Has anyone ever gotten the dowery given back to them, thats one I haven't seen.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I got all of the dowry back except 40,000 baht to pay for band, food, etc. No big deal to me. Cheap... for a large band with 12 very beautiful dancers and food for 300 people. Oh...for my wife, I gave her a new credit card (ouch!!).

Ski

[Nam Kao]

Big Spuds you better find out what the dowry is now and not "later"

You could be in for a shock

[Nam Kao]

>>>Why the 1/2 baht for mum - just looks nice and its respectful

Thats a good idea giving some gold to the Mum, She is the one that'll be calling

all the shots and controlling your wife throughout the marriage anyways.

And the first time Mum asks for $$ tell her to sell the gold you gave her.

Chok Dee

Nam

[Jai Dee]

I bought my fiance a diamond ring for our engagement last year and she is more than happy.

The wedding is planned for later this year, and to financially assist my teeruk's family, I have paid 1/3 of the dowry already to kick start renovation of the house (in Korat). Another 1/3 will be paid just before the wedding and the remaining 1/3 in cash on the wedding day.

All this has been discussed thoroughly with the family and all are happy with the arrangement.

Gold is also expected to be given... I'm thinking along the lines of a matching set... ear rings and necklace maybe.

But I like that suggestion of giving some gold to mum as well... big face for the family.

[chanchao]

Personally I would never have anything to do with dowry. And especially not when merely for show. And ESPECIALLY not if in gold rather than in sensible financial assistance for something important.

Also asking her mother was only an after-thought, as the main person having to consent to getting married would be your intended fiancee..

I got a diamond engagement ring, nothing overly big (or even remotely sizeable) but I guess the total cost would have been something like 15K baht. I'm not exactly sure as I already had the diamond; merely had it set into a nice golden ring for about 3000 baht if I recall correctly.

Cheers,

Chanchao

[RamdomChances]

The gold is usually given at the engagement party and is noy usually retuned!! (I did'nt have one, just the marrage), I've also seen rings exchanged at the engagement, but not often. I would say the average ammount of dowry( thai/thai) around here is 5 to 10 bht of gold and 100,000 in money, with the wifes family paying for the wedding (they also keep the money that comes back)

As for wether the money is usually returned in my experaince about 50-50, for most thai families gold is just like pretty money as you can borrow money off it or sell it if need be.

I did'nt pay any but we put money in for show, just to make the mother-in-law happy, but she did want a big wedding (over 1000 in the night) which I paid for, she even gave us the money donated at the wedding by guests as we had paid for the wedding, I think after the cash had come back I cost about 60,000 and as she gave us a house (ok it was a run down thai style house) and about 50 rai of land so I was happy.

Different areas have slightly different customs, and wether you pay or not is a whole different argument, basicaly talk to your fiance and do whatever you feel comfertable with.

Cheers RC

[sua yai]

Reckon I've got away quite lightly. Will probably get married this May/June. No engagement involved. The mother is a mai chee (Buddhist nun), so will perform the ceremony herself. Only people present will be her, the father, one sister and the two of us.

The mother insisted on a dowry, not for herself, but to be put in a bank account for my future wife should things collapse. She then has money to fall back on. We've settled on 50,000 Baht.

No big party and the family finally consented to our getting the marriage properly registered with the british embassy and Thai authorities when I pointed out that it would make life much easier for the future wife to visit the UK and for me to obtain a marriage visa and thus stay long term without visa hassles and take care of her.

[astral]

At our wedding I paid 100,000 in cash as a dowery, crisp new 500 baht notes.

My brother in law put it a bag and slung it over his shoulder as he left.

Later in the day I got the money back, as we had agreed.

It was part of the show, to show how much I value my wife!!

[tutsiwarrior]

I met my wife in a go go place in Patong. Once we were decided that we were both interested in staying together (after about 4 days) I made the statement of intent...6 months together in the UAE where I was working then take it from there if we were both still happy. I bought her a gold trinket (about 300 $US) to confirm my intentions.

Things worked out favorably (married in the Thai embassy in Abu Dhabi) but we were still in the UAE. In the mean time we bought a house in Suphanburi. I had not seen it until we came to stay for awhile while I was between jobs. The wife then put on a big party for the house blessing (about 300 guests and cost around 60k baht). She never did say anything about a local wedding or anything associated thereto.

So I presumed that the house blessing was intended to cover all the concerns. We never discussed a dowry...from the time that she came to stay with me in the UAE I gave her mother 20k baht per month. I guess that covered that issue.

It's been a great 5 years...

[daveh]

Big Spuds you better find out what the dowry is now and not "later" 

You could be in for a shock

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I agree. You should know what you are in for before you commit. It could turn ugly if the two of you have different ideas as to what is the correct amount for dowry.

[Ajarn]

I also agree. Best to get money matters settled upfront. Everyone can then move on without the stress of later dealing with it- and it's possible repercussions.

As for amounts, follow your heart. Don't do anything you don't want to do. If it feels good to you, go for it. Why should you care what some other farang thinks about how much you chose to pay?

If you feel very pressured by the family, pay attention to the clues

Edited January 6, 2005 by Ajarn

[peder.klockmann]

So far,

Before even marriage talk, I had allready purchased her a Neklace and, a Bracelet (Up-graded her current one). Then after marriage talk we went back, Up-graded the Necklace and the Bracelet and, purchased a ring.

Had her mom talk with the monks, they said January 25th would be the day. She told me that it would be 100,000 Baht for the ceremony and the dowry. Her mom would keep 30,000 of it. Being generous I asked her if her mom needed anything. She said no, but then later she told me her mom needs a Washing Machine (her husband is past away and takes care of my girls sister's daughter). Plus her TV is about 10 years old so I said I would get a new one for her too.

So, now its 70.000 for ceremony, 30.000 for mom, washing machine, tv, oh yeah almost forgot a DVD/Kareoke thing.

Then later she told me that she wanted to give her the Necklace I bought for her So, now the Necklace goes to mom as well and, she want's me to buy her a new one. Before I didn't quite understand why, but now after reading this tread I do. I guess it's customary to give the mom gold and purchase a necklace for the fiance. So, I'm ok with that.

Well needless to say I'm excited. I'm getting married in less then 3 weeks to the most wonderful woman (that compliments my personality to perfection) I have ever met.

[davethailand]

We had a christian wedding at a hotel in Pattaya, No gold (family etc), No dowry nothing just 2 wedding rings and a wedding party.

[britmaveric]

We had a christian wedding at a hotel in Pattaya, No gold (family etc), No dowry nothing just 2 wedding rings and a wedding party.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Dave- thats how it should be done. Always thought your wife was a star - once again its re-affirmed. Personally I don't mind paying for a reception or gold for the missus, but dowry is a waste of time. I already said as much to my gf- just in case she has any ideas. (better things to spend dosh on like a home)

[davethailand]

We had a christian wedding at a hotel in Pattaya, No gold (family etc), No dowry nothing just 2 wedding rings and a wedding party.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Dave- thats how it should be done. Always thought your wife was a star - once again its re-affirmed. Personally I don't mind paying for a reception or gold for the missus, but dowry is a waste of time. I already said as much to my gf- just in case she has any ideas. (better things to spend dosh on like a home)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I forgot to add- 150 wedding guests ***bht per head (Marriott Royal Garden). Was'nt cheap but worth every penny.

(Some special guests also )

[ray23]

Why would you pay a dowry? (granted custom has it- the family is supposed to give it back to you, but never the less don't personally see the need for it these days)

Necklace- depends on the weight - just hope its not 10BHT weight or you will be paying a nice tidy sum. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Has anyone ever gotten the dowery given back to them, thats one I haven't seen.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I got all of the dowry back except 40,000 baht to pay for band, food, etc. No big deal to me. Cheap... for a large band with 12 very beautiful dancers and food for 300 people. Oh...for my wife, I gave her a new credit card (ouch!!).

Ski

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That is encouraging as well as the stories that follow maybe here in Issan people haven't much money and you don't hear much of the dowery coming back, or the family helping the newly weds at all. Just the opposite in fact as a norm you definetely become the big ATM in the sky. My circumstances were much different in that my wife's parents were deceased, but still yet family uncles and one brother, wanted the ARM I just said no. For one reason they had nothing to help her, poor kid had pair of clothes to her name when she came to me. Maybe if they had tried to help her instead of taking what little money she had. i would have probably helped them within reason.

[southern1]

Why would you pay a dowry? (granted custom has it- the family is supposed to give it back to you, but never the less don't personally see the need for it these days)

Necklace- depends on the weight - just hope its not 10BHT weight or you will be paying a nice tidy sum. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Has anyone ever gotten the dowery given back to them, thats one I haven't seen.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yes,I gave the dowry in the morning of our Thai wedding ceremony,a considerable amount of cash,returned to me in the afternoon plus envelops with cash and cheques(all good)

[RDN]

Member "enforcer" has been deleted, as has his last post and all those posts that referred to it.

[Khutan]

At our wedding I paid 100,000 in cash as a dowery, crisp new 500 baht notes.

My brother in law put it a bag and slung it over his shoulder as he left.

Later in the day I got the money back, as we had agreed.

It was part of the show, to show how much I value my wife!!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I must agree astral;

Its all a show, at the end of the day isn't a western wedding also??

Forgetting a few unforseen expenses it all came back. I am talking about 1-2 thousand baht. We put it all into a block of land (soon to be advertised here) and a rice farm.

I had the "Must live in pocket for 3 days", there was nothing else unexpected.

The big one is expectations. Set your expectations correctly. Try to manage as many people's expectations as possible. Then when everything is finished, no-one will be upset.

Also, and I have done this, give mum 1/2 a baht when you want to marry, it shows good intentions, then you can negotiate the big "Sin Sod". When people know you have honest intentions (jai jing), things are alot easier. Even in the most impovrished areas, honesty and good intentions go a long way.

Other than that, try to keep the ceremony as shory as possible. You won't undetsrand it and possibly your bride wont. A wedding ceromony is an Icon, the work starts the next day......

Good Luck, and I wish you a good fun life together.

[jkwn]

Good luck with everything. Remember to westerners some don't like the idea of the dowry but because it's custom and i've also seen that the younger the bride the more you have to pay, it becomes important to them. And as for getting money back, in the cases i've seen you don't get it back well except for the money that gets put in the 'tin can' as a blessing.

Also you'll end up with two wrists full of the special string 'faiy' that everyone ties on your wrists, which is nice.

Best of luck

[Jai Dee]

Also, and I have done this, give mum 1/2 a baht when you want to marry, it shows good intentions, then you can negotiate the big "Sin Sod". When people know you have honest intentions (jai jing), things are alot easier. Even in the most impovrished areas, honesty and good intentions go a long way.

Agree mattnich.

Honesty and your continuing demonstration of your integrity is an important thing to the future family and their friends.

I have been discussing the dowry and the cost of the wedding etc. with my teeruk now for a while, and although I am in a slightly different situation, both my future "in-laws" and I are more than happy with the situation.

I will not be getting the dowry back. I do not want the dowry back. It is being used to build a new house for the family... one that replaces the termite infested wooden shack that they used to live in. And... it's going to have a falung toilet in it! (just for me!)

They are simple, honest, and hard-working people... and I respect them.

I'm happy for them. I can afford it. I found the girl of my dreams, and I feel privileged to be a part of such a wonderful family.