Dustoff Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 The animal refuge who gave the OP the dog in the first place should be shut down or at least made to change its systems for failing to qualify her as a suitable person to have an animal as a pet. And it and the OP should be charged with animal cruelty. How ridiculous. Agreed. Way, WAY over the top! Having trained dogs for many years in the past, I can safely say that it takes constant attention and admonishments/rewards for behavior that are as important as for human children. If you have to lock your dog or child up in your yard, perhaps you should not be a dog or child owner. In order to effectively teach responsibility, we have to first have it within ourselves. We rescued our Thai street dog as a pup that had been seriously injured by being run over by a pickup truck that permanently damaged his right rear leg (his name is Donkey but I call him Hopalong). It is still an ongoing process of course, as with any child, but he is a very valued member of our Moo Ban and the neighbors absolutely love him. While he still grumbles a bit at noisy pickups, he has full freedom in our street and has far more human and canine friends than I. In life, we serve best by example... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patklang Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 The animal refuge who gave the OP the dog in the first place should be shut down or at least made to change its systems for failing to qualify her as a suitable person to have an animal as a pet. And it and the OP should be charged with animal cruelty. How ridiculous. Agreed. Way, WAY over the top! Having trained dogs for many years in the past, I can safely say that it takes constant attention and admonishments/rewards for behavior that are as important as for human children. If you have to lock your dog or child up in your yard, perhaps you should not be a dog or child owner. In order to effectively teach responsibility, we have to first have it within ourselves. We rescued our Thai street dog as a pup that had been seriously injured by being run over by a pickup truck that permanently damaged his right rear leg (his name is Donkey but I call him Hopalong). It is still an ongoing process of course, as with any child, but he is a very valued member of our Moo Ban and the neighbors absolutely love him. While he still grumbles a bit at noisy pickups, he has full freedom in our street and has far more human and canine friends than I. In life, we serve best by example... so where does the dog crap and piss,and do neighbors like the smell of dog shit.The flies around the dog crap are nice too and the disease this can give to children. you must be a good dog trainer to make this dog shit on the toilet and not in the street. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drummachine Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 In Sakon they tend to have less respect for dogs and this is not the old black dog delicious story. Kicking and beating are a regular occurence. Dogs go missing and are just ignored on a daily basis. To stop this there is but one solution, BIG WALL with GATES! Dog alcatraz... Goodluck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patklang Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 I t amazes me sometimes that dog owners have the bare faced cheek to allow/or train their dog to shit away from their own property,and close to somebody else then stands back in amazement when one complains.If you must let the dogs out for a crap,follow them and CLEAN up after the mutt or dont have a dog,dead simple Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nienke Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 (edited) Having trained dogs for many years in the past, I can safely say that it takes constant attention and admonishments/rewards for behavior that are as important as for human children.If you have to lock your dog or child up in your yard, perhaps you should not be a dog or child owner. In order to effectively teach responsibility, we have to first have it within ourselves. We rescued our Thai street dog as a pup that had been seriously injured by being run over by a pickup truck that permanently damaged his right rear leg (his name is Donkey but I call him Hopalong). It is still an ongoing process of course, as with any child, but he is a very valued member of our Moo Ban and the neighbors absolutely love him. While he still grumbles a bit at noisy pickups, he has full freedom in our street and has far more human and canine friends than I. In life, we serve best by example... Maybe in your (part of the) mooban people don't mind so much the free roaming dogs. In other moobans maybe people do not appreciate it when other people's dogs walk free. Besides the fact that dogs soil and people can by accident step in it, for children it is less safe to play outside when a dog or dogs they do not know walk free. It is also that in that part of your mooban there is not much traffic. Having a dog roam free where there is traffic it is not only dangerous to the dog but also for the ones who ride bikes and cars. Even the best trained dogs should NEVER be let loose in the vicinity of traffic, even when the owner is right there to supervise. That's totally irresponsible. I do agree though, that it is better for the mental (and often also the physical) well-being of the dog whne they are able to walk free. However, if this means they there is a high risk of being killed, or worse, become disabled due to road accidents or being kicked or poisoned, then I think it is better to keep them confined and put time and effort in taking them for walks to satisfy their physical and mental needs. <quote>If you have to lock your dog or child up in your yard, perhaps you should not be a dog or child owner.<unquote> In other words, parents and dog owners should allow their child or dog outside at any time of day no matter where they live? Or, if they can't do so, but have to confine their child or dog to the garden or house/appartment for their own safety, they should not have children or dogs? It would help solve the world over-population of people and dogs, wouldn't it? Nienke Edited February 20, 2009 by Nienke Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rixalex Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 I t amazes me sometimes that dog owners have the bare faced cheek to allow/or train their dog to shit away from their own property,and close to somebody else then stands back in amazement when one complains.If you must let the dogs out for a crap,follow them and CLEAN up after the mutt or dont have a dog,dead simple I'm a dog owner and 100% agree with this. I might add too that cat owners should take responsibility for their pet's mess cos it really stinks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tijnebijn Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 Common this is Thailand , every dog shits wherever they want , nobody cares why should you ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dustoff Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 Having trained dogs for many years in the past, I can safely say that it takes constant attention and admonishments/rewards for behavior that are as important as for human children.If you have to lock your dog or child up in your yard, perhaps you should not be a dog or child owner. In order to effectively teach responsibility, we have to first have it within ourselves. We rescued our Thai street dog as a pup that had been seriously injured by being run over by a pickup truck that permanently damaged his right rear leg (his name is Donkey but I call him Hopalong). It is still an ongoing process of course, as with any child, but he is a very valued member of our Moo Ban and the neighbors absolutely love him. While he still grumbles a bit at noisy pickups, he has full freedom in our street and has far more human and canine friends than I. In life, we serve best by example... Maybe in your (part of the) mooban people don't mind so much the free roaming dogs. In other moobans maybe people do not appreciate it when other people's dogs walk free. Besides the fact that dogs soil and people can by accident step in it, for children it is less safe to play outside when a dog or dogs they do not know walk free. It is also that in that part of your mooban there is not much traffic. Having a dog roam free where there is traffic it is not only dangerous to the dog but also for the ones who ride bikes and cars. Even the best trained dogs should NEVER be let loose in the vicinity of traffic, even when the owner is right there to supervise. That's totally irresponsible. I do agree though, that it is better for the mental (and often also the physical) well-being of the dog whne they are able to walk free. However, if this means they there is a high risk of being killed, or worse, become disabled due to road accidents or being kicked or poisoned, then I think it is better to keep them confined and put time and effort in taking them for walks to satisfy their physical and mental needs. <quote>If you have to lock your dog or child up in your yard, perhaps you should not be a dog or child owner.<unquote> In other words, parents and dog owners should allow their child or dog outside at any time of day no matter where they live? Or, if they can't do so, but have to confine their child or dog to the garden or house/appartment for their own safety, they should not have children or dogs? It would help solve the world over-population of people and dogs, wouldn't it? Nienke My goodness, such friendly responses! You are absolutely right Nienke, as you always insist on being, in that there are many things I did not take into consideration. For one, that most people such as yourself have little to no concept of a fully-trained dog nor have the time nor desire to learn the necessary techniques and pass them on to their beloved pets. My mooban is quiet most of the time and during the work/school traffic my Donkey hangs out off-road just outside of our gate and watches it all go by. As for his waste products, he deposits them in a specified back corner of our yard religiously and we deposit it into our septic tank daily. As for 'free-roaming', most of the time when he leaves our immediate area it is when neighbors invite him over for a visit. And to bring him back to me immediately, locked by my side, only takes a little whistle or mention of his name. He is also trained in hand commands and, if I am in his sight, I don't even have to speak to him. He has been trained not to bark except for a warning woof if someone actually approaches our yard/gate and he is forbidden to harrass people in any way whatsoever nor enter their property without their permission. This he obeys whether we are there to supervise him or not. While you and others may not have much confidence in the profound intelligence and learning capacity of dogs, I do. And we, my Hopalong and I, practice it every day... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hagler Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 The animal refuge who gave the OP the dog in the first place should be shut down or at least made to change its systems for failing to qualify her as a suitable person to have an animal as a pet. And it and the OP should be charged with animal cruelty. How ridiculous. I dont think so or I wouldnt have said it. I would gladly fund legal action against the refuge if it meant that they that they needed to put systems in place to prevent animals being given to people who are unwilling or unable to look after the animals they are given properly. Obviously in this sad case of animal neglect and abuse proper vetting of the applicant wasnt done. Both the OP and the refuge are just aiding and abetting the continuation of the abuse of the poor animal. Disgusting behaviour by both of the parties and they both should both hang their heads in shame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slip Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 ^^ Hagler, hang on a minute, whilst you may be right that the OP has not immediately set up a perfect environment, she certainly seems to want to remedy that situation. I think you're being a bit harsh on her. However, I can't disagree that the refuge has not vetted OR supported this new owner nearly well enough. Surely any refuge should be asking potential adopters if they have the basic environment to keep a dog? I feel from the OP's posts that she is going to do whatever is necessary to make a safe environment for her dog, so maybe we should cut her some slack? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bunta71 Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 (edited) NOBODY kicks MY dog... Where was the photo in the background behind the Alaskan Malemute? Looks close to home for a couple of us here.Knik River perhaps? Edited February 20, 2009 by bunta71 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blinky Bill Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 NOBODY kicks MY dog... Where was the photo in the background behind the Alaskan Malemute? Looks close to home for a couple of us here.Knik River perhaps? Didn't know you had real man-eaters up there. Looks like a salty to me, plenty of them around northern Australia, eat a couple of tourists every year. I thought the US of A only had those harmless alligators plus a few nasty bears. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bunta71 Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 Having trained dogs for many years in the past, I can safely say that it takes constant attention and admonishments/rewards for behavior that are as important as for human children. In life, we serve best by example... Like showing Donkey and guests where to pee... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bunta71 Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 NOBODY kicks MY dog... Where was the photo in the background behind the Alaskan Malemute? Looks close to home for a couple of us here.Knik River perhaps? Didn't know you had real man-eaters up there. Looks like a salty to me, plenty of them around northern Australia, eat a couple of tourists every year. I thought the US of A only had those harmless alligators plus a few nasty bears. Someone said it's a global house warming thing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patklang Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 some of the posts are not nasty or cruel they are basic common sense.Just because most thais allow the dogs to crap anywhere,does that mean everybody should the same.why dont you put your baby in the front basket of a motorbike then or copy everything the thais do. Owning a dog is a huge reponsibilty and until thais and farangs realise this we will have crap and pee all over the streets,which IS illegal.Cats always crap in their own cat litter and generaly much cleaner than dogs.they can be a pest where fishbowels/tanks are concerned and the person has every right to throw/kick/scare the cat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blinky Bill Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 To the OP.......Krupnik, after more than 3 days what have you done to keep your mutt out of other peoples property and business? You have received loads of advice, some good and some otherwise, so what was your solution? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patklang Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 Blinky I will be surprised if she actualy admitted she is in the wrong as most dog owners who allow their animals to give neighbors a nightmare life do not care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bunta71 Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 As the silence builds to a creshendo and I eagerly await on the edge of my seat..... how do you spell creshendo? got through spell check but don't look natural Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patklang Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 I have a thai neighbor who allows her 6 little barking, shitting muts to use the soi as a dumping ground for their shit.I asked her to talk to her little doggies and stop them shitting by my gate and she said they are little dogs and only shit litle ones. Now you think she is a sensible person or not.A catapult and water hose have nearly stopped them but its me who are training her dogs not to shit by my property.If it doesnt stop then its going to be hot water with floor cleaner in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patklang Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 CRESCENDO i think Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krupnik Posted February 20, 2009 Author Share Posted February 20, 2009 hagler is downright stupid and has no right to say that I neglect my dog when you know so little about our relationship. As for the solution, I haven't found one yet. While I am at work she has been staying inside the house, and when I get back she stays with me or comes with me when I go out somewhere. I have been allowing her out on my Soi when she wants to go, without a leash, but have myself gone with and kept by her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krupnik Posted February 20, 2009 Author Share Posted February 20, 2009 Admit I am wrong?! Grow up please. I had a very happy dog for the duration of her long life in my home country, who was also rescued - which is probably why the refuge trusted me, also they came to check out and visit my house, they are an excellent organisation how dare you say otherwise. I know how to look after a dog but things are very different here and I have not had her for that long I'm trying to adjust which is why I came here for advice and experiences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drew Aitch Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 hagler is downright stupid and has no right to say that I neglect my dog when you know so little about our relationship. As for the solution, I haven't found one yet. While I am at work she has been staying inside the house, and when I get back she stays with me or comes with me when I go out somewhere. I have been allowing her out on my Soi when she wants to go, without a leash, but have myself gone with and kept by her. Don't worry about or respond to anything Hagler says Krupnik If you trace some of his posts, he doesn't have much good to say about anyone on any subject. He's obviously a lonely character who gets his latent kicks out of stirring up forum threads. Best ignored i guess! In fact, you might call him a virtual nobody Hagler Personal Profile * Age Unknown * Gender Not Set * Location Unknown * Birthday Unknown * Interests: No Information * Contact Information: No Information Says it all really. Aitch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dustoff Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 hagler is downright stupid and has no right to say that I neglect my dog when you know so little about our relationship. As for the solution, I haven't found one yet. While I am at work she has been staying inside the house, and when I get back she stays with me or comes with me when I go out somewhere. I have been allowing her out on my Soi when she wants to go, without a leash, but have myself gone with and kept by her. If you have not been on the internet all that long, be advised that you will find that there are many, many out there who lurk about, poised like vultures to grab any opportunity to vent their hostilities. Try not to take it personally or engage since it simply encourages them. Like anyone else on here, I have no idea what your living circumstances are. If others around you have gardens, then you are likely not on a 'concrete and asphalt' soi in the middle of the city. The best guage of how your dog is doing is to get to know your neighbors and see how they respond to your dog when you wander by and say hello. Don't be disappointed - most on TV are helpful but there will always be those who are most happy to help drag a thread down into the pits. Good luck with your dog. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hagler Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 (edited) hagler is downright stupid and has no right to say that I neglect my dog when you know so little about our relationship. As for the solution, I haven't found one yet. While I am at work she has been staying inside the house, and when I get back she stays with me or comes with me when I go out somewhere. I have been allowing her out on my Soi when she wants to go, without a leash, but have myself gone with and kept by her. Don't worry about or respond to anything Hagler says Krupnik If you trace some of his posts, he doesn't have much good to say about anyone on any subject. He's obviously a lonely character who gets his latent kicks out of stirring up forum threads. Best ignored i guess! In fact, you might call him a virtual nobody Hagler Personal Profile * Age Unknown * Gender Not Set * Location Unknown * Birthday Unknown * Interests: No Information * Contact Information: No Information Says it all really. Aitch Thank you Sir for your concise assessment of my position in life. I couldnt have summed it up more perfectly. OP and animal refuge should still be charged with neglect. Poor animal is still sufffering and I hate to see defenceless creatures being tormented. Edited February 20, 2009 by hagler Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rixalex Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 Cats always crap in their own cat litter and generaly much cleaner than dogs. Aha - so you're a cat lover? I guess that because this is the sort of stuff i hear them say. Cats only crap in their own cat litter? Really??? Well could you come round my way and tell all the cats that make a habit of coming into my garden, digging up the soil (killing plants in the process) and leaving the most smelly mess you could imagine, about this rule! Cat owners, whilst often quick to complain about unresponsible dog owners, seem to think that they bear no responsibility for what their pets do - just because they happen to be cats. Whilst i appreciate it might be hard to control the movements of a cat, that shouldn't be my problem - they are the ones who decided to get the darn thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geriatrickid Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 Sorry but I spent too much time in trauma operating rooms to believe that a vet can tell the difference between a kick injury and one caused by being run over by a motorbike which is a VERY common occurance over here. Disagrew with you there. Are you talking about a human ER? Dogs have different anatomies to humans and are indeed susceptible to blunt force injury. Vital organs are laid out differently. The subject described is a small dog. Have a look at your foot and consider the area involved in an impact on an animal about the size of your thigh. How many humans did you see that had an object of that ratio targeted to the vital organs? Anyway, if the OP lovers her critter, she will keep it in a safe enclosed space (with water). To do otherwise will result in a shortened lifespan and painful injuries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blinky Bill Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 Sorry but I spent too much time in trauma operating rooms to believe that a vet can tell the difference between a kick injury and one caused by being run over by a motorbike which is a VERY common occurance over here. Disagrew with you there. Are you talking about a human ER? Dogs have different anatomies to humans and are indeed susceptible to blunt force injury. Vital organs are laid out differently. The subject described is a small dog. Have a look at your foot and consider the area involved in an impact on an animal about the size of your thigh. How many humans did you see that had an object of that ratio targeted to the vital organs? Anyway, if the OP lovers her critter, she will keep it in a safe enclosed space (with water). To do otherwise will result in a shortened lifespan and painful injuries. Sadly, when I was lot younger, many years ago, as a cop I saw injuries to human babies from mothers and fathers that would be of a similar ratio to what you are talking about. Some were fatal. And this has nothing to do with the fact the Krupnik is an irresponsible dog owner by allowing her animal roam the streets. She asked for answers, got them but has done nothing to solve her problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patklang Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 Cats always crap in their own cat litter and generaly much cleaner than dogs. Aha - so you're a cat lover? I guess that because this is the sort of stuff i hear them say. Cats only crap in their own cat litter? Really??? Well could you come round my way and tell all the cats that make a habit of coming into my garden, digging up the soil (killing plants in the process) and leaving the most smelly mess you could imagine, about this rule! Cat owners, whilst often quick to complain about unresponsible dog owners, seem to think that they bear no responsibility for what their pets do - just because they happen to be cats. Whilst i appreciate it might be hard to control the movements of a cat, that shouldn't be my problem - they are the ones who decided to get the darn thing. Your post has no value as i am not a cat lover,so try again clever clogs.You missed the other part of the post,when i said they deserve a kick.You sound like a politican,stretching the truth to suit you. YOUR CREDIBILITY DOWN THE SPOUT FOR SURE,SO COME BACK WHEN YOU HAVE SOMETHING POSITIVE TO SAY. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gpdjohn Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 the other solution is to spend some quality time with your dog. have some beer and smoke a few joints together. it would really allow your dog to bond more closely with the you. he/she would never feel like leaving the house ever... i seriously did know someone who fed his dog some beer quite oftenly. the dog was so positively reinforced with the sound of glass from the bottles. apologise if this is yeah, but everytime he rolls one, his nails poke through the paper thus leaving the doober vented and not a good draw of smoke. Bought him a bong, but he can't break a bud apart to put it in the bowl.. Rasta dog...gots a schizzhel..go snoop! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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