Prime Minister Worries About Thailand Image

[justanothercybertosser]

I see the red shirts "love Chiang Mai 51" group have now stopped a gay parade because it would damage the reputation of the city. Wonder when we get the comparisons with facists for these self appointed protectors of the city.

Hardly the open minded socialists we have heard of. Not content with attacking demonstrating corn farmers they now show their homophobic colours.

I am sure that we can all agree on condemning this group and calling for action against them.

Yes, for my part we can agree on this.

The least they need is a PR person that explains them that attacking a gay pride parade has nothing whatsoever to do with the political struggle of the majority Red Shirts in the rest of the country, and not only demeans them in the eyes of the public, but also the other Red Shirts which have begun several months ago to repair their damaged image, still go through pains transforming themselves into a wider democracy movement.

Important to understand though is that the individual groups under the Red Shirt umbrella are almost completely autonomous. That diversity is partly a strength - groups of diverse ideological backgrounds can stay under one umbrella - and a weakness, as we can see with the numerous distasteful incidents that especially the Chiangmai Lovers 51 have been associated with.

[Pierrot]

What goes around comes around. The only people who are justified to protest against today's red shirt movement are the people who stand against the PAD last year. All others, especially those who supported the criminal activities of the yellow shirts, have lost all credibility.

And it's so funny to see those PAD supporters recycling our posts from last year, they really have no shame !

recycling your posts?

Nah, most people on here understand the basics of parliamentary democracies enough never to recycle your posts PierRot

Before going into the details of parliamentary democracy, I suggest you try to understand democracy first .

[john b good]

He should be worried (about Thailand's image)

When you have a bunch of wank*rs thinking that they are gonna revive the tourist industry with some cocktail concoction he better believe it (and have good cause to worry) he has gotta understand that Thailand is the laughing stock of the entire world

[PeaceBlondie]

seems some of you just want free speech for the gays, surely the people who turned up to protest against the gay march have the same freedoms and rights to express their opinion.

Why do people feel the need for gay marches anyway, I don't recall ever going on a straight march or shouting about my straightness. I don't care if someone is straight or gay, I don't see how it affects me either way, so why march? is it to raise awareness? is it to get new recruits? is it a celebration?

it puzzles me,

redcourse, I was not there when the violent northern Thai thugs associated with the red shirted Thai murderers of Chiang Mai threatened to end the gay pride parade by hurting Thais and farang. However, my friends were there, and it was far more than a debate over free speech.

Straights can parade day in and day out. They do parade, with their women, and with their manly macho strides, every day. Human history has been marching hard, straight, and macho since the fall of the Roman empire. However, in a few places like Thailand, gay pride parades almost seemed unnecessary...until the violent THAI killers shut down the rights to a simple, decent, Thai parade in Chiang Mai, last Saturday night..

Actually, I have never been to a gay pride parade, either. I wish I had gone Saturday. It was partly to raise awareness of AIDS/HIV prevention, which the sponsoring Thai agency is involved with as an NGO. I don't think they were trying to get recruits, but it was supposed to be a Thai celebration of Thai diversity.

[jdinasia]

He should be worried (about Thailand's image)

When you have a bunch of wank*rs thinking that they are gonna revive the tourist industry with some cocktail concoction he better believe it (and have good cause to worry) he has gotta understand that Thailand is the laughing stock of the entire world

Who is laughing at Thailand? Can you give us examples, or is this just your bias showing?

[john b good]

He should be worried (about Thailand's image)

When you have a bunch of wank*rs thinking that they are gonna revive the tourist industry with some cocktail concoction he better believe it (and he has good cause to worry) he has gotta understand that Thailand is the laughing stock of the entire world

Edited February 23, 2009 by john b good

[Eagle60]

So he should be. What with killings, airport closures, bad treatment of refugees......there is a lot to be worried about. Hope he can sort it out but I doubt it. With world recessions comes massive social problems too. crime, discontentment and civil unrest. Not just Thailand either....look forward to a happy 2009

[Ricardo]

When you have a bunch of wank*rs thinking that they are gonna revive the tourist industry with some cocktail concoction he better believe it (and have good cause to worry) he has gotta understand that Thailand is the laughing stock of the entire world

Perhaps he might drown his sorrows, and support the new cocktail, at the same time ?

I have to agree that this latest idea is amusing, on a par with the idea last year, to sell souvenir lucky-pen*s charms to tourists. Perhaps we need a thread on TV, to suggest alternative ideas, to promote tourism or the country ?

[ballpoint]

What goes around comes around. The only people who are justified to protest against today's red shirt movement are the people who stand against the PAD last year. All others, especially those who supported the criminal activities of the yellow shirts, have lost all credibility.

And it's so funny to see those PAD supporters recycling our posts from last year, they really have no shame !

recycling your posts?

Nah, most people on here understand the basics of parliamentary democracies enough never to recycle your posts PierRot

Before going into the details of parliamentary democracy, I suggest you try to understand democracy first .

Could you please enlighten us with your understanding of democracy?

[TAWP]

Dems got into power legitimately by coersing former govt parties to switch sides.

Beyond that I don't see how TRT election wins, or price of fish are related to this thread. Five years ago Thaksin was a an ambitious, risging star. Now he is a convicted criminal whose backroom dealings have been exposed for everyone to see.

Shit like that happens all the time here, he's not the first one, Asean members are not striving for his return.

The best remark that sums up their attitude came from Bush, of all people. I can easily visualise his chuckle - "He got caught, heh?"

No one here is calling for Thaksin to return. You should seek medical help for your paranoia.

Bold to point out the lie.

There are several users on this forum that openly declare they wish him to return to become PM.

[TAWP]

I can understand the reds are so dangerous since they attacked politicians by eggs. The yellows only killed some people and sat at airports.

Please tell us this isn't your understanding of the reality... but then again, listening to taxi-radio stations all day will surely blurr the whole truth/fiction line...

Edited February 23, 2009 by TAWP

[Pierrot]

What goes around comes around. The only people who are justified to protest against today's red shirt movement are the people who stand against the PAD last year. All others, especially those who supported the criminal activities of the yellow shirts, have lost all credibility.

And it's so funny to see those PAD supporters recycling our posts from last year, they really have no shame !

recycling your posts?

Nah, most people on here understand the basics of parliamentary democracies enough never to recycle your posts PierRot

Before going into the details of parliamentary democracy, I suggest you try to understand democracy first .

Could you please enlighten us with your understanding of democracy?

You're the specialist, and you will explain us the following from Xinhua :

"Chinese Defense Minister Liang Guanglie met visiting Thai Army Commander-in-Chief Anupong Paochinda, and vowed to further promote bilateral military ties Monday. Liang, also a state councilor, spoke highly of Thailand's support for China on the Taiwan and Tibet issues as well as the Beijing Olympic Games"

And from the Bangkok Post :

"Thai Finance Minister Korn Chatikavanij yesterday also held private meetings with his Chinese counterpart, Finance Minister Xuren Xie. Thailand hopes that China will also participate in the government's plan to invest 1.9 trillion baht in new infrastructure over the next four years."

Democracy at its best !

[Pierrot]

The problem is, after pissing off western democracies, Abhi doesn't have many friends left. I believe he already contacted Burma for advises. Thailand next guest of honor will probably be Kim il Jong

[jdinasia]

The problem is, after pissing off western democracies, Abhi doesn't have many friends left. I believe he already contacted Burma for advises. Thailand next guest of honor will probably be Kim il Jong

Pardon me?

Which "western democracies" has Abhisit "pissed off"?

For that matter what issues do you see about that silliness you posted about the Chinese? You don't think the government of Thailand should talk to the government of China?

Edited February 23, 2009 by jdinasia

[ballpoint]

What goes around comes around. The only people who are justified to protest against today's red shirt movement are the people who stand against the PAD last year. All others, especially those who supported the criminal activities of the yellow shirts, have lost all credibility.

And it's so funny to see those PAD supporters recycling our posts from last year, they really have no shame !

recycling your posts?

Nah, most people on here understand the basics of parliamentary democracies enough never to recycle your posts PierRot

Before going into the details of parliamentary democracy, I suggest you try to understand democracy first .

Could you please enlighten us with your understanding of democracy?

You're the specialist, and you will explain us the following from Xinhua :

"Chinese Defense Minister Liang Guanglie met visiting Thai Army Commander-in-Chief Anupong Paochinda, and vowed to further promote bilateral military ties Monday. Liang, also a state councilor, spoke highly of Thailand's support for China on the Taiwan and Tibet issues as well as the Beijing Olympic Games"

And from the Bangkok Post :

"Thai Finance Minister Korn Chatikavanij yesterday also held private meetings with his Chinese counterpart, Finance Minister Xuren Xie. Thailand hopes that China will also participate in the government's plan to invest 1.9 trillion baht in new infrastructure over the next four years."

Democracy at its best !

I never claimed to be a specialist, I was just interested in your understanding of what democracy is all about? We see so many posts here claiming to support it, but nobady ever seems to say what it means to them.

I also never saw the "democratic west" boycotting the Chinese Olympics. Neither did the hero of Thai democracy, Thaksin. In fact, he used the games as his excuse to flee the country.

[TAWP]

And Tibetans are better off under the Chinese than under the religious extremists...but that is just me.

[ballpoint]

And Tibetans are better off under the Chinese than under the religious extremists...but that is just me.

I'd disagree with that, but that's not the issue here. Peirrot's post was slagging off the Thai government for talking to the Chinese. The bit about Thailand supporting China's stance on Tibet and Taiwan was interesting. Seeing as this government has been in power for 2 months now I doubt if it has publicly made any policy on the issue, and any support was the policy of the previous government. Such a message sounds to me like the typical Chinese talk of "Thailand has supported us in the past, and we expect this to continue, if you know what's good for you and you want that investment."

[justanothercybertosser]

The problem is, after pissing off western democracies, Abhi doesn't have many friends left. I believe he already contacted Burma for advises. Thailand next guest of honor will probably be Kim il Jong

He hasn't yet pissed off western democracies. He has been running around telling everyone how great he is, and that he stands for the law and justice. The more than formidable international lobbying skills of the Democrat Party (don't forget - for some strange reason this very conservative party is part of the international liberals) have taken care that most western democracies are somewhat impressed by a Thai Prime Minister that has excellent English speaking skills.

Western Democracies right now have a somewhat positive wait and see attitude.

What Western Democracies will learn sooner or later is that what Abhisit says is most of the time the exact opposite of what he does. And what he does is not going to bring either national reconciliation nor the rule of law that western democracies recognize. Which in turn will bring further turmoil to Thailand. That will threaten the very large investments of western democracies in Thailand. And that is a point that will piss Western Democracies off.

Most Western Democracies are, when it comes down to their involvement in Thailand, not much better than a sex tourist that sends some money to his sweetheart from the bar, and then finds out that she spends it on sex and drugs with her Thai lover instead of what the western hubby wants her to spend it on, but doesn't really care about the reasons why the little one ended up in the bar in the first place.

[samgrowth]

And Tibetans are better off under the Chinese than under the religious extremists...but that is just me.

I'd disagree with that, but that's not the issue here. Peirrot's post was slagging off the Thai government for talking to the Chinese. The bit about Thailand supporting China's stance on Tibet and Taiwan was interesting. Seeing as this government has been in power for 2 months now I doubt if it has publicly made any policy on the issue, and any support was the policy of the previous government. Such a message sounds to me like the typical Chinese talk of "Thailand has supported us in the past, and we expect this to continue, if you know what's good for you and you want that investment."

The is no Taiwan embassy in Thailand or vice versa.

[spirit47]

Democracy is an illusion, where the money, there is the might to manipulate most of the people. How you think Thaksim get his millions from? Buying votes for get president to make more money and force. Democracy, hahaha, nice dream. Look at Germany, we have 5 parties, 5 different colour, but allways the same. I must stop to spend my time with this s..., better go for awalk or write postcards...

[hammered]

I see the red shirts "love Chiang Mai 51" group have now stopped a gay parade because it would damage the reputation of the city. Wonder when we get the comparisons with facists for these self appointed protectors of the city.

Hardly the open minded socialists we have heard of. Not content with attacking demonstrating corn farmers they now show their homophobic colours.

I am sure that we can all agree on condemning this group and calling for action against them.

Yes, for my part we can agree on this.

The least they need is a PR person that explains them that attacking a gay pride parade has nothing whatsoever to do with the political struggle of the majority Red Shirts in the rest of the country, and not only demeans them in the eyes of the public, but also the other Red Shirts which have begun several months ago to repair their damaged image, still go through pains transforming themselves into a wider democracy movement.

Important to understand though is that the individual groups under the Red Shirt umbrella are almost completely autonomous. That diversity is partly a strength - groups of diverse ideological backgrounds can stay under one umbrella - and a weakness, as we can see with the numerous distasteful incidents that especially the Chiangmai Lovers 51 have been associated with.

I think within the broad umbrella there is going to be more tension/conflict between "pro-democracy" red groups and out and out "pro-Thaksin" red groups which includes some very reactionary groups in the provinces.

[hammered]

When you have a bunch of wank*rs thinking that they are gonna revive the tourist industry with some cocktail concoction he better believe it (and have good cause to worry) he has gotta understand that Thailand is the laughing stock of the entire world

Perhaps he might drown his sorrows, and support the new cocktail, at the same time ?

I have to agree that this latest idea is amusing, on a par with the idea last year, to sell souvenir lucky-pen*s charms to tourists. Perhaps we need a thread on TV, to suggest alternative ideas, to promote tourism or the country ?

Reality black magic holidays. Gotta be a market for that

[hammered]

The problem is, after pissing off western democracies, Abhi doesn't have many friends left. I believe he already contacted Burma for advises. Thailand next guest of honor will probably be Kim il Jong

Abhisit like most Thai PMs before him has tried to develop the China relationship. Reality is in the geo-politcal world Thailand like the rest of mainland SE Asia is becoming increasingly under Chinese as oppsoed to US hegemony.

What is wrong with Thailand trying to deal with China. Every US president since Nixon has been going down on them and trying to get them to underwrite the wars and tax cuts of the US. The UK also just publically announced it recognized Tibet as Chinese territory. Everyone wants to be China's mate. Financial experts and economists spend half their time debating whether China can drag the world out of recession.

[Scott]

At this point in time I think the image of Thailand is best represented by the head hanging from the bridge.

[JoeThePoster]

Dems got into power legitimately by coersing former govt parties to switch sides.

Beyond that I don't see how TRT election wins, or price of fish are related to this thread. Five years ago Thaksin was a an ambitious, risging star. Now he is a convicted criminal whose backroom dealings have been exposed for everyone to see.

Shit like that happens all the time here, he's not the first one, Asean members are not striving for his return.

The best remark that sums up their attitude came from Bush, of all people. I can easily visualise his chuckle - "He got caught, heh?"

No one here is calling for Thaksin to return. You should seek medical help for your paranoia.

Bold to point out the lie.

There are several users on this forum that openly declare they wish him to return to become PM.

I mean't in this particular thread up to the point of my post in question. But with your head so far up where the sun doesnt shine, it doesn't really matter.

[TAWP]

Dems got into power legitimately by coersing former govt parties to switch sides.

Beyond that I don't see how TRT election wins, or price of fish are related to this thread. Five years ago Thaksin was a an ambitious, risging star. Now he is a convicted criminal whose backroom dealings have been exposed for everyone to see.

Shit like that happens all the time here, he's not the first one, Asean members are not striving for his return.

The best remark that sums up their attitude came from Bush, of all people. I can easily visualise his chuckle - "He got caught, heh?"

No one here is calling for Thaksin to return. You should seek medical help for your paranoia.

Bold to point out the lie.

There are several users on this forum that openly declare they wish him to return to become PM.

I mean't in this particular thread up to the point of my post in question. But with your head so far up where the sun doesnt shine, it doesn't really matter.

Do you mean no-one that has posted in this thread want him back or that no-one has posted just that exact statement in just This thread (but perhaps 19 others)?

If you are going to insult people atleast make it clear what it is you are trying to state.

"ktnxbye"

[justanothercybertosser]

I think within the broad umbrella there is going to be more tension/conflict between "pro-democracy" red groups and out and out "pro-Thaksin" red groups which includes some very reactionary groups in the provinces.

Nothing new about that. These conflicts have existed since the 2006 coup, and will continue to exist. What is somewhat surprising is though that the Red Shirts are still, after more than 2,existing, get stronger and more numerous. Even though its opponents will not accept that fact, but regardless some of their not so democratically developed groups, the Red Shirts as a whole have come a far way in terms of democratic development. Not all is democratic there, but they do develop, instead of regressing as the PAD is doing.

Lets wait and see if Thaksin will match that development, otherwise he will one day be left behind by the Red Shirts.

Edited February 25, 2009 by justanothercybertosser

[jbowman1993]

I think within the broad umbrella there is going to be more tension/conflict between "pro-democracy" red groups and out and out "pro-Thaksin" red groups which includes some very reactionary groups in the provinces.

Nothing new about that. These conflicts have existed since the 2006 coup, and will continue to exist. What is somewhat surprising is though that the Red Shirts are still, after more than 2,existing, get stronger and more numerous. Even though its opponents will not accept that fact, but regardless some of their not so democratically developed groups, the Red Shirts as a whole have come a far way in terms of democratic development. Not all is democratic there, but they do develop, instead of regressing as the PAD is doing.

Lets wait and see if Thaksin will match that development, otherwise he will one day be left behind by the Red Shirts.

Except for the fact that they are not getting stronger, and are not more numerous....

http://www.bangkokpost.com/news/local/1229...est-loses-steam

[taxexile]

jdinasia

Who is laughing at Thailand? Can you give us examples, or is this just your bias showing?

who is laughing at thailand ???

more to the point , who takes thailand and its governmental and judicial systems seriously ?

absolutely nobody , thats who.

Edited February 26, 2009 by taxexile

[Plus]

they do develop

Then why can't they build a coherent, reasonable platform and keep putting out stupid demands.

They can't revert to 1997 constitution anymore, for example. And getting tens of thousands of people to block the govt house for days to oust just ONE minister who hasn't done absolutely nothing wrong in his job yet?

Not to mention that as a matter of principle the govt allegedly backed by the military has the same legitimacy as a govt backed by Thaksin.

Basically they don't have an end game, there's no point at which they could be satisfied.

As for the number of brainwashed, emotionally charged people - it doesn't mean anything in a big scheme of things, it's just a minor annoyance as long as they don't make any sense and can be reasoned with.