Brit Faces Two Years In Thai Jail For Being 'rude'.

[jackr]

So what's the problem with Thai immigration?

Not meaning to generalise, and certainly not defending them over this debacle, but going by some of the dregs that come into the country, I'm not surprised they're a bit uptight.

[farseer]

"All and all I still find that Thai immigration is the most ineffective and unfriendly I have been able to find in Asia"

The Thai immigration are certainly not ineffective when it comes to catching people and extorting money.

But they are the most Unfriendly people I have ever had to deal with.

[bungy007]

There are now A4 paper signs up in Bangkok airport warning of jail sentences up to one year for insulting behaviour towards officials.

I didn't want to incur their wrath so I didn't bother with a photo.

In light of this action by Thailand's immigration, I think all embassies should put Thailand on their list of places to avoid directly because of this. It should be highlighted that, regardless of civil unrest in the realm, the fact is, travellers (whether for business or for pleasure) are at the mercy of the whims of a gang of brown shirted thugs!

I would go one step further: issue a decree that if travelers insist on visiting Thailand they should sign a waiver of protection from their embassy in the event of a repeat of Simon's scenario. I accept that according to the information on this forum, Simon was abandoned by the British embassy for days before they verified the legality of his passport. Having said that, the brown shirted thugs kept him confined in quarters unsuitable for humans to the tune of 11 days!! Thus it should be made abundantly clear: come at your own peril as no-one can guarantee your safety from instant arrest which could translate into years of prison; in the harshest of climates and levels of comfort or worse, at the whim of anyone with the power to do so!

It is about time the international diplomatic community stepped up and acted on behalf of the world's citizens. This action should be condemmed at the highest levels and if that means banning the issue of travel documents and visas to Thailand (unless under extenuating circumstances such as a long term resident/expat etc) then so be it. It appears that Thailand is only influenced by money and any adverse effects on their ability to amass tourist dollars. Therefore, I say, cut-off their supply until they put their house in order and provide safe passage for travellers through their gateways.

[FatherF]

There are now A4 paper signs up in Bangkok airport warning of jail sentences up to one year for insulting behaviour towards officials.

I didn't want to incur their wrath so I didn't bother with a photo.

In light of this action by Thailand's immigration, I think all embassies should put Thailand on their list of places to avoid directly because of this. It should be highlighted that, regardless of civil unrest in the realm, the fact is, travellers (whether for business or for pleasure) are at the mercy of the whims of a gang of brown shirted thugs!

I would go one step further: issue a decree that if travelers insist on visiting Thailand they should sign a waiver of protection from their embassy in the event of a repeat of Simon's scenario. I accept that according to the information on this forum, Simon was abandoned by the British embassy for days before they verified the legality of his passport. Having said that, the brown shirted thugs kept him confined in quarters unsuitable for humans to the tune of 11 days!! Thus it should be made abundantly clear: come at your own peril as no-one can guarantee your safety from instant arrest which could translate into years of prison; in the harshest of climates and levels of comfort or worse, at the whim of anyone with the power to do so!

It is about time the international diplomatic community stepped up and acted on behalf of the world's citizens. This action should be condemmed at the highest levels and if that means banning the issue of travel documents and visas to Thailand (unless under extenuating circumstances such as a long term resident/expat etc) then so be it. It appears that Thailand is only influenced by money and any adverse effects on their ability to amass tourist dollars. Therefore, I say, cut-off their supply until they put their house in order and provide safe passage for travellers through their gateways.

On the other hand, you could of course, learn to behave in an appropriate manner when in a foreign country, accept the culture of a foreign country, or just stay at home........

FF

[PhilHarries]

On the other hand, you could of course, learn to behave in an appropriate manner when in a foreign country, accept the culture of a foreign country, or just stay at home........

FF

Whilst I would agree with you wholeheartedly I would ask; Why the behaviour modification just because a person crosses a line on the map? If people were taught to behave in a civil manner at appropriate times in their home country there would be no need for a change when they travel save for minor cultural niceties. A good half, if not more, of the problem is the breakdown of civility and respect in many predominantly western countries. The use of the 'F' word is so commonplace as, in many instances, not to even elicit a reaction so that it has become meaningless. Why should the rest of the world be expected to follow the west down that path?

[caf]

There are now A4 paper signs up in Bangkok airport warning of jail sentences up to one year for insulting behaviour towards officials.

I didn't want to incur their wrath so I didn't bother with a photo.

In light of this action by Thailand's immigration, I think all embassies should put Thailand on their list of places to avoid directly because of this. It should be highlighted that, regardless of civil unrest in the realm, the fact is, travellers (whether for business or for pleasure) are at the mercy of the whims of a gang of brown shirted thugs!

I would go one step further: issue a decree that if travelers insist on visiting Thailand they should sign a waiver of protection from their embassy in the event of a repeat of Simon's scenario. I accept that according to the information on this forum, Simon was abandoned by the British embassy for days before they verified the legality of his passport. Having said that, the brown shirted thugs kept him confined in quarters unsuitable for humans to the tune of 11 days!! Thus it should be made abundantly clear: come at your own peril as no-one can guarantee your safety from instant arrest which could translate into years of prison; in the harshest of climates and levels of comfort or worse, at the whim of anyone with the power to do so!

It is about time the international diplomatic community stepped up and acted on behalf of the world's citizens. This action should be condemmed at the highest levels and if that means banning the issue of travel documents and visas to Thailand (unless under extenuating circumstances such as a long term resident/expat etc) then so be it. It appears that Thailand is only influenced by money and any adverse effects on their ability to amass tourist dollars. Therefore, I say, cut-off their supply until they put their house in order and provide safe passage for travellers through their gateways.

I agree but looking after one's citizens is not a priority agenda item. The UK and USA want to keep on the right side of Thailand

[FatherF]

On the other hand, you could of course, learn to behave in an appropriate manner when in a foreign country, accept the culture of a foreign country, or just stay at home........

FF

Whilst I would agree with you wholeheartedly I would ask; Why the behaviour modification just because a person crosses a line on the map? If people were taught to behave in a civil manner at appropriate times in their home country there would be no need for a change when they travel save for minor cultural niceties. A good half, if not more, of the problem is the breakdown of civility and respect in many predominantly western countries. The use of the 'F' word is so commonplace as, in many instances, not to even elicit a reaction so that it has become meaningless. Why should the rest of the world be expected to follow the west down that path?

I quite agree.

FF

[torrenova]

Sorry but to all those who think "he got what he deserves" well I've news for you. Stop trying to be more Thai than the Thais and get your tongues out of their <deleted>.

Tin pot rules which you undoubtedly abide by but which you cannot name on the statute book because they just don't exist. Rules are made up along the way as they see fit. Wait till you are on the receiving end and see how you like it.

Thai officials are a pain in the arse 90% of the time. This country is going to the dogs. Nevermind leave your cash at the airport and go home, soon they'll just ask you to Western Union it over from your local pub without ever having to set foot in the country.

Someone educated outside Thailand needs to wield a big stick at these buffoons but as the elite pay each other off to secure top jobs, it will never happen. Until then, innocent people will be caught up by either medieval laws or stupid rules which are just made up to extract money from the very people they profess to want so much. Lunacy, sheer lunacy.

[johnefallis]

It would appear that he swore at the immigration official, criticised Thailand & snatched his passport back, so on that basis he got what he deserved & if he does receive a prison sentence, he has only himself to blame - end of discussion. I'd just add that I've no sympathy for him whatsoever.

Clearly an ignorant bigoted comment.

If he receives 2 years, you should receive at least the same.

Hopefully they'll put you in together.

[torrenova]

It would appear that he swore at the immigration official, criticised Thailand & snatched his passport back, so on that basis he got what he deserved & if he does receive a prison sentence, he has only himself to blame - end of discussion. I'd just add that I've no sympathy for him whatsoever.

Clearly an ignorant bigoted comment.

If he receives 2 years, you should receive at least the same.

Hopefully they'll put you in together.

No, this Clayton Seymour fellow can do the 2 years given to the tourist and allow the tourist to go home

Just what do you think the outcome would be in a civilised country whether he grabbed his passport back or not ? Next to nothing if not nothing at all. That speaks volumes for Thailand.

[ClaytonSeymour]

No, this Clayton Seymour fellow can do the 2 years given to the tourist and allow the tourist to go home

Just what do you think the outcome would be in a civilised country whether he grabbed his passport back or not ? Next to nothing if not nothing at all. That speaks volumes for Thailand.

Exactly - there lies the problem. That speaks volumes about 'civilized' countries that have been destroyed by liberals & do-gooders.

Edited March 31, 2009 by ClaytonSeymour

[ClaytonSeymour]

Clearly an ignorant bigoted comment.

If he receives 2 years, you should receive at least the same.

Hopefully they'll put you in together.

Chuck Norris' personal code rule number 8. I will maintain respect for those in authority and demonstrate this respect at all times.

[Joints]

Clearly an ignorant bigoted comment.

If he receives 2 years, you should receive at least the same.

Hopefully they'll put you in together.

Chuck Norris' personal code rule number 8. I will maintain respect for those in authority and demonstrate this respect at all times.

I guess that will make him a perfect nazi if he ever tries.

I wonder how so many can have such a strong opinion about what happened, what is right and what is wrong, even when you were not there? How do you do it?

[ClaytonSeymour]

I wonder how so many can have such a strong opinion about what happened, what is right and what is wrong, even when you were not there? How do you do it?

It's not just about Simon Burrowes is it? It's the battle between those who share completely different values in life. The liberals, do-gooders & PC correct see him as a martyr to their cause, yet for such as myself, it's a classic scenario of the UK street yob thinking he can say & do whatever he likes without any fear of authority.

Chuck Norris' personal code rule number 8. I will maintain respect for those in authority and demonstrate this respect at all times.

[neverdie]

I hope he gets life, then gets 'shanked' on the first day inside..... , but I am a bit of a sadist, albiet a fair sadist.

[Electra]

I wonder how so many can have such a strong opinion about what happened, what is right and what is wrong, even when you were not there? How do you do it?

It's not just about Simon Burrowes is it? It's the battle between those who share completely different values in life. The liberals, do-gooders & PC correct see him as a martyr to their cause, yet for such as myself, it's a classic scenario of the UK street yob thinking he can say & do whatever he likes without any fear of authority.

Chuck Norris' personal code rule number 8. I will maintain respect for those in authority and demonstrate this respect at all times.

Or perhaps it is the vicarious conflict between those posturing their sanctimonious claptrap from the moral high ground of their assumed superiority and the rest of us mere mortals more rooted in the reality of modern life unencumbered by the burden of bitterness, prejudice and stupidity?

[ClaytonSeymour]

Or perhaps it is the vicarious conflict between those posturing their sanctimonious claptrap from the moral high ground of their assumed superiority and the rest of us mere mortals more rooted in the reality of modern life unencumbered by the burden of bitterness, prejudice and stupidity?

Thanks for letting us know which side of the fence you're on.

[Electra]

Right is might, eh what?

[Sabum]

Or perhaps it is the vicarious conflict between those posturing their sanctimonious claptrap from the moral high ground of their assumed superiority and the rest of us mere mortals more rooted in the reality of modern life unencumbered by the burden of bitterness, prejudice and stupidity?

Thanks for letting us know which side of the fence you're on.

Well if you know please tell me cause Im still trying to figure it out.

[GungaDin]

Back to the topic.

Quote:

"I agonised over my plea, discussing the ramifications with my Thai lawyer, family and fellow prisoners. A guilty plea would allow the case to be heard and resolved quickly after the 84-day investigation period, but I risked accepting responsibility for a crime I did not understand. A not-guilty plea would keep me in prison for a minimum of six months after the first hearing, at 84 days, until a trial began - with no guarantee that the matter could be finalised in one trial.

Over the next month I met prisoners who had chosen to defend themselves and had spent up to three years in detention, making periodic court appearances. I came to see that the Thai legal system is designed to discourage people from contesting charges, and offers the inducement of a commuted sentence - half the declared sentence - if the defendant pleads guilty. Those who do choose to fight have to deal with errant witnesses, missing or incomplete evidence, translation difficulties, court-assigned interpreters and submissive Thai lawyers unwilling to challenge judicial authority. Some prisoners have even had the same judge for both their sentencing and subsequent appeal."

Source

Don't shoot the messenger.

[Electra]

Or perhaps it is the vicarious conflict between those posturing their sanctimonious claptrap from the moral high ground of their assumed superiority and the rest of us mere mortals more rooted in the reality of modern life unencumbered by the burden of bitterness, prejudice and stupidity?

Thanks for letting us know which side of the fence you're on.

Well if you know please tell me cause Im still trying to figure it out.

Do you have the same difficulty counting your fingers and toes?

[geriatrickid]

No, this Clayton Seymour fellow can do the 2 years given to the tourist and allow the tourist to go home

Just what do you think the outcome would be in a civilised country whether he grabbed his passport back or not ? Next to nothing if not nothing at all. That speaks volumes for Thailand.

Exactly - there lies the problem. That speaks volumes about 'civilized' countries that have been destroyed by liberals & do-gooders.

Don't get out much do you? I believe that it is those liberals and do gooders that are most likely to demonstrate basic manners, courtesy and respect than a great many of your kind. Those liberals and do gooders believe passionately in certain values that you would consider to be "conservative". Coming through swampy a couple days ago, it was the young person in dreads that gave up his seat on the airplane shuttle bus for the old lady and not the conservative looking man with his trollop girlfriend. When I walk down Bangla Rd. in patong, the people I see behaving badly are not the evil liberals or do gooders but the types that you would label "conservative". Good old working folks, filled to the brim with beer and cavorting with whores. A liberal do gooder wouldn't do such a thing since it would go against his or her values of social responsibility. You are all for the rule of law until it impacts you. And then you will say the law doesn't apply to you. The reality is that the typical liberal do gooder is the true conservative and demonstrates a more puritan type of lifestyle than all the bitter angry males in need of blaming others for their own failures in life.

[valentinob29]

It always amazes me that expats becomes so "institutionalised" living in Thailand they forget the basic rights they were brought up with.

It's like a sad version of Stockhausen syndrome.

Pathetic really

Way too many people living here in Thailand want the Thais to accept their beliefs and values.

Wake up, you're living i a different country with different ideas. Those basic rights are the basic rights you grew up with, but they don't apply here, nor in lots of other countries that don't share your (western) morals and values.

it is not western it is human to want a place so backwards like here to wake up and start behaving matury and resxpecting human rights

I am part thai,

so maybe i can commet

always , this is asia, asian vbalue--- God help us, what a laod of nonsens!this makes me ashamed, deeply so, it is pathetic and anyone who support this is so also

[valentinob29]

Sorry but to all those who think "he got what he deserves" well I've news for you. Stop trying to be more Thai than the Thais and get your tongues out of their <deleted>.

Tin pot rules which you undoubtedly abide by but which you cannot name on the statute book because they just don't exist. Rules are made up along the way as they see fit. Wait till you are on the receiving end and see how you like it.

Thai officials are a pain in the arse 90% of the time. This country is going to the dogs. Nevermind leave your cash at the airport and go home, soon they'll just ask you to Western Union it over from your local pub without ever having to set foot in the country.

Someone educated outside Thailand needs to wield a big stick at these buffoons but as the elite pay each other off to secure top jobs, it will never happen. Until then, innocent people will be caught up by either medieval laws or stupid rules which are just made up to extract money from the very people they profess to want so much. Lunacy, sheer lunacy.

someone withn sense

there is hope

[valentinob29]

is this for real?

yes, this thailand, please wake up people, this poor innocent man has to do some time just becasuse of some pathetic low life wants to save his face

do you know why they get away with this?

answer- because the west ( who ultimatley controls the world) lets them

its as simple as that

trade is far more important than basic human right- we could get that man out faster than simply saying " do it, or we will fXXX you up"

I love what the brits did just after WW2- they should do the same( economicly) every time any place steps out of line.

For everyone, inluding the locals sake.

why have what people died for, when this is allowed to happen. Who knows anything about this poor man. i I wish to arraange a visit.

When one man like this sit's in jail all so called legal process must be questioned.

I pray for his well being

Hear Hear. But when will it get better? ... I think not. The west says serves you right for going abroad.

it will get better

the world will get better when the stupid political correct get off their asses and recognise that fundamental human rights should be at the top of all country agenda

and punish all places that ignore this

the west could bring thailand to its knees in days,

like 90% of other countrys, like it did just after WW2 when it bombed bangkok and showed it how to sit when told

now, the priorty is on making moneys- big corparations

thus, it does not act when there is the abuse

embassy should be there to assit that its citezan rerceive the fair impartail treatment thus accored and

fought for

NOT just to make sure that western multi nationals reaps huge profits

[Blue2]

Clearly an ignorant bigoted comment.

If he receives 2 years, you should receive at least the same.

Hopefully they'll put you in together.

Chuck Norris' personal code rule number 8. I will maintain respect for those in authority and demonstrate this respect at all times.

Chuck Norris' personal code rule number 4. I will look for the good in all people and make them feel worthwhile.

Chuck Norris' personal code rule number 5. If I have nothing good to say about a person, I will say nothing. http://' target="_blank">

[ClaytonSeymour]

Chuck Norris' personal code rule number 4. I will look for the good in all people and make them feel worthwhile.

Chuck Norris' personal code rule number 5. If I have nothing good to say about a person, I will say nothing.

If you bother to read the full thread, you'll see that those points have already been raised & addressed.

[ClaytonSeymour]

Well if you know please tell me cause Im still trying to figure it out.

Do you have the same difficulty counting your fingers and toes?

Edited April 2, 2009 by ClaytonSeymour

[Jiu-Jitsu]

No, this Clayton Seymour fellow can do the 2 years given to the tourist and allow the tourist to go home

Just what do you think the outcome would be in a civilised country whether he grabbed his passport back or not ? Next to nothing if not nothing at all. That speaks volumes for Thailand.

Exactly - there lies the problem. That speaks volumes about 'civilized' countries that have been destroyed by liberals & do-gooders.

Don't get out much do you? I believe that it is those liberals and do gooders that are most likely to demonstrate basic manners, courtesy and respect than a great many of your kind. Those liberals and do gooders believe passionately in certain values that you would consider to be "conservative". Coming through swampy a couple days ago, it was the young person in dreads that gave up his seat on the airplane shuttle bus for the old lady and not the conservative looking man with his trollop girlfriend. When I walk down Bangla Rd. in patong, the people I see behaving badly are not the evil liberals or do gooders but the types that you would label "conservative". Good old working folks, filled to the brim with beer and cavorting with whores. A liberal do gooder wouldn't do such a thing since it would go against his or her values of social responsibility. You are all for the rule of law until it impacts you. And then you will say the law doesn't apply to you. The reality is that the typical liberal do gooder is the true conservative and demonstrates a more puritan type of lifestyle than all the bitter angry males in need of blaming others for their own failures in life.

Erm..... I'm going to have to agree with you.

[TAWP]

I wonder how so many can have such a strong opinion about what happened, what is right and what is wrong, even when you were not there? How do you do it?

It's not just about Simon Burrowes is it? It's the battle between those who share completely different values in life. The liberals, do-gooders & PC correct see him as a martyr to their cause, yet for such as myself, it's a classic scenario of the UK street yob thinking he can say & do whatever he likes without any fear of authority.

Chuck Norris' personal code rule number 8. I will maintain respect for those in authority and demonstrate this respect at all times.

Respect is earned and not taken.

You seem to be under the impression that not showing the amount of respect the receiver wishes should be a crime. By that logic you would go to jail in an instant if it was enforced as a 'protection' for the whole population as you clearly seem unable, in my eyes, to show the proper respect for your fellow posters in this thread.

"Hang him, I say" we shall shout.